• We have updated the guidelines regarding posting political content: please see the stickied thread on Website Issues.

Strange Crimes

hunck said:
Coventry Cat Shaver

A number of cats have been partially shaved since 2021.

The latest victim, six-year-old Tallulah, is the first in more than a year.

Her owner Bonnie Towe, who lives in the suburb of Radford, said she noticed the bald patch when her daughter picked up the beloved pet.

‘It had been done quite carefully as well, as her stomach didn’t look sore or cut.’


View attachment 62364
Click to expand...

Cat shaving spreads to Kent

In Walderslade.

1675896411044.png
 
maximus otter said:
"Gwin told the San Fransisco Chronicle that the woman, identified as “Cora,” had been behaving belligerently just before he turned the hose on her. He claimed she turned his trash cans upside down, was spitting on him and verbally berating him.

Despite her frequently hostile behavior, Gwin said he had a soft spot for the woman and had let her sleep in the entryway of his gallery for multiple days. He had called social services and police in an effort to get her help, but found they let her back out after several days and she returned."

https://nypost.com/2023/01/19/san-francisco-gallery-owner-shannon-collier-gwin-arrested/

As some context/background for this incident:

Fed-up San Francisco businesses vow to stop paying taxes over homeless problem​

August 29, 2022

Businesses in one of the trendiest sections of San Francisco are threatening to withhold tax payments unless the city takes action in removing homeless people from the area, claiming that their presence has hurt their bottom line.

The Castro Merchants Association, an umbrella group representing some local 125 businesses in the Castro District, wrote a letter to city officials earlier this month outlining their demands.

“We’re just seeing constant vandalism, constant drug use in public, people passed out on the sidewalk, people having psychotic breakdowns, and it’s just not something a small-business owner should have to deal with,” [a local gym owner] said.

Terrance Alan, the owner of Cafe Flore and Flore Dispensary, [said] that his businesses’ windows have been smashed 11 times and that several homeless people have been living on the streets for more than a decade.

“Every day we wake up and have to help people on the street,” Alan said.

“We have to clean up feces on the street. We have to clear our people from doorways, so we can open our businesses.”

“It’s not fair,” said Alan.

https://nypost.com/2022/08/29/fed-u...w-to-stop-paying-taxes-over-homeless-problem/

maximus otter
Click to expand...
Our NY Post newspaper is our favorite, they tell the real news! :)
By the way, that 'San Francisco Chronicle' in your post is the same newspaper featured in the 'Zodiac' film, it is where Robert Graysmith worked, he was the employee there who wrote the 'Zodiac' book.
 
Luffy isn't so lucky.

Japanese police have arrested four men for allegedly orchestrating scams and robberies while jailed overseas, in a case that has gripped the country.

Authorities say they targeted the elderly, and stole or cheated their victims of billions of yen. From their jail in the Philippines, the men managed to recruit accomplices in Japan to carry out the robberies.

One of them is said to be the mastermind, who calls himself "Luffy" after a popular anime character.

Philippine authorities deported two of them, Kiyoto Imamura and Toshiya Fujita, to Japan earlier this week. The other two - Yuki Watanabe and Tomonobu Kojima - arrived in Japan on Wednesday night.

They were among dozens of Japanese nationals who have been arrested in the Philippines since late 2019 on suspicion of involvement in scam crimes.

Japanese authorities had been hunting down the gang since the wave of crimes first began in the summer of 2021. More than 50 incidents spread across 14 prefectures are said to be linked to the gang, including one which resulted in the murder of a 90-year-old woman in Tokyo in January.

The four ringleaders were already held in a Philippine jail when they began their scheme, according to reports. Using their mobile phones, they recruited for accomplices in Japan via social media, where they put up cryptic ads for "dark part-time jobs" promising lucrative pay. They would send instructions and communicate with their gang members via the encrypted app Telegram.

The accomplices would pose as members of the police or members of the Japan Financial Services Agency and tell victims that their accounts had been compromised, according to the Asahi Shimbun. During a subsequent visit to the victim's home, the accomplice would steal their ATM cards to withdraw all their money. ...

The case has also underscored how detainees in Philippine jails are able to bypass security to command robbery, kidnapping and drug-dealing operations using their smartphones.

