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Animal Suicide (Do Animals Commit Suicide Like Humans Do?)

A

Anonymous

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One of those random, idle thoughts - is suicide a purely human trait or is it also something that occurs in the animal kingdom?
And no myths about lemmings, please :)
 
straightdope.com/mailbag/mbugsuicide.html
Link is dead. See later post for the MIA webpage's contents.
 
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It is not rare for a perfectly healthy domestic pet rat to pine away and die in a matter of two or three days if it loses a close companion .
 
dogs and people do that too.
So do swans, I think.


pinkle
 
I was thinking more along the lines of a little noose and a hastily scrawled note.
 
Hanging isn't a nice way to go. It's too slow. It often fails. I hanged once, by accident as a child. Twasn't nice. My mum found me by coming into the livingroom by chance...or I wouldn't be here!

I read in someone else's newspaper (so I don't have a source, sorry) that a chap whose wife died of cancer got so depressed that he killed himself by sticking many nicotine patches to his chest.

Sorry to hijack thread. Thinking about it, I'd guess that only creatures with advanced intelligence would do this - dolphins, apes, etc. But then there's the swans who seem to have a lifetime attachment to each other, but as they are only birds, you wonder if emotional attatchments are more than based on intelligence.

OK I'm not making much sense, sorry. Had a couple glassses of wine!

Add more tomorrow, this is an interesting subject. As is the subject of whether animnals can be gay - did anyone see that Channel 4 programme? Damn interesting stuff.

pinkle (pickled)
 
Rolf Harris comments:

"Well life can be hard sometimes for the RSPCA inspectors. Recently
they had a call from a Mr Whitehead in Manchester. A beautiful
litter of Andrex puppies had somehow managed to lodge themselves
around his U-bend. What made it more remarkable was the fact that
this was the seventh litter drowned there that month!

Sadly, a bit of detective work by our inspectors uncovered the fact
that their owner was watching far too much television. Anaesthetised,
as he was by alcohol, it did him no harm whatever. But for the poor little
fellas, it was fatal!

By cross-checking their records, the RSPCA were able to ascertain that
the peak time for the puppies' deaths was Wednesday evenings during
house make-over programmes. Quite simply, they had lost the will to
live.

Mr Whitehead declined to comment on the brown stripes found all over
the pups. Continued page 96 . . ."
 
Pinklefish said:
Hanging isn't a nice way to go. It's too slow. It often fails.
Click to expand...
Not wishing to sound macabre, but if hanging takes longer than a couple of seconds, you're doing it wrong. The correct way to hang someone is to drop them far enough that the jolt on the end of the rope snaps their neck. (How long they actually live after this isn't exaclty clear, but the idea is that it is relatively quick and painless.) This isn't to say that dangling from the end of the rope won't kill you, but it does give you more of a chance to get discovered.

I guess we're lucky you didn't do it properly.

As for animals committing suicide, the obvious example is whales and dolphins beaching themselves, although I wouldn't want to be the one to say that they intend to die that way. There are also tales of migrating cattle (springboks, buffalo, and the like), although they are usually attributed to archaic migration routes that don't lead anywhere anymore rather than the loss of will to live. Some of these stories probably have as much truth in them as a Disney documentary on small rodents.
 
Pinklefish said:
But then there's the swans who seem to have a lifetime attachment to each other, but as they are only birds, you wonder if emotional attatchments are more than based on intelligence.
Click to expand...
Er, excuse me! Birds can be extremely intelligent (look at me, I can type :D ) Crows have been observed using tools, and as for psitacines, need I say more? Blasted cheek! I'll put it down to the alceehol. ;)
 
What about hedgehogs, they're always throwing themselves under cars - perhaps we should start putting prozac out for them instead of milk (1)



(1) Don't do this at home kids! And BTW, I know its catfood you put out because cow's milk is bad for them.
 
Google only found to be a handful of links on the subject.
This one is on the suicide of tarsiers in captivity.
This one is a general q&a on suicide in animals - sorry about the pidgin English, it was translated by Google.
Link is dead. The MIA webpage (in its original French) can be accessed via the Wayback Machine:
https://web.archive.org/web/20020805094614/http://www.cybersciences.com/cyber/2.0/q3867.asp
Click to expand...

The poor tarsiers. I can't think of a worse way to go than trying to smash your own skull.

The second link had some interesting turns of phrase. But you did warn us, so I read it with a pseudo-French accent and it didn't seem so bad.
:D :D
 
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What about rabbits, throwing themselves in front of cars? Suicidal tendencies or just daredevil attitudes?
'Go on, run in front of the car, bet you're too chicken, ...' :D
 
Is that not just myximitosis?
'Whassat noise? Who said that? Wh-Aaaargh!'
 
I think I can rememeber a mention that dolphins can conciously hold their breath until they die if they are captured and stressed .
 
Did I miss something?

Dolphins and whales of all sorts beach themselves and then die on the shore...generally from dehydration and their own weight crushing their lungs. If dragged back out to sea they will turn back to shore to beach themselves again. If that isn't suicide I don't know what is....
 
