Billy Meier

vogel7fire

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stu neville wrote:
Oh I see - in the sense that though he regards it as wrong he accepts that it takes place?
He does not regard it as wrong. He is saying that some people, by nature, are homosexuals. What is "un-natural" is the inability to procreate.

I will continue to look in the FIGU archived material to locate my exact question and his exact answer.
 

AMPHIARAUS

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vogel7fire said:
Amphiaraus wrote:
Also seems Marcel didn't have a very good opinion of Billy - but that is just hearsay now.
Marcel and I didn't talk about Billy much as I recall. I would nonetheless be very interested in the "hearsay" if you are willing to provide it.
Likewise I would like to hear your anecdotes! I wont quote directly without permission but to paraphrase others quotes re: Vogel about Meier:
  • not convinced.
    somewhat of a skeptic about these things.
    doubtful.

Do you have any clue regarding / contact details for for Siegfried Vogel? as his co-inventor / relative at IBM I would be very interested in their opinion. I have seen his/their patent and it it is a genuine technical patent, not new age rubbish so will not dismiss any of his opinions without consideration.

Anyway the most important thing is credibility and so far that is not forthcoming as the claims for him (100 + patents) do not match reality (1 shared patent)

My personal opinion after a more than fair shake of the stick:

Meiers credibility is hovering around zero
Alledged eyewitnesses testimony is poor to negative
The late Mr Vogels contribution is a bit muddy.
 

vogel7fire

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Amphiaraus wrote:
Likewise I would like to hear your anecdotes! I wont quote directly without permission but to paraphrase others quotes re: Vogel about Meier:

not convinced.
somewhat of a skeptic about these things.
doubtful.


Do you have any clue regarding / contact details for for Siegfried Vogel? as his co-inventor / relative at IBM I would be very interested in their opinion. I have seen his/their patent and it it is a genuine technical patent, not new age rubbish so will not dismiss any of his opinions without consideration.

Anyway the most important thing is credibility and so far that is not forthcoming as the claims for him (100 + patents) do not match reality (1 shared patent)

My personal opinion after a more than fair shake of the stick:

Meiers credibility is hovering around zero
Alledged eyewitnesses testimony is poor to negative
The late Mr Vogels contribution is a bit muddy.
My anecdotes stretch over a 10 year period of time. I think that's whole chapters of my unfinished autobiography "Pieces of the Puzzle."
I will tell you all this much. It may resonate with some of you. The first night I met Marcel, he told me something that I will never forget:

You are not of this world. There are many of you. You have been sent here on missions. In your heart of hearts you know what your mission is. You do not think like most people think. You do not feel like most people feel.

Now, this:
to paraphrase others quotes re: Vogel about Meier:

not convinced.
somewhat of a skeptic about these things.
doubtful.
I wonder what "these things" means. Marcel and I talked often about the Pleiadeans (that's what they were called in 1980 and for years after that until the name changed to Plejarens). I certainly thought he considered them very real. He told me he had telepathic contact with them and was "trying to bring them out, but they won't come out." I know, according to Rumi Da (and I posted this previously) that he was very unhappy that someone would send him "phony samples" after the original metal sample disappeared (dematerialized? got beamed up?)

I don't have any contact details for Siegfried Vogel (yes, surely a relative). Once again, I suggest you e-mail Rumi Da for that information.

Did Michael Horn claim that Marcel had 100+ patents?

Finally,
My personal opinion after a more than fair shake of the stick:

Meiers credibility is hovering around zero
Alledged eyewitnesses testimony is poor to negative
The late Mr Vogels contribution is a bit muddy.
I agree that Marcel's contribution is a bit muddy. What would it take, in your opinion, to bolster the credibility of Meier and the eyewitnesses or witnesses?
 

Mighty_Emperor

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vogel7fire said:
What would it take, in your opinion, to bolster the credibility of Meier and the eyewitnesses or witnesses?
Its an interetsing question - in this case and Forteana in general.

I suppose everyone has to set the levels accordingly but I suppose:

1. Reliable witnesses - most times friends and family would be a bit iffy but if, as has been suggested a number of times, we are dealing with something bordering on a cult then you need to be extra cautious. That sai a lot o that testimnoy makes me wodner what they actually saw. Meier seems to be seeing very clear ships but most witnesses get a run around in a dark wood followed by some odd lights. Their testimony makes me suspect something suspcious is going on not he other way around.