Before the "Luffy" case, past raids have found that inmates kept jacuzzi tubs, blow-up sex dolls, methamphetamines, high-powered guns, and a recording studio that allowed the ringleader of a kidnapping gang to record a music album and post music videos on YouTube. ...

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-64578543
 
hunck said:
Woman finds 'doppelgänger' on social media before killing her to stage own death

The mutilated body of a woman was found in a Mercedes Benz in a residential part of Ingolstadt in Germany, but the woman initially thought to be the victim turned out to be the killer, police say

Initially, police believed the body belonged to Sharaban K, whose surname is withheld in line with Germany privacy laws, a beautician with Iraqi ancestry.

But after DNA testing they found that Sharaban was in fact not the victim, but that Algerian beauty blogger Khadidja O was the woman brutally butchered and posed in the front seat of her car in a residential part of the Bavarian city.

The women looked "strikingly alike" both with straight jet-black hair, similar complexions and heavy makeup on their face, cops told local media.
Click to expand...

A similar case in New York.

A Russian woman living in New York city has been found guilty of attempting to murder her doppelgänger in a bizarre identity-theft plot.

Viktoria Nasyrova tried to kill her beautician Olga Tsvyk in 2016 by giving her a piece of cheesecake poisoned with a strong sedative.
However Ms Tsvyk survived, and when she returned from hospital, found her identity documents had been stolen. Nasyrova will be sentenced next month, and is facing up to 25 years in prison.

At the time, the pair looked quite similar, with dark hair and the same skin complexion, and they were both Russian speakers.

"The jury saw through the deception and schemes of the defendant," Melinda Katz, the Queens District Attorney said in a statement. "Fortunately, her victim survived and the poison led right back to the culprit," Ms Katz added.

The jury heard that in August 2016, Nasyrova, now 47, went to her beautician's house in Queens with a box of cheesecake - eating two pieces herself, and offering the third, poisoned slice to Ms Tsvyk, who was 35 at the time. She started to vomit and went to lie down.

"Before passing out, the woman's last memory was of seeing the defendant walking around her room," Ms Katz's statement said.

Ms Tsvyk's friend found her unconscious the next day, her clothes changed to lacey lingerie and pills scattered around the floor as if she had tried to take her own life. ...

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-64595317
 
It's the judge's reaction which recommends the story to this thread.

Man threw keg of beer through Cork book shop front window hours after release from prison​


A district court judge offered some advice to a Limerick man who threw a keg of beer through the front window of a shop in Cork.

Judge Colm Roberts said to 33-year-old Derek Lynch, of no fixed address: “When you cross and see a keg, ignore the keg, say ‘Goodnight keg’, and go on your way.”

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/courtandcrime/arid-41070743.html
 
EnolaGaia said:
This Wisconsin woman has been arrested and charged with murdering and dismembering a male acquaintance. I wonder what she did to warrant the third criminal charge - for sexual assault ... :thought:

SOURCE: https://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory/wisconsin-woman-charged-killing-man-mutilating-corpse-83187693
Click to expand...

Update:

“The Wisconsin woman accused of decapitating her lover during a wild meth-fueled escapade last year randomly attacked her own lawyer in the courtroom Tuesday — striking him in the head.

NYPICHPDPICT000006673130.jpg


Taylor Schabusiness, 25, lunged at defense attorney Quinn Jolly after the judge in the gruesome murder case suggested pushing the trial back two months.

The bizarre blowup came after Jolly asked Walsh for an extension in order to prove his client was not competent to stand trail for the February 2022 grisly murder of 25-year-old Shad Thyrion.

Schabusiness allegedly decapitated Thyrion during sex, continued to perform sexual acts on his lifeless body and mutilated his corpse with a serrated bread knife.

She then stuffed his severed head and penis in a bucket and other body parts in a crock pot, leaving them for his mother to find, prosecutors claim.

The woman — who is married to another man — was found by police at home covered in blood, records show.

She reportedly told cops they would “have fun trying to find all of the organs.”

https://nypost.com/2023/02/14/taylo...wyer-in-court-after-accused-of-killing-lover/

maximus otter
 
I couldn't make this up...

