Billy Meier

zardozzz

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We have to remember Meir was a one armed man with no freinds, who was already "famous" in his area after the first batch of photo's were published. From then on he was increasingly watched and spied on by his neighbours and peop0le wishing to discredit him. He took the pictures with an old clunky camera and an old style home movie camera. He was followed many times and sometimes would seem to turn a corner and dissapear into thin air. then when he returned later he often had new photos. Most of which were i belive developed at the local chemist (or equivalent) and not by himself. Many people then started to appear at the farm and many of the original negatives were stolen. But he was never caught setting up and rigs to cheat the pictures, even though the farm was often overrun with hangers on.

As has been said many times the only trouble with the meir photo's/movies, is that they are TOO good to be true. As strange critisism indeed ?
 
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Anonymous

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After reading this lengthy and at times, rather tedius thread all the way through, it has become apparant to me *IMO* that some of the 'pro-Meier' posters could very well be sock puppets.
Their insistant claims appear to be backing up the same things. Not really moving in any direction at all but stating that because noone has caught him out * even though he appears to have the power of a Mafia overlord* that he must be genuine.
The photographs and movie clips speak volumes about the authenticity of the various claims, right down to the styalised construction of the ' space ships'. Were new photographs or clips to surface taken recently, I would not be surprised if they are modified and within the imagination of today's thinking.
My personal opinion on the whole Meier case is that it is a complete fabrication made not by one man with a limb missing, but a whole entourage of cult believers perpetuating a huge money making scam to build a larger following of a 'neo-religion'. Prove me wrong Mr Horn and colleagues.
*I very much found the sound clips amusing and the fact that noone can be really bothered to recreate them being sounded out as proof that they cannot because they are real. lol*
 

AMPHIARAUS

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Against my better judgement (and more than a little bored at work) here goes.

If your still watching the FTMB vogel7fire - may I have some reference numbers and offices for the patents mentioned in the quote below please?

vogel7fire said:
I have revisited the question of Marcel Vogel's patents in an attempt to verify the actual number, as Amphiaraus attempted to do some time ago.
Two researchers from another forum have been dilgently searching many databases and at this point have confirmed the existence and source of 10 patents.
 

AMPHIARAUS

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keelibibi said:
After reading this lengthy and at times, rather tedius thread all the way through, it has become apparant to me *IMO* that some of the 'pro-Meier' posters could very well be sock puppets.
Their insistant claims appear to be backing up the same things. Not really moving in any direction at all but stating that because noone has caught him out * even though he appears to have the power of a Mafia overlord* that he must be genuine.
Which is why this thread has some value. Each dubious pro Meier claim made within it has been followed up with with pointers to proof of fraud or at lease some logical analysis which shows it in its proper light.

Anyone who would normally take the claims at face value will at least have a chance to see the bogus material, and how badly tainted Meier is. If they then choose to believe stupid get out clauses such as "the saucers were flown to make them look like models" , well they have my pity.
 
A

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Yeah lol. I cannot for the sake of me understand that little gem of an excuse. It's analogous to saying, "The beamship made that noise to deliberately sound like a cheap synthesiser from the early 60s being played through a speaker in the garden just so whatever." Only after someone has easily replicated it, *having been bothered*.
It's amazing what they will come up with next to justify the whole pulled to bits saga. :lol:
 

vogel7fire

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Amphiaraus, yes I'm still here, but for reasons much more important than the number of patents Marcel Vogel had or didn't have. Nonetheless, I will go back to the discussions about them and refer you to some sources that were discovered. Give me some time to locate them. In the grand scheme of things (except for an argument of credibility), the numbers no longer seem terribly important to me.

I'm taking some real blows on a forum at the moment where I'm basically accused of not being "a supporter." I'm asking what "a supporter" is, sounds like, talks like, smells like, feels like and whether or not there is a "Manual for Being a Supporter and Agreement" that should be signed in order to be "one of them," which they're telling me I'm not. When I suggest that they are the "cult" that the world wide internet perceives them to be, they tell me I'm an insitgator, a doubter, that I waste everyone's time, and that I should go somewhere else.

