Christian Group Wants To 'Redeem' U.S. States

[ramonmercado]

Christian group wants to 'redeem' US states
By Harriet McLeod
Mon Oct 24,11:13 AM ET



Cory Burnell wants to set up a Christian nation within the United States where abortion is illegal, gay marriage is banned, schools cannot teach evolution, children can pray to Jesus in public schools and the Ten Commandments are posted publicly.

To that end, Burnell, 29, left the Republican Party, moved from California and founded Christian Exodus two years ago with the goal of redirecting the United States by "redeeming" one state at a time.

First up for redemption is South Carolina.

Burnell hopes to move 2,500 Christians into the northern part of the state by next year and to persuade tens of thousands to relocate by 2016. His goal is to fill the state legislature with "Christian constitutionalists."

The push comes at a time when Christian fundamentalism is a growing force in U.S. politics, displays of the Ten Commandments in government buildings are spurring litigation and President George W. Bush is touting the evangelical Christian credentials of Supreme Court nominee Harriet Miers.

Christian Exodus officially started in May 2004, reaching people mainly through the Internet. Since then, five families and two individuals have relocated to South Carolina, Burnell said.

The organization, which claims about 1,000 members, held its first conference October 15-16 to promote its agenda. About 50 people from as far away as Ohio and Oregon attended.

Burnell picked South Carolina partly for its Christian majority and conservative politics.

"Historically, Southerners do have a states' rights mentality," he said. "Christians in the North are experiencing the most liberalism, or you could say persecution."

Christian Exodus hopes to throw off what it considers unconstitutional burdens imposed by the federal government. Examples, Burnell said, are federal spending on public education and the National Endowment for the Arts, and the use of the courts "to teach that Heather has two mommies."

"We (want to) force Washington, D.C., to reform itself by not going along with it," he said.

The organization's Web site says if it does not meet its goal of change, it will work to secede from the United States.

South Carolina was the first state to secede from the union in 1860, and the first shots of the U.S. Civil War were fired from Charleston's Battery onto Fort Sumter.

The group's reception in South Carolina has been mixed.

Arthur Bryngelson, chairman of the Dorchester County Republican Party, spoke at a Christian Exodus' conference and said he would encourage Christian Exodus members to become Republicans.

"I consider myself to be a fundamental Christian," he said. "I'm with (Christian Exodus) all the way up to secession. ... I'm not in favor of going down to the Battery and firing on Fort Sumter again."

State Sen. Mike Fair, a Republican who described himself as "a narrow-minded, right-wing, fundamentalist fanatic," said he was suspicious of Christian Exodus.

"I had huge credibility problems with them," he said. "Their plank for this perceived buckle of the Bible Belt, they're so far off the mark. I don't think they're going to get much traction."

Joel Sawyer, spokesman for Republican Gov. Mark Sanford, would not comment except to say, "We have a great state with a great quality of life that's certainly open to anyone."

Columbia attorney Herbert E. Buhl III, who does legal work for the American Civil Liberties Union, said he received "a nasty little letter ... calling me a liar" from a Christian Exodus representative.

Buhl said the letter came after he had represented Wiccan Darla Wynne, who successfully sued the town of Great Falls to remove the name of Jesus Christ from pre-meeting prayers. The 4th U.S. Circuit Court of Appeals agreed in 2004 with a federal judge that the town's prayers were an unconstitutional endorsement of religion by government.

"This should be a nonissue," Buhl said. "It's separation of church and state. This is black-letter law."

Christian Dominion

 

[OneWingedBird]

Burnell hopes to move 2,500 Christians into the northern part of the state by next year and to persuade tens of thousands to relocate by 2016. His goal is to fill the state legislature with "Christian constitutionalists."

I believe there was a town somewhere in the US where the Scientologists were successful with this strategy, always forget where it was though. It's sort of a reverse gerrymandering.

 

[Pietro_Mercurios]

'Redeem' that's a new word for 'Control' is it?