2. Corroborating evidence - the stuff from the air force sounds intriguing but do we have anything other than that guy's word?

3. Testing of physical evidence - getting the space metal tested and it showing clear signs of being not of this earth.

It is ultimately up to people making the claims to provide solid proof and as he has been shown to be a faker Meier and co have a big mountain to climb and at this stage they'd need to pull somehting special out of the bag.
 
A

Anonymous

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Larry King Live

Larry King Live today on UFO and Aliens
Airs: 9-10 p.m. ET

Wednesday's show: Experts weigh in on UFO sightings -- and people's claims they’ve been abducted by aliens.
 

vogel7fire

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Emperor wrote:


1. Reliable witnesses - most times friends and family would be a bit iffy but if, as has been suggested a number of times, we are dealing with something bordering on a cult then you need to be extra cautious. That sai a lot o that testimnoy makes me wodner what they actually saw. Meier seems to be seeing very clear ships but most witnesses get a run around in a dark wood followed by some odd lights. Their testimony makes me suspect something suspcious is going on not he other way around.
I've read and read the witness testimony from the sites I gave you.
As I read it, there are a number of people who are talking of sightings as early as 1975, these include "children" who are most likely to report what they see. The "cult" seems to be a product of internet sites related to the information from FIGU. I know that when I discovered and joined the FIGU discussion group in 1998/1999, the website and forum had only just been formed. I've also heard (from someone) that the Plejarens told Billy that he would "not be happy with the current group." That could be total hearsay. So, I think the likelihood of early witness testimony is good. Also, as I read the witnesses, it seems that several people had not only daylight sightings, but three (maybe) saw Asket, Ptaah, and Semjase. I'm still willing to give some credence to this criteria.

2. Corroborating evidence - the stuff from the air force sounds intriguing but do we have anything other than that guy's word?
In some cases, "the word" is the best we can do. I hope you are familiar with the work of Dr. Steven Greer, founder of the Disclosure Prolect. It was Dr. Greer who gathered a group of top military, government, and intelligence witnesses to speak at the National Press Club Conference in Washington, D.C. on May 9,2001 for the purpose of uncovering a 50+ year government cover-up and for attesting to the reality of Exterrestrials,
Extraterrestrial Vehicles (ETV's - they are no longer Unidentified Flying Objects or UFO's) and extraterrestrial intelligence. Each speaker says "My testimony is true and I will tell this to the United States Congress." You may be interested in taking a look at it: http://www.netro.ca/disclosure/npccmenu.htm

So, here I would be willing to hear the testimony of UFO Researcher Erwin Murner from Zurich who claims to have confirmed information by talking with two Swiss Air Force officers. Coupled with the very early (1975ish) eyewitness testimony, I argue that the "witness testimony" of the case could help but not hurt the case.
3. Testing of physical evidence - getting the space metal tested and it showing clear signs of being not of this earth.
Okay, here we are again (Think I'll go join Spillage now for a toddy.)
In all seriousness, would you and perhaps some others care to join in on an e-mail to FIGU Switzerland? Michael says there are other samples there. I don't seem to be having much response about re-opening this aspect of the investigation, but there's nothing keeping anyone else from making a case for it. I'd be willing to help draft something, but you seem to have some very capable writers here. I'd certainly want to sign any finished piece.

Finally,
It is ultimately up to people making the claims to provide solid proof and as he has been shown to be a faker Meier and co have a big mountain to climb and at this stage they'd need to pull somehting special out of the bag.
Yes, very true, once any of us gets caught in lies and fraud, our credibilty is pretty well shot. (Okay, is this why the Plejarens deliberately insert "plausible deniability" so that Billy will not be readily believed? That's what they say, anyway. :roll: )

But I'm with you. I wouldn't mind it at all if something really special
jumped right out of the bag. We're left with:

1)witnesses (maybe) to seeing the craft, seeing 3 different ET beings, seeing landing tracks, hearing and tapes of the sounds of the craft, and photographs of the craft

2)a very iffy metal specimen

3)new handprints left on the hood of someone's truck and currently being analyzed

4)all the contact notes (information imparted to Billy alone by his ET friends)

5) what Michael Horn calls the "higher standard of proof" i.e. Billy's prophetically accurate information, allegedly imparted to him by his Plejaren friends

6)The (questionable) co-discovery by Billy and Rashid of theTalmud of Jmmanuel

7)the absolutely unproven ancient parchment listing the seven prophets of Billy Meier's prophetic lineage

(If I can think of more, I'll add it)

8)witnesses to a partly burned tree after a beamship made physical contact with it.

