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Oh, The Irony

catseye said:
I wonder if they were influenced by too much American TV, where kids can drive alone on a learner's permit.
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escargot said:
Surely nobody here believes they can drive alone on a learner licence?
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Driver licensing regulations can vary among the 50 states, but I've never heard of anyone with a learner's permit being legally allowed to drive without a supervising adult in the passenger seat. However ...

Some states do provide for an intermediate or provisional license (more than a learner's permit; less than a full driver's license) for learner's permit holders who've meet certain requirements (e.g., length of time driving on the permit; driver's ed certification). These intermediate licenses allow limited legal driving under restricted conditions but don't require an adult supervisor on board.
 
EnolaGaia said:
Driver licensing regulations can vary among the 50 states, but I've never heard of anyone with a learner's permit being legally allowed to drive without a supervising adult in the passenger seat. However ...

Some states do provide for an intermediate or provisional license (more than a learner's permit; less than a full driver's license) for learner's permit holders who've meet certain requirements (e.g., length of time driving on the permit; driver's ed certification). These intermediate licenses allow limited legal driving under restricted conditions but don't require an adult supervisor on board.
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The accident in The Sopranos involves two teenage girls in a car. Another car (driven by someone UTI) veers towards them, glances off their vehicle and spins off the road, rolling down an embankment.

The girls' dialogue is as follows:

Kennedy (passenger): Maybe you should go back, Heidi.
Heidi (driver): I'm on my learner's permit after dark.

They continue on their way.

(One assumes the damage to Heidi's car is noted at some point and the cause of it deduced from news reports, but nothing is said because of who was in the other car!)
 
If the Sopranos scene takes place in New Jersey, the writers (or characters) are demonstrating misunderstanding of the law. A NJ learner's permit requires a supervisor in the front seat who is over 21 with a valid license and 3 years driving experience. After passing a road test the learner's permit is exchanged for a probationary license, which can be exchanged for a full license after a year. Both learner's permits and probationary licenses allow for driving "after dark", but not between 11PM and 5AM except for religious or educational purposes.

The only way to justify Heidi's line is to parse it as "I only have a learner's permit, and it's probably worse that I'm driving at night."
 
How are all these schoolkids able to drive themselves to and from school? Admittedly most of my knowledge comes from watching Buffy, but I remember her pleading with her mum to be allowed to borrow the car to go to school.

She prangs the car, if I remember rightly, so unlikely to have a probationary permit. She also goes out at night.
 
catseye said:
How are all these schoolkids able to drive themselves to and from school? Admittedly most of my knowledge comes from watching Buffy, but I remember her pleading with her mum to be allowed to borrow the car to go to school.

She prangs the car, if I remember rightly, so unlikely to have a probationary permit. She also goes out at night.
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In quite a lot of US TV series and films, kids seem to have their own cars.
How is this permitted?

OK, some states allow 14 year olds to have a learner's licence.
 
Mythopoeika said:
In quite a lot of US TV series and films, kids seem to have their own cars.
How is this permitted?

OK, some states allow 14 year olds to have a learner's licence.
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British sixth-formers could drive to school if they passed their test at 17. Some teenagers of better-off and especially rural families have access to cars.
 
The laws do vary a lot from state to state. We moved to Kansas when I was fifteen. I had a learner's permit from Iowa, where it wasn't the easiest thing to get. I failed my written test on the first try, and I was used to acing tests. It bummed me out for a week or so. You could get that permit at 14, and it was only good with a parent, guardian, or instructor in the seat next to you. At 16 you could get a provisional license, which was good for driving anywhere but it would be revoked if you got a single ticket. I knew a few high school students who had their own cars, but could not legally drive them. At 18, you got a full license.

In Kansas, the law was that you could get a restricted license at 14 I believe, which meant you could drive to school or work and back alone, but otherwise needed to have an adult along. In practice though, it was pretty much a free for all, especially during harvest. I knew 15 year old girls who could maneuver a big old grain truck around like a boss. My first license was a slip of heavy paper with a state seal printed on it, with my information typed in. They were, of course, very easy to fake. The de facto drinking age was 13 or 14. An awful lot has changed since then!
 
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escargot said:
If they were thick enough to believe that they're too stupid to take on! :chuckle:

In The Sopranos a driver leaves the scene of a fatal accident because they don't want to be prosecuted for driving after dark, which is illegal there for learners. They can drive unsupervised only in the daytime.

Surely nobody here believes they can drive alone on a learner licence?
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Clearly 2 girls believed they could. As far as thickness and being taken on is concerned, that was Ms Petes view (the positions were quite responsible ones). Quite how you can be in your 20's and still reach that level of thickness defeats me, but it's clearly possible.
 
