Coronavirus Disease 2019 (COVID-19): Conspiracy Theories & Claims

marhawkman

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I didn't see anything referring to whether people who got that variant were vaccinated or not, AND it mentioned that this is just a variant to watch, that there is not enough information to know whether it is more virulent yet.

And it is certainly your choice whether you get a vaccine or not, but at the very least you need to understand how virus' work and how vaccines work.
I posted a source that talked about that a few days ago. Israel's population is mostly vaccinated... and many of their new cases are from vaccinated people.
Well this is worrying.... :/
https://www.thedailybeast.com/ultra-vaccinated-israels-debacle-is-a-dire-warning-to-america
back to the "does the vaccine actually work" discussion it seems :/
This article's position is that it might last as long as 6 months at best. And that's assuming it actually works on new mutant strains at all. Which is weird, because most vaccines... don't have that problem.
Which you apparently saw already. But yeah.... Questioning the effectiveness of the vaccine(s) is still on the table.

Realistically, I can't call them proven to work. "immunity" that only lasts 6 months at best? what?
 

michael59

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I didn't see anything referring to whether people who got that variant were vaccinated or not, AND it mentioned that this is just a variant to watch, that there is not enough information to know whether it is more virulent yet.

And it is certainly your choice whether you get a vaccine or not, but at the very least you need to understand how virus' work and how vaccines work.

This report/study follows quite a few people in all the different categories



Today's b(2).jpg



Yeesh, it can be so confusing at times, am I right? I think I am going to stick with my, "wait and see...." for as long as I can.

I do want to reiterate that I am not a professional in any kind of medical or scientific capacity and therefore I do not advocate that anyone follow suit with my decision.
 

Vardoger

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I guess the website is kind of a way to retaliate against all the antivaxx propaganda from the CTs. An eye for an eye?
The website is harsh, but so are the antivaxxers propaganda..
 

Yithian

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I'm not inclined to take Invermectin from all I've seen, but this media visual spin is dodgy. A number of secondary sources that reproduced the CNN video (right) instead of the Instagram post (left) also commented on his pallor.

E-WDSlKVUAMtfJc.jpeg
 

marhawkman

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I guess the website is kind of a way to retaliate against all the antivaxx propaganda from the CTs. An eye for an eye?
The website is harsh, but so are the antivaxxers propaganda..
to be honest, some of the stuff getting thrown around I personally suspect to be mis-information about "anti-vaxxers"... such as the idea that people who oppose mandates to get the vaccine actually think it's bad. Example: that stupid 5G BS... seriously? Sure.... some of the people repeating it might believe it... but who started it and why?
 

marhawkman

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I'm not inclined to take Invermectin from all I've seen, but this media visual spin is dodgy. A number of secondary sources that reproduced the CNN video (right) instead of the Instagram post (left) also commented on his pallor.

View attachment 44503
Yeah that's full-on digital FRAUD. you're MAKING the person look sick by re-coloring the picture. It's not an accident, it's intentional deception. Also the fact they call it "horse de-wormer" is.... ethically questionable... on a good day and potentially grounds for a law suit.

People like to talk about "suppressing mis-information"? well Ivermectin has been proven in real-world clinical usage to be an effective anti-viral agent in HUMANS. Calling it "horse de-wormer"? That's intentional mis-information.
 

Nosmo King

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Yeah that's full-on digital FRAUD. you're MAKING the person look sick by re-coloring the picture. It's not an accident, it's intentional deception. Also the fact they call it "horse de-wormer" is.... ethically questionable... on a good day and potentially grounds for a law suit.

People like to talk about "suppressing mis-information"? well Ivermectin has been proven in real-world clinical usage to be an effective anti-viral agent in HUMANS. Calling it "horse de-wormer"? That's intentional mis-information.
Advertisers have been doing that for years, take an advert for skincare for example, the before photo is always in low light with washed out colour and lank hair, the after image is the same person who has just spent 2 hours in hair and make-up and professionally lit.

Example,
article-2403530-1B7D96C7000005DC-357_310x189.jpg
 

marhawkman

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Advertisers have been doing that for years, take an advert for skincare for example, the before photo is always in low light with washed out colour and lank hair, the after image is the same person who has just spent 2 hours in hair and make-up and professionally lit.

Example,
View attachment 44504
yeah, but retouching images used in promoting your own product has different ethical issues than retouching images of a third party just to make them look bad.
 

Vardoger

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Ivermectin trouble in COVID paradise...
------------------------
U.S.