In the meantime, I'm still focused on a project at hand and hope that Emps will soon post a proposal to FIGU Switzerland regarding the testing of another metal sample that may or may not be available. Up until recently, it has been my understanding that other samples are availabe, but now I understand from Michael Horn's posts on other forums that if any samples do exist, they are not available for testing. This is new information. I have attempted to find out from Switzerland whether or not other samples exist to begin with and have received no response.
 
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I look at it this way. If the samples were real, Mr Meier, FIGU, or whoever is in charge of these things at the moment would make them freely available for testing. They wouldn't keep stonewalling requests to examine them. They wouldn't keep fobbing researchers off with bizarre stories of samples being teleported away, or stolen by goverment agents (excuses which have been used before by many others - witness Howard Menger's infamous 'Moon Potato' which was allegedly confiscated by the authorities, or the much-vaunted alien implants which always seem to vanish as soon as anyone shows an interest in analyzing them).

Considering Meier has had 30 years to provide his 'proof', and has failed, I see no point in pursuing this case any further. It's like flogging a dead horse.

If (as I suspect) benevolent extraterrestrials are not visiting our planet, then you are simply wasting your time if you devote your life to tracking down 'proof' of them. If they are visiting us, then we should trust them to know what they are doing, and accept that they will make themselves known publicly when they decide the time is right.

Of course, it's just possible that not only are ETs visiting our planet, but they really are behaving just as Meier and his fellow contactees tell us. They deliberately 'wobble' their ships when you try to film them. They take you on psychedelic trips around the cosmos, then solemnly present you with a solitary potato as 'proof' of your travels. They bore you rigid for hours with their self-righteous new-age monologues, then make fir trees vanish into thin air just to make a fool out of you. They pose for snapshots, then send the Men in Black round to tamper with your photo collection. We can only draw one conclusion from this extraordinary behaviour: they are obviously stark, raving bonkers!

The only sensible thing to do is to hope that you're never unlucky enough to actually meet one.
 

rynner2

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vogel7fire said:
I'm taking some real blows on a forum at the moment where I'm basically accused of not being "a supporter." I'm asking what "a supporter" is, sounds like, talks like, smells like, feels like and whether or not there is a "Manual for Being a Supporter and Agreement" that should be signed in order to be "one of them," which they're telling me I'm not. When I suggest that they are the "cult" that the world wide internet perceives them to be, they tell me I'm an insitgator, a doubter, that I waste everyone's time, and that I should go somewhere else.
Well, you're welcome here, so please continue to report here your experiences elsewhere in this weird world of ours! 8)

(As Forteans, we are as interested in the process as in the alleged facts. And of course cults are another field of Fortean interest.)

Much as I'd like to believe otherwise, I can't help but agree with graylien:
They pose for snapshots, then send the Men in Black round to tamper with your photo collection. We can only draw one conclusion from this extraordinary behaviour: they are obviously stark, raving bonkers!
Yes, maybe the Cosmic Joker is really the Cosmic Lunatic.... :shock:
 

vogel7fire

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rynner wrote:
Well, you're welcome here, so please continue to report here your experiences elsewhere in this weird world of ours!
Well, that's right kindly of you. As it stands, I'm here but also working on developing another forum that will not be Meier-related (though Meier included) and once developed, I'll invite you to check it out.

I've been corrected about my latest information. It's clear (allegedly) that there is no original photographic evidence available to test, but that does not mean there is no more metal sample evidence available to test.

As for this:

rynner wrote:
Much as I'd like to believe otherwise, I can't help but agree with graylien:
They pose for snapshots, then send the Men in Black round to tamper with your photo collection. We can only draw one conclusion from this extraordinary behaviour: they are obviously stark, raving bonkers!
Yes, maybe the Cosmic Joker is really the Cosmic Lunatic....
You have to keep in mind that "they" could only be Billy Meier's version of of "them." And keep in mind that I have personally seen one of "them" who was far from stark, raving bonkers!
 

mothman8

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You saw one of ' them ', you mean one of those in with him on it don't you :lol: This just gets better and better 8)
 

vogel7fire

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Oh yes, inded, I mean a beautiful, extraordinary, magnificent alien being who looked perfectly human (but very handsome!) and emanated a vibration of pure love and peace. . . .and then vanished . . . and then reappeared. . . and then vanished again. Not exactly your ordinary experience walking down the road, or sitting in a coffee shop, or crossing the street. But if you think that's funny or laughable, go ahead and laugh.
But I hope for you that you will be able to have the same experience some day.
 