 

[Philo_T]

They interviewed this guy on "The Daily Show". He's behind the movement to encourage Christians to relocate to South Carolina and take it over. He looked particularly dumb when the interviewer asked him the obvious question - "You currently live in California, when are you relocating to S.C.?"

 

[Timble2]

Welcome to Gilead (see The Handmaids Tale)

 

[austen27]

As far as I am aware no one in the US is forced to have an abortion or be a lesbian but people are free to do either if they wish. No one is prevented from being a Christian in the US. I don't think any one should be forced to be a Christian; even though I am one.

 

[ElishevaBarsabe]

So, this guy gets thousands of people to move to North Carolina, where they change laws. Then the group has to move somewhere else, and the laws get changed back.

He's a bit short on logic.

However, I do think that the American people aren't paying enough attention, which is how Mr. Bush got re-elected.

 

[krobone]

However, I do think that the American people aren't paying enough attention, which is how Mr. Bush got re-elected.

Too true - we are a dumb people sometimes. Sigh...

 

[decipheringscars]

Why move to California to start a group that moves people to South Carolina? Well, California has a reputation (whether it's fair or not... but then again, who makes the Terminator their governor?) for being full of nuts. (I'm living in CA at the moment, but I wasn't here for that election.) Clearly this guy felt the need to seek out his own and went with the popular stereotype of CA. Hope he at least got a good tan out of it.

I think the rest of us should support this guy, though - so that once he moves all his people into one state (I say Florida or Texas), we cut 'em loose & let them be their own country. They wouldn't be a threat to our national security, what with the inbreeding that's sure to follow, and the pathetic educational system, isolationism, and so forth.

On a serious note, I'm sick of certain Christians claiming they're being persecuted when they're not. I was raised in a strand of Christianity where that thinking was not uncommon. (I'm still a Christian, but of a very different sort.) There are Christians, and people of other faiths, who truly are being persecuted for their faith, or for their political views, gender, or sexual orientation (just browse Amnesty International's website). Not being able to control the lives of free agents around you is not persecution! If you don't like the environment you're in, move out to the boondocks, or with others of your kind. Being surrounded by "liberalism" is not persecution. In fact, the very nature of liberalism is such that it's unlikely to try persecuting people.

These ultra-religious-conservative types on the one hand have such a romantic nostalgia for the early days of Christianity, with all the martyrs being thrown to lions and so forth; and on the other hand, they want to control the government and make everyone conform to their standards (much like Constantine was the first to do for Christianity). Can't have it both ways, guys. Just please, PLEASE stop taking God's name in vain by propping up your idolotrous political agendas with your white male Republican patriarchal caricature of a god.

Sorry for the rant... Wait, no I'm not.

 

[Kondoru]

I think its quite an intrguing idea.

Talking on persecution, a lot of my fluffy new age friends seem to be very fond of the idea of actually being persecuted. They are always moaning about the church (who is not very interested in them) but oddly enough, they are first to kiss up to xtianity.

And as to their attitude to jews...I wonder what things would be like if the jews `hadnt` been persecuted probably "stupid ME cult" sort of thing.

And as for continuity, a lot of my `genuine brought up in the 60s flower children` friends have children who have grown up pretty `square`

 

[OneWingedBird]

I think many of the charismatic xtians I used to know were like that too, like they really wanted to believe they were being persecuted. Sort of self importance thing I guess.

 

[tastyintestines]

Am I really tired or does the end of the title end with United States States??

The New Scientist has been doing this recently in their feedback column. One
example was "The Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim" which when tranlated means "The The Angels Angels of Anaheim."

Sorry in advancefor any derailment.

 

[austen27]

Am I really tired or does the end of the title end with United States States??

I suppose it should say "States of the United States" - as they want to win one state at a time rather than the whole country.

 

[karlmarxismydad]

Still, it would mean we had all the extremist nutters conveniently in one place.