9)witnesses to a tree completely vanishing, leaving no trace of ever having been there

10)of the "The Spiritual Teachings." A whole category of its own which doesn't (to my knowledge) provide evidence of the Plejarens

Again, if I think of anything else . . . (How many times can you edit?)
 
A

Anonymous

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Ufology is full of such accounts - what is the evidence beyond people's word for this?
People's word should ammount up to something.Maybe you have noticed that the courts of law often work with eyewitness testimonies to reach a conviction.The more there are of those, the higher the probability that the accused will be sentenced for their crime(s).
Of course the prosecution and the defence will bend those eyewitness testimonies to their advantage.Not because it's the objective thing to do, no, because it helps their respective causes.Ufology is similar to this example.

TerraX
 
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True, but courts of law aren't dealing with paranormal phenomena. They're dealing with everyday occurences such as theft, murder, and fraud. No-one would claim that theft didn't exist. We can take that for granted. The only question is whether or not the defendant is guilty of it.

However, we certainly can't take the existence of aliens, and more specifically, Pleiadians, for granted. And it will take more than half-a-dozen eyewitness accounts of dubious provenance before we can. It's interesting that Meier himself dismisses virtually everyone else who has ever claimed extraterrestrial contact as a fraud (see, for example, this interview), and yet his own 'evidence' is of exactly the same nature as that proffered by the likes of George Adamski and Howard Menger. Why should we believe Meiers' cronies but not Mengers? Why should we take Meiers' dodgy photos seriously but not Adamskis?

The vast majority of people who have anomalous experiences do not act in the way Meier does. They see something strange in the sky, or meet a bizarre entity, report their encounter, then go back to living out their everyday lives. I'm inclined to credit them with at least being sincere (even if they are sincerely mistaken). However, when someone who claims an alien encounter turns it into a cottage industry and sets themselves up as a virtual messiah, then I'm inclined to be much more sceptical and to demand a much greater quality of evidence.
 

vogel7fire

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Graylien wrote:
The vast majority of people who have anomalous experiences do not act in the way Meier does. They see something strange in the sky, or meet a bizarre entity, report their encounter, then go back to living out their everyday lives. I'm inclined to credit them with at least being sincere (even if they are sincerely mistaken).
By 1980, I was no longer capable of living out my every day life. I was literally compelled to disseminate the little information I had about the Meier case and my personal anecdotal stories spanning a decade that connected me to the Pleiadeans. My "mission" was to speak of their existence. As I was an experienced teacher, it seemed that's what I should do.
. . .when someone who claims an alien encounter turns it into a cottage industry and sets themselves up as a virtual messiah, then I'm inclined to be much more sceptical and to demand a much greater quality of evidence.
Spot on. I don't know of any other contactee Messiah besides Meier. Demanding a much greater quality of evidence is exactly what I'd like done and presented to FIGU Switzerland.

I especially noticed this statement of Billy's from the link you provided:

Furthermore, the spiritually and physically very advanced Pleiadians are able to maintain personal, i.e., physical contact only with those Earth humans who have reached the high spiritual level of evolution necessary for the physical and telepathic contacts and for meaningful dialogues. I am the only human being on Earth who is able to maintain physical and telepathic contact with Pleiadians and other life forms of the same evolutionary level. Nobody on Earth is able to do this, not even those people whose spirit forms did not originate on Earth
I agree and disagree.
 

BuckeyeJones

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By 1980, I was no longer capable of living out my every day life. I was literally compelled to disseminate the little information I had about the Meier case and my personal anecdotal stories spanning a decade that connected me to the Pleiadeans. My "mission" was to speak of their existence. As I was an experienced teacher, it seemed that's what I should do.
So you have been in this racket for 25+ years as well eh?

1980 was a good year for me as well, Joey Ramoan puked on my guitar case.
I felt compelled to wash it off.
How many Vogel's are involved in this thing anyway?

Once these board members get on the scent they are like a blood hound after an escaped convict.............