Mahavatar

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Amazing!

You have no idea how many time i tried to get back on line.
I could never get back in as SkySpirit, so i had to re-register several times and now i am Mahavatar.

I haven't seen all the posts, so i don't want to say much for now, but just want to say Hi!

As mentioned by vogel7fire, we have been treated badly by the PAR missionary group (meierites) for posting doubts about the meiercase, and now we are starting a new yahoo discusson group.

Mahavatar
 

vogel7fire

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Well, Emps, I think we just got our answer.
Dear Linda ,

sorry for the delayed answer. I talked to Billy about the samples and
he said there doesn't exist similar other metal samples anymore.

with kind regards

Philia
So, there we have it, I guess :blah:
 

vogel7fire

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Some of us (myself included) have finally been banned from a Meier-related forum. Inevitable, yes.

We have created a new forum that invites open debate and the kinds of comprehensive issues that you may be interested in. It would be nice to have you join us and continue our relationship from across the pond.

http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Our_Cosmic_Neighbors/
 

zardozzz

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Graylien wrote
They pose for snapshots, then send the Men in Black round to tamper with your photo collection. We can only draw one conclusion from this extraordinary behaviour: they are obviously stark, raving bonkers!
This is nothing new. It seems to be a very common occurence. A "contactee" is given some of the "good stuff" at first, and then when people start to take notice the stuff they get gets stranger and weirder. Sometimes the contactee's are driven to distraction over this, and try to compose ever stranger hypotheseis or explainations to fit in with it. If you think back over the last 60 years this has happened time and time again. Almost as if our credulity and "faith" is being tested quite on purpose.
 

mothman8

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Long after the world has ended, this thread will still be caried on by aliens who will argue that Meire didnt really know about them after all :lol: :lol:
 
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And our old friend Michael Horn has a press release out on PRWeb (you pay we'll release):

Overlooked Photo Reveals Swiss UFO-Contact Case Genuine


Many of Billy Meier’s other UFO photographs have also been found incapable of being hoaxed using only methods available 25-30 years ago.

Los Angeles, CA (PRWEB) March 14, 2006 -- Since the mid-1970s, UFO investigators worldwide have been bewildered by the many hundreds of clear daytime UFO photos and the movie films taken by the Swiss contactee, Eduard “Billy” Meier. Many rejected Meier’s abundant photographic (and other hard physical) evidence as being too good to be true.

Heavy debunking of the case ensued, despite all the evidence from the primary investigators from 1975-1986, and authentication by various scientists and experts, that the case could be no hoax. But the photo* from which the image on the right was recently cropped went largely overlooked. Meier took it, along with many other shots, in the hills of Switzerland some 15 miles southeast of Zurich, in 1981, long before personal computers and photo-manipulation software were readily available.

Regarding the tree in front of the craft’s right side, Professor Emeritus D. A. Brodie of the College of Forestry, Oregon State University, said: "The tree is one of the European true firs -- Abies species. The picture has only a portion of the top of the crown, 10 to 15 feet. There could be anywhere from 10 to 50 feet of tree bole below the picture."

The extent of the tree above the UFO is estimated by Professor E. C. Jensen, College of Forestry, Oregon State University, to be between 6-10 ft. This yields a UFO diameter of from 9 to 15 ft., ruling out a model UFO, a possibility that must always be considered.

