Death Of Agriculture

skinny

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#1
I suppose this is all in a matter of due course according to economic rationalism. The welfare of land-based communities must die to satisfy the almighty MARKET. I'm not satisfied. The farmers built our wealth here and in most wealthy democracies. How dare the powerbrokers shaft our farmers. I hate the biggest businesspeople becuase they have no social intelligence whatsoever. All I can hope for is that their generation dies in it's turn and we return to sanity. Fuck commerce. Fuck profit. Fuck every arsehead who responds to this post saying that's life. Right. Fuck you. Get with the program? The PRogram will have the majority of us ground down to feed the elite. I'm implacably oppose3d to THE MARKET in all of its fascist forms. DIE you scum. Our people will always be ready to rebuild when your acidic philosophy paasses on as it inevitably will! The sooner the better.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-06-26/dairy-farmers-mass-exodus-from-the-industry/11215730
 

Floyd1

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#2
I suppose this is all in a matter of due course according to economic rationalism. The welfare of land-based communities must die to satisfy the almighty MARKET. I'm not satisfied. The farmers built our wealth here and in most wealthy democracies. How dare the powerbrokers shaft our farmers. I hate the biggest businesspeople becuase they have no social intelligence whatsoever. All I can hope for is that their generation dies in it's turn and we return to sanity. Fuck commerce. Fuck profit. Fuck every arsehead who responds to this post saying that's life. Right. Fuck you. Get with the program? The PRogram will have the majority of us ground down to feed the elite. I'm implacably oppose3d to THE MARKET in all of its fascist forms. DIE you scum. Our people will always be ready to rebuild when your acidic philosophy paasses on as it inevitably will! The sooner the better.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-06-26/dairy-farmers-mass-exodus-from-the-industry/11215730
I live in a small (ish) market town and in even just the last few years the amount of new houses that have gone up is astounding (and terrible workmanship on most of them as well). There are, of course, people who insist ''a place must grow to survive'', (which I don't agree with) especially when the infrastructure isn't also being improved; roads,schools,dentists,doctors and most importantly, jobs for all the people who move to these new houses. All that happens is a lot of the people with money who moved here because it was peaceful, are now starting to move out because it's becoming just another busy town. There is some land here owned by a consortium from London who have never and will probably never, come here. In a few years they'll be yet another large field gone.
I hear people who have moved here from big cities saying how great it is compared to where they've been living. Well, in a few years as more greedy landowners sell (or are forced to sell) more and more land, it will only get worse.
I think the ancient towns should be left alone and if new towns are needed, then build new towns from scratch with adequate roads that can handle modern traffic.
 

blessmycottonsocks

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#3
I live in a small (ish) market town and in even just the last few years the amount of new houses that have gone up is astounding (and terrible workmanship on most of them as well). There are, of course, people who insist ''a place must grow to survive'', (which I don't agree with) especially when the infrastructure isn't also being improved; roads,schools,dentists,doctors and most importantly, jobs for all the people who move to these new houses. All that happens is a lot of the people with money who moved here because it was peaceful, are now starting to move out because it's becoming just another busy town. There is some land here owned by a consortium from London who have never and will probably never, come here. In a few years they'll be yet another large field gone.
I hear people who have moved here from big cities saying how great it is compared to where they've been living. Well, in a few years as more greedy landowners sell (or are forced to sell) more and more land, it will only get worse.
I think the ancient towns should be left alone and if new towns are needed, then build new towns from scratch with adequate roads that can handle modern traffic.
Pretty well all of these problems stem from gross overpopulation.

My old school's playing fields are now a new housing estate. As the fields were prone to flooding, I expect the houses will be too.

Concreting over what's left of our natural flood plains is lunacy. Expect the annual floods to get steadily worse.
 

Ogdred Weary

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#4
I largely agree with the sentiments of the OP, large companies can squeeze every last penny out of the people who produce what we consume in search of maximising profit. Eventually taken to it's logical extreme, there won't be any farmers, or at least not enough. The money men can always put pawns in to fell the gaps but if those people don't have the skills or experience then that's not going to work, or not for long anyway. Trouble is, we kind of need food, not anywhere as much as most of us in the First World have become used to eating but it's kind of important, it's not as though it's shitty plastic Super Hero figures or other crap that people fill their empty lives with.
 

Floyd1

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#5
I know skinny is speaking of Oz, but it seems to be the same all over. Why work every hour to make a loss. It's crazy.
In England, most of our veg comes from Spain and the Netherlands where it is grown under vast glass houses. We have the technology to do the same, (I think they do do this in Thanet in Kent), but it's only a small operation and of course it's cheaper to ship it all the way from there and often from all over the world as well.
In many places here we have people from other countries growing and picking our veg because British people just won't do it.
As you say Ogdred, I often go into a shop and am amazed at all the superfluous crap for sale that we just don't need.
 

Floyd1

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#6
Pretty well all of these problems stem from gross overpopulation.

My old school's playing fields are now a new housing estate. As the fields were prone to flooding, I expect the houses will be too.

Concreting over what's left of our natural flood plains is lunacy. Expect the annual floods to get steadily worse.
Yes.
I know that every house stands where there was once a field, but it seems crazy to me to keep enlarging our ancient market towns and villages that were never built for modern life, removing their character, taking away the fields, trees and farms and turning them into them just 'another' commuter town. In a few generations farming will be a lost knowledge here, I fear.
 

blessmycottonsocks

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#7
The first priority should be to achieve a sustainable level of population. The sharp increase, particularly in England, since around the year 2000, has caused a great many problems.

