Britain: Police State?

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Reminder - this thread has a topic, and individual platforms on capital punishment/judicial murder (to be even handed) don't come under it.

I'm tidying up posts which have followed on from a post which stirred the mods to action, and removed that "trigger" initial post so that people aren't mislead in future.
 

INT21

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Possibly Bob61 could place his post about the UK tightening up it's grip on citizens here ?

It seemed to fit the thread criteria.

police control etc.
 

bob61

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Happy to read your appraisal of how.
for starters visit www.policestate.co.uk , in the uk it seems like the police are more worried about internet crimes of “ hate speech” than physical crimes like home invasion , burglary , etc,etc ...... I have heard that the police like to send Orwellian warnings to citizens that hate speech is a crime that will get you arrested ( i’ve heard this happens a lot after a ... well .... someone of a certain faith attacks innocent people ) any criticism of their religion / faith online & you can be sure the uk police will be there to have a talk with you and / or arrest you .
they must have a whole department just for that , lol . the uk police has called on it’s citizens to “turn in “/ “ report “ on your neighbors , co - workers , friends .... whoever for offensive hate speech ,mind you NOT libelous speech or death threats per say but just plain old insulting speech .
it seems all you have to do is hurt someone’s feelings & the police will come -a-knocking on your door . i’ve heard that when Nadia Chan ( self described Islamist ) made deeply racist remarks on social media concerning Caucasian people & openly endorsed terror attacks on Iranian state tv the uk police decided not to investigate / or arrest her after many complained to the met .or when transgender model Monroe bergdorf made vile comments about
caucaisian’s she too was met with indifference by the police ( they just didn’t care )but god forbid you say something about homosexuals , Muslims , or your a pro- life advocate denouncing abortion WATCH OUT... you’ll be banned on social media sites ,etc... , it’ s

o.k in the world now to attack white people , attack Christianity & so forth ....... there’s a saying I heard years ago “ satan hates people & they love him , Jesus loves people & they hate him “ , it truly seems like the world has everything backwards . you can’t speak about Jesus Christ , you can’t call out evil when you see it , you can’t tell homosexuals that their lifestyle offends god ( just an example ) , you can’t enforce your nations borders without being called a racist , you can’t question authority , you can’t do this or that ....... the world is busy killing innocent children through abortion & people are o.k. with it , the world is pushing sick perverted agendas on us & were supposed to keep our mouth’s shut , don’t say anything or speak up or else we will come after you & punish you . it seems like the world is in a stupor & nobody cares . it’s time to wake up people , political correctness will be the death of all of us
 
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Yithian

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...you can’t speak about Jesus Christ , you can’t call out evil when you see it , you can’t tell homosexuals that their lifestyle offends god ( just an example)
Rather presumptuous.

I tend to let God and Jesus speak for themselves.

As to the rest, you really can do all these things that you seem to want people to do, but people who oppose them will oppose you--that's the nature of democracy: you need to persuade the majority.

Many of the things you appear to hope for do not have a majority.

It's crap in many ways, but on the whole it's better than murdering one another or saving up bloody revolutions.
 

Coal

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As to the rest, you really can do all these things that you seem to want people to do, but people who oppose them will oppose you--that's the nature of democracy: you need to persuade the majority.
Plus, with a democracy (even the imperfect ones), these loons will never get into power and even if they get a toehold, they can be turfed out at the next election. That's why democracy matters and should always be adhered to.
 

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@bob61 You are lumping lots of things together, and... so many "I hear" and "it seems"! Hearsay. Please note that "the police" are not the monolithic body you think. On simple accuracy grounds your argument fails at that point.

Yes, have a look at a one view website :) It is a good sign that, despite what you say, such sites are not hindered or hampered or anything else.

the police are more worried about internet crimes of “ hate speech” than physical crimes like home invasion , burglary , etc,etc ......
No. Not true. Next time you talk to a serving police officer (or 50+ as I will do next month) ask them. There will be complaints about funding, the steer from the top, local problems and so on. It has been like this for the last 50 years to my knowledge. Do you have first hand evidence of the situation?