Reading about a recent whale beaching in the Firth of Forth, the causes given were failure of the animals' ability to navigate, probably caused by disease or manmade interference like engine sound, and in the case of mass beachings groups of animals following their leader who had become disorientated.
 
Wastrel said:
...the causes given were failure of the animals' ability to navigate, probably caused by disease or manmade interference like engine sound...
Click to expand...

But those are just theories as to the causes. There are instances of beachings all over the world without commonality of circumstance one to the other.

Quite frequently I've heard that these are sick animals, and "go off to die" but examinations don't always reveal illnesses. A similar statistical sampling of suicidal humans would, I suspect, reveal a similar rate of illness, but in humans the illness itsself is seldom the reason the individual commits suicide.
 
all kinds of animals

are alledged to use suicide.
Lemmings,Elephants,Whales,Dolphins,Dogs,cats.
I don't think we'll truly know until we can actual find a proper way of harness the converstaion skills of these animals, and asking them.Anything other than that is pure conjecture.
 
Fallen Angel said:
But those are just theories as to the causes.
Click to expand...
Suicide's just a theory as well. We just don't know, but what I do know is that if we all decide that it must be suicide then we have no hope of ever finding out the truth.
 
400 Sheep Commit Suicide in France

Well I think this can not be called suicide, and similar reasons may lead to such occurances.
sakina
AP

400 Sheep Commit Suicide in France
Tue Jul 23, 9:10 AM ET

More than 400 sheep leapt to their deaths this weekend in mountainous southeastern France — likely a panicked attempt to escape from a pack of wolves, police said.



The sheep have lain in a ravine near the Mercantour national park since Saturday, and police were burning them on Tuesday. Officials discovered wolf bite marks on some of the carcasses.

Police said there was no risk of contamination to the water supply.

The local agriculture department started a procedure to reimburse the owner, who lost 406 animals — nearly his entire herd.
 
Aren't there stories about groups of rats found dead in a circle with their tails linked together? Group suicide prehaps?
 
daftbugger said:
Aren't there stories about groups of rats found dead in a circle with their tails linked together? Group suicide prehaps?
Click to expand...
Sounds more like auto-erotic accidental death during fetishistic rituals to me. That's a whole different kettle of fish (or dead rats).
 
daftbugger said:
Aren't there stories about groups of rats found dead in a circle with their tails linked together? Group suicide prehaps?
Click to expand...

They're called 'Rat Kings'. I think there is also a bird version too.
 
I was talking to a Persian (refuses to be called Iranian) guy once and he told me how overworked donkeys sometimes just throw themselves off cliffs. Donkeys, or asses or mules are normally very sure footed so I think that this is a case of animal suicide.
 
