Coronavirus Disease 2019 (COVID-19): The Disease & Its Spread (Per Se)

charliebrown

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As 206 people in Britain die from covid in the past 24 hours, the most since March, vaccine passports in Britain will be required soon.

Scottish Labour refuses to support this vaccine passport.

Belfast Hospital Northern Ireland is warning that the bodies will start stacking up soon.
 
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kamalktk

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Ivermectin and human male sterility.

E-remb2X0AQUq_-.jpg


Research article:
https://www.scholarsresearchlibrary...tions-of-nigerian-onchocerciasis-patients.pdf

It also makes man parts shrink.

https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1111/and.12891
 

JahaRa

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Shrinking male parts is the last thing a man wants to hear along with rectal prostrate exam.

They should print this in big letters on the package in the side effects, and people will stop taking this drug.
But some of them aren't using the type made for humans because you need a prescription for it, they are getting it from the feed store or borrowing it from their dogs (heart worm medicine is ivermectin).
 

charliebrown

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The state of Idaho has put out a warning in that they have no hospital space.

Idaho will ration healthcare.

Now in the U.S. one in four cases of covid are children.

Children are getting infected.
 
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EnolaGaia

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Multiple studies are contributing to a view that "hybrid immunity" obtained through a COVID-19 infection plus an mRNA vaccination provides protection surpassing anything seen from any other approach. The bad news: It requires both (infection plus vaccination) for individuals to generate this state of hybrid immunity.

This hybrid immunity has even been suggested to provide protection against any new variants that may emerge.
New Studies Find Evidence Of 'Superhuman' Immunity To COVID-19 In Some Individuals

Some scientists have called it "superhuman immunity" or "bulletproof." But immunologist Shane Crotty prefers "hybrid immunity."

"Overall, hybrid immunity to SARS-CoV-2 appears to be impressively potent," Crotty wrote in commentary in Science back in June.

No matter what you call it, this type of immunity offers much-needed good news in what seems like an endless array of bad news regarding COVID-19.

Over the past several months, a series of studies has found that some people mount an extraordinarily powerful immune response against SARS-CoV-2, the coronavirus that causes the disease COVID-19. Their bodies produce very high levels of antibodies, but they also make antibodies with great flexibility — likely capable of fighting off the coronavirus variants circulating in the world but also likely effective against variants that may emerge in the future. ...

So who is capable of mounting this "superhuman" or "hybrid" immune response?

People who have had a "hybrid" exposure to the virus. Specifically, they were infected with the coronavirus in 2020 and then immunized with mRNA vaccines this year. "Those people have amazing responses to the vaccine," says virologist Theodora Hatziioannou at Rockefeller University, who also helped lead several of the studies. "I think they are in the best position to fight the virus. The antibodies in these people's blood can even neutralize SARS-CoV-1, the first coronavirus, which emerged 20 years ago. That virus is very, very different from SARS-CoV-2."

In fact, these antibodies were even able to deactivate a virus engineered, on purpose, to be highly resistant to neutralization. This virus contained 20 mutations that are known to prevent SARS-CoV-2 antibodies from binding to it. Antibodies from people who were only vaccinated or who only had prior coronavirus infections were essentially useless against this mutant virus. But antibodies in people with the "hybrid immunity" could neutralize it. ...
FULL STORY: https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsa...uman-immunity-to-covid-19-in-some-individuals
 

charliebrown

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Mr. Zarka from Israel Health Ministry is warning his countrymen that a fourth vaccination will be needed in the near future.

Israel is now trying to get people to take their third shot.
 

Ghost In The Machine

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Multiple studies are contributing to a view that "hybrid immunity" obtained through a COVID-19 infection plus an mRNA vaccination provides protection surpassing anything seen from any other approach. The bad news: It requires both (infection plus vaccination) for individuals to generate this state of hybrid immunity.

This hybrid immunity has even been suggested to provide protection against any new variants that may emerge.

FULL STORY: https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsa...uman-immunity-to-covid-19-in-some-individuals
Yay, I knew my March 2020 covid would eventually come in useful!

I can buy this, too. Dunno if I posted it here but in June, this year, one of my sons got delta variant (he had the hayfever type symptoms, and delta was already predominant). The day of his first symptom he sneezed right in my face. From cms away. Just before your symptoms start or the first day or two is supposed to be peak infectivity. I didn't catch it. (Not asymptomatically either as we all did constant tests that 10 days).