A recent attempt by a professional model maker/photographer to duplicate Meier’s photos (and daytime video) of this UFO (commonly referred to as the “Wedding Cake” UFO) has failed, as have past efforts by a variety of skeptics dating back to at least 2001. While there are six categories of physical evidence in the case that are referred to as “still irreproducible,” there is a voluminous amount of prophetically accurate, published information also to be reckoned with in the case, as well as some 88 eyewitnesses (and five other photographers) who can affirm that Meier is a genuine UFO contactee.

To learn more about the Meier case – its other evidence, witnesses to Meier’s contacts, and the documentation of the prophetic information, as well as linking to Meier-case debunking web sites and articles that refute them, see: http://www.tjresearch.info/Links_for_PR.htm.

For more information, contact:

Michael Horn
Authorized American Media Representative
The Billy Meier Contacts
310.745.9009

Jim Deardorff
Research Professor Emeritus
Oregon State University
541.757.8905

*From Meier’s photo #850
© 1981 Genesis III / F.I.G.U.
Image enhanced in contrast.
Piccie of that picture at the source:

www.emediawire.com/releases/2006/3/emw357776.htm

I wonder if we could pay them to release one stating?:

Many of Billy Meier’s other UFO photographs have also been found to be easily hoaxed using only methods available 25-30 years ago. Not to mention that a number of them have been shown to be obvious hoaxes.
 

Timble2

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The tree is one of the European true firs -- Abies species. The picture has only a portion of the top of the crown, 10 to 15 feet. There could be anywhere from 10 to 50 feet of tree bole below the picture."
You find somewhere where they've been logging, take the trimmed off top of a tree, stick it in the ground, hang UFO up on bit of string, shoot from angle so that you've got a tree background and you can't see where bottom of the tree in front actually is - don't know about Switzerland, but I've seen the chopped off tops of large tree sold as Christmas trees.

Pity the photo is cropped so that we can't see more of the foreground tree...

FFS - the photo on the page on the link of the gold-coloured wedding car UFO and a car is shoddy even by Mr Meier's standards...the car's a Dinky toy or something similar... :D

On that link, where they're trying to refute the problem that the base of the UFO looks remarkably like a dustbin lid from Billy Meier's FIGU centre.

A strong suspicion exists, however, that around that time one of the Pleiadians/Plejarens implanted the design of the garbage-can lid into the mind of a garbage-can manufacturer whose product would later be sold in cities near Schmidrüti. If so, this would be another example of alien "damage control" to ensure that the Meier case, with all its photographic evidence, would not by itself cause a premature rupture of the UFO coverup.
:rofl:
 
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Anonymous

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Leave Billy Meier alone!

EVERYONE in the 'know' knows (isn't English cool) we are being visited by miniature aliens in their space ships (piss poor models - clever!) that like nothing better than to get 'stuck' to the side of Bonsai trees. Or get suspended by wire from fishing rods. Rods? Don't mention the rods!

PROOF!
 
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Timble2 said:
The tree is one of the European true firs -- Abies species. The picture has only a portion of the top of the crown, 10 to 15 feet. There could be anywhere from 10 to 50 feet of tree bole below the picture."
You find somewhere where they've been logging, take the trimmed off top of a tree, stick it in the ground, hang UFO up on bit of string, shoot from angle so that you've got a tree background and you can't see where bottom of the tree in front actually is - don't know about Switzerland, but I've seen the chopped off tops of large tree sold as Christmas trees.

Pity the photo is cropped so that we can't see more of the foreground tree...
As you find out when youa re a kid - pine trees have fractal like properties and breaking off a bit of one makes a good tree

That cracked me up - they claim the two photos were taken seconds apart but the person taking the picture has somehow jumped forward an awful long way. They also claim it is a completely different craft than the otherwise identical one. Why don't they show the road or any other things in the foreground or background? It's possibly the worst faked picture I've seen - a good model maker could have mocked up something suitably convincing given a week or two to work on it - they clearly jsut couldn't be bothered with any of that. You get the feeling if hey'd been doing special effects work for Ed Wood he might have even sent them back to the workshop and told them to try a bit harder.

--------
And the dustbin lid!! Well where to start...

