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The March Of Technology

Self driving cars will be equipped with deep learning neural networks which learns how the traffic behaves and take decisions on its own. It will not only be computer programs running If-Then loops.
...such machines will always keep a safe distance from the car in front, never drive excessively fast and stop as safely and as quickly as is possible. None of those things are done by people for the most part.
 
If it won't decide that it's need to go as fast as possible everywhere, all the time, is better than observing basic road safety and common sense then it will far safer than the majority of drivers currently on the roads.
 
Eventually, when all cars are driverless, the level of safety will be much higher than it is now.
However, there will always be petrolheads who insist on driving themselves...and invariably they will drive in a risky manner. Unless laws are passed to ban such risky behaviour completely.
 
Unless laws are passed to ban such risky behaviour completely.
Hmm, don't know if that would work. Look at current laws concerning mobile phone use whilst driving.

I've thought about the driverless car thing for a while now and I honestly can't see how it would work...unless all cars were made driverless at the same time.

Eventually, when all cars are driverless, the level of safety will be much higher than it is now.
I agree, it would. I just think that the transition period would be a nightmare.
 
Hmm, don't know if that would work. Look at current laws concerning mobile phone use whilst driving.

I've thought about the driverless car thing for a while now and I honestly can't see how it would work...unless all cars were made driverless at the same time.

I agree, it would. I just think that the transition period would be a nightmare.
I'd speculate an interim period with speed limiters and sensors to ensure space between vehicles would come first, possibly with the faculty to remotely shut down vehicle engines.
 
I've thought about the driverless car thing for a while now and I honestly can't see how it would work...unless all cars were made driverless at the same time.

I agree, it would. I just think that the transition period would be a nightmare.
Yes.
 
The way things seem to be going the transition between driver and driverless is being filled with driver-assist. As things stand, a Tesla will probably get you safely to your destination, but you are still expected to be in control of your vehicle, even if that control consists of holding the wheel and paying attention to what the car is doing and what's on the road. I don't think there's any doubt that driverless cars will be the norm in, say, twenty years time, but there are issues, both practical and legal, to be hammered out in the meantime. That process has begun, but I think it will be a long time before you are not still expected to be in control of your vehicle, perhaps except in locations specifically designed as suitable for driverless travel.
 
perhaps except in locations specifically designed as suitable for driverless travel.

And that's how you deal with the petrol head problem. Make three lanes of the motorway for driverless cars, the petrol heads get one, cross into the driverless lane and an ANPR camera by the side of road hits you up for three points and £200.
 
And that's how you deal with the petrol head problem. Make three lanes of the motorway for driverless cars, the petrol heads get one, cross into the driverless lane and an ANPR camera by the side of road hits you up for three points and £200.
...and turns your engine off, and you have to pay to be towed out.
 
And that's how you deal with the petrol head problem. Make three lanes of the motorway for driverless cars, the petrol heads get one, cross into the driverless lane and an ANPR camera by the side of road hits you up for three points and £200.
:rofl:
I hadn't been thinking of anything quite so draconian. I imagine road layouts and laws will respond to changes when convenient for the most part, and only slightly drive change (while claiming to be driving change to appease green concerns). So, change will be mostly driverless.
 
I can't see driverless cars completely taking over for a long time yet. A lot of people (me included) enjoy driving, some even class it as a hobby (I'm not quite at that stage yet).
 
If I were a long-haul trucker, I'd be preparing for my next career, because I think that's where we'll see widespread adoption of the technology first. I can foresee gangs of die-hard teamsters sabotaging the first autonomous rigs, but I think the economics of freight shipping make the changeover inevitable.
 
Vehicle manufacturers can't even make the computerized engine control systems work with 100% reliability. And they are just dumb computers that take input from sensors and apply it to the engine.

No way are they ever going to have even 99% reliability with AI.

I won't be around when they try to roll it out; or I would be taking bets.

INT21
 
Driver less cars are both unnecessary and potentially very dangerous. The whole idea should be dropped.

I doubt that they could ever be programmed for every eventuality.

A good example is where a car in front of you indicates to turn right. Moves over toward the centre of the road to initiate the turn, then turns left across the front of you. This happens surprisingly often.

