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Derren Brown: Master Mind-Manipulator

Zoffre said:
liveinabin1 said:
Anyway, I don't see the fact that there were cameras around is a convincing argument. There are CCTV cameras around us all the time. Just walk down any high street and there are cameras. As far as I'm aware ambulances have cameras in them as standard, as do police cars. With all that was going on I'm not surprised he didn't notice them.
True, but one of the cameras in the ambulance wasn't a CCTV type camera (I don't know about the ones in his house) - it was sticking out of a cupboard (you can see it clearly in the clip that's on the GMAM page I linked to) so surely he must have seen it at some point. As the original commenter says, it's all about whether he knew (even subconsciously) that it wasn't real and was therefore just going along with it. After all, people do a lot of things to get on TV, and if he'd given the game away it wouldn't have been shown... ;)

I wonder though if his acceptance of the situation and failure to notice the cameras was part of the hypnosis that Derren had performed on him. Also, if we were in that kind of situation, would we think logically? Would we notice things like that?

I have been in a similar, but different, situation. I was in central Manchester when it was bombed in the mid 90s. I was close enough to the blast for it to blow me off my feet. I was not nearly as together or rational as I thought I might be in a situation like that where everything changes. The friend I was with had been at the Hillsborough disaster and was far more together than I was. He thought logically and calmly in a manner I know I couldn't do at the time, butI think I could do now. He later said that his past experience of an emergency situation helped him to cope then.

What I don't understand was why he didn't look for his clothes, wallet, phone etc. That said there was a lot of footage recorded that wasn't shown.
I find it odd that it can no longer be found on Channel 4 On Demand.
 
liveinabin1 said:
I find it odd that it can no longer be found on Channel 4 On Demand.

Perhaps the government has pulled it as it is too close to the truth! :shock:
 
I wouldn't read too much into the lack of On Demand showing, I had to wait three weeks for an episode of Angelos Epithemiou which I'd missed.
 
I do find On Demand tends to have tech problems on the odd occasion I use it, so it might be no more sinister than that.
 
I always find it odd when the debate about Derren Brown faking it rucks up especially as he has already told you what he does is fake and nothing more then manipulating the human condition.

Lost Phone in House : I imagine there is a good hours worth of footage of him tearing the place upside down trying to find it but ultimately he was reassured by his brother it was there and no doubt had to go to work at some point so why waste the 45 minutes of air time you have with an overlong phone search?

The psychological feats he performs only work on a certain mind, I don't want to say simple but perhaps a mind that doesn't question is more fitting. For example the bit he did on Simon Pegg and convinced him all he wanted for Christmas was a Red BMX bike and not a leather jacket. Through out the scene I picked up on the constant "touches" when bike related words were said however the girlfriend didn't.
 
I just thought of something - do you reckon DB checks out this forum?

We know he is interested in Fortean subjects and no doubt if he were here he would read a thread about himself. I've been wondering about this for a while regarding "celebrities" in general.

By law of averages, we must have some famous people here, never giving away their true identity.

If you are here DB, please PM me because I would really like to ask you something totally unrelated to Apocolypse and I promise that your FTMB identity secret is safe with me.
 
Ronson8 said:
Trouble is Ringo, anyone of us could pm you claiming to be him. ;)

You'd have to answer my security question first. ;)
 
Ringo_ said:
I just thought of something - do you reckon DB checks out this forum?

We know he is interested in Fortean subjects and no doubt if he were here he would read a thread about himself. I've been wondering about this for a while regarding "celebrities" in general.

By law of averages, we must have some famous people here, never giving away their true identity.

If you are here DB, please PM me because I would really like to ask you something totally unrelated to Apocolypse and I promise that your FTMB identity secret is safe with me.

Going back to the late 90s, in the early days of internet forums, I had a friend who was an actor and son of a middling famous actor and was friends with Peter Davidson. We were talking one night about the new phenomenon that was internet forums. He said that Davidson was a frequent poster on a one of the Doctor Who forums under a nom-de-plume. He never let on who he was, he just liked being included in a dialogue about Doctor Who like a normal person.

Edit: yes, I know it's the classic FOAF tale. But I know he was a friend with Davidson.
 
Aw, that was quite nice, really. Had to laugh at the Danny guy blurting "I don't have a heart!" Maybe Stephen was gullible, but I believed his reactions. Bit disappointed the gore warned about by the continuity announcer was non-existent, but otherwise, heartwarming rather than flesheating zombie stuff.

Next week, people without fear.
 
I enjoyed the second part more than the first. If this is totally genuine, and I'm leaning that way, then it really was quite an astonishing piece of TV history.