All the cpitures look fae there - my main arguement against the bin lid would be that the shots of the UFO in front of things suggest it is probably smaller than the bin lid.
 
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Anonymous

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Mighty_Emperor said:
All the pitures look fake there - my main arguement against the bin lid would be that the shots of the UFO in front of things suggest it is probably smaller than the bin lid.
I agree. The silver balls are probably 'standard' size of around 1cm each - making the whole thing little more than a foot in diameter.
A bin lid would be much more impressive giving a greater focal range - though less easy to suspend. Even so he obviously had difficulty rigging this one up - bit heavy? And he should have kept the shutter open longer (and shoved a load of extra light on it) to make it look less like a tiny model. Still. He'll know better next time.
 
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EVERYONE in the 'know' knows (isn't English cool) we are being visited by miniature aliens in their space ships (piss poor models - clever!)
Actually there are quite a few reports of tiny aliens emerging from model-size saucers. In one case, a saucer the size of a dinner plate flew into a womans bedroom and a crew of tiny aliens stepped out, tinkered about 'repairing' their craft, then flew back out through the window. And there was a wave of miniature humanoids and miniature saucers in Malayisia during the 1970's (including one sighting of a full-sized monkey wearing a suit which shrunk to only a few inches high in front of an astonished schoolgirl).

None of this is relevant to Mr Meier of course, who claimed to see full sized aliens. But I pity anyone who manages to take a snapshot of a genuinely miniature saucer!
 
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Anonymous

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Sure. Just taking the p*ss out of Meier and his follows here. Which is just horrible of me. Actually one of my favourite UFO accounts is of the 'Mince Pie Martians' which I read about through an early (very early) copy of FT. I'll try and find a web reference - or dig up the article and scan it. What intrigued me the most, apart from the absurdity of it all, was the fact that there WAS actually physical evidence of the encounter.

Anyway, any Hitchhiker fan knows all about the problems that can occur when scale isn't taken into account. Woof!
 
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Anonymous

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Quicky web reference...

Link

1979 - Yorkshire, England. Jean Higley was allegedly visited by three aliens wearing silver tunics and transparent helmets in what was later dubbed the 'Mince Pie Martians Incident'. Mrs Higley claimed she had a conversation with her visitors and shared her freshly made mince pies with them.
She later found her TV and radio would not work and her audio cassettes had been wiped clean. She was left with a scar on her forehead for which no explanation was found.
Although, IIRC the physical effects were 'landing' markings outside the house.
 

GNC

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Frobush said:
Quicky web reference...

Link

1979 - Yorkshire, England. Jean Higley was allegedly visited by three aliens wearing silver tunics and transparent helmets in what was later dubbed the 'Mince Pie Martians Incident'. Mrs Higley claimed she had a conversation with her visitors and shared her freshly made mince pies with them.
She later found her TV and radio would not work and her audio cassettes had been wiped clean. She was left with a scar on her forehead for which no explanation was found.
Although, IIRC the physical effects were 'landing' markings outside the house.
Didn't her Christmas tree disappear as well?

Talking of miniature aliens, don't forget the Twilight Zone episode with the mumbling old lady menaced by the tiny flying saucer in her attic.
 

PeniG

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Complete FOAF here and nothing to do with Meier (excuse me) -

My late friend John related to us once how his late grandmother, during one of her hospitalizations, saw a small flying saucer hovering over her bed. Little men (I remember them as green and purple but don't specifically remember whether that was my spontaneous mental image of if John specified) swarmed out, lowered themselves on lines, did something to the portion of her abdomen where the organ that had put her into the hospital was located, climbed up, and flew away. She was subsequently pronounced well and discharged.

John had no idea what medication she was on, but he said she insisted on the reality of the sighting (which is no great bit of evidence without the information about the meds - American hospitals give old people psychoactive drugs without a flicker of conscience and leave the families to deal with the fallout) and that the recovery happened spontaneously, before the planned procedure. Not worth much as evidence of anything, but if all aliens were as helpful and cute as that we'd be well off.

Alas, they did not show up after John's quadruple bypass and he died of a secondary infection.
 
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