Man serving 15 years for murder tries to escape prison disguised as a sheep​

A prisoner serving 15 years for murder attempted to pull off an un-baa-lievable escape from jail by wrapping himself in sheepskin.
He was a real-life wolf in sheep’s clothing.
José Luis Callisaya Diaz attempted to escape from Chonchocoro, a maximum security prison in Bolivia, earlier this month by wrapping himself in sheepskin and crawling through the grassland surrounding the jail.

The inmate used his fleece coat to sneak past security and attempted to break through one of the prison’s external walls on February 4.

Despite his sneaky attempts, security noticed Diaz, who is serving 15 years for murder, was not in his cell.
Click to expand...
https://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/r...p/news-story/4b22d18fd5b6ad5041a65a97b7eeb713
 
Min Bannister said:
H

He probably knocked on the door and waited until he heard them at the other side.
Click to expand...
Yes. I spent many years in my early career out on the road investigating insurance claims, mainly burglary.

Every day, customers would "explain" to me how the burglars "must have known we were out" because the car was not on the drive, or the lights were not on, or... etc., and how they had now decided to leave the lights on on a timer, leave the TV on when they were out, etc.

I always told them, if I wanted to know if you were in, I would knock on your door. If you opened the door, I could easily make an excuse. "Is this 14 Smith Street?" "No, this is Smith Avenue." "Sorry."

Crime isn't complicated, because most victims are unsuspecting.

I often attended cases where the neighbours had spoken to the burglars without realising. If you walk away from a house confidently, with a TV under your arm, and smile and say hello to the neighbours, they will assume that you are entitled to be taking the TV. (And if you're wearing overalls or hi viz and have a white van, you can steal almost anything.)
 
Mikefule said:
I often attended cases where the neighbours had spoken to the burglars without realising. If you walk away from a house confidently, with a TV under your arm, and smile and say hello to the neighbours, they will assume that you are entitled to be taking the TV. (And if you're wearing overalls or hi viz and have a white van, you can steal almost anything.)
Click to expand...
Someone I knew years ago had a partner who'd do that. He and a mate would stride into Currys or some other electrical retailer wearing brown 'workman' coats and walk out with an expensive TV. As they looked like delivery men and there was no CCTV in the 1970s they got away with it many times.
 
Mikefule said:
Yes. I spent many years in my early career out on the road investigating insurance claims, mainly burglary.

Every day, customers would "explain" to me how the burglars "must have known we were out" because the car was not on the drive, or the lights were not on, or... etc., and how they had now decided to leave the lights on on a timer, leave the TV on when they were out, etc.

I always told them, if I wanted to know if you were in, I would knock on your door. If you opened the door, I could easily make an excuse. "Is this 14 Smith Street?" "No, this is Smith Avenue." "Sorry."

Crime isn't complicated, because most victims are unsuspecting.

I often attended cases where the neighbours had spoken to the burglars without realising. If you walk away from a house confidently, with a TV under your arm, and smile and say hello to the neighbours, they will assume that you are entitled to be taking the TV. (And if you're wearing overalls or hi viz and have a white van, you can steal almost anything.)
Click to expand...
I never answer the door even in daytime (unless I'm expecting a parcel, or if I looked out and saw a police car), because there is simply no need to otherwise.

In the past, MrsF's Mum and Dad have said that a ''guy came around last night selling windows/cleaning products'' etc and I ask why on earth are they opening the door at 7-8pm?
(At the very least, have a look out of a bedroom window first).

A lot of older people still seem to have this inherent trait of trust in people, even after all the stories we hear of them being robbed in their homes by someone that they have let in.
 
Floyd1 said:
A lot of older people still seem to have this inherent trait of trust in people, even after all the stories we hear of them being robbed in their homes by someone that they have let in.
Click to expand...

The scum responsible for distraction burglaries can be very plausible. Also, OAPs are from a generation accustomed to “deference to authority”, and if a man with an ID card brusquely announces that there’s been a gas leak in the area, and all citizens have to have their devices checked immediately, then…

l detest distraction burglars more than (most people profess to despise) paedos.

maximus otter
 

Cow sex allegation leads man to kill fiancée in Indonesia​


A man in Indonesia has been arrested for the murder of his fiancée, following her accusation that he had sex with a cow.