Is it only me who sees a contradiction between Bush's war on terror (not to even mention his spoutings regarding democracy) and his posting of the 10 commandments in public buildings? 'Thou shalt not kill' anyone? What about coveting thy neighbour's oil? :headbutt:

 

[Pietro_Mercurios]

However, I do think that the American people aren't paying enough attention, which is how Mr. Bush got re-elected.

Too true - we are a dumb people sometimes. Sigh...

Don't feel too bad kids, 'The Powers That Be' have been doing a behaviourist hoodoo number on the US Public for decades now. I't makes it just that much harder to think outside the box. It's called 'Consumerism'.

 

[lupinwick]

Just did some checking. Christian Exodus consider Bush a liberal :shock: Ok they're anti-war, possibily anti-everything not in the bible (tis the word of god and correct etc. regardless of it being moulded by the church for its own purposes.)

Interestingly though they're likened to the Free State Project:
http://www.freestateproject.org/

Are you frustrated at the loss of freedom and responsibility in America, while the growth of government and taxes continues unabated? Do you want to live in strong communities where your rights are respected, and people exercise responsibility for themselves and in their dealings with each other?

If you answered "yes" to those questions, then the Free State Project has a solution for you.

Difference being CE come across as intolerant nutters

So perhaps the good 'ol US of A is going to fragment in time?

 

[austen27]

Difference being CE come across as intolerant nutters

While the Free State people are just nutters?

It always strikes me as perverse that wanting to destroy the government is seen as patriotic in some parts of the US.

 

[lupinwick]

Dunno. Never met one (or likely to). Possibly well meaning nutters.

I suppose that if you are patriotic (in the sense of loving your country and being a proud citizen) but you disagree with the government policies and feel that there is no democratic way of changing this, then yes you could view dismantling the current political appartus as partriotic. Though this could only work if you have massive grass-root support.

It may just be a sympton of a disaffected and disenfranchised American populace.

 

[amester]

Some fundy types honestly believe that you're not a true Christian if you're not being persecuted, so they almost go out of their way to seek out being ridiculed, etc. (Sometimes they get what they deserve, to be honest.) And sometimes they whine about being "persecuted" when they don't get to be in total control of everyone else's beliefs and actions. :headbutt:

 

[Ria777]

I believe there was a town somewhere in the US where the Scientologists were successful with this strategy, always forget where it was though. It's sort of a reverse gerrymandering.

Clearwater, Florida.

 

[lupinwick]

Some fundy types honestly believe that you're not a true Christian if you're not being persecuted, so they almost go out of their way to seek out being ridiculed, etc. (Sometimes they get what they deserve, to be honest.) And sometimes they whine about being "persecuted" when they don't get to be in total control of everyone else's beliefs and actions. :headbutt:

Collective guilt for 1500 years or so of persecution of anybody who didn't agree with them (in the West anyway)?

 

[ramonmercado]

A pertinent tweet from Margaret Atwood:

Margaret E. Atwood ‏@MargaretAtwood 7m7 minutes ago
Thanks to all for a fascinating visit @WestPoint_USMA , talking to cadets about #handmaidstale and dictatorships, and WW2.

 

[ramonmercado]

And heres an article about Margaret Atwoods visit to Westpoint.

... The entire first-year class of cadets at West Point had read her 1985 novel, “The Handmaid’s Tale,” for a literature course. The 75-year-old author agreed to speak to the assembled plebes (as first-year students at the military academy are called) after lunching with them on mac-and-cheese under the gothic arches of the campus’ vast, Hogwartsian mess hall. ...

While Atwood prepared to go onstage, Lt. Col. Naomi Mercer, the assistant professor and course director responsible for assigning “The Handmaid’s Tale” (which was paired with the Ursula K. LeGuin story “The Ones Who Walk Away From Omelas”), talked about her choice. Mercer, an Iraq War veteran, is also the author of a forthcoming book on feminist science fiction from the 1980s, “Toward Utopia.” “The Army has real gender issues, still,” she said. Reading a book like “The Handmaid’s Tale,” “at least creates a vocabulary to talk about those issues. It was very prescient.” ...