And it was fun to play "Find the Wizard of Oz" references. Here's what I found:

Kansas Autos
Follow the Yellow road
Courage, Heart, Brain (obviously)
Military HQ was called Emerald
Their call sign was OZ
The helicopter had a Hot Air balloon on it
LEOna - is that too contrived?

Anyone else find anything more?
 
I did some digging around and found a further clue. Leona is carrying a toy Lion in one scene. Other people have noticed these too and one guy on DerrenBrownExposed.net has shown all the clues here: http://derrenbrownexposed.net/2012/10/27/derren-brown-apocalypse-wizard-of-oz/

Also, this guy shows a supposed tweet from Steve which alludes to the Wizard of Oz. He tweeted this during the secret filming but before the actual "apocalypse" event. Here's the link: http://derrenbrownexposed.net/2012/10/30/steve-brosnan-leaked-derren-brown-apocalypse-on-twitter/

At that point, he hadn't been exposed to any OZ stuff. Very coincidental.
 
One thing that I want to know is when did this take place?

The reason I ask is because in the piece that Derren put on youtube he introduced Steve as now working as a teacher.

Now, to train as a teacher takes one year assuming you already have a degree. However there are only particular times in the year that you can start and apply for training, You need to apply at Xmas to start training the following September. Derren clearly says that he is now working as a teacher, not training to be a teacher. So if we assume the filming took place in the summer, Steve then applied for training in the December and started training the following September, so that is a full year before he even starts training. Then a year of training before he starts working, so two years in total. Did they really film this two years ago?
 
liveinabin1 said:
One thing that I want to know is when did this take place?

The reason I ask is because in the piece that Derren put on youtube he introduced Steve as now working as a teacher.

Now, to train as a teacher takes one year assuming you already have a degree. However there are only particular times in the year that you can start and apply for training, You need to apply at Xmas to start training the following September. Derren clearly says that he is now working as a teacher, not training to be a teacher. So if we assume the filming took place in the summer, Steve then applied for training in the December and started training the following September, so that is a full year before he even starts training. Then a year of training before he starts working, so two years in total. Did they really film this two years ago?

That is quite possible. TV companies often work on projects well ahead of when they expect to 'put it to the market'.
 
Another post from Derren, which cleared up my question. Steve is now a Teaching assistant, not a teacher. You can become a teaching assistant without any training whatsoever.

We all survived. Steven is a finer Steven than before: despite a week of negative Twitter speculation reported disingenuously in the Sun, he really did do it and he really is a better man for it. For those wondering what has happened to him since, Steven now works as a teaching assistant in a special-needs school, a job he finds much more rewarding then the series of positions he held before. And I think in time he’ll make an excellent teacher. For now he’s keeping his Twitter and FaceBook set to private, but I’m sure before too long he’ll open them up and you’ll be able to ask him about his experience.
The show was, as many of you spotted, The Wizard of Oz with zombies. Our Dorothy (you’ll have noted the Kansas Autos sign on our mechanic’s van who visits Steven’s house) did not seek a place over the rainbow, but nonetheless had to learn that there is no place like home. With some extra motivation and carpe diem thrown in: L. Frank Baum’s message that you don’t need to go looking anywhere further than your own back yard always struck me as a little limiting. After the tornado/apocalypse, our Dorothy encounters Leona – of course a cheap play on ‘lion’ – to discover courage and responsibility, a scarecrow (Iain) who becomes indecisive and necessitates a new alpha-male in the group, and a tin-man (Danny) who, having no heart, makes it necessary for Steven to find his own. The Yellow Brecon Road awaits to take Steven to salvation, but it is Oscar Zulu from Emerald Communications – the wizard (ahem) behind the curtain – who provides the noisy, army equivalent of his hot air balloon to take them away. You’ll have spotted the graphic on the side of the helicopter. Like Dorothy, Steven is left behind: before he can return home he has to say what he has learnt from his experience, and what he has known all along. Which he does, movingly, in the video tape he makes for his family. To encourage this moment, we had him see the others do the same and held the camera held back from him until he was ready. That done, and his lesson learnt, cue the deus ex machina of the phone call (I know now I should have floated down in Glinda’s bubble for absolute authenticity) and he’s magically transported back home to a life now dramatically reassessed.
Writing a show with an unscripted, unwitting central character is a strange and demanding task. My co-creators Iain Sharkey (himself a freaked-out participant in my Séance programme many years ago where we first met) and Stephen Long worked on the idea with me in the first instance, before Mark Gatiss got involved to help find possibilities for narrative. The massive bulk of the extraordinary writing task was then shared by Iain and a gifted, lovely writer called Ben Teasdale, both of whom gave heart and soul to the project. Sharkey can be seen starring as the first we see of the ‘infected’, behind the window in the red tag building. His condition of butt-nakedness-save-for-a-backless-hospital-gown was sadly lost in the gloomy lighting of the sequence, but I’m sure it added to Steven’s growing sense of deathly horror.
For my production team to make it all happen took a level of dedication and love almost unheard of in the industry. Working 30 days without a break, spending nights awake in Steven’s shed waiting to pull a plug to his television, they were stretched beyond anything one would expect anyone to put into making a television show. Samuel Palmer and Dave Struthers in particular – both brilliant and talented core members of our little family – deserve special mention here. Dave’s Twitter feed over the last week was a tirade of fury at the glib, uninformed assurances of fraud after the endless work he and Sam put into the hugely demanding job of secretly filming Steven over such a long period of time. I bow to the extraordinary level of commitment and resolve shown by the whole team, who were bonded above all by a desire to do right by Steven. It was a formidable show to make.
And it’s not over yet. Next week brings two more shows under the banner Derren Brown: Fear and Faith. In part one, airing this Friday at 9, we follow the first members of the public to take a wonder-drug, developed for the military, that completely eradicates the experience of fear. It was another astonishing journey. I hope you enjoy it.