I have heard that the police like to send Orwellian warnings to citizens that hate speech is a crime that will get you arrested ( i’ve heard this happens a lot after a ... well .... someone of a certain faith attacks innocent people ) any criticism of their religion / faith online & you can be sure the uk police will be there to have a talk with you and / or arrest you .
Again, no. Not sure where you get your info from? If it includes UK mainstream press then please understand that it is firmly biased in one direction! The problem with the way you have phrased your misapprehension is that it looks like you are implying that one faith or people or whatever cannot even be named. Shock!!! Horror!!! actually that's Total Bollocks!!! and is a rather uncunning rhetorical trope. Maybe it plays better where you are which is why you choose to use it?

they must have a whole department just for that , lol . the uk police has called on it’s citizens to “turn in “/ “ report “ on your neighbors , co - workers , friends .... whoever for offensive hate speech ,mind you NOT libelous speech or death threats per say but just plain old insulting speech .
Again with the partial truth, the misinformation and the... words fail me. Do you mean that where you are citizens do not interact with their police force? When we had a spate of broken windows in our parish the police got loads of calls, emails, tweets and so on. And we are invited to do it, for all crimes. It's /our/ police and if we don't educate and pressure it we have only ourselves to blame.

i’ve heard that when Nadia Chan ( self described Islamist ) made deeply racist remarks on social media concerning Caucasian people & openly endorsed terror attacks on Iranian state tv the uk police decided not to investigate / or arrest her after many complained to the met .or when transgender model Monroe bergdorf made vile comments about
caucaisian’s she too was met with indifference by the police ( they just didn’t care )
You are mistaking "balanced and informative reporting and offensive material which didn't meet the threshold for prosecution" for "soft pedalling on certain groups". What she said was carefully and intelligently phrased to be so. Are you suggesting that a moderate and balanced, generalised law should be tweaked to make it worse for some people than for others?

but god forbid you say something about homosexuals , Muslims , or your a pro- life advocate denouncing abortion WATCH OUT... you’ll be banned on social media sites ,etc... , it’ s

o.k in the world now to attack white people , attack Christianity & so forth .......
Are you talking about the UK? or one of the countries within it? or "the world"? Or are you talking about the USA? What you describe is not so - although some of the press enjoys the dogwhistle effect of reporting as if it is so. Some people get great comfort from believing themselves to be attacked and oppressed. In fact, it is their bile and failure to meet basic standards of debate and conduct which gains them mockery and censure. In most cases - things do go wrong sometimes of course - which is why all the checks and balances are built into the system.


you can’t speak about Jesus Christ , you can’t call out evil when you see it , you can’t tell homosexuals that their lifestyle offends god ( just an example ) , you can’t enforce your nations borders without being called a racist , you can’t question authority , you can’t do this or that ....... the world is busy killing innocent children through abortion & people are o.k. with it , the world is pushing sick perverted agendas on us & were supposed to keep our mouth’s shut , don’t say anything or speak up or else we will come after you & punish you . it seems like the world is in a stupor & nobody cares . it’s time to wake up people , political correctness will be the death of all of us
I'm really sorry that this is your experience of your life, in your country. However you can't reasonably take that and argue that a country far far away and of which you appear to know little is the same.

Creating a monolithic bloc which is totally against you is an interesting thing to do. You do know that the members here are international and varied? So that when you talk about christians or muslims or whatever you are actually talking about us? Same with "asians" "blacks" and so on. You might find it helpful to envisage your arguments being read and analysed by the groups that you are talking about. Used to do this as a teaching exercise and it tends to result in more closely argued, better supported and less partial discourse.

I went through this section by section so that you couldn't think that you weren't being heard; I have no desire to feed in to your vision.

TL-DR Your conclusions are based in partial evidence and hearsay. What you are describing is a system under stress which applies the same laws across the board. It's a democracy with checks and balances.

Question: Why have you decided to fit your world view to the UK?
 

AnonyJoolz

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for starters visit www.policestate.co.uk , in the uk it seems like the police are more worried about internet crimes of “ hate speech” than physical crimes like home invasion , burglary , etc,etc ...... I have heard that the police like to send Orwellian warnings to citizens that hate speech is a crime that will get you arrested ( i’ve heard this happens a lot after a ... well .... someone of a certain faith attacks innocent people ) any criticism of their religion / faith online & you can be sure the uk police will be there to have a talk with you and / or arrest you .
they must have a whole department just for that , lol . the uk police has called on it’s citizens to “turn in “/ “ report “ on your neighbors , co - workers , friends .... whoever for offensive hate speech ,mind you NOT libelous speech or death threats per say but just plain old insulting speech .
it seems all you have to do is hurt someone’s feelings & the police will come -a-knocking on your door . i’ve heard that when Nadia Chan ( self described Islamist ) made deeply racist remarks on social media concerning Caucasian people & openly endorsed terror attacks on Iranian state tv the uk police decided not to investigate / or arrest her after many complained to the met .or when transgender model Monroe bergdorf made vile comments about
caucaisian’s she too was met with indifference by the police ( they just didn’t care )but god forbid you say something about homosexuals , Muslims , or your a pro- life advocate denouncing abortion WATCH OUT... you’ll be banned on social media sites ,etc... , it’ s