As for agriculture, I suppose farmers will have to adapt to changing food consumption trends I.e. less pastoral farming and more arable, notably crops such as soya beans, pulses and grains.
 

Mythopoeika

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#8
Farmers have to try to push back against companies like Tesco. Tesco use their market power to drive down the prices that are being paid to farmers. It's no wonder that many of their suppliers are going bust. Prices have to rise to pay for local farmers. I don't mind this, but other people may not like having to pay more.
 

INT21

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#9
Farmers have to try to push back against companies like Tesco. Tesco use their market power to drive down the prices that are being paid to farmers. It's no wonder that many of their suppliers are going bust. Prices have to rise to pay for local farmers. I don't mind this, but other people may not like having to pay more.
The problem is that more and more people are finding it harder to make ends meet.

They are getting squeezed from every direction. An dit is going to get worst.

If the prices go up, they have to cut back on something else. Eventually one runs out of ways to economise.

INT21.
 

maximus otter

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#10
I hate...All I can hope for is that their generation dies...Fuck commerce. Fuck profit. Fuck every arsehead...Fuck you....ground down...implacably oppose3d...fascist... DIE you scum.The sooner the better.
...you may say l’m leaping to conclusions, but you’re not completely happy, are you?

If there were no profit, there’d be no commerce. If there were no commerce, there’d be no food. Or much of anything else, for that matter.

lt's all very well fulminating about the eeeeevils of capitalism, but it works: That’s why we are conducting this discussion on computers, over the Intermong, with full bellies, in a state of good health; and not using a stick to scratch shallow furrows in poor soil, dropping in a few saved seeds and praying that the crop won’t fail again this year.

There are more people on Earth, living longer, healthier and more prosperous lives than ever before. That’s because people can sell surpluses to make profit, not because they can dream of some hippy agrarian idyll that never existed.

maximus otter
 
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EnolaGaia

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#12

Mythopoeika

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#13

Naughty_Felid

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#16
...you may say l’m leaping to conclusions, but you’re not completely happy, are you?

If there were no profit, there’d be no commerce. If there were no commerce, there’d be no food. Or much of anything else, for that matter.

lt's all very well fulminating about the eeeeevils of capitalism, but it works: That’s why we are conducting this discussion on computers, over the Intermong, with full bellies, in a state of good health; and not using a stick to scratch shallow furrows in poor soil, dropping in a few saved seeds and praying that the crop won’t fail again this year.

There are more people on Earth, living longer, healthier and more prosperous lives than ever before. That’s because people can sell surpluses to make profit, not because they can dream of some hippy agrarian idyll that never existed.

maximus otter
Yeah but we've sort of peeked somewhat and life span is now declining in the UK and US, there' the re-emergence of diseases that we once had a grip on and the gap between the rich and poor just keeps widening.

I can offer lots of links to support this but you'll have no interest in them as you live in some sort of strange "Margo and Jerry" 70's fantasy land, (I do Margo and Jerry a disservice as both were quite compassionate people).
 

Ladyloafer

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#17
we've got to adapt though.

so much natural landscape and pastoral land (UK) was lost during ww2, as there was no choice. already, some 70 odd years ago the population was dependant on imported food. and with no guarantee and that food getting through they had to invest in using new land and technology.

post war, new towns had to be built. people needed homes.

and they do now. i live on a housing estate built in 40 ish years ago. this was all farmland once. there is a mahoosive new estate gone up, still going up, on the perimeter of this. all farmland until about 4 years ago. i used to drive home from my nightshifts, and watch the sun coming up over those fields, and in winter the mist would swirl mystically around the dips in the hill. it was beautiful.

but otoh around 1000 trees have been planted on just one area of retained 'parkland'. if only 10% of those trees survive thats still around 100 trees more than were there before. generally that field was grown for rapeseed oil. very pretty it looked, but whats that all for? all that veg oil is going into prepacked food, biscuits, 'coatings' and other such food we don't really need.

so, without returning to some bucolic historical notion, where crops could easily fail, and people go hungry, but also without growing crops that serve as cheaply produced, high profit, low nutritional value crud, where do we go?

i'd much rather look out over fields of rape seed plants than some robotic warehouse but there has to be a balance, theres no going back.

(well until oct 31st, then we'll be all about the spuds and manglewurzals.)
 

Ladyloafer

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#19
Europe could be farmed entirely through agroecological approaches and still feed a growing population, as long as diets shift to being more plant-based, according to the study by European sustainable development thinktank IDDRI. The Ten Years for Agroecology report suggests that pesticides could be phased out and greenhouse gas emissions radically reduced in Europe through agroecological farming, which is based on ‘ecological principles first, chemicals last’. Using fresh modelling, the report’s authors examine the reduction in yields that would result from a transition to agroecological farming. These can be mitigated by reorienting diets towards plant-based proteins and pasture-fed livestock, and away from grain-fed white meat, they say. More than half the cereals and oilseed crops grown in the EU are currently fed to animals.

the link is a pdf. i admittedly haven't read the report, but it looks interesting.

SUSTAINABLE FOOD FOR 530 MILLION EUROPEANS The TYFA scenario is based on the widespread adoption of agroecology, the phasing-out of vegetable protein imports and the adoption of healthier diets by 2050. Despite an induced drop in production of 35% compared to 2010 (in Kcal), this scenario: - provides healthy food for Europeans while maintaining export capacity; - reduces Europe's global food footprint; - leads to a 40% reduction in GHG emissions from the agricultural sector; - regains biodiversity and conserves natural resources. Further work is needed and underway on the socio-economic and policy implications of the TYFA scenario.
,
 
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