http://derrenbrown.co.uk/post-apocalypse/
 
Thanks for posting that, it's a shame nobody believes anything anymore except the worst (well, sort of). As a note, was anybody else worried that Derren was able to hypnotise the guy over the phone?!
 
gncxx said:
As a note, was anybody else worried that Derren was able to hypnotise the guy over the phone?!
I think it's only possible with the simplest of minds which he obviously was.
 
I'm sure he'd rather say it was down to him being more suggestible in an tense and alien situation! But if I'd been through that and saw the phone, I'd be thinking "Waaaaaiiit a minute!", assuming I'd gotten to that stage.
 
In Derren's early shows he did a thing where he would cause just random people in the street to collapse over the phone.

He would ring a pay phone and say something to whoever answered and they would collapse. From what I remember there is a certain kind of person who would answer a pay phone and then he would just say something completely random. Of course they didn't show all the times it didn't work.

I wonder if he was actually in some state of hypnosis.

Either that or Derren said, 'it's OK Steve, you don't have to walk to Wales', and he collapsed with relief.
 
I enjoyed the show, but did anyone else find it terrifically moralising?

Or perhaps we ought to be thanking Derren for saving the world from one more Slacker.
 
liveinabin1 said:
In Derren's early shows he did a thing where he would cause just random people in the street to collapse over the phone.

He would ring a pay phone and say something to whoever answered and they would collapse. From what I remember there is a certain kind of person who would answer a pay phone and then he would just say something completely random. Of course they didn't show all the times it didn't work.

Yup, I used to love that! lol. He also did one where he got a young guy to feel really drunk when Derren said a certain word. He could then just text this young man & he would become drunk just from reading said word!
 
James_H2 said:
I enjoyed the show, but did anyone else find it terrifically moralising?

Or perhaps we ought to be thanking Derren for saving the world from one more Slacker.

Yes i did think "isn't it a bit much, couldn't his mum just give him a bollocking for being a lazy git" (which tbh, is the parents fault for letting him get away with it for so long!) :roll:

It wasn't Derren's best work, yup it was a big production etc, but I do think his early tv work was much better. Making the guy on the tube train forget his station is still one of the best IMHO.
 
I was at the library the other day, and bought three books. One of them was Derren Brown 'Tricks of the Mind'. He explains how to do 'some' of his stuff. I'm interested in his section on body language.
 
The "Tricks of the mind" book is a great read. Really interesting.

I love his cold reading of audience memebers on his live shows too. Great stuff!
 
Nice and positive last night, with Derren as a combination life coach and social worker. Weird that placebos can cure allergies. Good to see the anxiety guy make such an improvement. Bet the first fear of heights chap was annoyed it worked so quickly on him, he was hardly in it.

Derren's favourite subject (apart from mediums) next week: he's dismantling the world's religions!
 
I loved it! Can't wait for next weeks :)

Also, I liked the drugs name: Rumyodin = your mind 8)
 
Interesting one last night, thought it was a bit cruel to put the scientist girl through her fake religious revelation, though she was quite cheerful about it at the end. Kind of worrying how easy it is to manipulate people into this, though Derren is an expert what if there's someone who decides to use his powers and techniques for evil?

Also, kind of embarrassing to see how many supposedly non-religious people get massively superstitious instead. Reminds me of the G.K. Chesterton quote (paraphrased), "When people stop believing in God they start believing in anything". Not sure about lumping the agnostics in with the atheists, though.
 
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