Peace
=^..^=217
Oh and just for the record, I too think there was alien intervention in human development. ( that is why our minds out pace our emotions and bodies)
 
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Anonymous

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By 1980, I was no longer capable of living out my every day life. I was literally compelled to disseminate the little information I had about the Meier case and my personal anecdotal stories spanning a decade that connected me to the Pleiadeans. My "mission" was to speak of their existence. As I was an experienced teacher, it seemed that's what I should do.

So you have been in this racket for 25+ years as well eh? (Like Michael Horn!!!!)

Hmmmmmmm....well done Buckey....maybe you just pointed out some Horn related relevence there! HO HO!
 

vogel7fire

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Buckeye Jones wrote and spillage echoed:

So you have been in this racket for 25+ years as well eh? (like Michael Horn)
Well, I do believe I resent that innuendo. I've been in no "racket" . And actually, as I've previously posted, my connection to the Pleiades begins in 1971 -- so that makes almost 35 years. It was by 1980 that I decided to present some public seminars for which I received no compensation. I was volunteering at an adult education program that resulted in the most terrifying years of my life, Trust me, you would not want to live through those years. Try, if you can, to empathize ever so slightly. I did not learn of the FIGU organization or website until 1998/1999. And, as I've previously told you I have been "the black sheep" of the various forums I've participated in, I am not an internet evangelist, and now I feel like I'm repeating myself, repeating myself, repeating myself . . .should we down 12 double vodkas and have a real repetitive "moment of clarity" drunken conversation? (Now, now vogel7fire, don't get too fiery!) :evil:
 
A

Anonymous

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graylien said:
True, but courts of law aren't dealing with paranormal phenomena. They're dealing with everyday occurences such as theft, murder, and fraud. No-one would claim that theft didn't exist. We can take that for granted. The only question is whether or not the defendant is guilty of it.

However, we certainly can't take the existence of aliens, and more specifically, Pleiadians, for granted. And it will take more than half-a-dozen eyewitness accounts of dubious provenance before we can. It's interesting that Meier himself dismisses virtually everyone else who has ever claimed extraterrestrial contact as a fraud (see, for example, this interview), and yet his own 'evidence' is of exactly the same nature as that proffered by the likes of George Adamski and Howard Menger. Why should we believe Meiers' cronies but not Mengers? Why should we take Meiers' dodgy photos seriously but not Adamskis?

The vast majority of people who have anomalous experiences do not act in the way Meier does. They see something strange in the sky, or meet a bizarre entity, report their encounter, then go back to living out their everyday lives. I'm inclined to credit them with at least being sincere (even if they are sincerely mistaken). However, when someone who claims an alien encounter turns it into a cottage industry and sets themselves up as a virtual messiah, then I'm inclined to be much more sceptical and to demand a much greater quality of evidence.
Very good, greyalien, on multiple accounts.It's nice to see someone paying attention.Because of the claim that extraterrestrials visit us, the standard changes dramaticly simply because people have a hard time accepting it or basicly don't want to accept.
That's why most people wont have a problem if 6 eyewitnesses identify a person that stole their car but those same 6 eyewitnesses aren't good enough if they saw a UFO land and an ET step out.

On the subject of Meier's treatment of other 'contactees', again a correct observation.Others such as Adamski and Menger had the same kind of case with pictures, films and eyewitnesses.They also had controversy just like Meier but the latter takes a completely different course of action and tries to debunk other sources in ufology in a consistent manner.On this point I'm of the opinion that Meier lies through his teeth and he knows it, he just seeks monopoly on spiritual, religious and ufological matters.

More on this later,
TerraX
 
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Anonymous

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I don't wish to offend anyone or get their goats up...but, do you feel there's a bit of Good cop Bad cop psychology going on here?
Just my observational scepticism here...not making any specifics.
 
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Anonymous

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spillage said:
I don't wish to offend anyone or get their goats up...but, do you feel there's a bit of Good cop Bad cop psychology going on here?
Just my observational scepticism here...not making any specifics.
While I'm not offended spillage, I do find it funny since you appear to be a better conspiracy theorist than I am.
 