Son's work insisted on a PCR not the lateral flow test he'd done at home. Husband had to drive him to the test centre (after he tested positive)... and had been giving him lifts to and from work in the days before. Husband (who also had covid March 2020) also didn't get covid...

His older brother shares a room with him. He had Wuhan strain in 2020 and then in Sept, Alpha. Then double jabbed. He also, despite sharing a small room with his little brother, ALSO didn't get covid!

Bear in mind Delta is 60% more transmissible than Alpha, which in turn was considerably more transmissible than Wuhan... All three of us in the house who are double vacc'd and had covid, didn't catch it from son with Delta, and all tested continually for the ten days and no asymptomatic covid either.

I had no antibodies only 4 months after having covid but what I probably had was T cells and apparently, the good news is - people with T cells from a natural infection plus double vacc, may be less likely to catch new variants as the thing mutates. Not impossible, but less likely.
 

Ghost In The Machine

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JahaRa

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Mr. Zarka from Israel Health Ministry is warning his countrymen that a fourth vaccination will be needed in the near future.

Israel is now trying to get people to take their third shot.
Yeah the Pfizer/BioNtec vaccine seems to be a huge failure. Another absolutely idiotic political thing to add to how politics can ruin everyone's health.
 

JahaRa

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Not as successful as hoped ≠ a huge failure.

It has clearly saved a large number of lives.
I don't think you could use the term "clearly" in that sentence. How is it clear that it has saved any lives?
 

Endlessly Amazed

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Yeah the Pfizer/BioNtec vaccine seems to be a huge failure. Another absolutely idiotic political thing to add to how politics can ruin everyone's health.
JahaRa –

I have no idea what connection you are proposing between covid vaccines and political decisions. I think that with new vaccines, a certain amount of uncertainty will be inevitable until a statistically robust sample size is attained. Three different main strategies of vaccines were used, with varying results. The results will continue to vary as the covid virus continues to mutate. Since the scientists can’t predict with 100% accuracy how the virus will mutate, I am glad that different approaches were used. The uncertainty is driven by the rate, spread, and deadliness of mutation, not the vaccine which will always be playing catch-up.

If the Moderna vaccine would have been proven as ‘failed” as you term the Pfizer vaccine, would you then have declared the Modena vaccine a huge failure, and again linked the failure to political decisions? What are your sources of information that you deduce a politically-based failure of a specific vaccine? I actually would like to understand your reasoning on this.

I try as much as possible to get information from as close to primary data sources as possible, or from reliable interpreters of medicine, such as the wonderful Dr. John Campbell from the UK.
 

JahaRa

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JahaRa –

I have no idea what connection you are proposing between covid vaccines and political decisions. I think that with new vaccines, a certain amount of uncertainty will be inevitable until a statistically robust sample size is attained. Three different main strategies of vaccines were used, with varying results. The results will continue to vary as the covid virus continues to mutate. Since the scientists can’t predict with 100% accuracy how the virus will mutate, I am glad that different approaches were used. The uncertainty is driven by the rate, spread, and deadliness of mutation, not the vaccine which will always be playing catch-up.

If the Moderna vaccine would have been proven as ‘failed” as you term the Pfizer vaccine, would you then have declared the Modena vaccine a huge failure, and again linked the failure to political decisions? What are your sources of information that you deduce a politically-based failure of a specific vaccine? I actually would like to understand your reasoning on this.

I try as much as possible to get information from as close to primary data sources as possible, or from reliable interpreters of medicine, such as the wonderful Dr. John Campbell from the UK.
So this is what I think about the whole thing, in the U.S. the FDA approved the unproven Pfizer and Moderna vaccines before the Jansen vaccine, which is based on tried and true methods in use for over 60 years, over 50 if you just think about the flu vaccine. And they never approved the Astra Zeneca vaccine even though many facilities were making millions of doses of that vaccine in this country. They sat undistributed until someone noticed or complained and then they were sent over seas. The methodology that the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines are based on is new, only a few immuno therapy drugs for cancer have been approved in the last 10 years. And those were tested for at least 10 years before they were approved, AND you can look up the side effects of those. The mRNA vaccines that are in use for cancer treatments are dangerous and only given to certain people after a lot of tests are done to make sure they are marginally safe for treatment. The thing is, what those therapies do is the same thing cancer does to cells, it replaces RNA in the cell. The body fights it or should fight it as an invasion, but sometimes it triggers such a strong immune response that the organs are destroyed. I am not an immunologist but I can read and I have read a lot about these therapies. I will stick with the old fashioned tried and true vaccines.

