Destination Mars!

INT21

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..and now with the Chinese landing a vehicle on the far side of the Moon,.

One might wonder why no one else did it .
 

EnolaGaia

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..and now with the Chinese landing a vehicle on the far side of the Moon,.
One might wonder why no one else did it .
The Soviets and Americans had mapped the far side of the moon from orbit or close passes during the 1960's. One of the American Ranger spacecraft (the ones that gathered and transmitted data while diving into the moon's surface) - Ranger 4 - was supposed to do the dive onto the far side, but it suffered a hardware failure before the final phase of the mission. Since then, a number of lunar orbiters have continued sensor and photographic scanning of the far side.

As to why no one's bothered with a soft landing on the far side until the current Chinese mission ...

The primary issue is communication. Any craft sitting on the far side is blocked by the moon itself from having line-of-sight communications back to earth. This means any data collection from the far side entails either:

(a) a landing plus subsequent take-off to afford communication or physical return to earth, or
(b) the placement of an additional satellite in lunar orbit as a comm relay.

Strategy (b) was proposed in the context of a possible Apollo landing on the far side back in the 1970's, but NASA rejected the idea owing to heightened mission complexity and risks.

On the other hand ... The far side's radio comm blackout condition has long been touted as an advantage if a radio telescope were to be placed there.
 

tastyintestines

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Tastyintestines,

..Your fear is being used to control and tax. Go spread it for someone else. ..

Not the kind of facts you want to hear ?

Still waiting for your vision of a brave new world.

INT21
It's called NASA and crop yield. Not to difficult to understand. One uses imagination and human ingenuity to get us to space. We have the time and resources to eventually colonize it. The other is how our crop yield has multiplied while the native pop of usa has not due to low birthrate. That solves your trying to control or fear of people out breeding and eating you. simples
 
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INT21

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...The other is how our crop yield has multiplied while the native pop of usa has not due to low birthrate. ..

You are seeing things from an American--centric viewpoint.

Your country, large as it is, is a modern Western society. but it is not the only country on the planet; something some of you guys seem to forget.

Just look around at the rest of the world, particularly the so called third world, and tell me how the plan will apply to them.

Surely you do not dispute that the World population is increasing at a unsustainable rate.

Crop rate is increased by adding more fertilizer. This is getting into the waterways causing algae problems in many places.

Get into space. Agreed.

Now look at the practical side of it. Two or three trips to a virtually uninhabitable Moon, with no permanent presence, and a couple of automated rovers on Mars. A start. But not exactly shuttle runs of thousands of people to Mars. Which in itself will require huge projects to make it even partway inhabitable. We can't live on it as it stands without very specialized equipment. And who will be allowed to go if it is populated ? You can bet it won't be Average Joe and his family.

Look, there is no fear mongering going on.

The population on my home town has gone from 35,000 twenty years ago, to 50.000.

This has required the use of farming land to build new houses. Expansion of the sewage system. A bigger demand on the water and electricity supplies.

I am not trying to score points off you. but I often wonder why people don't see what is going on all around them.

INT21.

And there are no other Planets on the horizon.
 
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Mythopoeika

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I want to put down my marker on the "Mars Colonization" pool. I bet that no-one currently living will see humans land on Mars, because climate change with its attendant social/political destabilization is going to accelerate dramatically in the very near future, and space exploration will move way down the list of our priorities.

Hoping to be proven wrong.
Won't that move Moon & Mars colonisation UP the ladder? The rich and powerful will want to leave if the planet goes tits up.
 

Mythopoeika

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It's called NASA and crop yield. Not to difficult to understand. One uses imagination and human ingenuity to get us to space. We have the time and resources to eventually colonize it. The other is how our crop yield has multiplied while the native pop of usa has not due to low birthrate. That solves your trying to control or fear of people out breeding and eating you. simples
It's not just food supply that's an issue. New land isn't being made (OK, Holland and Dubai are exceptions) and other resources are in limited supply.
 

INT21

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And Dubai is, in many ways, the worst possible example. One wonder if the water will run out before the oil.

Desalination is not a long term solution (if you will excuse the pun). The salt extracted has to go somewhere.

It's a rich boys playground. I was there (actually Sharjah, just up the road) in the early seventies when it was just a fishing port.

INT21.
 

Frasier Buddolph

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Won't that move Moon & Mars colonisation UP the ladder? The rich and powerful will want to leave if the planet goes tits up.
They may want to leave, but there's nowhere to go. And all of them combined don't have enough money to change that, at least not in the time available.
 

INT21

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Most powerful man in the World says it is all false news anyway.

INT21.
 

James_H

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It's not just food supply that's an issue. New land isn't being made (OK, Holland and Dubai are exceptions) and other resources are in limited supply.
I'd guess that the majority of inhabited land in Hong Kong is recovered from the sea.
 

INT21

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..I'd guess that the majority of inhabited land in Hong Kong is recovered from the sea.

And if the sea level rises by a Metre or so then Hong Kong will be in deep trouble .

Along with places like Holland.

INT21.
 
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..I'd guess that the majority of inhabited land in Hong Kong is recovered from the sea.

And if the sea level rises by a Metre or so then Hong Kong will be in deep trouble .

Along with places like Holland.

INT21.
Dykes will save them!
 

tastyintestines

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Sorry for the optimism and speck of faith in humanity. There are a lot of books on human ingenuity, endurance, adaptability and inventiveness if you want further evidence. We have other threads that are the proper place for conversations about educating women and lowering birth rates and increased yield leading to less land usage and runoff control thru vegetation, etc..:p
 
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