How would the self drive car see the situation ?

Would it, as most drivers do, say to itself 'there is a good chance this idiot will change his/her mind and cut me up' or will it assume the driver will do as he/she indicated ?

Be prepared for your insurance policy to go through the roof.

INT21

Yes because human drivers are so fucking reliable.
 
Yes because human drivers are so fucking reliable.

With human drivers the unreliability isn't the biggest danger, it's a human being's innate ability to willfully disregard common sense and established rules which enforce that common sense because of a hugely inflated sense of their own driving skill that most definitely is.
 
NF,

I amazed at how this site allows such expletives to go unchallenged.

However.

In the case of a collision, who will be to blame ?

INT21
 
Mythopoeika,

From your link...

....because semiautonomy is showing that computer drivers are likely safer than human ones...

There is a fatal flaw in this reasoning.

There are far, far fewer computerised cars than human driven ones. The accident rate sample is much to small to draw conclusions from. When the ratio reaches, say, 50/50 then it can be better assessed.

INT21
 
Environmentalists who are worried that Luddites have become extinct will be reassured by the responses on this thread! Luddites still want to stand in the way of technological progress...

The Luddites were a group of English textile workers and weavers in the 19th century who destroyed weaving machinery as a form of protest. The group was protesting the use of machinery in a "fraudulent and deceitful manner" to get around standard labour practices.[1] Luddites feared that the time spent learning the skills of their craft would go to waste as machines would replace their role in the industry.[2] It is a misconception that the Luddites protested against the machinery itself in an attempt to halt progress of technology. However, the term has come to mean one opposed to industrialisation, automation, computerisation or new technologies in general.[3] The Luddite movement began in Nottingham and culminated in a region-wide rebellion that lasted from 1811 to 1816. Mill owners took to shooting protesters and eventually the movement was brutally suppressed with military force.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luddite
 
I can't see driverless cars completely taking over for a long time yet. A lot of people (me included) enjoy driving, some even class it as a hobby (I'm not quite at that stage yet).
Track days. The occasions when I have actively enjoyed driving a car comprise a fairly small proportion of the occasions I have driven a car. The smile factor is much bigger when it comes to riding a motorbike, but I have had my share of gritting my teeth through bad weather, or inching along in the heat, humidity and motorbike jams in Ho Chi Minh City rush hour. If I could sit back and get an extra hour's sleep or read a book on my commute, rather than having to pilot my vehicle - yes, please.
 
In the opening scene in the book 'Gold Coast' four friends are sitting in a fully automatic car observing the blue lights and the emergency services sorting out a multi car crash.

'SIS' says one.

'Yes, his friend agrees. 'Something In the Silicon'.

Krepostnoi,

...If I could sit back and get an extra hour's sleep or read a book on my commute, rather than having to pilot my vehicle - yes, please...

And you will sleep knowing you have no control over the situation whatsoever ?

INT21
 
People already do that on bus journeys.
A timely episode of Fully Charged from Robert Llewellyn. The Intellibus from about 1.25 into the episode (although the tomatoes at the start are interesting too).

 
It will be a strange sight watching a traffic jam, cars moving slowly and almost all drivers sleeping in the seats.
Or reading books. Or on their mobile phones.
Oh, wait - that last bit - that's happening right now.
 
This is how technology to partly fuel vehicles on water could tackle Cornwall's pollution problem
By HannahCL | Posted: February 28, 2017

New technology that will see vehicles partly fueled by water will be trialled in Cornwall in a bid to improve air quality after it was reported that residents may be forced to sell their homes in pollution hotspots.
Innovative new 'autonomous electrolysers' will be fitted to a number of vehicles in Cornwall as part of a new trial project to reduce emissions and improve air quality as the council continues to battle pollution problems.

The electrolysers created by Water Fuel Engineering Ltd, work by splitting water into hydrogen and oxygen, using the hydrogen as fuel alongside fossil fuels to help reduce emissions.
The electrolysers need to be used alongside conventional fuels such as diesel or petrol, so although you can't count on running your car on tap water any time soon the pioneering new technology means we are one step closer to it becoming a reality in the future.

