Connected / Shared Dreams

gattino

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Most of the odd things that occur to me generally fall into the category of "psychic" daydreams and multi-layered coincidences. Seemingly precognitive dreams make an occassional appearance, but lately dreams have been to the fore, in my thoughts, (failed) experiments and conversations, with a couple of precognitive images thrown in. And then...this:

Last night I woke up from a dream about visiting a friend, Renato, in Australia, who didn't make me feel very welcome in his home. I check my phone for the time and find its 4am...and that there's a message for me. It had just been sent by the self same Renato in Australia.

Eerie enough but when I tell him in the morning about my dream he reports that he too had woken from a disturbing dream at 4am Australian time...a dream in which he was fending off an "unwelcome visitor". (His words.. it was actually someone breaking in to try and kill him)



:shock:
 

MercuryCrest

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I once had a similar situation with a friend of mine....

In my dream, I was walking down the road and I passed a mailbox. I turned around, opened it, took out the mail, then stopped myself and thought, "What the hell am I doing? This isn't mine."

As I put the mail back, someone from the house across the street (whose mailbox it was) came out and started yelling at me about not messing with other people's things.

I didn't recognize the guy, but the woman standing next to him was my roommate's girlfriend. She was trying to calm him down, telling him how it was an honest mistake and that I didn't know the mail wasn't mine.

The next day, my roommate comes up and tells me the exact same dream, but from HIS perspective...he was the guy who was yelling at me. He didn't recognize me, either. :shock:

We never did confirm whether his girlfriend had a similar dream that night.
 

gattino

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Brilliant story...better than mine! One thing of possible interest though is the fact that neither you nor your room mate recognised each other in the dreams. One of the principle reasons mine and Renato's dreams did NOT match so closely was that he never associated the person in his dream with me at all. Your story seems to suggest that doesn't necessarily matter...

One other thing of note is that in MY dream (which involved no horror, but did end up stressful: I was struggling to get to the airport for my flight home and was clearly never going to make it in time) there was someone else present at R's house with me, but who he was or what his part in the tale might have been vanished immediately upon waking and he was reduced in my mind's eye to nothing but a black shapeless someone.
 

gattino

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Since writing the above tale it has become evident that it is in fact only a small part of a much larger and rather mindboggling web of synchronicity triggered by an experiment in dream telepathy.

This is a long tale, but I hope worth it. I shall try my best to break it up into small bite sized chunks to aid clarity.

The two key names are Gadge (Gary) and Rennie (Renato). The former is a brit living in Holland and the latter is the Australian friend from the story above. They don't know each other, have never met or had any contact.

It all began a few weeks ago when, following a seemingly successful attempt to "will" a long lost friend to get in touch by sending telepathic instructions at night while he dreamt - a success that could have been coincidence and so needed to be tested - I set upon the idea of actually planting an image into the mind of someone else. Gadge was chosen as he's an artist and so would have a strong visual imagination and a possible propensity for "psi".


The exact nature and purpose of the experiment seemed to change each day over the course of a week and was all rather half-arsed. But the essential point was to get him to dream about, and report that he'd dreamt about, an image of which he had no knowledge and could not reasonably hit upon by chance. The image was of a winged elephant.

Rennie was one of the handful of people I was keeping informed of my activities. Intriguingly no sooner had we begun but Rennie himself had a startling precognitive dream. It involved someone he'd never seen before turning up in real life the following day.

The experiments with Gadge meanwhile were generally a flop. He kept a dream diary but no elephant, winged or otherwise, turned up in his recollections. On the 3rd night of trying I altered things slightly and to aid me in properly "aiming" my thoughts I chose to look at a printed out photo of Gadge as I willed him to dream of the elephant. The only photo I had to hand was of him at a halloween do dressed rather like Freddie Kruger, and I was looking at it in the dark by the dim light of my phone which added to its rather creepy appearance. But I didn't think it relevant.
Once more no winged elephant appeared in his reported dream. But - and it took a while for the potential significance to occur to me - he reported that night he'd had a nightmare He was at home and being pursued by a horror movie bogeyman trying to kill him.....

Realising that the photo of him I'd been looking at might have worked its way into his dreams, where the elephant motif had not, we changed tack. The elephant was sacked and replaced by a vivid image, produced in photoshop, of Gadge himself as a Spanish bullfighter. Would this have more success? That night - nothing. He had almost no dream material to report and certainly nothing related to the image in question.