PeteS said:
Clearly 2 girls believed they could. As far as thickness and being taken on is concerned, that was Ms Petes view (the positions were quite responsible ones). Quite how you can be in your 20's and still reach that level of thickness defeats me, but it's clearly possible.
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They're fooling themselves. They must know it's illegal but Dad says it's OK and anyway they don't want to walk everywhere and he doesn't want to drive them.

How did you find out they only hold provisional licences? Is driving a condition of the job?
 
Mythopoeika said:
In quite a lot of US TV series and films, kids seem to have their own cars.
How is this permitted?

OK, some states allow 14 year olds to have a learner's licence.
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Rich parents. As for the legality of it, yeah, a high-schooler having their license is not difficult as long as the parents are prompt about getting them the requisite classes/test.
 
I've mentioned this before on another thread.
Eight teenagers and a man of 23, nearly all from the same Cheshire village and all known to each other, died in road accidents in nine months in the mid-90s.

This writer tried to make a mystery out of it but to outsiders it seemed more like inexperienced drivers speeding in vehicles they couldn't handle.

VILLAGE OF THE DAMNED

There is a joint memorial to them in the village which I saw when I took elderly relations to visit our forebears' graves there some years ago. All very sad.
 
escargot said:
I've mentioned this before on another thread.
Eight teenagers and a man of 23, nearly all from the same Cheshire village and all known to each other, died in road accidents in nine months in the mid-90s.

This writer tried to make a mystery out of it but to outsiders it seemed more like inexperienced drivers speeding in vehicles they couldn't handle.

VILLAGE OF THE DAMNED

There is a joint memorial to them in the village which I saw when I took elderly relations to visit our forebears' graves there some years ago. All very sad.
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My cousin was down from Manchester a few weeks ago, hes in his early 20's and in to his cars, him and a group of his mates went for a 'cruise' up to Scotland recently and one of the group managed to flip his 'hot hatch' over a roundabout at about 80 mph, luckily nobody was injured, but the guys folks weren't too happy about having to go and pick him up at stupid o'clock in the morning and deal with his wrecked car.
 
escargot said:
They're fooling themselves. They must know it's illegal but Dad says it's OK and anyway they don't want to walk everywhere and he doesn't want to drive them.

How did you find out they only hold provisional licences? Is driving a condition of the job?
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No they apparently actually believed it was legal and driving was a condition of the job. Finding out? Ms Petes has a way of making people talk:hahazebs:. (Actually I think it's a legal or insurance requirement for driving licences to be produced when applying for a care job involving driving)
 
PeteS said:
No they apparently actually believed it was legal and driving was a condition of the job. Finding out? Ms Petes has a way of making people talk:hahazebs:. (Actually I think it's a legal or insurance requirement for driving licences to be produced when applying for a care job involving driving)
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Just thick then. :wink2:

Most unusual though.The whole point of applying for a provisional licence is to prepare for the test.
It's all laid out on the government page, including the £1,000 fine and 6 penalty points for driving without supervision.
 
escargot said:
Just thick then. :wink2:

Most unusual though.The whole point of applying for a provisional licence is to prepare for the test.
It's all laid out on the government page, including the £1,000 fine and 6 penalty points for driving without supervision.
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What was even more unusual was that this arose on the same day in the same batch of interviews for the same job. What are the chances?
 
PeteS said:
What was even more unusual was that this arose on the same day in the same batch of interviews for the same job. What are the chances?
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So it was two women from different families? I misunderstood your use of 'father' in your first post about this and assumed they were sisters.
 
escargot said:
I've mentioned this before on another thread.
Eight teenagers and a man of 23, nearly all from the same Cheshire village and all known to each other, died in road accidents in nine months in the mid-90s.

This writer tried to make a mystery out of it but to outsiders it seemed more like inexperienced drivers speeding in vehicles they couldn't handle.

VILLAGE OF THE DAMNED

There is a joint memorial to them in the village which I saw when I took elderly relations to visit our forebears' graves there some years ago. All very sad.
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Without wishing to offend anyone, was it a case of 'rich kids being given fast cars' sort of thing?
 
Junopsis said:
Rich parents. As for the legality of it, yeah, a high-schooler having their license is not difficult as long as the parents are prompt about getting them the requisite classes/test.
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Is it true to reality when we see the programmes where kids in some schools like in Beverly Hills own top of the range cars, that are far more expensive than most, if not all of the teachers?
 
Floyd1 said:
Without wishing to offend anyone, was it a case of 'rich kids being given fast cars' sort of thing?
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That was the general feeling. The victims came from a rural area where they'd've been driving from a very young age and would be used to having access to vehicles.