Cornwall Council has secured a grant from the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (Defra) of £236,650 to trial the new technology.
A total of ten vehicles from Cornwall Council and CORMAC including road sweepers, tippers, vans and lorry mounted cranes will be fitted with the electrolysers.

Phil Davies, Water Fuel Engineering's marketing director, said: "We're delighted to have the opportunity to work with Cornwall Council on this ambitious and pioneering project.
"Poor air quality is a concern in the UK and reducing or eliminating the emissions from essential utility vehicles is the driving force behind our HydroGen electrolysers."

Last month the council were focused on a Clean Air for Cornwall Strategy policy to look at various ways of dealing with pollution with some drastic suggestions including compulsory purchase of homes in the worse affected areas, although this would have to be subject to further talks.
At the time, Cornwall Council said: "Although the air in Cornwall is generally very clean, a few areas have poorer air quality mainly due to road traffic."
It is now hoped that the trial will see electrolysers reduce emissions of nitric oxide, nitrogen dioxide, particulate matter and carbon, and emissions of the vehicles will be monitored throughout the trial.

Geoff Brown, Cornwall Council's portfolio holder for communities, said: "This grant funded trial is excellent news for Cornwall. Nitrogen dioxide and particulate matter play a role in many of the UK's health challenges, so anything that helps to reduce these pollutants is very welcome.
"If the trial is successful, this technology has the potential to be widely used to convert cars and lorries and reduce emissions from many of the older vehicles on our roads, which could make a big difference to air quality in Cornwall's seven Air Quality Management Areas."

http://www.cornwalllive.com/this-is...-air-quality/story-30165787-detail/story.html
 
...The electrolysers created by Water Fuel Engineering Ltd, work by splitting water into hydrogen and oxygen, using the hydrogen as fuel alongside fossil fuels to help reduce emissions...

Anyone, like myself, who has spent time studying and experimenting with electrolysis will know that this isn't so straight forward as this article makes it sound.

Producing hydrogen and oxygen from water is quite simple.

producing enough of it to be feasible is something else.

Also it seems they are going to dump the oxygen and only use the hydrogen.

I dabbled in the hydroxy idea. That uses the combined gas' as produced.

This gas is highly explosive. Burns VERY fast. It isn't safe to store it. You really do have to produce it as you need it.

All kinds of complications are involved.

It's a fascinating subject. But beware snake oil merchants.

I still have a largish unit. But as I run Diesel engined cars, occasionally running on home brew bio Diesel It would only be of academic interest to me now.

But the ides is still appealing.

INT21
 
But beware snake oil merchants.
That was my impression of the whole article. It feels like a pitch for funding to un-technical types for an idea which will never quite work, but will pay handsomely while it's not being developed.
 
That was my impression of the whole article. It feels like a pitch for funding to un-technical types for an idea which will never quite work, but will pay handsomely while it's not being developed.
Read it again. The funding is already in place, and now they are just testing the idea in real vehicles in working conditions.

The grant comes from Defra, and I don't expect Cornwall to be the only place where this testing is going on, it's just that local papers report local news, innit!?
 
Read it again. The funding is already in place, and now they are just testing the idea in real vehicles in working conditions.
OK. So I read it again and I find that the trials seem to use a 'box' which generates hydrogen for mixing with existing fuel. Simple electrolysis of water into oxygen and hydrogen is not a new thing. Typically the efficiency of splitting hydrogen from water and then recombining it as fuel for power generation is around 25%.

So if the hydrogen is being produced by using electricity from the vehicles themselves it's likely wildly inefficient. I'd speculate that the (claimed) emissions clean-up gained will be offset by the necessity to burn extra fuel to generate the power to split the water into hydrogen.

I see nothing in this article that explains how it works, how it actually improves performance overall or really reduces emissions. They make claims for emission reduction and reduced fuel use, I see no test figures. The system diagram is indistinguishable from any HHO scam product. The FAQ is cleverly imprecise.

I stand by my previous comment, other than they have already got the cash.

When I see independently verified tests of economy and emission improvement, I'll change my mind.
 
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