However....another change of tack that very night was deciding to record my own dreams, to see if anything interesting happened. Nothing of note did...at first. It was only 3 days later that one of the dreams (arial footage of a german city and the place of Hitler's birth being singled out) was replayed before my very eyes on a television documentary. This represent the 3rd Psi-seeming event in the course of the week, not one of which involved the images I was actually trying to send.

At this point we decided the dream influencing experiment was a flop. It occurred to me that it was bound to be so. I'd heard of the Maimonides program, and how its procedures involved sending the image while the subject was categorically in a dream state, then waking them from the dream before anything has a chance to fade. This we clearly weren't in a position to do.

So a final change of tack. A daytime remote viewing exercise, still using the bullfighter image. I would concentrate on it for 15 minutes while Gadge in Holland tried to clairvoyantly perceive what I was looking at. Again, a complete failure.

And so the experiments came to an end with only the "bogeyman" dream, at this point, suggestive of any kind of success.

Several days passed and on Sunday night the account at the beginning of this topic involving a semi-shared and eerily timed dream with Rennie in Australia occurred. He happened to be sending me a message at the very time I was dreaming about him, and I woke at 4am...then later found that he had woken at 4am his time from a symbolically related dream.

Two things struck me about this. The first was that we had accidentally followed the procedures of the aforementioned Maionides project - thoughts "sent" during the actual dream state, and being woken from the dream so as to report it fresh - this inspired me to send off for the book of those events, Dream Telepathy by Ullman, Krippner and Vaughan, which arrived yesterday. The second thing that passed my thoughts was the essential similarity between Rennie's dream - which involved a killer trying to break into his house to get him - and the "bogeyman" dream of Gadge's over a week earlier during the experiments. But as there was no connection between the two individuals or events I thought it not worth expressing.

Yesterday the book arrived and I began reading it while the television was on in the background, showing a repeat of the sitcom Duty Free. My attention was pulled suddenly from the book by the certainty someone on the television had just used the word "mulato". This word had been the key element of a much earlier "telepathic" experience, but one which I'd been recounting just a couple of days ago. So I payed attention to the TV show and found that this episode largely revolved around an encounter with a bull fighter......

Hmmm...2 similarities to the Gadge experiments within a couple of days? Still perhaps too far fetched to mention. So I carried on reading the book and within minutes........

I come to an account of a famous psychiatrist in 1914 being pestered by a clairvoyant to do some ESP experiments. He agrees and they do exactly what we were doing. For 15 minutes at lunchtime the psychiatrist is concentrating on an object in his study while the clairvoyant tries to see it psychically. The clairvoyant's reading, like ours, turned out to be complete rubbish. But here's the twist...

Before the clairvoyant's report arrived the psychiatrist heard first from a friend of his who'd just had a remarkable dream...involving the very thing the shrink was concentrating on and trying to send. What was it? The image of an elephant.....

(From the book "Would suggest evidence for Jung's hypothesis of synchronicity - an intricate web of meaningful coincidences clustered around an emotional situation.")

Every thought I have about this whole thing is also constantly turning up in the book. Does the idea that Rennie and Gadge should share a dream sound like total nonsense when they've no connection to each other? On the subject of cases in the world of psychoanalysis it remarks " When patients who have never met have intermeshing dreams on different nights (Gadge and Rennie?) and these dreams become meaningful only when discussed with their common point of contact, the psychiatrist (me?), one begins to wonder just who might be sending telepathic messages to whom."


My head hurts.
 

Sergeant_Pluck

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gattino said:
had just used the word "mulato". This word had been the key element of a much earlier "telepathic" experience, but one which I'd been recounting just a couple of days ago. So I payed attention to the TV show and found that this episode largely revolved around an encounter with a bull fighter......

It's possible you heard the word 'muleta' - the muleta is the Spanish word for the red cape that a torero uses.
 

gattino

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That muleta thing would be a perfect fit..and every bit as uncanny if it was what grabbed my attention. Great detective work! ( a phrase I use with a purpose, as we shall see....)

There were two subsequent spooky/psi events since the above account, the latter of which is recorded on the thread "Sign of the Cross" on the "It Happened To Me" forum. 2 days ago, looking back I noticed something extraordinary in it's own right.