Patients Overdosing on Ivermectin Are Clogging Oklahoma ERs: Doctor​

BY JON JACKSON ON 9/2/21 AT 4:43 PM EDT

A doctor in rural Oklahoma has claimed that people taking the horse de-wormer medication ivermectin to treat COVID-19 are filling up the area's emergency rooms.

"There's a reason you have to have a doctor to get a prescription for this stuff because it can be dangerous," Dr. Jason McElyea, a frontline family physician who works in emergency rooms in eastern and southern Oklahoma, told local news station KFOR-TV.

The rise in human ivermectin use has led multiple health agencies, including the Food and Drug Administration (FDA), to issue stern warnings against using the drug for anything other than its intended purposes.

McElyea said he's seen many patients in the ER recently due to adverse reactions to ivermectin. He also claimed ambulances are being overwhelmed from responding to people sick from the medication.

"The ERs are so backed up that gunshot victims were having hard times getting to facilities where they can get definitive care and be treated."

https://www.newsweek.com/patients-overdosing-ivermectin-are-clogging-oklahoma-ers-doctor-1625631
 

marhawkman

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Ivermectin trouble in COVID paradise...
------------------------
U.S.

Patients Overdosing on Ivermectin Are Clogging Oklahoma ERs: Doctor​

BY JON JACKSON ON 9/2/21 AT 4:43 PM EDT

A doctor in rural Oklahoma has claimed that people taking the horse de-wormer medication ivermectin to treat COVID-19 are filling up the area's emergency rooms.

"There's a reason you have to have a doctor to get a prescription for this stuff because it can be dangerous," Dr. Jason McElyea, a frontline family physician who works in emergency rooms in eastern and southern Oklahoma, told local news station KFOR-TV.

The rise in human ivermectin use has led multiple health agencies, including the Food and Drug Administration (FDA), to issue stern warnings against using the drug for anything other than its intended purposes.

McElyea said he's seen many patients in the ER recently due to adverse reactions to ivermectin. He also claimed ambulances are being overwhelmed from responding to people sick from the medication.

"The ERs are so backed up that gunshot victims were having hard times getting to facilities where they can get definitive care and be treated."

https://www.newsweek.com/patients-overdosing-ivermectin-are-clogging-oklahoma-ers-doctor-1625631
well... this is a matter of people needing to know the safe dosage. It's not an issue if you use the right dosage.
 

michael59

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Alberta has reinstated the mandatory mask rule, starting today. Right at the end of tourist season, how convenient. I say that because almost all pandemic rules were lifted right at the start of tourist season, July 1st which is Canada's Independence day.
 

Naughty_Felid

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well... this is a matter of people needing to know the safe dosage. It's not an issue if you use the right dosage.
Taking medication without actually having an idea of drug interactions, contraindications, medical history, etc, is stupid, to say the least.

There's actually a process involved before a drug is prescribed. Even doctors check, double-check, get work-ups, test, before commencing a pharmacological treatment.

There's enough stupidity out there without people self-prescribing.



"The tweet included a link that described the dangers of ivermectin. Side effects humans may experience while taking the cattle medicine, according to the FDA, include nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, low blood pressure, dizziness, seizures, coma and even death".
 
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marhawkman

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Taking medication without actually having an idea of drug interactions, contraindications, medical history, etc, is stupid, to say the least.

There's actually a process involved before a drug is prescribed. Even doctors check, double-check, get work-ups, test, before commencing a pharmacological treatment.

There's enough stupidity out there without people self-prescribing.

"The tweet included a link that described the dangers of ivermectin. Side effects humans may experience while taking the cattle medicine, according to the FDA, include nausea, vomiting, diarrhea, low blood pressure, dizziness, seizures, coma and even death".
Yeah... so... why is it a case where you have to self dose in order to get it?

This is not a substance that isn't already used on Humans!!!!
 

EnolaGaia

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Yeah... so... why is it a case where you have to self dose in order to get it?
This is not a substance that isn't already used on Humans!!!!
It's already in use in humans for treatment of parasitic worms, insects and mites. It works by biochemically interfering with nerve and muscle control channels in invertebrate parasites - killing 'em off by f**king them up. It's not all that inaccurate to metaphorically think of it as nerve gas for worms, insects and mites.

News Flash: Viruses don't have neural / muscular channels to disrupt.

In excessive dosages it has the same effect on vertebrate hosts (i.e., neural interference / damage) as well as other deleterious side-effects.

Veterinary formulations of this drug contain dosages multiple times the safe / non-toxic level established for human use.