A

Anonymous

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I'm sorry? What do you mean by that? If you mean that my naturally suspicious manner on this thread sounds a little like a conspiracy theorist, then you are either being sarcastic or are mistaken. It's a defensive mechanism rather than a wooly headed one. Think about it! :roll:
 

AMPHIARAUS

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vogel7fire said:
Now, this:
to paraphrase others quotes re: Vogel about Meier:

not convinced.
somewhat of a skeptic about these things.
doubtful.
I wonder what "these things" means. Marcel and I talked often about the Pleiadeans (that's what they were called in 1980 and for years after that until the name changed to Plejarens). I certainly thought he considered them very real. He told me he had telepathic contact with them and was "trying to bring them out, but they won't come out." I know, according to Rumi Da (and I posted this previously) that he was very unhappy that someone would send him "phony samples" after the original metal sample disappeared (dematerialized? got beamed up?)

I don't have any contact details for Siegfried Vogel (yes, surely a relative). Once again, I suggest you e-mail Rumi Da for that information.

Did Michael Horn claim that Marcel had 100+ patents?

I agree that Marcel's contribution is a bit muddy. What would it take, in your opinion, to bolster the credibility of Meier and the eyewitnesses or witnesses?
OK "these things" is the Meier case itself. Seems that the people you have been pointing us to dont sing from the same song sheet.

I have had contact with Rumi, but have yet to get a response to my last message.

The number of Patents people claim for him varies from 32 to 100+. I think Rumi's crystal website quotes 100. Problem is he only really has one credit, and a joint one at that, so they are all mistaken.

What would it take to 'bolster' the credibility of this case? I'm not sure that its possible - after all you would need some credibility to start with.

And no its not about extraordinary evidence - its just about having anything that stands up to scrutiny and so far not a thing does.

You seem to have had experiences that have drawn you to the whole Pleiadian / Meier story.
Have you considered alternatives? Intense visions and dreams are everyday occurences. Telepathic contact (itself an unproven paranormal phenomenon) could be coming from anywhere.
Would a mischief making demon be any less credible than telepathic aliens?
 

vogel7fire

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I have just learned of the exlosions that ripped through the transportation system in London, the resulting damage, deaths and injuries. What I see on CNN is devastating. As some of you are there or near there, I cannot help but wonder how you and your loved ones are.

I will get to some other posts later.
 
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Anonymous

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My deepest sympathy over the terrible event today in London.

It is a sad day for U.K., Europe, and the World.
The U.S. is partly to blame IMO for the mess we got us in.
Hope you are all doing well.

SkySpirit
 
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Anonymous

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Should the discussion still be ongoing regarding the authenticity of the Meier case, this should be sufficient to resolve the issue (for reasoning, logical and open minds):

1998: Swiss Military Airspace Safety Monitoring Unit informed Swiss ufologist Luc Bürgin and the MUFON-CES research group about recorded data pertaining to radar sightings of unknown flying objects in the Swiss air space. According to their information, 236 UFO radar sightings took place in the airspace above the land of the Swiss confederates between the 25-month period from April 1, 1993 to April 31, 1995. Particularly noteworthy were the clusters of UFO radar positions above the Zurich highlands—precisely in the area where Billy Meier has his contacts.
 

Jerry_B

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'Unknown flying objects' does not necessarily equal 'spaceships'. It's a bit of a leap to assume that it does - especially if we are to have a 'reasoning, logical and open minds'.
 
A

Anonymous

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Well of course, 236 confirmed UFO radar sightings over the area of Meier's contacts, hey similar things are confirmed over radar all the time, virually everywhere, right?

It's obviously a mere coincidence that these should happen to be occurring right where the 63-year long Meier case is occurring. And, as for the following info, don't tell me, isn't this where the ubiquitous "anyone" who "could have said that" (but of course didn't) is alluded to?

Contact 251, Feb.3, 1995, Meier foretells the future of animal food production and the “growing” of meat in laboratories.
Corroborated: July 6, 2005 Univ. of Maryland scientists propose techniques for growing meat in vitro. Reported in June 29 issue of Tissue Engineering.

Contact 150, 10 Oct. 1981, Meier publishes information about planetary system with 3 suns and 16 planets.
Corroborated: July 15, 2005 New proof that these complex planetary systems involving 3 suns actually exist: "Before now we had no clues about whether planets could form in such gravitationally complex systems," said Dr. Konacki, of the California Institute of Technology.

The words "intellectual honesty" are not synonymous with "mental contortions".

And we wonder why "they" won't "prove" their existence!
 