Monday 12th November: Rennie had his precognitive dream about the stranger.
Monday 19th November: The Hitler documentary "broke my dream" of a few days earlier.
Monday 26th November: The shared dream with Rennie which started this thread.
Monday 3rd December: The incident I've not recorded on either thread: my morning post-sleep daydreaming had me thinking about an obscure superhero character with the silly name Noman. 90 minutes later a truck passed me in the street emblazoned with the logo "Noman Flowers". I googled the fictional character when I returned home to find he was a disembodied consciousness that entered and animated a set of android bodies, which best worked "the more closely similar their brains" were. A veritable instruction manual on telepathy!
Monday 10 December: The incident described on the Sign Of The Cross posting (In summary: A book arrives in the post about synchronicity, specifically claiming its a sign of contact with "the other side". A few pages in there's a paragraph which is an almost exact account of a "paranormal" experience that happened to me 10 years ago, involving an item given by my dad to my mum. That's to say it recounts another person having an all but identical experience to mine, not just in general but in so many layers of "coincidence" that it beggars belief. As soon as I note this, my mum in a sudden bout of infection-based confusion/delirium begins demanding a box from a drawer and will only be placated when she's given it...where she, without comment or explanation, goes rummaging to triumphantly pull out the item at the centre of the aforementioned "coincidence". Earlier that day she'd also reported my (long dead) dad had been standing by the door of her room...)

It's so obvious written down like this but it genuinely never hit me till 48 hours ago that all the major oddness of recent weeks has happened on a Monday. With that in mind I determined to record my dreams last night again in case it helps facilitate anything today. I told Rennie about it conversationally online, not meaning in anyway to imply - as it never occurred to me - that it ought to have anything whatever to do with him, yet he must have interpreted it that way as he replied that he'd try and note his too if he remembered. I didn't comment.

I have indeed recorded my dreams and I'll point out first off that there is no guarantee anything at all will happen today (the monday thing may be coincidence), no reason to assume it'll be related to my dreams if it does, no reason to assume anything precognitive need turn up today rather than later in the week, and no reason to assume it need involve Rennie as he's not been part of most of the odd things, only a couple. With all that in mind something interesting, if not sinister did thread trough my dreams.

No less than 3 separate dreams had the theme of murder/witness/police hunt. The first involved someone burying a body in the garden, but being watched by the woman next door fromt eh upstairs window...she's telling the police/reporters the signs were all there etc. He's apprehended as he tries to leave the country I think. A later dream had a small detail in it where a friend of mine on public transport in a foreign city with me has a hair sneakily picked off his clothes by a detective watching us, to compare to one at a crime scene. And the final dream of the night was very much in the tv detective show mould (it even featured Dick Van Dyke) as it involved someone wrongly accused in a race to uncover the real killer, who looks like him, before he himself is arrested. The real killer is spotted by the key witness when he turns up on tv, an awards ceremony possibly, wearing the same make up he used during the crime.

The repeated theme in 3 different dreams in one night is clearly suggestive of something being picked up from somewhere. If's it precognitive it may simply turn out to be the plot of a tv show. If it's telepathic it may relate to Rennie, perhaps to his own dreams. This is where it gets a little sinister.

I'd not been in touch with Rennie for months before we started chatting online again several weeks ago, just before the whole dream telepathy experiments began. But oddly enough our first conversations were, by coincidence, around the subject f dreams. He'd been having disturbing ones about his parents. In a particularly vivid one his dad was no longer i the old family home and he kept asking his mum where he'd gone - she refused to answer, before going on the run.. he chased after her and demanded at rifle point that she tell him where dad was. She just tells him he's "left the house". Rennie woke up crying in distress. He was worried this was a dream suggestive of secret health problems his dad might have.

But then add the fact the shared dream with me at the start of this thread involved, at his end, cowering from someone trying to break in to kill him.

Then all my dreams last night about murders and crime scenes would have rather unsettling implications if it was indeed related to Rennie. So have I any reason to believe they did? Only this: listening back to the dictaphone recordings from last night the first thing that I made mention of was the presence of the young Jackie Kennedy. Only later this morning did it hit me for the first time ever that JK bore a very strong resemblance to Rennie's family, including himself. In fact the message he sent me that night I woke at 4am was to ask me to do some photoshop work on an old pic of his sister..and looking at it now she looks strikingly like Jackie O. As dreams are usually layerd in their associations its worth saying Jackie's main fame is in being the widow of a murdered man.....

You can make your own predictions where this is going, I'm just keeping notes!
 