There is no scientifically credible evidence to date supporting the notion this family of anti-parasite drugs provides a safe, much less useful, effect in inhibiting or eradicating any virus. The one suggestive study everyone points to indicated viral reproduction was inhibited in cultured monkey cells when Ivermectin was introduced. Nobody's yet demonstrated this overall effect was the result of Ivermectin screwing with the virus directly as opposed to (e.g.) crippling or fatally disrupting the host cells themselves.

Large-scale studies aimed at evaluating its efficacy as a general-purpose anti-viral have been underway in the USA and UK since the beginning of this summer.

Until the results of those studies start rolling in anyone who self-medicates on the advice of non-medical sociopolitical pundits who make their living manipulating the hoi polloi are playing biochemical Russian Roulette on no firmer basis than their own gullibility.
 

michael59

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It's already in use in humans for treatment of parasitic worms, insects and mites. It works by biochemically interfering with nerve and muscle control channels in invertebrate parasites - killing 'em off by f**king them up. It's not all that inaccurate to metaphorically think of it as nerve gas for worms, insects and mites.

News Flash: Viruses don't have neural / muscular channels to disrupt.

In excessive dosages it has the same effect on vertebrate hosts (i.e., neural interference / damage) as well as other deleterious side-effects.

Veterinary formulations of this drug contain dosages multiple times the safe / non-toxic level established for human use.

There is no scientifically credible evidence to date supporting the notion this family of anti-parasite drugs provides a safe, much less useful, effect in inhibiting or eradicating any virus. The one suggestive study everyone points to indicated viral reproduction was inhibited in cultured monkey cells when Ivermectin was introduced. Nobody's yet demonstrated this overall effect was the result of Ivermectin screwing with the virus directly as opposed to (e.g.) crippling or fatally disrupting the host cells themselves.

Large-scale studies aimed at evaluating its efficacy as a general-purpose anti-viral have been underway in the USA and UK since the beginning of this summer.

Until the results of those studies start rolling in anyone who self-medicates on the advice of non-medical sociopolitical pundits who make their living manipulating the hoi polloi are playing biochemical Russian Roulette on no firmer basis than their own gullibility.

You also have to have the virus before getting the treatment at a clinic. It also involves 4 shots/jabs so you might as well get the vaccinations because they say that you will still need to even after the treatment. Seems a little excessive to me.
 

michael59

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List of dead antivaxxers on this website.

Unfortunately, I cannot get this link to open and I honestly believe that it is purposely being hidden by pro-vaxers...

l
Breakthrough Covid cases: Data shows how many vaccinated ...
https://www.nbcnews.com › health › health-news › brea...
Jul. 30, 2021 — ... 125000 fully vaccinated Americans have tested positive for Covid and 1400 of those have died, according to data compiled by NBC News.

NBC is not prone to or known to be fake news.
 

EnolaGaia

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Unfortunately, I cannot get this link to open and I honestly believe that it is purposely being hidden by pro-vaxers...
The link works fine for me.
 

michael59

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The link works fine for me.

It immediately get re-routed to a blank page for me that just buffers and then at the bottom left side of the page it continuously reads: Transfering data from...or Waiting for... They all appear to be advertising sites that are being listed.
 

michael59

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Can you possibly quote more information from the data and post it here, please?
 

EnolaGaia

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Can you possibly quote more information from the data and post it here, please?
Here's a condensed set of the article's paragraphs - the ones that cite numbers or describe the problems in evaluating them.
There's nothing I can do about the 2 videos included on the NBC article webpage you can't access.
At least 125,000 fully vaccinated Americans have tested positive for Covid and 1,400 of those have died, according to data collected by NBC News.

The 125,682 "breakthrough" cases in 38 states found by NBC News represent less than .08 percent of the 164.2 million-plus people who have been fully vaccinated since January, or about one in every 1,300. The number of cases and deaths among the vaccinated is very small compared to the number among the unvaccinated. A former Biden adviser on Covid estimated that 98 to 99 percent of deaths are among the unvaccinated.

But the total number of breakthrough cases is likely higher than 125,683, since nine states, including Pennsylvania and Missouri, did not provide any information, while 11, like Covid hotspot Florida, did not provide death and hospitalization totals. Four states gave death and hospitalization numbers, but not the full tally of cases.

And vaccinated adults who have breakthrough cases but show no symptoms could be missing from the data altogether, say officials.

Health officials continue to caution that breakthrough cases were expected, extremely rare and not a sign of vaccine failure. For example, according to Erin McHenry, spokesperson for the Minnesota Department of Health, "Our most recent data shows that 99.9 percent of Minnesotans who are fully vaccinated have not contracted the virus. Even among those very rare breakthrough cases, we have seen very few illnesses serious enough to require hospitalization."

