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Rendlesham Forest Incident

The case is dead but it refuses to lie down. Those photos are very unconvincing. I am inclined to believe the (genuinely) English witnesses, some of whom saw something come down, and some who witnessed military and police activity that first Christmas night, and those who spoke to foresters soon afterwards. The reason I am still doubtful about the alien spaceship kind of theory is that all of the subsequent obvious diisnformation is actively promoting the ET theory. If it was a spaceship, trying to cover it up with stories of crashed or landed UFOs makes no sense at all.
 
Ian Ridpath said:
Has it occurred to you that's because the UFO believers dare not let this one die? One by one, just about all their cherished cases have wilted and died. This is supposedly the British Roswell, you know. And many have now lost faith in Roswell.
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If you'll permit me to quote myself, I said (18 years ago!) at the beginning of this very thread..
stu neville said:
IMHO, no matter what anyone says or does, like a slightly more dilute Roswell this story by now has it's own momentum. Even if incontrovertible proof were furnished one way or the other there will always be those who will believe otherwise.

It's the old skeptic vs. true believer problem: proof of truth to one is proof of delusion to the other - and once again, in the commentary box, the Fortean :) .
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Ian Ridpath said:
Has it occurred to you that's because the UFO believers dare not let this one die? One by one, just about all their cherished cases have wilted and died. This is supposedly the British Roswell, you know. And many have now lost faith in Roswell.
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Roswell was the first time they managed a black project crash using the alien cover story. It was a huge success. There are genuine UFO cases but whatever they are, it probably isn't anything extraterrestrial. The problem is not so much the phenomenon as that the ET theory seems to be the only one that people want to believe in, even the most "scientific" ufologists. Ballester Olmos, for example, wrote a detailed analysis of a remarkable single witness case and ended accepting that the witness was totally honest, and that physical traces were later found that supported his story. He concluded, however, that he did not accept this as evidence of the reality of the phenomenon because the beings that were seen did not correspond to his idea of extraterrestrials. (Personal communication.)
https://www.academia.edu/39927304/IMAGINATION_OR_REALITY_THE_LANDING_AT_TURIS
 
stu neville said:
If you'll permit me to quote myself, I said (18 years ago!) at the beginning of this very thread..
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Of course you may.
In my experience, most of us got interested in UFOs from the ET angle. Then, about 40+ years ago, there was a move towards some kind of paranormal angle. Then the believers either went back to the ET explanation or came out the other side altogether and became skeptics. (My own conversion to skeptic was rather quicker and more direct.)
For an amusing bit of history, see my interview with Hynek from New Scientist in 1973
https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=A1iqVQgvZnAC&lpg=PA422&pg=PA422
 
Swifty said:
He also states that ".. Halt and his team were 200 metres away from me .." .. a team of military professionals specifically that night on a reconnaissance mission to guard a base didn't spot a bloke walking about poaching in the woods? ..
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First let me say I believe the story and pic is BS however at 200 meters in woodland at night no way would they see someone who didn’t want to be seen.
Rescue teams have been known to miss bodies just a few meters away in daylight in woods.
 
We don't seem to have much on record, if in anything, pertaining to our second night's events.

Also, what was the catalyst for our third night...

What resulted in Lt. Bruce Englund interrupting Halt at the belated officer's Christmas dinner to alert that, 'the UFO was back'?

I recalled having surmised a conceivable explanation for this and have eventually located same.

Uploaded is the original publication in its entirety.

Additionally therein, is some further case material maybe of interest.

www.forteanmedia.com/V16.txt
 
New case evidence?

Came across a really old video tape which has a recording of a program:

'Britain's Closest Encounter'

Don't remember this and must be a significantly early UK broadcast.

It could never possibly have been taped over by accident, so, was really looking forward to watching it...

www.forteanmedia.com/video.mp4
 
Those original witness statements are elemental case evidence.

I have come across a copy of the issue of the newsletter I published and which told background story to their acquisition and my decision it was imperative their existence and content was revealed.

It's a perspective which also touches on issues we have only recently discussed.

For some, apparently, it was, to quote Billy Connolly, 'as welcome as a fart in a spacesuit'.