Cherrybomb

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Wow, anything else happend since? I'm hooked!
 

gattino

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Well nothing of note happened on Monday - the Cosmic Joker being a git - and though there is something potentially of interest in the Sunday night/Monday morning dreams which I later transcribed they really can't count as part of the pattern as there wasn't anything spontaneous or related to myself about it. However for the sake of completion here's what was perhaps noteworthy about that night's dreams on closer inspection:

First and foremost Murder, witnesses to the crime, police and mistaken or confused identity kept popping up.

In the first dream someone next door was burying a body in the garden, but witnessed from the upstairs window by the neighbours, who were showing the police or reporters the squalor he had lived in. Also in this section Buddy Rich the famous drummer made an appearance before I corrected myself and realised it was someone called Buddy Ricciu, who looked a bit like him, played drums like him, but wasn't him.

The second dream section related to the situation in Egypt and was very symbolic.

The third recording involved a church scene and leaving in the company of a friend Paul, who is a gaunt faced chap with shoulder length hair, leaving the church I was on my own for bit lost in Madrid before finding myself on a bus or tram with Paul there again and a fat middle aged police detective noticing and keeping an eye on us as he tries to sneakily take a loose hair off Paul's clothes to compare with one at the scene of a crime.

The fourth recording was a tale set in San Francisco or LA, with the wrong person - perhaps the policeman himself - at risk of being arrested for a murder because he looked like the killer, and he was out to find the real one before it was too late. The witness who had identified him then sees the real killer, a young man in theatrical/pop star make up on the tv screen and identifies him instead.

So murder and confused identity repeating as I said. I go into such detail as I read something on Monday night on news sites that fits suspiciously well:

There is one obvious murder in the news at the moment - the killings in that school in america, but I'd not considered it because it's already happened and the killer was dead and identified on the spot. However nor had I been reading the details of it at all, I only saw the basic headlines. Monday night though I read a profile of Adam Lanza, the shooter, on a news site and saw for the first time the following intriguing fact which I had not known:
The police originally told the press the killer was Ryan Lanza, Adam's brother, who was living in another city and was subsequently bombarded with hate messages and press interest at the same time as learning of his own mum and brother's deaths. He was tweeting and texting his innocence online, quoted even as saying "It wasn't me! I'm on the bus right now". He was taken in to help police with their inquiries and photos show he, like his brother, is a gaunt fellow with shoulder length hair.

There are certainly matches in that tale! Of course its not precognition since all this had happened before my dreams (unless it was a precognition of me READING about it of course). And it also doesn't really fit into the Monday phenomenon since unlike all of the other things it didn't happen to me and wasn't spontaneous. Still, intriguing...
 

Cherrybomb

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Good stuff. That bit about the Ryan/Adam Lanza part was really interesting.

Also, a little side note, I've not heard the name Buddy Rich for years, but last night I was watching an episode of Archer on netflix and one of Archers' possible fathers was....Buddy Rich! :D
 

gattino

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It's a thought we seldom have....when nothing odd seems to be happening in our lives, how do we know we're not ourselves part of someone else's amazing coincidence?

Similarly I sometimes entertain the thought that the random thoughts, dreams, daydreams and eerie feelings we have which DON'T appear to come true or reflect the content of someone else's mind may in fact be just a case of they ARE but we just never have reason to know. How do I know my dreams don;t relate to the lives of my neighbour, or the random wanderings of my mind on a train aren't being picked up from the stranger sitting opposite who I'd have no reason to ever talk to about it?
 

PeniG

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Just to add to the identity confusion theme - early in the breaking news sequence, some careless (and, I hope, now unemployed) reporter googled Ryan Lanza, found a Facebook page, and broadcast it. This would have been irresponsible enough if the Facebook page had belonged to the Ryan Lanza for whom the shooter had been mistaken.

It wasn't. It was a completely different Ryan Lanza.

Tragedy and Farce. Who can distinguish them when the blood isn't actually flowing?
 

Cherrybomb

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:? That is awful PeniG.

It's like the idea of Tulaps (sp?) where an idea passes from one person to the next. I'm sure I've said this here before, but my mother believes ghosts are people dreaming/thinking of that place. So the little ghost in the living room is just someone else dreaming of when they were young playing in their living room, etc.

As a kid I used to have vivid nightmares that I was being woken up in another life. I'd fall asleep in my normal home and wake up in my dreams to find I was living rough on the streets of London with beggers for parents. Was someone elses reality crossing wires with my own? :shock:
 

Mythopoeika

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cherrybomb said:
:? That is awful PeniG.