That said, there is sadly nothing unusual about inexperienced drivers coming to grief and taking their friends with them.

I don't know if this is more common around where I live - we have long, flat, straight roads - but it seems to happen a lot.
 
PeteS said:
Yes different families and no apparent connection- in a truly Fortean investigative manner I questioned Ms Petes closely on the subject.:chuckle:
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With access to no other relevant figures and so on a purely intuitive level, two such drivers in the same area appears statistically significant. :nods:
 
One of these again. It's just sad. They thought they did the right thing and lost.
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A prominent Israeli anti-vaccine activist has reportedly died of COVID-19.
His death came after he posted a final message to his Facebook followers on Saturday, informing them that his condition was "extremely critical."
Alongside a photo of himself on a ventilator, he wrote: "Dear friends. My situation is extremely critical."

Shaulian added that he was "in a very serious condition" and "unable to talk."
"I have no oxygen and can't stabilize," he continued. "It took me about an hour to figure out who I am. Where am I and what am I doing here. Lack of oxygen is a terrible thing."
He added that he believed he would recover "with God's help."

Despite his dire situation, Shaulian urged his followers to "keep fighting" against Israel's "Green Pass" scheme that registers who has been fully inoculated against COVID, if they have presumed immunity after contracting the disease, or tested negative in the previous 24 hours.
"It has nothing to do with the coronavirus," he wrote. "It has nothing to do with vaccines. It has to do with coercion."

When Shaulian fell ill last week, he claimed that police had tried to poison him after he was arrested during a protest against the Green Pass.
"I'm telling you, this is an attempt to wipe me out and if something happens to me know that's exactly what happened," he said in a social media video, according to The Times of Israel.

He previously called on his followers not to get vaccinated against COVID-19. "There is no epidemic—the vaccine is unnecessary and dangerous," he was quoted in The Post.
 
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uair01 said:
One of these again. It's just sad. They thought they did the right thing and lost.
View attachment 45060
A prominent Israeli anti-vaccine activist has reportedly died of COVID-19.
His death came after he posted a final message to his Facebook followers on Saturday, informing them that his condition was "extremely critical."
Alongside a photo of himself on a ventilator, he wrote: "Dear friends. My situation is extremely critical."

Shaulian added that he was "in a very serious condition" and "unable to talk."
"I have no oxygen and can't stabilize," he continued. "It took me about an hour to figure out who I am. Where am I and what am I doing here. Lack of oxygen is a terrible thing."
He added that he believed he would recover "with God's help."

Despite his dire situation, Shaulian urged his followers to "keep fighting" against Israel's "Green Pass" scheme that registers who has been fully inoculated against COVID, if they have presumed immunity after contracting the disease, or tested negative in the previous 24 hours.
"It has nothing to do with the coronavirus," he wrote. "It has nothing to do with vaccines. It has to do with coercion."

When Shaulian fell ill last week, he claimed that police had tried to poison him after he was arrested during a protest against the Green Pass.
"I'm telling you, this is an attempt to wipe me out and if something happens to me know that's exactly what happened," he said in a social media video, according to The Times of Israel.

He previously called on his followers not to get vaccinated against COVID-19. "There is no epidemic—the vaccine is unnecessary and dangerous," he was quoted in The Post.
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I find this for some reason incredibly sad.
 
PeteS said:
Because he was so deluded that he firstly believed that there was no epidemic, secondly that he didn't believe he had contracted Covid and thirdly that he believed god would save him. I find it sad that people can suffer from such delusions.
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The evidence of the pandemic was all around him. He was being stubborn.

If people want to let themselves die from it that's their lookout but trying to stop others having vaccinations is evil.

I wonder how far he got before realising God wasn't saving him.
 
Not a new story, but it cropped up on today's Quora and probably deserves a mention here as maybe the only time that an unsolicited text message to a mobile was welcome!

A would be suicide bomber and her accomplice were planning to detonate themselves in Red Square amongst the celebrating crowds, only for a Happy New Year text message sent from their mobile network prematurely detonated the bomb connected to their phones.

https://www.theregister.com/2011/01/27/sms_suicide_bomber/
 
escargot said:
The evidence of the pandemic was all around him. He was being stubborn.

If people want to let themselves die from it that's their lookout but trying to stop others having vaccinations is evil.

I wonder how far he got before realising God wasn't saving him.
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"Stubborn" is an understatement, he was clearly amongst other things an attention seeker. More fool the people who followed him, but some will never learn, despite their experiences and what's in front of their eyes.
 
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