Some state officials said that they could not be sure the vaccinated individuals had died from Covid-19 or from other causes. But other states directly attribute the cause to Covid-19: 32 deaths in Louisiana, 52 in Washington state, 24 in Georgia, 49 in New Jersey, 169 in Illinois.

Breakthrough cases among the elderly were more likely to be serious, according to available data. In Washington state, 27 of the 52 people who died were known to be associated with long-term care facilities, according to state information. In Louisiana, the median age of those with severe outcomes was 73.

For other states that publish data like Utah, it's clear breakthrough cases have accelerated in the past two months. In Utah on June 2, 2021, just 27 or 8 percent of the 312 new cases in the state were breakthrough cases. As of July 26 there were 519 new cases and almost 20 percent or 94 were breakthroughs, according to state data.

In Virginia, total breakthrough cases resulting in death from Covid-19 went from 17 in mid-July to 42 on Friday.

In Oklahoma, where cases are up by 67 percent, state officials broke down the data to show that for residents who got Johnson & Johnson vaccine the incidents of breakthrough were greater at 160 per 100,000 people compared to 93 per 100,000 for Moderna.

CDC's most recent published data says that as of July 26 there have been 6,587 hospitalizations among fully vaccinated Americans and 1,263 deaths. Research by NBC News indicates that the number who have been hospitalized or died has already passed 7,300 in just the 30 states providing data.

Dr. Marcus Plescia, medical director for the Association of State and Territorial Health Officials, says federal and state officials are still trying to understand the breakthrough rate especially when people who take at-home tests are under no obligation to report the results to health departments. And he says while there are concerns that the percentage of breakthrough cases may be higher in the elderly and immuno-compromised than was once thought, the vaccines are still effective. "Seventy percent is still really good, it's better than most flu vaccines," he said.

While some states track breakthrough cases meticulously, others — like Missouri, where cases are surging — lack "quality statewide data," according to state officials. Other states are choosing to only release partial data.

For example, like Florida, New York is not releasing data on breakthrough deaths.

Even among states that track cases closely, officials cautioned data is likely incomplete. Vaccinated people who are infected but asymptomatic are probably largely missing from statistics.

Robert Long, spokesperson for Maine Department of Health and Human Services, said, "Those who have been fully vaccinated and have a breakthrough case but are not symptomatic and not part of a regular testing protocol may never be captured in these numbers."
SOURCE: https://www.nbcnews.com/health/heal...-000-fully-vaccinated-americans-have-n1275500
 

Naughty_Felid

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Unfortunately, I cannot get this link to open and I honestly believe that it is purposely being hidden by pro-vaxers...

l
Breakthrough Covid cases: Data shows how many vaccinated ...
https://www.nbcnews.com › health › health-news › brea...
Jul. 30, 2021 — ... 125000 fully vaccinated Americans have tested positive for Covid and 1400 of those have died, according to data compiled by NBC News.

NBC is not prone to or known to be fake news.

Works for me.
 

michael59

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Here's a condensed set of the article's paragraphs - the ones that cite numbers or describe the problems in evaluating them.
There's nothing I can do about the 2 videos included on the NBC article webpage you can't access.

SOURCE: https://www.nbcnews.com/health/heal...-000-fully-vaccinated-americans-have-n1275500

Thank you, EnolaGaia. I really wanted to know what the News report stated because I did post the link and I hated to do that without having read it fully.

Your assitance is much appreciated. :)
 

Lb8535

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Unfortunately, I cannot get this link to open and I honestly believe that it is purposely being hidden by pro-vaxers...

l
Breakthrough Covid cases: Data shows how many vaccinated ...
https://www.nbcnews.com › health › health-news › brea...
Jul. 30, 2021 — ... 125000 fully vaccinated Americans have tested positive for Covid and 1400 of those have died, according to data compiled by NBC News.

NBC is not prone to or known to be fake news.
The numbers 125K and 1400 are miniscule with a base of 374 million doses of vaccine given . It's so small my cheap calculator won't give e a %.

I'm posting this link which provides data from a proper study of breakthrough infections. I will also copy some of the article because NYT links can be dodgy. https://www.nytimes.com/article/bre...lick&module=Well&pgtype=Homepage&section=Well and
https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/mm7034e5.htm#F1_down


“People want to be told what to do — is it safe if I do this?” said Dr. Sharon Balter, director of the division of communicable disease control and prevention at the Los Angeles County Department of Public Health. “What we can say is, ‘These are the things that are more risky, and these are the things that are less risky.’”