It's like the idea of Tulaps (sp?) where an idea passes from one person to the next.

Tulpas?
 

MercuryCrest

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cherrybomb said:
...my mother believes ghosts are people dreaming/thinking of that place. So the little ghost in the living room is just someone else dreaming of when they were young playing in their living room, etc.

I've been pondering this exact same thing. Given the oddness of dreams, could some of the stranger things people report seeing (Mothman, Springheeled Jack, etc,) actually be someone dreaming so strongly that it gains a particular reality which crosses into our own?

I often take the oddest occurrences within dreams completely in stride. If, at some point, I find myself belching blue flame into some poor woman's face, I'll have to look for Fortean reports of the return of Springheeled Jack.... :shock:
 

gattino

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Another precognitive dream!

I didn't record them last night, but remember them all enough for a few moments at least to note them down on waking this morning. Death themes kept cropping up, a scary and very vivid ghost encounter, more mistaken identtiy (this time in relation to the deceased rather than a killer) and then.....one involving a creature I somehow identified as the egyptian god anubis....who when I looked him up on wiki was the god of the underworld, funerals and graves...it all seemed rather ominous. Until I realised my dream had already come true.....


You see when I got up this morning and went to check my mum was awake before the carers come, I found a very comical sight...she had a sheet over her nose like a gas mask and a floral beanbag type neck pillow was wrapped around her head like one of those hairdrying hats. It was so comical I decided to fetch the camera and sneak a photo..making sure to switch off the flash so as not to wake her and get caught. It was only half an hour later that I realised this was my dream....

You see I'd dreamed of a strange goblin like creature who I interpreted as egyptian (and hence anubis) because of the strange elaborate headwear it had on. I was sneaking a photo from a distance when he looked up and spotted me doing it and I ran like hell.....
 

gattino

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Yesterday -another Monday, another precognitive dream. But precisely which of two scenarios it foretold is rather difficult to say.

The key elements were these.. that we (a group of us) were travelling on the rope that hung beneath a balloon. Some were inside the balloon (it wasn't as big as a hot air balloon, but obviously bigger than a toy one..it served as some kind of vessel for transport) but we were hanging and swaying on a the dangling rope that descended from it's underside...it was never more than several meters above ground, and at first it seemed to be over sea, as I recall we looked down directly onto a person standing alone on something that was floating on the sea's surface. The sense was he'd survived a wreck or naval battle maybe that we ourselves must have been part of ..we called down to him, he looked up, and we pulled him up on to the rope. In appearance he was essentially captain birdseye (ie bearded uniformed chap) a fact not dwelt upon.

Next thing we're coming in close to our destination...my house.. we (by now its just me and a friend of mine) are coming down on the main road just around the corner from my street, and could simply have landed there and walked to the house but for some reason we were obliged to get the whole way by balloon despite now struggling wiht it and it pulling us backwards a bit...like a parachute in a gust might. I could carry on a bit more but those are the essential elements that then, as ever, manifested unexpectedly in the real world shortly after. Or did they?

I was walking back from the post office - I always seem to be when these thigns happen, always the same long road (the stroll must put me in a daydreaming mental state) - and dwelling on the dream, wondering what the balloon part could possibly represent.

At precisely the point on on the road where we were coming in to land in the dream, I passed somethng that grabbed my attention and curiosity, but carried on several yards before it hit me and I turned back a little (like the balloon in the dream had dragged us back) to take another look. What had grabbed my notice before the connection hit me was something at the front of a christmas house. It was a 2 foot tall santa doll (capt Birdseye?) dangling a couple of meters above the ground from a rope above the side of the door....

My dream was broken. Here it was manifest.. and I told myself I clearly and absolutely had a precognitive dream. And I did. But was it of that? You see, one day later and the animated film UP is on tv. It features a house being used a means of transport, flying through the air by balloon power, and our two heroes hanging from a rope directly beneath it, and a short distance off the ground.....

At times it was like a literal re-enactment of my dream. But is that coincidence? Or it it this that I had "foreseen"? And if the latter, then what do I make of the rope dangling santa yesterday? Was that the coincidence? Or evidence of seeing patterns and links where none really existed?