Authorities have detained a suspect, identified as Mikhael Oi, for the death of a 35-year-old woman, identified as Augustina Rere.

The suspect has been constantly abusing and assaulting his soon-to-be bride because he was disappointed that she would not agree to his demands of physical intimacy, according to the police.

The victim was attacked on two separate occasions, where she sustained fatal injuries in the second assault, the police said.

The man first attacked the woman on 4 Feb when he hit her with his bare hands. The second assault happened on 7 Feb when hit her with a wrench, which resulted in a serious physical injury.

“The suspect was upset with the victim because she accused him of committing adultery, often asking for sex, and that he had sex with a cow on their farm,” the local police chief said in the report.

https://news.yahoo.com/cow-sex-allegation-leads-man-kill-fiancee-indonesia-044350501.html

maximus otter
 
ramonmercado said:
A close call.

A prospective first-time buyer said he nearly bought a house which was being listed for sale fraudulently on property website Zoopla.

Max Holland had an offer accepted on a home in Cambridge in June 2020, but then police rang to tell him the house was not for sale by the real owner.

Last month, tenant Andrew Smith was jailed for his part in the fraud connected to the home in Argyle Street.

A Zoopla spokesperson said it had "a robust system of vetting and checks".

A joint BBC Radio 4 You and Yours and BBC Look East investigation has discovered fake estate agents had been invented and posted their listings on Zoopla.

Mr Holland said he had been house-hunting and saving for a deposit when he spotted a property that "seemed like a pretty good deal".

Using a form on the site, he got in touch with the agent, called Smith and Jones Estate Agents, who replied saying it had been sold - but offered him the details of a similar terraced house nearby which was "even nicer", he said. ...

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-cambridgeshire-63871888
Click to expand...

It's happening in Canada as well.

A Canadian couple recently learned that their home was sold by fraudsters without their consent while they were out of town. Experts say theft of this nature is rare, but there has been a notable rise of similar cases in the country's most populous city.

Early this year, Toronto police said they wanted the public's help in catching two people who were involved in a complex fraud scheme. The individuals, police said, had used fake identities to pose as owners of a home in the city. They then successfully sold the home, handing over the keys to the unsuspecting new owners.

The real owners of the home, meanwhile, had been out of the country for work since January 2022. The out-of-town couple only learned that their home had been sold without their knowledge months later, after noticing that their mortgage payments had disappeared from their bank accounts.

The incident captured the fascination of many in Canada, particularly in the Greater Toronto Area and Vancouver, where real estate is categorised as a national obsession because of its high cost - the average home costs over C$1m ($749,000; £620,000) - and housing scarcity.

Similar stories from other property owners in Toronto have since emerged, and investigators say these once-rare cases of property title fraud appear to be on the rise. ...

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-64547396
 

Fort Myers man arrested after disrespectfully consuming key lime pie​


/about 10 paragraphs into the article before we get to the important parts...

https://nbc-2.com/news/weird/2023/0...r-disrespectfully-consuming-key-lime-pie/amp/

-------------------------------
As the man’s blood began to boil over the disrespect shown to his key lime pie, he confronted David, and the two became embroiled in a war of words over the final course. In his attempt to de-escalate things, Powelson tried to “cool off” his heated opponent by dumping two large glasses of water all over the pie-less victim.

With that, the Lee County Sheriff’s Office was called, where the victim and Powelson each explained their side of the story, according to the arrest report. Following a brief investigation, Powelson was arrested and charged with battery on a person 65 or older.
 
Japanese Man Arrested For Attempting To Turn A Teenage Girl Into His Sex Slave By Showing Her Pictures Of Aliens
Hirohito Shibuya and his ex-wife, Chiaki, allegedly told the girl that she would be abducted by aliens if she did not enter into a relationship with them.

More here - did not fact check :)
https://allthatsinteresting.com/hir...NW5ZfF16MJ_mWb8YCjGwvs3DV2LH4SwDa4_MpJNsh_OEQ

On Feb. 7, 2023, police in Tokyo arrested a polyamorous 74-year-old man and one of his ex-wives for allegedly attempting to brainwash a young girl by showing her pictures of aliens.

As reported by Kyodo News, police believe that Hirohito Shibuya and his ex-wife Chiaki, 43, had been planning to sexually assault the adolescent girl after brainwashing her.