So that leads me to consider the possibility that there is a lot of money changing hands and the FDA is not acting in the best interests of the population, instead it's actions are political (which always has to do with money).
 

Endlessly Amazed

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So this is what I think about the whole thing, in the U.S. the FDA approved the unproven Pfizer and Moderna vaccines before the Jansen vaccine, which is based on tried and true methods in use for over 60 years, over 50 if you just think about the flu vaccine. And they never approved the Astra Zeneca vaccine even though many facilities were making millions of doses of that vaccine in this country. They sat undistributed until someone noticed or complained and then they were sent over seas. The methodology that the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines are based on is new, only a few immuno therapy drugs for cancer have been approved in the last 10 years. And those were tested for at least 10 years before they were approved, AND you can look up the side effects of those. The mRNA vaccines that are in use for cancer treatments are dangerous and only given to certain people after a lot of tests are done to make sure they are marginally safe for treatment. The thing is, what those therapies do is the same thing cancer does to cells, it replaces RNA in the cell. The body fights it or should fight it as an invasion, but sometimes it triggers such a strong immune response that the organs are destroyed. I am not an immunologist but I can read and I have read a lot about these therapies. I will stick with the old fashioned tried and true vaccines.

So that leads me to consider the possibility that there is a lot of money changing hands and the FDA is not acting in the best interests of the population, instead it's actions are political (which always has to do with money).
So, again, I politely ask for your sources of information. I think I disagree with you on the definitions of "approved" but can't tell since you have not disclosed your sources of information from which you derived your opinions.
 

JahaRa

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So, again, I politely ask for your sources of information. I think I disagree with you on the definitions of "approved" but can't tell since you have not disclosed your sources of information from which you derived your opinions.
Did I not list them in this forum? Maybe that was someplace else that I listed them. I will look for the links.
 

Ghost In The Machine

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Yeah the Pfizer/BioNtec vaccine seems to be a huge failure. Another absolutely idiotic political thing to add to how politics can ruin everyone's health.
I dunno. Since vaccines rolled out here, only a tiny % of those (THOUSANDS) who have died of covid are double vacc'd. It seems like a big success. It's still more effective than the flu vaccine ever is, any given year and that has to be tweaked for the latest variant annually...
 

Ghost In The Machine

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So this is what I think about the whole thing, in the U.S. the FDA approved the unproven Pfizer and Moderna vaccines before the Jansen vaccine, which is based on tried and true methods in use for over 60 years, over 50 if you just think about the flu vaccine. And they never approved the Astra Zeneca vaccine even though many facilities were making millions of doses of that vaccine in this country. They sat undistributed until someone noticed or complained and then they were sent over seas. The methodology that the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines are based on is new, only a few immuno therapy drugs for cancer have been approved in the last 10 years. And those were tested for at least 10 years before they were approved, AND you can look up the side effects of those. The mRNA vaccines that are in use for cancer treatments are dangerous and only given to certain people after a lot of tests are done to make sure they are marginally safe for treatment. The thing is, what those therapies do is the same thing cancer does to cells, it replaces RNA in the cell. The body fights it or should fight it as an invasion, but sometimes it triggers such a strong immune response that the organs are destroyed. I am not an immunologist but I can read and I have read a lot about these therapies. I will stick with the old fashioned tried and true vaccines.

So that leads me to consider the possibility that there is a lot of money changing hands and the FDA is not acting in the best interests of the population, instead it's actions are political (which always has to do with money).
Interstingly, I did some research for a piece on the history of anti vaxxers and discovered that in the 1860s - 60 odd years after Jenner developed the concept of vaccination - smallpox anti vaxxers were claiming that it was an "untried and tested" thing, rushed out due to Jenner (who was long dead) being showered with £££s, dodgy dealings etc etc.

Even if mRNA was a concept that was 100 years old, someone would be whingeing that it was too recent to be trusted.