o.k in the world now to attack white people , attack Christianity & so forth ....... there’s a saying I heard years ago “ satan hates people & they love him , Jesus loves people & they hate him “ , it truly seems like the world has everything backwards . you can’t speak about Jesus Christ , you can’t call out evil when you see it , you can’t tell homosexuals that their lifestyle offends god ( just an example ) , you can’t enforce your nations borders without being called a racist , you can’t question authority , you can’t do this or that ....... the world is busy killing innocent children through abortion & people are o.k. with it , the world is pushing sick perverted agendas on us & were supposed to keep our mouth’s shut , don’t say anything or speak up or else we will come after you & punish you . it seems like the world is in a stupor & nobody cares . it’s time to wake up people , political correctness will be the death of all of us
I live here. Many of our fellow Forteans live here. And whoever or whatever is giving you your information is wildly exaggerating.

You can hold opinions, express opinions freely. Unless you are advocating violence or harm against a group of people no-one will come bashing down your door. Incitement to harm is a criminal offence and should be in any civilised country. For example I'm not a big fan of identity politics and Islamism. I made a long but reasoned opinion post online. No-one arrested me. I'm also a Christian, and believe in living my faith in the real world and not engaging in Internet bollocks.

If you are offering a commercial service to customers you may not discriminate on any basis of skin colour, ethnic origin, religion, disability etc., even if you have your own deeply-held beliefs about the matter. Again that makes sense to me.

Many extreme religious groups (mostly Islamic in nature) have been proscribed in the UK as they were advocating harm and terrorism.

Your post is full of "I've heard that..." rather than any concrete information. You're basically looking at websites that confirm your own viewpoints and opinions.

I would suggest that you come and visit, even live and work here for a while and then form an experienced view. I have a slightly different view of the situation here in that my spouse is from south Asia, and hence members of our family and friends are variously Hindu, Sikh, Muslim, Buddhist and mostly a bit brown. They receive no 'special treatment' from authorities and never have done unless it's been a medical emergency and they required some language help.

If you find this place doesn't open your mind to other possible ways to seeing the world, or its variety of people and places then maybe https://forum.davidicke.com might be more up your street :)
 

AlchoPwn

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Plus, with a democracy (even the imperfect ones), these loons will never get into power and even if they get a toehold, they can be turfed out at the next election. That's why democracy matters and should always be adhered to.
Do you seriously think that if a democracy ever allows such people into power that it will survive the experience? Dictatorships tend to stay entrenched for at least 2 decades once they are allowed to establish themselves.
 

Frideswide

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Do you seriously think that if a democracy ever allows such people into power that it will survive the experience? Dictatorships tend to stay entrenched for at least 2 decades once they are allowed to establish themselves.
I think that what we have is possibly the best we can hope for - taking a view across the millennia, humans can do much worse. Archaeologically speaking 20 years is a disaster for the individuals but a blip in terms of the group.

It has always been a terror that I would find myself living in a such a blip. :(
 

Coal

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Do you seriously think that if a democracy ever allows such people into power that it will survive the experience? Dictatorships tend to stay entrenched for at least 2 decades once they are allowed to establish themselves.
Kinda my point, probably wasn't clear enough.

There's certainly a risk in democratic systems that extremists of some kind can gain a toe-hold (i.e. a few seats) in a single election. In this event, they can be voted out at the next opportunity.

You're quite correct - in the event extremists gain any significant share of a government, usually over the course of several elections - there's always the risk that they will stage a kind of coup based on representative share of seats and a self defined 'popular mandate'. That's the difference between 'regular' folk and 'extremists', the latter will seek to remove democracy at the first convenient point (for them).

While democracy and democratic systems are not perfect, they generally return the vote of the sensible middle, but in any event there is an opportunity to reset the result at regular proscribed intervals.