Timble2

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Michael812 said:
Contact 251, Feb.3, 1995, Meier foretells the future of animal food production and the “growing” of meat in laboratories.
Corroborated: July 6, 2005 Univ. of Maryland scientists propose techniques for growing meat in vitro. Reported in June 29 issue of Tissue Engineering.

Contact 150, 10 Oct. 1981, Meier publishes information about planetary system with 3 suns and 16 planets.
Corroborated: July 15, 2005 New proof that these complex planetary systems involving 3 suns actually exist: "Before now we had no clues about whether planets could form in such gravitationally complex systems," said Dr. Konacki, of the California Institute of Technology.
The first thing's been kicking round in SF stories for years nul points.

The second item isn't about 16 planets and three suns, it's about three suns and one "hot Jupiter" a very different type of system.
If we're being picky we could say that George Lucas predicted it in Star Wars four years before Billy Meier.

And Isaac Asimov predicted multi-sun systems long before that in, for example, his short story "Nightfall".


The Guardian

Astronomer's three-star find

Tim Radford, science editor
Thursday July 14, 2005
The Guardian

An astronomer has identified a planet with three suns far away in the galaxy - the first of a class dubbed "Tatooine planets" after the home of Luke Skywalker, the young hero of the Star Wars films.
Maciej Konacki, of the California Institute of Technology, describes in Nature today how he trained a 10-metre telescope on three stars 149 light years from Earth, and found they shared a planet slightly larger than Jupiter.

The stars are about as close to each other as Saturn is to the sun. "The environment in which this planet exists is quite spectacular," Dr Konacki said. "With three suns, the sky view must be out of this world, literally and figuratively."

In this region of the galaxy binary stars and even multiple star systems - heavenly bodies caught in a complex gravitational waltz - are more frequent than single stars.

But no one expected that a planet could either form or survive for long in a group of triple suns. No life could survive there, but the outlook from the planet, linked to the main star, HD 188753, would be pretty bright.

The main star, like the sun, is yellow; the larger of the other two is orange, the smaller red. A day on the mystery planet would be lurid, but its year would be brief as it completes its annual orbit in three and a half Earth days.

Researchers discovered the first "hot Jupiter" in 1995. This was an extra-solar gas giant that orbited its parent star in three to nine days. So far they have logged more than 20 such planets, among more than 100 extra-solar planetary systems.

The calculation is that a disc of gas and dust gathers around such stars at a distance of about 300m miles and this pile of rubble gradually assembles into a giant companion which is then tugged nearer its parent star. But no one has so far worked out how a giant planet would survive in the three-cornered gavotte of stars.

"How that planet formed in such a complicated setting is very puzzling. I believe there is much to be learned about how giant planets are formed," Dr Konacki said.
 

Jerry_B

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Michael812 said:
Well of course, 236 confirmed UFO radar sightings over the area of Meier's contacts, hey similar things are confirmed over radar all the time, virually everywhere, right?

It's obviously a mere coincidence that these should happen to be occurring right where the 63-year long Meier case is occurring. And, as for the following info, don't tell me, isn't this where the ubiquitous "anyone" who "could have said that" (but of course didn't) is alluded to?
'UFO' doesn't mean anything in real terms. It could be anything, it could be nothing. It just means that there are 236 incidences of radar contacts with objects not identified by the radar operator. It shouldn't be taken of indicative of anything that says 'spaceships', Plejaren or otherwise.
 
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Anonymous

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Knocking around SF for years? Now there's a bit of sound scientific info, unsubstantiated and, well pardon me, but Meier wasn't knocking around SF for years to hear about it over lattes. And should I have said one planet and added the 15 others later?

If I recall from a while ago, this is the same board of absolute geniuses on which Meier's information about Jupiter and its moons, including the single item that NASA considered probably the most important discovery of the mission, which was published by Meier 5 months before "official"" discovery, also received the armchair skeptics intellectual tap-dancing award for improbable explanations.

You guys have yourselves a ruddy good time over there demonstrating why little things like preponderance of (specific, abundant, varied, still irreproducible) evidence usually grab the attention of genuine investigators and prescient information like the following (from 1987) is fulfilling itself in the land(s) of the know-it-alls...but anyone could have said that:

"And it will be that the fanatics of Islam will rise up against the countries of Europe and all will shake and quiver. Everything in the West will be destroyed; England will be conquered and thrown down to the lowest level of misery. And the fanatics and warriors of Islam will retain their power for a long time. However, not only Europe will be affected but ultimately all the countries and peoples of the Earth, as the great horror expands to a war that will encompass the entire world... France will not only be invaded by the aggressors from the outside, but will also be conquered from within as a result of collaborative forces and other forces. This can be envisioned as being the many foreigners of a different religion living in France at that time, and specifically Islam, which will be this force working from within..."