After her opening remarks, the questions posed by the cadets — who identified themselves by name and rank before asking — referred to everything from Islamism to Descartes, whom Atwood paraphrases at one point in “The Handmaid’s Tale.” Yes, if she were writing the novel now she might have borrowed some of the oppressive tactics of Muslim fundamentalists, but, 30 years on, contemporary American politics — such as conservatives’ references to “real rape” in the run-up to the 2014 elections and the bizarre belief held by Rep. Todd Akin, R-Mo., that a woman’s body reflexively disables conception in the event of “legitimate rape” — still offers ample inspiration. When those stories broke, she said, the hashtag “#handmaidstale” began to appear all over social media. The book has been filmed, made into an opera and is currently being adapted as a graphic novel. ...

http://www.salon.com/2015/02/08/mar...nversation_on_gender_politics_and_oppression/

 

[GingerTabby]

The Handmaid`s Tale has also been made into a ballet:

http://nac-cna.ca/dance/event/8356

I was interested to note that the prof who assigned the novel paired it with Ursula K. Leguin`s story `The Ones Who Walk Away from Omelas.` That story gives me the shivers but I love it nevertheless.

 

[ramonmercado]

Another Christian Dominion guy. Well, if he believes in killing all males who don't follow biblical law (regardless of race) then I guess he's not racist. But he is a misandrist.

State Rep. Matt Shea of Spokane Valley in conservative eastern Washington has been under fire since he acknowledged in a Facebook video last week that he had distributed the four-page document titled, “Biblical Basis for War” to some of his supporters.

The document condemns abortion and same-sex marriage and describes how those who don’t follow biblical law should be punished. At one point, the document says, “If they do not yield, kill all males.”

News of the document prompted several of Shea’s political contributors to demand refunds of their donations. ...

Shea has embraced far-right conspiracy theories, mingled with militia groups, visited right-wing activists who seized a wildlife refuge in Oregon in 2016, and led a push to convert eastern Washington into a 51st state, called Liberty. ...

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entr...pmgnews__TheMorningEmail__110518&guccounter=1

 

[Mythopoeika]

What happened to 'thou shalt not kill'?

 

[Mikefule]

What happened to 'thou shalt not kill'?

It's like the pirates' code: more like "guidelines".

 

[Austin Popper]

Another doofus gets his fifteen minutes of fame.

 

[maximus otter]

What happened to 'thou shalt not kill'?

To be fair, the original Jewish bible says “Thou shalt not murder” (tirtsah) rather than “Thou shalt not kill” (ratsah). There’s a big distinction.

“As Swiss Jesuit theologian Raymund Schwager has identified, the Old Testament contains 600 passages of explicit violence, around 1000 verses detailing God’s own violent punishments, and most significantly over 100 passages where God expressly commands others to kill people.”

“A representative sampling…

“When the Lord your God brings you into the land you are entering to possess and drives out before you many nations…then you must destroy them totally. Make no treaty with them and show them no mercy.” (Deuteronomy 7:1-2)

“…do not leave alive anything that breathes. Completely destroy them…as the Lord your God has commanded you…” Deuteronomy 20:16

“This is what the Lord Almighty says… ‘Now go and strike Amalek and devote to destruction all that they have. Do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, child and infant, ox and sheep, camel and donkey.’” (1 Samuel 15:3)”

https://apholt.com/2015/03/17/thou-shalt-not-kill-vs-thou-shalt-not-murder/

( Atheist BTW: not my fault...)

maximus otter

 

[ramonmercado]

“This is what the Lord Almighty says… ‘Now go and strike Cromer and devote to destruction all that they have. Do not spare them, but kill both man and woman, child and infant, ox and sheep, camel and donkey.’” (1 Samuel 15:3)”

Fixed your typo.