While it's easy to think that democracy should return the 'right' result, that's not its real job - the real job is to help prevent placing loons in power and then to remove any such as soon as it becomes obvious they're loons and before they do any real damage.

Those who think it's OK to overturn or re-run any kind of democratic vote, be it a general election, a by-election or a referendum, because the result was 'wrong' (or 'not what we wanted') are dabbling with a precedent that will then be unhesitatingly used by those who would immediately remove any right to vote.

That's why one lives with a democratic result even if one doesn't like it or agree with it. It's the price one pays for avoiding utter tyranny.

It pays to be very wary of those in positions of power who cannot be removed and any organisation based on such. Those who crave power over all else, gravitate towrds such postion like fies to horse-poo and these are never ethical or equitable people.

The first past the post system is (imo) open to abuse from bi-partisan politics (or 'taking turns') and we're (imo) at this point in the UK.
 

AlchoPwn

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The first past the post system is (imo) open to abuse from bi-partisan politics (or 'taking turns') and we're (imo) at this point in the UK.
This is unequivocally true. This paradigm leads to major parties crushing all the smaller ones, or at least it has done for decades across the English speaking world where Westminster style bicameral politics prevail. In Europe, where proportional representation (PR) voting prevailed on the grounds it was "more democratic", there were often only minor parties, and they were perpetually forced to create unstable "coalitions of the begrudgingly willing". On the other hand something new has happened...

In the past, the Westminster style systems with two major parties would simply toss the job to each other ever 8 years pretty much without fail, but that has changed. Since the introduction of the Internet, there has been a change, where minor parties have been able to get a decent enough proportion of the vote that they have been elected, often when the votes between the major parties have been sufficiently split that neither had a clear majority, leading to a position where the minor party becomes a necessary coalition partner for a major party to hold office.

This leads to a position where minor parties become disproportionately influential, which is a new form of problem for Wesminster systems, that makes them seem more like the PR systems of the continent and has made politics less stable in the English speaking world. This has made minor parties able to win in what is in effect an asymmetric system slanted against them. The problem is that we wind up with unstable governments, and people complain about that too, as the public only like flexing their "democratic muscle" once every 3-4 years before it is all tuckered out.
 

Frideswide

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and never have done unless it's been a medical emergency and they required some language help.
My first language is english - I get extra help in the circumstances because I tend to go non verbal when stressed. It's a courtesy and a kindness and the sort of thing we do rather well.
 

Frideswide

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The first past the post system is (imo) open to abuse from bi-partisan politics (or 'taking turns') and we're (imo) at this point in the UK.
and also what @AlchoPwn has said

I've been very interested to see the way that things have developed in scotland, where we don't have a simple FPTP system for Holyrood. There has been a big increase in the number of people involved in politics in general, but I can't say if it is cause or effect, probably both! :)

This wikipedia entry gives links to the variations used.

Edit to add: I wouldn't say thate "D'Hondt" happens in daily conversation but there is certainly a pleasing number of people who know what it is, find it interesting and use it knowledgeably !
 

bob61

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I live here. Many of our fellow Forteans live here. And whoever or whatever is giving you your information is wildly exaggerating.

You can hold opinions, express opinions freely. Unless you are advocating violence or harm against a group of people no-one will come bashing down your door. Incitement to harm is a criminal offence and should be in any civilised country. For example I'm not a big fan of identity politics and Islamism. I made a long but reasoned opinion post online. No-one arrested me. I'm also a Christian, and believe in living my faith in the real world and not engaging in Internet bollocks.

If you are offering a commercial service to customers you may not discriminate on any basis of skin colour, ethnic origin, religion, disability etc., even if you have your own deeply-held beliefs about the matter. Again that makes sense to me.

Many extreme religious groups (mostly Islamic in nature) have been proscribed in the UK as they were advocating harm and terrorism.

Your post is full of "I've heard that..." rather than any concrete information. You're basically looking at websites that confirm your own viewpoints and opinions.

I would suggest that you come and visit, even live and work here for a while and then form an experienced view. I have a slightly different view of the situation here in that my spouse is from south Asia, and hence members of our family and friends are variously Hindu, Sikh, Muslim, Buddhist and mostly a bit brown. They receive no 'special treatment' from authorities and never have done unless it's been a medical emergency and they required some language help.

If you find this place doesn't open your mind to other possible ways to seeing the world, or its variety of people and places then maybe https://forum.davidicke.com might be more up your street :)
lol , thanks but I already know about David icke .
 