My head hurts again.
 

gattino

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Perhaps reality itself is another kind of dream...and the strange and meaningful things that happen around us are that dream on the verge of turning lucid. Then death itself would be no more than waking up, and we shall bore our friends with our tale of life and how real it all seemed, though already half forgotten.
 

gattino

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As this thread turned into my personal dream diary, and the following involves Gadge, one of the protagonists of the original saga recorded here....here is another seemingly precognitive dream from the night before last.


I had a dream in which I met Gadge...only he and I were in colour, the rest of the world was greyed or whited out in some way. Which made me think I was meeting him in an actual dreamland.

We tested this by attempting to fly...running and taking a dive, in my case over grass, but carrying on just above the ground for several brief seconds before hitting it. With excitement each of us bore witness to the fact the other really did fly just a tiny bit. The need to believe to make it happen was commented on.

Something involving a couple of hags was involved in the dream but the details were completely lost.

***************

Last evening I went last minute and with zero foreknowledge of the movie itself to see the Great and Powerful Oz.

Like the original it starts in black and white and turns to colour. A scene involves the flying monkeys flying low over the sleepy poppy fields before hitting the ground....this just after the Wizard gives a rallying speech: "When we believe, nothing is impossible.".

The hag connection is also pretty obvious.....
 

gattino

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After a 4 month hiatus, Psychic Mondays may be back! The following three incidents all happened on Monday of this week. It even includes a link back to the long saga of events at the heart of the posts on here.

1) I've been having a recurring dream every several weeks (it involves browsing/searching through superhero titles in a comic book shop) I had it again in Monday night so told a couple of people about it on Tuesday to see if they could interpret the meaning.

Last night I picked up the book the Holographic Universe. It's not about dreams. Yet I found myself reading the following passage.
"During the course of his practice Ullman noticed that when one of his patients failed to recognize or accept some truth about himself, that truth would surface again and again in his dreams, in different metaphorical guises and linked with different related experiences from his past, but always in an apparent attempt to offer him new opportunities to come to terms with the truth."

To add another layer the Ullman who gets a passing name check in that paragraph is, by "coincidence", the author of the book/experiments on dream telepathy that was at the centre of all that stuff with Rennie and Gadge before Christmas. The Maimonides program.

Creepily coincidental enough, but then half an hour later I decided to start watching the box set of the Twilight Zone I never got round to. Randomly chose disc 6 with no idea what the first story was or about. Shadow Play it's called. And, take a guess. It involves a man on death row trying in vain to persuade the people around him that they are just part of the same recurring dream he has every single night, and when they execute him they will all cease to exist.....

**********************

2) My mum's back in hospital ...she's fine (though now completely loopy) and of course being 85 and in and out of the place I always find myself morbidly contemplating the inevitable. On this occassion, as a hearse passed my bus on the road, I was thinking about the practical things whenever the day does come..including such as what if anything to write in the notices of the local paper (!). When I got home I suddenly noticed a piece of paper sticking down from the gap at the back of the shelf above this computer. This used to be my dad's room though there' next to nothing of his in here now. I retrieved the mysterious piece of paper and - clearly typed out by him but not composed by him - were a few lines of verse of the kind seen in the local paper's death notices. It was addressed to a "dear mum" saying how heartbreaking it was she was gone but all her pain was now over and we'll be together one day......

Kinda creepy "coincidence",no?

***************************************

3) Again on Monday night... I had actually noted the basic summary of ALL that night's dreams into the dictaphone, not just the recurring dream, which I haven't done for ages. I never listened to it..and therefore never remembered my other dreams...until last night.....

Last night after watching the twilight zone episode I referred to above I watched Naked Gun on tv. In one scene the silver haired Leslie Nielson is hanging from the stone phallus of a life-size statue on the facade of a building. He turns the penis around giving the statue an erection, which breaks off in his hand... After watching the film I went to bed, recalled the dictaphone recordings from 2 nights earlier and played them back for the first time. There was my account of the recurring dream, but there also was another dream...one about a (similarly coiffured) Cary Grant, in a movie, trying with great embarrassment to cover the unintended impression of an erection on a life-sized stone statue of himself.....

Looks like it's all kicking off again....
 

gattino

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Addendum.. I've just noticed the posting I made before this one, about the great and powerful oz precognitive dream, was made on the 13th March and referred to seeing the movie the night before (12th), meaning that dream must have happened n the 11th. I've just checked the calendar. Yup...another monday.
 

Ulalume

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Gattino, your dreams are interesting. To me, it sounds like your personal unconscious mind is meeting with the collective unconscious somehow.
 

Ulalume

tart of darkness
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On the subject of shared dreams...