“The military politics of the USA will likewise know no limits, as neither will their economic and other political institutions which will be focused on building and operating a world police force, as it is the case already for a long time. But that will not be enough, and, in the guise of a so-called peaceful globalization, American politics will aspire to gain absolute control of the world concerning supremacy in economy…”

“…the United States of America will be a country of total destruction. The cause for this will be manifold. With her global conflicts which are continuously instigated by her and which will continue far into the future, America is creating enormous hatred against her, worldwide, in many countries. As a result, America will experience enormous catastrophes, which will reach proportions barely imaginable to people of Earth. The destruction of the WTC, i.e., the World Trade Center, by terrorists will only be the beginning.”
 

Timble2

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Prophecies aren't prophecies unless they're published before the events an as we've already established a lot of Billy Leiers' prophecies weren't circulated outside his circle of believers until after the event.

You've pasted two paragraphs of apocalyptic waffle, and one post-hoc prophecy.

I assumed Billy Meier has read science fiction (SF - not San Francisco) because he rips it off comprehensively enough.
 

rynner2

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Timble said:
The second item isn't about 16 planets and three suns, it's about three suns and one "hot Jupiter" a very different type of system.
If we're being picky we could say that George Lucas predicted it in Star Wars four years before Billy Meier.

And Isaac Asimov predicted multi-sun systems long before that in, for example, his short story "Nightfall".
Ah, yes, Nightfall was a classic.

And please, Michael, give references.
Contact 150, 10 Oct. 1981, Meier publishes information about planetary system with 3 suns and 16 planets.
When and where was this published? What exactly was the information?
"Three suns" is pretty interesting, but we need details, not generalisations.
Was this a 'prophecy' of this particular discovery, or of another one that might be made in a few years time? (In which case, you might have jumped the gun!)
 
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Anonymous

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My, my, the ignorant must have their day. Ahem, mere inches from my hands sit a number books, copyrighted books, published books, containing specific information that was not "officially" (or unofficially) discovered until well after the events occurred, after the dates of copyright, which were themselves after the dates of first publication.

That's called proof positive, especially when it's as abundant, varied and error free as it is.

No L. Ron anybody, no nonsensical, fearful, denial based claims can change the facts. Gosh, why do think the case has survived decades of debunkers from geniuses like you?

I seem to also recall that someone here was going to duplicate the UFO sounds iwth some guitar equipment or somesuch. Now, considering how easy that must be to do, where would I find that?

And, while you'd like your facile dismissal of the radar sightings to pass away without further ridicule, do you have any idea how stupid such commnets are? I think you do.

I think you guys should perfomr the complimentary exercise to one that I perfomed. I asked myself what would happen if I learned that the Meier case was proven to be a hoax. My answer is that I'd b efirst in line to want to know how he did it.

Your excerise, if ever you're not too afraid to do it, is to ask yourselves what you will do when you can no longer deny the truthfulness of the Meier case...something that just occurred today for a UFO researcher who's been quite vocal in proclaiming the case a hoax...until now. Admirable of him to change his opinion based on his actually looking at the evidence.

Now you all take care over there and keep fighting against the obvious, I've got radio shows and lectures to do. Hopefully you'll show up somewhere to one of them and set the record straight, Right, waiting for that.
 

Timble2

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I'm working on the saucers.

Unfortunately I have to work rather than pimp the ideas of a third-rate would-be messiah around no-account local radio stations and on badly designed websites.

Your excerise, if ever you're not too afraid to do it, is to ask yourselves what you will do when you can no longer deny the truthfulness of the Meier case...something that just occurred today for a UFO researcher who's been quite vocal in proclaiming the case a hoax...until now.
Is this anyone we've ever heard of?

I don't have to ask myself the questions, because like numerous other microcults and minireligions it won't be proved. Maybe it'll develop into something like the Aetherius Society; Adamski has his followers but they're thinning out; maybe like the channeled messages from Spaceship Capricorn it will just fade away...

So many aliens, which ones to believe...
 
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