Anti vaxxers in recent months made a huge thing about the vaccines only being approved provisionally. Once fully approved, they've had to shift the goalposts. Same old narratives in the whole anti vaxx movement that I was able to find in the 1860s' anti vaxxers'. Sometimes, word for word.

You may need to link us to cold, hard research.
 

JahaRa

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I dunno. Since vaccines rolled out here, only a tiny % of those (THOUSANDS) who have died of covid are double vacc'd. It seems like a big success. It's still more effective than the flu vaccine ever is, any given year and that has to be tweaked for the latest variant annually...
I know you are stating an opinion just like I have stated my opinion, but I am curious about why you think the flu vaccine is not effective.

The point of both vaccines is to keep people healthy enough to not need the hospital. There are always deaths from complications due to influenza, and there always will be, but if we did not have the flu vaccine the hospitals would not be able to handle the number of flu patients. And the covid vaccine is effective, it is not to keep people from getting the virus, it is to give people who get it a chance for their body to fight it. Some of the vaccines are a success, but the Pfizer is not, in my opinion, when they need 2 shots to begin with and a third now, and Israel has already given everyone 3 shots and they are still in dire straights, so are talking about giving everyone a 4th shot. And it is not a modified version based on mutations like the flu shot is every year, it is the same shot. Why would it work any better the 4th time?
 

Ghost In The Machine

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I know you are stating an opinion just like I have stated my opinion, but I am curious about why you think the flu vaccine is not effective.

The point of both vaccines is to keep people healthy enough to not need the hospital. There are always deaths from complications due to influenza, and there always will be, but if we did not have the flu vaccine the hospitals would not be able to handle the number of flu patients. And the covid vaccine is effective, it is not to keep people from getting the virus, it is to give people who get it a chance for their body to fight it. Some of the vaccines are a success, but the Pfizer is not, in my opinion, when they need 2 shots to begin with and a third now, and Israel has already given everyone 3 shots and they are still in dire straights, so are talking about giving everyone a 4th shot. And it is not a modified version based on mutations like the flu shot is every year, it is the same shot. Why would it work any better the 4th time?
I didn't say I think it's not effective. Like any vaccine, it only works for a % of people. I don't think the 100% effective vaccine exists, as such.
 

JahaRa

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Interstingly, I did some research for a piece on the history of anti vaxxers and discovered that in the 1860s - 60 odd years after Jenner developed the concept of vaccination - smallpox anti vaxxers were claiming that it was an "untried and tested" thing, rushed out due to Jenner (who was long dead) being showered with £££s, dodgy dealings etc etc.

Even if mRNA was a concept that was 100 years old, someone would be whingeing that it was too recent to be trusted.

Anti vaxxers in recent months made a huge thing about the vaccines only being approved provisionally. Once fully approved, they've had to shift the goalposts. Same old narratives in the whole anti vaxx movement that I was able to find in the 1860s' anti vaxxers'. Sometimes, word for word.

You may need to link us to cold, hard research.
For one thing I am not an anti-vaxxer, for another the polio and small pox vaccinations had been around decades by the 1960's. I couldn't go to school until I had my 4th small pox vaccine because I was naturally immune to it. The doctor had to write a note asking to please let me go to school as I had had 4 tries and never got the expected reaction to prove I was vaccinated. We all had a polio vaccine when we were in 2nd grade, pink stuff on a sugar cube.

The mRna concept has been around for about 20 years that I know of, however it was not considered for a vaccination until recently. And it was only approved in the U.S. 10 years ago for two cancer therapies. When the first flu vaccine came out in the 70's lots of people had bad reactions to it and were told by the doctors to never get another flu shot. Some of those people are in their 70's & 80's and are afraid to get the covid vaccine. Things have changed a lot and the flu vaccine has been perfected over the last 50+ years and that is the method that should have been primary in getting a covid vaccine out in a hurry. There is No Rational Reason the mRNA version should have been fast tracked and the 2 regular, tried and tru methods been vilified and disparaged, except for money.

I am not an anti-vaxxer, by the way and I know what kinds of crazy stories have been told to support the anti-vaxxers. Too many people are lacking in education and common sense.
 