Perhaps more importantly nowadays, it features evidence from testimonies which, again, could be of interest:

www.forteanmedia.com/V15.txt
 
Comfortably Numb said:
Additionally therein, is some further case material maybe of interest.

www.forteanmedia.com/V16.txt
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Extracted from therein:

The case presented by Bruni is essentially that:

(3). The original witnesses statements which I publicly revealed are fabricated.
(End)

I have discovered related case evidence, which could not be more specific.

This is an exact quote from a lengthy interview Penniston gave to AJS (Salley) Rayl and published in OMNI magazine (1997):

"Also, an Air Force Form 1569, an accident and complaint report, was filled out...".

Buran and Chandler did use the official Form 1569:

Buran_1.jpg

Chand_2.jpg

Chand_3.jpg

Cabansag and Penniston's were typed on plain paper and Burroughs hand-written on same. Penniston confirmed:

!Penn_1.jpg


Penn_2a.gif


Accompanying Penniston's, was his original sketch of the perceived object.

In this, we can see Penniston writes, "us", indicating how far away they are and adds a separate drawing of the box-shape and lights, in an attempt to illustrate this in more detail, presumably because there isn't a close-up drawing.

Penn_4a.jpg

Penn_4b.jpg


Hopefully, this all helps to clarify the truth.
 
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Yithian said:
...What kind of camera natively produces the kind of 'texture' seen on those tree trunks?

How deep are the grooves in that bark?...
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Aside from the fact that the images indicate unexplained light sources other than the one we are supposed to be looking at, the structure of the bark in those photographs is the first thing that caught my eye. That deeply fissured pattern would not be out of place for, say, certain types of mature fir - or a mature ash or alder - but the visible twist (more apparent in the first three images) is, I think, a bit odd. That oddness might constitute a natural anomaly – the natural lines of bark growth can be affected by other factors - but the fact that the identical vertical leftwards lean is visible in two roughly neighbouring trees makes me wonder. Generally speaking, bark tends to follow the line of growth of the tree, fissures generally following the upward flow of the trunk, rather than twisting around the tree in a spiral - which is effectively what the pattern in those images suggests.
 
Spookdaddy said:
the structure of the bark in those photographs is the first thing that caught my eye. That deeply fissured pattern would not be out of place for, say, certain types of mature fir. Generally speaking, bark tends to follow the line of growth of the tree, fissures generally following the upward flow of the trunk, rather than twisting around the tree in a spiral - which is effectively what the pattern in those images suggests.
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You can see a close-up of two trees in the area that I photographed in 1983 if you scroll down to the bottom of this page
http://www.ianridpath.com/ufo/rendlesham1a.html
The pictures show the so-called 'burns' on the trees reported by the airmen, which are in fact axe-cuts made by the foresters.
 
Spookdaddy said:
Aside from the fact that the images indicate unexplained light sources other than the one we are supposed to be looking at, the structure of the bark in those photographs is the first thing that caught my eye. That deeply fissured pattern would not be out of place for, say, certain types of mature fir - or a mature ash or alder - but the visible twist (more apparent in the first three images) is, I think, a bit odd. That oddness might constitute a natural anomaly – the natural lines of bark growth can be affected by other factors - but the fact that the identical vertical leftwards lean is visible in two roughly neighbouring trees makes me wonder. Generally speaking, bark tends to follow the line of growth of the tree, fissures generally following the upward flow of the trunk, rather than twisting around the tree in a spiral - which is effectively what the pattern in those images suggests.
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This is why I love the community.

I note the bark looks 'off'; he explains how and why.
 
Carl Grove said:
Penniston refers to multiple use of sodium pentathol and maybe other drugs by AFOSI. To get at hidden memories or to create a false memory trail?
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During that same, aforementioned 1997 interview published in OMNI and which I hadn't seen until now, Penniston clarified:

"Two days later, there was another, second encounter. I did not go out on that night. Lt. Col. Halt was sent out to investigate".

"After that incident, however, I was directed to report to OSI [Office of Special Investigations] at 0900 in the morning.

I met with a couple of agents, whom I had known because they had an office on the base.