Officially, they were arrested on suspicion of attempting to commit constructive forcible sexual intercourse — meaning the victim is either unconscious or in no state to resist, investigators said.

Shibuya has denied the charges. Chiaki, meanwhile, has remained silent.

Investigators said the incident leading to Shibuya’s arrest occurred on Dec. 12, 2022, at Shibuya’s home in Higashiyamato, near Tokyo. Shibuya lives at the property alongside Chiaki and at least eight more of his ex-wives, as well as three children.

Police allege that Chiaki lured the adolescent girl to their home under the guise of introducing her to a genuine fortune teller. Instead, police believe Chiaki and Shibuya showed the girl images of aliens over the course of several hours, telling her she “would be abducted by aliens” unless she entered into a relationship with them.

The girl reportedly believed the couple and told them she would visit their home again. Thankfully, her friends and family convinced her to instead go to the police.
 

The Rick & Morty Killer: The Bizarre Case of Denver Fenton Allen​

In 2016 Rick and Morty creators would release a short animation to the internet. It was a re-creation of a real-life altercation between a judge and a schizophrenic murder suspect that occurred in court. The bizarre, vulgarity-laden tirade was recited word for word in Rick and Morty voices, and went viral shortly after its publication. While many are aware of this Rick & Morty side project, many are unaware of the details surrounding the actual court it was based on. Today I'll be telling you the story of behind just what might be the most unhinged courtroom exchange of all time. This is the story of The State of Georgia vs. Denver Fenton Allen
 
The Cookie Monster!

A Florida woman, apparently upset that a McDonald's restaurant in Altamont Springs failed to give her a free cookie to which she was entitled, drew a gun and waved it at its drive-through window. Even after being given the free cookie, she remained irate and was eventually arrested.

Amari Bente Hendricks, 24, was booked into the Seminole County Jail on Feb. 16 on several charges, including aggravated assault with a deadly weapon, improper exhibit of a firearm, battery causing bodily harm, and resisting an officer, the report said.
The McDonald's employee told an officer with the Altamonte Springs Police Department that the woman was mad that no one asked if she was using the fast-food restaurant's rewards program and because of that, she thought she was entitled to a free cookie, according to the arrest affidavit.
When the employee got to the window, Hendricks was allegedly yelling and acting irate. The woman was eventually given a free cookie, and continued to argue with the employee, the report said.
Click to expand...
Today I learned that McDonald's has a rewards program! So there's some good news today.

https://boingboing.net/2023/02/20/f...they-gave-her-the-free-cookie-she-wanted.html
 
An enterprising town employee is nabbed.

A town official was running an illegal cryptocurrency mining operation from a crawl space under a school in the US state of Massachusetts, police say.

Nadeam Nahas, 39, who was an assistant facilities director in Cohasset, pleaded not guilty in court on Friday. He is charged with fraudulent use of electricity and vandalising Cohasset High School, just outside Boston.

Crypto is digital currency that can be "mined" through specialised computer processors. Because of the heavy computer calculations needed to verify transactions, such mining uses huge amounts of electricity.

Authorities were first alerted to the possible crypto-mining operation in December 2021, said Cohasset Police Chief William Quigley in a statement to the BBC.

Mr Quigley said the operation was being run from a remote crawl space that was discovered beneath Cohasset High School by its director of facilities.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-64767178
 
Two pots of stew containing human tissue found but as yet no evidence of cannibalism. Seems to be related to financial disputes. Even if her husband and inlaws didn't consume her I hope they are consumed with guilt.

Four people have been arrested after the dismembered body of a model and influencer was found at a house in a Hong Kong village.

Abby Choi was first reported missing on Wednesday and grisly details about her death have now been released by police. Her 28-year-old ex-husband was arrested over the murder on Saturday while trying to leave the city by boat, police said.
The man's parents and elder brother were arrested a day earlier.

This story contains details some readers may find distressing.

Ms Choi's remains were found in a fridge in a house in Lung Mei village - roughly 27km (17 miles) from where she was last seen in Kowloon City on Tuesday.

"We believe the victim and her ex-husband's family had many financial disputes involving huge sums," police superintendent Alan Chung was quoted by news agency AFP as saying. "Someone was dissatisfied with how the victim handled her assets, which became a motive to kill."