Dr. Balter’s team has recently collected surveillance data that give us a clearer picture of the difference in risk to the vaccinated and unvaccinated as the Delta variant surged from May 1 through July 25. They studied infections in 10,895 fully vaccinated people and 30,801 unvaccinated people. The data showed that:

  • The rate of infection in unvaccinated people is five times the rate of infection in vaccinated people. By the end of the study period, the age-adjusted incidence of Covid-19 among unvaccinated persons was 315.1 per 100,000 people over a seven-day period compared to 63.8 per 100,000 incidence rate among fully vaccinated people. (Age adjustment is a statistical method used so the data are representative of the general population.)
  • The rate of hospitalization among the vaccinated was 1 per 100,000 people. The age-adjusted hospitalization rate in unvaccinated persons was 29.4 per 100,000.
  • Older vaccinated people were most vulnerable to serious illness after a breakthrough infection. The median age of vaccinated people who were hospitalized for Covid was 64 years. Among unvaccinated people who were hospitalized, the median age was 49.
 

hunck

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Ivermectin: Oklahoma doctor warns against using unproven Covid drug


Patients have been needing urgent treatment at emergency units in Oklahoma hospitals after overdosing on the drug, Dr Jason McElyea says.

"You've got to have a prescription for this medication for a reason - because it can be dangerous," Dr McElyea told the BBC.

"You are not a horse. You are not a cow," the FDA said, warning that taking large doses of the substance "is dangerous and can cause serious harm”.

Ivermectin, mainly a veterinary deworming agent, can be used in small doses to treat some human conditions.

Small doses of Ivermectin are approved for use on humans, but not for Covid.

"Some people taking inappropriate doses have actually put themselves in worse conditions than if they'd caught Covid," he told KFOR.

"You have to ask yourself, 'If I take this medicine, what am I going to do if something bad happens?' What's your next step, what's your back-up plan? If you're going to take a medicine that could affect your health, do it with a doctor on board."
 

marhawkman

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It's already in use in humans for treatment of parasitic worms, insects and mites. It works by biochemically interfering with nerve and muscle control channels in invertebrate parasites - killing 'em off by f**king them up. It's not all that inaccurate to metaphorically think of it as nerve gas for worms, insects and mites.

News Flash: Viruses don't have neural / muscular channels to disrupt.

In excessive dosages it has the same effect on vertebrate hosts (i.e., neural interference / damage) as well as other deleterious side-effects.

Veterinary formulations of this drug contain dosages multiple times the safe / non-toxic level established for human use.

There is no scientifically credible evidence to date supporting the notion this family of anti-parasite drugs provides a safe, much less useful, effect in inhibiting or eradicating any virus. The one suggestive study everyone points to indicated viral reproduction was inhibited in cultured monkey cells when Ivermectin was introduced. Nobody's yet demonstrated this overall effect was the result of Ivermectin screwing with the virus directly as opposed to (e.g.) crippling or fatally disrupting the host cells themselves.

Large-scale studies aimed at evaluating its efficacy as a general-purpose anti-viral have been underway in the USA and UK since the beginning of this summer.

Until the results of those studies start rolling in anyone who self-medicates on the advice of non-medical sociopolitical pundits who make their living manipulating the hoi polloi are playing biochemical Russian Roulette on no firmer basis than their own gullibility.
What you say is mostly true... however... why did people want to try using Ivermectin at all? That is where the problem arises. Check this out:
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/ar...f1ynZsituEJAWhO-NZTW9UJFxzNusWTQxDEqn1yHNQXHw
Ivermectin is a drug of a wide range of bioactivity and has been in use for more than 30 years for treatment of parasitic infections in humans [1].It is being considered as the possible target drug for SARS CoV-2 and is under extensive research in clinical trials [2].Ivermectin is used in a dose of 0.15 mg/kg–0.2 mg/kg body weight for most of the parasitic infestations as oral tablet and is well tolerated. This is not the first time when the antiviral properties of ivermectin has been tested against human virus. Ivermectin has shown its potent in vitro antiviral effects against several RNA viruses, such as Zika virus, Influenza A virus, Newcastle disease virus, Chikungunya virus, Yellow fever virus, Dengue virus, Japanese encephalitis virus and DNA virus such as BK polyomavirus and Equine herpesvirus type 1 [3].
Yeah... it has proven effects as an anti-viral agent. The only question is if it works on Covid-19.
 
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