They debriefed me for about an hour and a half about the incident. It was an oral debriefing where I basically just told them what had happened, and they seemed quite content with the information that I provided them at the time".
 
Comfortably Numb said:
During that same, aforementioned 1997 interview published in OMNI and which I hadn't seen until now, Penniston clarified:

"Two days later, there was another, second encounter. I did not go out on that night. Lt. Col. Halt was sent out to investigate".

"After that incident, however, I was directed to report to OSI [Office of Special Investigations] at 0900 in the morning.

I met with a couple of agents, whom I had known because they had an office on the base.

They debriefed me for about an hour and a half about the incident. It was an oral debriefing where I basically just told them what had happened, and they seemed quite content with the information that I provided them at the time".
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Interesting use of words -- "they seemed quite content!"
 
Comfortably Numb said:
For a start, tales from the first and second night"s events are merged together.
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As regards:

"I saw a basket ball sized red orb, it had a black centre like a pupil and looked just like an eye winking at you, just like Halt explained it..."

What Halt actually explained was:

"And when you put the Starscope on it, it sorta has a hollow center, a dark center, it's like a pupil of an eye looking at you, winking".

Our supposed Poacher carrying one as well, was he...
 
Carl Grove said:
Interesting use of words -- "they seemed quite content!"
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Penniston claims that was because:

"I did not tell them at this point that I had approached the craft, touched the craft, but I did tell them about the photos I had taken".

He portrays a scenario where the OSI are satisfied the, 'UFO cover up' is safe.

Good job the twin-base was, what with all these security threats and everyone chasing UFOs, or just going back home after a prolonged, laser-like beam attack at the Weapons Storage Area...
 
Comfortably Numb said:
He portrays a scenario where the OSI are satisfied the, 'UFO cover up' is safe.
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I've just finished reading two lenthy transcripts in case material I acquired from the US.

They are conversations between Larry Fawcett and Sgt Adrian Bustinza and often refer to the alleged involvement of Larry Warren.

The rest of the discussion essentially relates to a downed craft (possibly alien), which sat in the forest for 2-3 days, awaiting, 'electronic' repairs.

Halt is named by Bustinza as being witnessed communicating with the craft's 'occupants', advising he will obtain spare parts for them, although...

...'these might have to come from another world'...

Unidentified civilians arrived rapidly and security police briefed not to ask any questions.

Said replacements later arrived on a C-130 transporter from Ramstein AFB, in Germany.

Bustinza then goes on to describe, in detail, the underground facilities, where he says, "intelligence" were based.

Halt has adamantly refuted any underground building existed and simply couldn't, because of the high water table where the twin-base was located.

Halt also, of course claims neither Bustinza or Warren were present.

Conclusions...well, if you enjoy a good sci-fi bedtime story...!

Daft thing is, if you make allowances for Bustinza's recollections being, 'a wee bit screwy', there's still this thread of, 'unusual' activity in the days following our second night's escapades.

Goin back to Penniston's interview with Salley Rayl, he states - comparative to Burroughs:

"During the first week in January, about a week or so later, we had a pass-on that was given at guard mount to brief our people to ignore any type of activity that was going to be happening on the perimeter of Woodbridge.

Apparently, or at least as we were told, there was a special team that was going to be out there doing some electronics work. They weren't wearing uniforms but civilian clothes.

Now it was perfectly normal to receive pass-ons, but this situation was different because these guys weren't wearing military uniforms. It was later rumoured that it was a U.S. team sent in as a containment study team. But I do not know that for a fact".


All coincidental...?

As previously noted, Burroughs does indicate he hever had any reason to expect a connection with previous events and in the absence of zero evidence otherwise, then coincidence has to be the default conclusion.

Amazing to think how this case has expanded over the years from a simple situation where a guy finds foil-like debris in the desert, hides it under a bush and goes to tell the local sheriff it might be one of those newfangled, 'flying saucers'...

No... wait... I'm getting confused...

Thankfully, in approximately 6 hours, 15 minutes and 30 seconds from now, here in Scotland the pubs can reopen!