Police said that two pots of stew believed to contain human tissue had been found in the house and that they were still searching for some of her body parts. ...

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-64769383
 
https://news.yahoo.com/man-15-old-arrested-shooting-211845797.html

Man, 15-year-old arrested in shooting of 9 children at Ga. gas station​


WSBTV.com News Staff
Sat, February 25, 2023 at 4:18 PM EST·1 min read


Two people, including a teenager, have been arrested and charged in connection with the shooting of nine children at a Georgia gas station last week.
Columbus police were called to a Shell gas station just after 10 p.m. on Feb. 17 where they found nine juveniles suffering from gunshot wounds.
All nine victims, which included a 5-year-old boy, were taken to local hospitals with non-life threatening injuries.

Officers have now arrested D’Angelo Robinson Sr., 35, and a 15-year-old boy for the shootings. The teenage suspect’s identity has not been released because he is a juvenile.

Robinson is facing eight counts of aggravated assault and the teen is facing one count of aggravated assault.

Investigators also say the 15-year-old is a known gang member.
Officials say more charges are expected.
Click to expand...
 
ramonmercado said:
Two pots of stew containing human tissue found but as yet no evidence of cannibalism. Seems to be related to financial disputes. Even if her husband and inlaws didn't consume her I hope they are consumed with guilt.

Four people have been arrested after the dismembered body of a model and influencer was found at a house in a Hong Kong village.

Abby Choi was first reported missing on Wednesday and grisly details about her death have now been released by police. Her 28-year-old ex-husband was arrested over the murder on Saturday while trying to leave the city by boat, police said.
The man's parents and elder brother were arrested a day earlier.

This story contains details some readers may find distressing.

Ms Choi's remains were found in a fridge in a house in Lung Mei village - roughly 27km (17 miles) from where she was last seen in Kowloon City on Tuesday.

"We believe the victim and her ex-husband's family had many financial disputes involving huge sums," police superintendent Alan Chung was quoted by news agency AFP as saying. "Someone was dissatisfied with how the victim handled her assets, which became a motive to kill."

Police said that two pots of stew believed to contain human tissue had been found in the house and that they were still searching for some of her body parts. ...

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-64769383
Click to expand...

They have found Abby's head and charges have been made.

The ex-husband and former in-laws of Hong Kong socialite Abby Choi have appeared in court after being charged in connection with her murder.

The accused include her ex-husband Alex Kwong, Kwong's brother Anthony and their father Kwong Kau. Kwong's mother, 63, has been charged with obstructing the case. They were all denied bail on Monday.

The 28-year-old was reported missing on Tuesday - the grisly details of her murder have shocked Hong Kong.

This story contains details some readers may find distressing.

Choi's head was found in a three-storey house in the rural Tai Po district on Sunday, days after her other body parts were found in the same location - roughly 27km (17 miles) from where she was last seen in Kowloon City on Tuesday. ...

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-64782060

A meat slicer and an electric saw were also found at the scene.
 
ramonmercado said:
They have found Abby's head and charges have been made.

The ex-husband and former in-laws of Hong Kong socialite Abby Choi have appeared in court after being charged in connection with her murder.

The accused include her ex-husband Alex Kwong, Kwong's brother Anthony and their father Kwong Kau. Kwong's mother, 63, has been charged with obstructing the case. They were all denied bail on Monday.

The 28-year-old was reported missing on Tuesday - the grisly details of her murder have shocked Hong Kong.

This story contains details some readers may find distressing.

Choi's head was found in a three-storey house in the rural Tai Po district on Sunday, days after her other body parts were found in the same location - roughly 27km (17 miles) from where she was last seen in Kowloon City on Tuesday. ...

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-china-64782060

A meat slicer and an electric saw were also found at the scene.
Click to expand...
This is a really hideous case and not terribly far from where I live. I'm usually pretty jaded about gory crime details but I felt quite ill reading about this one.
 
James_H said:
This is a really hideous case and not terribly far from where I live. I'm usually pretty jaded about gory crime details but I felt quite ill reading about this one.
Click to expand...
These types of murders have always bothered me because it reflects some people's views that women, especially spouses, daughters, exes are property and not people.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top