I've been whiling away the long evenings watching Good Mythical Morning on YouTube, and came across this one where Rhett tells of a disturbing shared nightmare he and his wife experienced.


It's a pretty darn creepy dream, I must say.
 

gattino

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I've read quite a few accounts on here and elsewhere of shared dreams. It's particularly common among married couples.

I say common...my theory is that its less well known than it could be not because it happens rarely, but because its rarely discovered. Most people forget even the most vivid and interesting dreams within a few minutes of waking. We seldom tell other people about them in any detail. So for two people to notice they'd had the same dream you'd need several things to happen, generally speaking - for the dream to be remembered, for it to be noteworthy or unusual enough in its content to bother reporting it, for the other person with whom the dream was shared to be close by and awake (hence the married couple thing) within those precious short minutes when its fresh in your mind, and for that other person to equally have retained a memory of their own dream. Without all of those ideal circumstances its unlikely you'd notice you had shared a dream with someone. So perhaps its happening all of the time.

My thing for a long time on here was noticing the precognitive elements of my dreams. Then maybe last year i accidentally discovered that when telling a friend about his appearance in my dream, the details appeared to match real life recent events in his life. The same thing happened with other friends in the followingfew days..so i decided there's clearly a telepathic element to dreams too..perhaps when an individual turns up unexpectedly in your dream you're picking up images from their mind. That dream world is in essence the shared unconscious. But then it doesn't happen often enough or clearly enough for that to seem true...unless, I surmised, you're more often than not picking up from their mind while they themselves are also dreaming. Dreaming dreams which they forget. So when I dream of X, and tell him about the dream and he sees no match to anything in his life perhaps its because i was picking up from X's sleeping mind, from his own concurrent dreams that night..dreams he will in all likelihood have already forgotten. It's only when his dreams are about his waking experiences that a match to the content of my dreams will be noticed.
 

gattino

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Can Two People Have the Same Dream?
If two people can share the same dream, then dreams transcend individual minds.
Posted Jun 19, 2016


Can two or more people share the same dream? As far as I know, there have been no scientific investigations of this question. But there are literally thousands of well-documented accounts.

The best-documented cases involve therapist-client shared dreams. In these, there is a professionally trained therapist who verifies the claim that the dream happened to both the therapist and the client around the same time. The next-best documented cases involve people in close relationships like parent/children, spouses, or lovers. Consistent with the effect of emotional closeness on shared dreams, we also have plenty of well-documented cases of twins sharing the same dream. The least well-documented cases involve complete strangers sharing the same dream. (We only have anecdotal reports of strangers experiencing the same dream because the strangers happened to run into one another and recognize each another from the dream!)

Continued:
https://www.psychologytoday.com/intl/blog/dream-catcher/201606/can-two-people-have-the-same-dream
 

Coal

The Ultimate Skepticus
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Interesting. This:

Nevertheless, I have learned to respect anecdotal reports in the world of dream research because these reports are usually reliable. There is no incentive for people to lie about the experience.
Specious reasoning. People lie. They just do.

An obvious experiment would be to get people (we could call them 'participants') to get a pen and paper out and write down their dreams on waking. Write, seal, post. Collate them for a month and then do some comparisons

There no room there for collusion, accidental or otherwise, and the act of recalling a dream at the point of waking is free of any recall-re-consolidation errors.

That ought to do it.

It would also be instructive to compare what people thought they wrote with what they actually wrote after.
 

gattino

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An obvious experiment would be to get people (we could call them 'participants') to get a pen and paper out and write down their dreams on waking. Write, seal, post. Collate them for a month and then do some comparisons
Well im not sure that would satisfy the researcher...if the typical experiencers of shared dreams are couples and the like, ie typically people in the same house if not bed....you could simply assert the possibility, indeed likelihood of collusion between them. Or at the very least of casual conversation on what they'd just dreamed.

So you would have to isolate the individuals and be there when they wake to get the first account of the dreams yourself. Which would presumably not be all that conducive to triggering this particular phenomenon. On top of that if your suspicion is untruthfulness on the part of the people reporting these experiences you could just as easily accuse them of agreeing beforehand what they were going to *claim* to the experimenter that their dreams were.
 

Lord Lucan

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About 30 years ago, two colleagues, at different times, both had the same dream about me! Apparently, I was wearing green flares dancing to acid house in a nightclub!

Was it a prophetic dream they both dreamed???
 
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