Naughty_Felid

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for starters visit www.policestate.co.uk , in the uk it seems like the police are more worried about internet crimes of “ hate speech” than physical crimes like home invasion , burglary , etc,etc ...... I have heard that the police like to send Orwellian warnings to citizens that hate speech is a crime that will get you arrested ( i’ve heard this happens a lot after a ... well .... someone of a certain faith attacks innocent people ) any criticism of their religion / faith online & you can be sure the uk police will be there to have a talk with you and / or arrest you .
they must have a whole department just for that , lol . the uk police has called on it’s citizens to “turn in “/ “ report “ on your neighbors , co - workers , friends .... whoever for offensive hate speech ,mind you NOT libelous speech or death threats per say but just plain old insulting speech .
it seems all you have to do is hurt someone’s feelings & the police will come -a-knocking on your door . i’ve heard that when Nadia Chan ( self described Islamist ) made deeply racist remarks on social media concerning Caucasian people & openly endorsed terror attacks on Iranian state tv the uk police decided not to investigate / or arrest her after many complained to the met .or when transgender model Monroe bergdorf made vile comments about
caucaisian’s she too was met with indifference by the police ( they just didn’t care )but god forbid you say something about homosexuals , Muslims , or your a pro- life advocate denouncing abortion WATCH OUT... you’ll be banned on social media sites ,etc... , it’ s

o.k in the world now to attack white people , attack Christianity & so forth ....... there’s a saying I heard years ago “ satan hates people & they love him , Jesus loves people & they hate him “ , it truly seems like the world has everything backwards . you can’t speak about Jesus Christ , you can’t call out evil when you see it , you can’t tell homosexuals that their lifestyle offends god ( just an example ) , you can’t enforce your nations borders without being called a racist , you can’t question authority , you can’t do this or that ....... the world is busy killing innocent children through abortion & people are o.k. with it , the world is pushing sick perverted agendas on us & were supposed to keep our mouth’s shut , don’t say anything or speak up or else we will come after you & punish you . it seems like the world is in a stupor & nobody cares . it’s time to wake up people , political correctness will be the death of all of us
Abortion has been around a lot longer than Christianity, as has Homosexuality. Abortion and Homosexuality will still be around long after Christianity is a footnote in the history books.

Abortion doesn't kill children as to be a child you have to be born. I would hazard a guess that abortion has saved many lives over the years, it gives choices to women who know they can't raise another child safely, or guarantee the safety and wellbeing of her other children by bringing another into the world.

Your sect managed to convince a couple of Roman Emperors that it was the right way to go and got the big gig for a couple of thousand years telling us all what to do in the west. It got lucky it could have been one of the scores of sects knocking around the Middle East at the time.

Well, thankfully that period of time looks like it's over and God and Jesus have had plenty of time to sign up on Youtube or Facebook to tell us otherwise - I'm still waiting.

Evidence would also suggest it's still "ok" to attack black people too you know. https://publicintegrity.org/federal...ims-of-hate-crimes-more-than-any-other-group/ . I know as a white person I am much less likely to get the shit kicked out of me or shot than if I were a black person. Any violence perpetrated against the weak should be fought no matter what colour.

At least the big corporations are there for everyone to see. They don't need to dress up people in funny costumes telling us fairy tales to make us toe the line.
 
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AlchoPwn

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Abortion has been around a lot longer than Christianity, as has Homosexuality. Abortion and Homosexuality will still be around long after Christianity is a footnote in the history books.
Agreed Naughty Felid. Let me add, that if God is so against abortions, how come He causes so many miscarriages in women? Moving in mysterious ways? So, what is the issue if someone goes and gets an abortion? Isn't that God moving in mysterious ways too? After all, if God wanted to intervene to prevent abortions, He could, if scripture is to be believed. Don't use any free will arguments either, because God can and generally does totally over-rule all human free will, every time per day we get thwarted in our efforts, or our prayers don't come true. Also, how come St Bridgit used to help Irish girls pregnant out of wedlock "pray" for abortions? LINK If God was anti-abortions, surely no Saint would grant the miracle of abortion?
 

Coal

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True fascism is growing the state at the expense of personal liberty and isn't something that Brits tend to be fond of or would vote for.
They don't though. Folk tend to vote for; "someone who listens when they're disenfranchised" or "someone who provides certainty and clear leadership in uncertain times". Only later (too late) do they discover they've voted for:

"growing the state at the expense of personal liberty"

Then no further votes will be held.
 