"Mystery of canine ‘suicides’ at eerie bridge
ALAN MACDERMID March 03 2005

The ancient burgh has had its ups and downs. Being turned into a corner of Glasgow by the makers of River City may have been the last straw.
But can it have affected Dumbarton so badly that even the dogs have lost the will to live?
Animal experts admitted yesterday they had no explanation for a spate of what appear to be canine suicides – all from the same spot.
At least five dogs have jumped to their deaths from a bridge over a burn at Overtoun House in the past six months.
In the most recent case, a woman out walking her dog watched in disbelief as her pet suddenly vaulted over the parapet and plunged 40ft to its death.
The bridge attracts visitors and dog-walkers, but it already has an eerie past. It was the home of Lord Overtoun, owner of a huge chemical works and pillar of the Free Church, and was the location for a BBC TV series Tales from the Madhouse.
But neither the dogs' shocked owners nor animal behavioural experts have been able to explain why the pets have turned the beauty spot into Rover's Leap.
Joyce Stewart, a leading animal behaviourist who regularly works with the Scottish Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals (SSPCA), said the pattern of deaths at the bridge was abnormal.
She said: "Dogs are very able to gauge the heights and depths they can safely jump. Some people will say this is very spooky and would look for another reason.
"I have never heard of a dog committing suicide. Often if they know they are going to die, they might go into hiding, but I have never heard of them actually taking their own lives.
"This is very weird. For five dogs to have done the same thing at the same spot is very mysterious. But there must be some rational explanation for it that has just not emerged.
"The bridge and what has happened there need to be urgently investigated."
Overtoun House was built in 1863 by James White, the father of Lord Overtoun. It was built as an ornate religious symbol and has the words "Fear God and keep His commandments" carved into its walls.
Local historians describe it as a place where angels and gargoyles are said to keep company.
It is now being renovated as a Christian Centre for Hope & Healing – part of a £2.5m project by Pastor Bob Hill.
But the outbreak of lemming-like behaviour has sent shudders down the spines of animal welfare inspectors, local residents and dog owners.
A spokeswoman for the SSPCA warned dog owners to get their pets on leads around the bridge.
She added: "It does seem rather strange that so many dogs are doing this at this same spot and it must have been heartbreaking for the owners."
One owner, who lost her cocker spaniel when it recently leapt off the bridge, said: "I know that a number of other dogs have died after jumping from that spot .I read somewhere that Dumbarton is one of the most depressing places to live in Britain, but I thought that meant for humans, not dogs."
The ancient burgh has had its ups and downs. Being turned into a corner of Glasgow by the makers of River City may have been the last straw.
But can it have affected Dumbarton so badly that even the dogs have lost the will to live?
Animal experts admitted yesterday they had no explanation for a spate of what appear to be canine suicides – all from the same spot.
At least five dogs have jumped to their deaths from a bridge over a burn at Overtoun House in the past six months.
In the most recent case, a woman out walking her dog watched in disbelief as her pet suddenly vaulted over the parapet and plunged 40ft to its death.
The bridge attracts visitors and dog-walkers, but it already has an eerie past. It was the home of Lord Overtoun, owner of a huge chemical works and pillar of the Free Church, and was the location for a BBC TV series Tales from the Madhouse.
But neither the dogs' shocked owners nor animal behavioural experts have been able to explain why the pets have turned the beauty spot into Rover's Leap.
Joyce Stewart, a leading animal behaviourist who regularly works with the Scottish Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals (SSPCA), said the pattern of deaths at the bridge was abnormal.
She said: "Dogs are very able to gauge the heights and depths they can safely jump. Some people will say this is very spooky and would look for another reason.
"I have never heard of a dog committing suicide. Often if they know they are going to die, they might go into hiding, but I have never heard of them actually taking their own lives.
"This is very weird. For five dogs to have done the same thing at the same spot is very mysterious. But there must be some rational explanation for it that has just not emerged.
"The bridge and what has happened there need to be urgently investigated."
Overtoun House was built in 1863 by James White, the father of Lord Overtoun. It was built as an ornate religious symbol and has the words "Fear God and keep His commandments" carved into its walls.
Local historians describe it as a place where angels and gargoyles are said to keep company.
It is now being renovated as a Christian Centre for Hope & Healing – part of a £2.5m project by Pastor Bob Hill.
But the outbreak of lemming-like behaviour has sent shudders down the spines of animal welfare inspectors, local residents and dog owners.
A spokeswoman for the SSPCA warned dog owners to get their pets on leads around the bridge.
She added: "It does seem rather strange that so many dogs are doing this at this same spot and it must have been heartbreaking for the owners."
One owner, who lost her cocker spaniel when it recently leapt off the bridge, said: "I know that a number of other dogs have died after jumping from that spot .I read somewhere that Dumbarton is one of the most depressing places to live in Britain, but I thought that meant for humans, not dogs."
The ancient burgh has had its ups and downs. Being turned into a corner of Glasgow by the makers of River City may have been the last straw.
But can it have affected Dumbarton so badly that even the dogs have lost the will to live?
Animal experts admitted yesterday they had no explanation for a spate of what appear to be canine suicides – all from the same spot.
At least five dogs have jumped to their deaths from a bridge over a burn at Overtoun House in the past six months.
In the most recent case, a woman out walking her dog watched in disbelief as her pet suddenly vaulted over the parapet and plunged 40ft to its death.
The bridge attracts visitors and dog-walkers, but it already has an eerie past. It was the home of Lord Overtoun, owner of a huge chemical works and pillar of the Free Church, and was the location for a BBC TV series Tales from the Madhouse.
But neither the dogs' shocked owners nor animal behavioural experts have been able to explain why the pets have turned the beauty spot into Rover's Leap.
Joyce Stewart, a leading animal behaviourist who regularly works with the Scottish Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals (SSPCA), said the pattern of deaths at the bridge was abnormal.
She said: "Dogs are very able to gauge the heights and depths they can safely jump. Some people will say this is very spooky and would look for another reason."
Click to expand...
:shock: :shock: Don't know about you folks, but this is the strangest thing I've heard of for a very long time :shock: :shock:

For more about this particular story see the thread dedicated to it:

Dog Suicides At Overtoun Bridge
https://forums.forteana.org/index.php?threads/dog-suicides-at-overtoun-bridge.63252/
 
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Suicidal Pigeons (and/or other animals)

Greetings, good people of the board.

Today, driving to work, I had to swerve to avoid a pigeon in the road.

Not particularly an earth-shattering event you might think, but since the beginning of this year I have had a number of similiar events.

The pigeons in question just sit in the road. They do not attempt to fly or run out of the way - they just sit there (as if on a nest.)

The pigeons look quite normal. I'm not a vet or anything, but they don't look as though they have been hit/attacked/ill - just 'serenely' waiting - (...and not for the no. 86 bus either!)

I live in London, and the roads I travel are, well, busy. I cannot imagine a bird would survive long in that positon.

I wonder if they want their time to come,or does anyone have another explanation?

Regards
Bazizabitsaddeneduno
 
Maybe they're one of those pigeons who have mysteriously lost a leg. There's no explanation for that either.
 
GNC said:
Maybe they're one of those pigeons who have mysteriously lost a leg. There's no explanation for that either.
Click to expand...
Round her we sometimes get seagulls and swans with fishing line around their legs, which I'd imagine could lead to the loss of the leg.
 
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