JahaRa

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I didn't say I think it's not effective. Like any vaccine, it only works for a % of people. I don't think the 100% effective vaccine exists, as such.
Well you worded it strangely if that is what you meant. Of course no vaccine is 100% effective for anyone, and there are some who will always have problems from any vaccine.
 

JahaRa

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There are fewer deaths in vaccinated than in non-vaccinated groups.
There are also fewer cases of symptoms in the vaccinated than the unvaccinated. That doesn't prove anything except that the vaccine is doing what it was designed to do. I just hope I am wrong about the mRNA versions and we don't have a lot of deaths 2 years from now because of those that have nothing to do with the virus.
 

Yithian

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Some of the vaccines are a success, but the Pfizer is not, in my opinion, when they need 2 shots to begin with and a third now, and Israel has already given everyone 3 shots and they are still in dire straights, so are talking about giving everyone a 4th shot. And it is not a modified version based on mutations like the flu shot is every year, it is the same shot. Why would it work any better the 4th time?

We need much more precision of language here.

It is meaningless to speak of a vaccine that 'works' or 'doesn't work', unless in the latter case you mean 'has no discernible medical benefit', which is not the case here.

The Pfizer vaccine has been shown in trials to reduce the chance of becoming infected and dramatically reduce the chance of serious illness and death across all age groups, especially the old.

The reason for additional 'booster' shots is not to make it more effective, but rather to extend the duration of the protection cited above.

In this respect--the relatively short duration of efficacy--the vaccine is sub-optimal, but any significant increase in protection for any duration is better than nothing given that the rate of incidence for non-negligible side-effects is lower than the chance of death and serious illness from Covid.

Edit: New from Israel.

E_RA76lWQAY9Nm8.png
 
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Victory

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The Israeli statistics are worrying but there are some explanations.

1.) Out of a population of just over 9 million, there remain 1 million people who have yet to be vaccinated.

In most cases this is because they have refused.

The other 8 million have nearly all had two doses, and (best guess) about 40 - 50% have now had three.

2.) Israel began vaccinating more people earlier.

By April 2021, nearly all adults who wanted to be vaccinated had already received two doses.
This was great protection at first, but in turn meant that the effectiveness of the shots wore off mid summer 2021, whilst other countries were still administering first and second doses.

3.) From the 7 September for three weeks, Israel's Jews observe several major festivals at the start of the religious year -
Rosh Hashonah, Yom Kippur, Succot, (and Hoshana Rabbah), Shemini Atzeret, Simchat Torah.
Most people will not be at work on these days, they are public holidays.

This means there is a lot more mixing of extended families than at other times of the year, with commensurate travel by public transport.

The schools have also gone back after the summer holidays.

4.) Some of Israel's Jews go on a Rosh Hashonah pilgrimage to Uman, Ukraine (7-9 September this year).
To visit the grave of Rebbe Nachman of Breslov.

This sees more mixing of people by train and plane.
About 30,000 went this year.


Pfizer have even said they have used Israel as a "Guinea Pig".
So the world continues to watch closely.
 
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Xanatic*

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Does anyone know the number of funerals done in the UK last year in comparison to previous years?
 

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Does anyone know the number of funerals done in the UK last year in comparison to previous years?

"You asked​

Please provide data on the burials/cremations for 2019 for UK and for 2020.

We said​

Thank you for your enquiry.

We publish mortality statistics in England and Wales based on the information supplied when a death is registered.

Unfortunately, we do not hold information about burial or cremation, as this is not supplied during the registration of a death."

https://www.ons.gov.uk/aboutus/tran...tionfoi/burialsandcremationsintheuk2019to2020


"Published by D. Clark, Jul 2, 2021

There were over 695.8 thousand deaths in the United Kingdom in 2020, compared with 604 thousand in 2019. Between 2003 and 2011, the annual number of deaths in the UK fell from 612 thousand to just over 552 thousand. Since 2011 however, the annual number of annual deaths in the United Kingdom has steadily grown, with the number recorded in 2018 a high for the provided time-period."

Number of deaths in the United Kingdom from 1887 to 2020​

tablecolumn chart

CharacteristicNumber of deaths
2020695,812
2019604,707
2018616,014
2017607,172
2016597,206
2015602,782
2014570,341
2013576,458
2012569,024
2011552,232
2010561,666

https://www.statista.com/statistics/281488/number-of-deaths-in-the-united-kingdom-uk/
 
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