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They don't though. Folk tend to vote for; "someone who listens when they're disenfranchised" or "someone who provides certainty and clear leadership in uncertain times". Only later (too late) do they discover they've voted for:

"growing the state at the expense of personal liberty"

Then no further votes will be held.
The best way to combat fascism is never to vote for any party seeking to grow the state.
 

Megadeth1977

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I live here. Many of our fellow Forteans live here. And whoever or whatever is giving you your information is wildly exaggerating.

You can hold opinions, express opinions freely. Unless you are advocating violence or harm against a group of people no-one will come bashing down your door. Incitement to harm is a criminal offence and should be in any civilised country. For example I'm not a big fan of identity politics and Islamism. I made a long but reasoned opinion post online. No-one arrested me. I'm also a Christian, and believe in living my faith in the real world and not engaging in Internet bollocks.

If you are offering a commercial service to customers you may not discriminate on any basis of skin colour, ethnic origin, religion, disability etc., even if you have your own deeply-held beliefs about the matter. Again that makes sense to me.

Many extreme religious groups (mostly Islamic in nature) have been proscribed in the UK as they were advocating harm and terrorism.

Your post is full of "I've heard that..." rather than any concrete information. You're basically looking at websites that confirm your own viewpoints and opinions.

I would suggest that you come and visit, even live and work here for a while and then form an experienced view. I have a slightly different view of the situation here in that my spouse is from south Asia, and hence members of our family and friends are variously Hindu, Sikh, Muslim, Buddhist and mostly a bit brown. They receive no 'special treatment' from authorities and never have done unless it's been a medical emergency and they required some language help.

If you find this place doesn't open your mind to other possible ways to seeing the world, or its variety of people and places then maybe https://forum.davidicke.com might be more up your street :)
You forgot to include the Christian Right/the religious right I think you're being a bit naughty leavening them out.
 

Coal

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The best way to combat fascism is never to vote for any party seeking to grow the state.
But vote. Extremists always vote. Even if you vote for the great British Monster Raving Looney party, you must vote.

The only wasted vote is an uncast one.
 

AlchoPwn

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The best way to combat fascism is never to vote for any party seeking to grow the state.
On the contrary, on many occasions a larger state is a better protection for ordinary people. The danger comes from excessive growth in the security side of the state. Ben Franlkin famously said: Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.", but lets face it, "cowardice doth make a conscience for us all" (yes, I know I'm misquoting Hamlet 3:1). Really the rot set in when we blithely accepted the surveillance state because of the "War on Terror", because people were too financially afraid of calling out KSA for what it really is.
 
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But vote. Extremists always vote. Even if you vote for the great British Monster Raving Looney party, you must vote.

The only wasted vote is an uncast one.
Exactly. Whilst a Remainer myself, I cannot abide the anti-Brexit argument that 52% of votes only represents around a third of the electorate.

Those Remainers who try to extrapolate non-votes into some mythical majority (and also those who really want the economy to go titsup just so they can sneer "told you so!" ) are those who give Remain a bad name.
 
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On the contrary, on many occasions a larger state is a better protection for ordinary people. The danger comes from excessive growth in the security side of the state. Ben Franlkin famously said: Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.", but lets face it, "cowardice doth make a conscience for us all" (yes, I know I'm misquoting Hamlet 3:1). Really the rot set in when we blithely accepted the surveillance state because of the "War on Terror", because people were too financially afraid of calling out KSA for what it really is.
Fair point, which adds a slight nuance to my comment.

It's the gross misuse of the term fascist which really gets my goat though.

Remember how the father of (modern) fascism defined it:

"All within the state.
Nothing outside the state.
Nothing against the state."

So Il Duce 's Italy was certainly fascist, as was The Third Reich and, arguably, The Soviet Union.

Today, North Korea is probably the closest thing to fascism, with Iran and China not far behind.
 

Megadeth1977

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Fair point, which adds a slight nuance to my comment.

It's the gross misuse of the term fascist which really gets my goat though.

Remember how the father of (modern) fascism defined it:

"All within the state.
Nothing outside the state.
Nothing against the state."

So Il Duce 's Italy was certainly fascist, as was The Third Reich and, arguably, The Soviet Union.

Today, North Korea is probably the closest thing to fascism, with Iran and China not far behind.
Far left and far right are all the same to me.
 
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