Could honestly do with some sanity and a wee dram... :)
 
Comfortably Numb said:
Mentioned before that I wasn't so sure, 'colours' made any sense and I wondered if it could be, 'choppers'.
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Still in search of a possible clarification, I have located a previously unseen transcript, which originates from, 'Above Top Secret', by Timothy Good and reads:

LT COLONEL HALT: Yeah, they're both heading north. Hey, here he comes from the south; he's coming in toward us now.

MASTER SERGEANT BALL: Shit.

LT COLONEL HALT: Now were observing what appears to be a beam coming down to the ground.

[Excited shouting in the background]

MASTER SGT BALL: Look at the colors... shit

https://ufologie.patrickgross.org/htm/rendlestape.htm

Annoyingly, of course, presumably we can't be sure of this without hearing that exact same copy of the tape?
 
Ian Ridpath said:
The colour picture of rabbit scrapings in the forest floor was taken by me in the summer of 2010.
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Going back to the archive newsletter recently posted:

www.forteanmedia.com/V15.txt

Chris Armold states:

"I'm quite confident that Burroughs pointed out these marks before daylight. My opinion was that they looked like an impression made by a 3 pound US coffee can".

Reading this again, for the first time in around 20 years, something came to mind which, like 95% of the archive, documented material revised of late, I had entirely forgotten about.

I received correspondence at one point, from someone serving in the 81st Security Police Squadron (SPS) at the time, who mentioned occasional night-time activity within Rendlesham forest, which offered cover, involving certain of his colleagues.

It was illegal metal detecting.

Given the local area's rich history of archeology, there was a prospect of unearthing valuable artefacts.

Should the metal detector pick up a signal worth investigating, the detectorists would use a coffee can to earmark that spot, press it into the ground and then extract the contents for closer inspection.

Did you ever come across any mention of illegal detecting?

Obviously, any clearings amongst the trees would be a prime location and not impossible we would have both types of ground imprints there?
 
EnolaGaia said:
In it he describes his interview with the Frost family in August 1980...
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Difficult to know what we should make of that fascinating, 'UFO' report and greatly appreciated you took time to find it.

My personal intrigue concerning that mid-late 1980s period, encompasses the various conflicts which merged - the Soviet threat in Poland/Europe (obviously relevant to our A10s) and the Iran hostage crisis, etc.

So far as the latter, there were some highly classified rescue projects, one of which impacted, at least to some extent, on the late December 1980 Cash-Landrum 'UFO' incident, contemporary with our own at RAF Bentwaters/RAF Woodbridge.

In particular, one such, 'black' project, which although literally ending in a spectacular failure, evidenced that any, 'strange aeriel craft' was on the agenda:

'Operation Credible Sport'

 
Mentioned in an email, back in 2001, from SSgt, Peter DeWolf:

"I was a Staff Sergeant assigned to the 81st Equipment Maintenance Squadron, Missile Shop located in the weapons storage area".

(...)

"Another note is that a few days prior to this (the incidents) a British National was riding her horse somewhere north of the base and was thrown when a red ball flew over her while riding".

Presumably such a thing would have been a notable, local news story.

Anyone possibly help with this?
 
Comfortably Numb said:
The rest of the discussion essentially relates to a downed craft (possibly alien), which sat in the forest for 2-3 days, awaiting, 'electronic' repairs.
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Completely unnoticed by the foresters who worked out there every day, or the people who walked and rode through there – Rendlesham Forest is open public land, remember.

Comfortably Numb said:
Halt is named by Bustinza as being witnessed communicating with the craft's 'occupants',
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Here is repeating Larry Warren's story, although Warren said it ws Gordon Williams not Halt who did the 'communicating'.
 
Comfortably Numb said:
[Excited shouting in the background]

MASTER SGT BALL: Look at the colors... shit
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Since they were presumably looking south at this moment, I am fairly sure Ball is looking at Sirius, which is well-known for scintillating colourfully. Ball is almost certainly looking at it with his own eyes, rather than the Starlight scope, which only produces one colour- green.

Sirius even looks colourful compared to other nearby stars- here's Sirius compared to Betelgeuse and Rigel. Note these colours are not an illusion, and Ball was not imagining this - they are a real phenomenon, which can be seen with good eyesight.
rigel-betelgeuse-sirius-colors-e1522176754263.jpg
 
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