Disinformation

A

Anonymous

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Anybody know what's happened to http://www.disinfo.com? It's been unavailable since Wednesday at least. Given its content, I find its disappearance after Tuesday's disaster extremely alarming.
 

JamesWhitehead

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Just been reading a piece on the Guardian-Observer site
about how the Internet is going to be targetted.

From now on, when I say the wingèd cat, I really mean Tony
Blair. Bush will be known as BigFoot and bin Laden will be
Mr. Wheelie.

Oh dear, there really is someone at the door . . . :eek:
 
A

Anonymous

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I don't know anything about the site in question, but at least one site I know of - the snopes message board - has had to be shut down because of being overwhelmed with hits, many times more of them than is typical. I have a hunch that any already popular site that deals with diseminating truth in the face of rumor is going to be swamped with traffic right about now. If the server can't take the heat, the site goes down. No conspiracy, just a tech problem.

Nonny
 

Ioethe

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It's working fine now...
 
A

Anonymous

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Thanks - I've just had a look. Seems curiously muted, though. I expected to see some analysis of WTC from their usual left-field veiwpoint, but they just carry a single news report. Give 'em time.....
 

JamesWhitehead

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The US counter-culture can't seem to get its head in gear on this
at all.

So much stuff about the New World Order and how to resist it
has suddenly been blown into a tailspin.

Suddenly the NWO seems a cosy communal place to be.

Thinking differently is very unpatriotic right now. Scrutinizing the
failures of intelligence and security which allowed the terrible
events is not a comfortable job in a mood of My Country Right or
Wrong.

It may be some time before a real alternative take emerges. By
then, we will all have other things to think about.
 
A

Anonymous

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political rock band rage against the machine message board has been shut down by the secret service due to several inflammatory posts
 

Mob1138

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the story is that disinfos site was closed due to their servers being based near the wtc,there fore they crashed.true or not?
 
A

Anonymous

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The U.S. is very conservative with an affirmative culture. Herbert Marcuse was a great thinker who wrote about the military-Industrial complex and the manipulation of mass culture by authoritarian capitalists. The CIA sucks. The US should have gone to that peace process and apologized for all the crap of the 20th century. The US is full of hypocrisy, the govt. that is. Yet, I think things go in cycles and eventually we will swing left again. Once the U.S. people figure out that our govt. is full of lies, then our society will change. Of course this won't happen for a while. After we have blown up Bin Laden and Iraq, and then when the people realize that GW is an idiot who was ruining the economy even before the attack, well, we will have started the descent to rock bottom. It will be hotter then and we will be poorer. Too bad the shit has to hit the fan before people get together and demand positive social change. Rage against the Machine rules!
 
A

Anonymous

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king mob said:
the story is that disinfos site was closed due to their servers being based near the wtc,there fore they crashed.true or not?
That's what Disinformation themselves say - sounds reasonable. The site seems to be getting back to its old self.
 
A

Anonymous

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God forbid that the USA will ever swing "left"and allow free reign to our so misguided and softly softly liberals who can spout about Americas failures.A few facts;president Bush is elected to his position as are all his officials.Contrast this with the mad mullahs who have the capacity to destroy the earth with no regard to life let alone democracy.Those who have not the stomach for what needs to be done will no doubt continue their sniping from the sidelines while enjoying all the benefits a free society brings.The struggle will be worth it in the end when freedom prevails but when that time comes,as it surely will,perhaps those who continue to spread poison cloaked in wishy washy pseudo liberals clothes will be looked at to see how much of a threat they represent to the rest of us who desire peace and living withion normal human standards.God bless America and the Allies,keep going even if the destruction of madness takes years.Incidentally the people protesting outside the US Embassy here in Dublin are sick and deserve to be treated as fellow travellers at this critical time.
 

JamesWhitehead

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Nearly rose to the bait, Alan. What a first rate parody!

I especially like the way in which neglect of the space key
allows all the clichés to clump together as if put through a
rubbish-compactor.

I think "wishy washy" is seldom heard outside of pantomime
and fringe meetings of Tories. But, as with all good parody,
the real question is whether the target is worth the effort. :)
 
A

Anonymous

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Ah James so the mask has slipped.No meetings of the loony left
at the moment then?You're feeble attempts to parody my use of the language are certainly worthy of pantomine,with the star performer none other than yourself.Perhaps your ever present sarcasm,ready wit and oh so brilliant contributions on every subject under the sun will eventually reveal themselves to more than me for what they really are.Tear away the mask of joviality and reveal the real James.it is with regret that I leave this site knowing that I am not the first and certainly wont be the last as long as James is given free reign.
The seven thousand souls who perished can rest easy in the knowledge that there are many who will avenge their deaths and then turn their sights on the enemy within.
 

greenrd

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Now I'm just confused. Is Alan a right-wing nutter or just a nutter? :confused:
 
A

Anonymous

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In my experience of internet boards - people who make dramatic and regretful exits (Alan) often get one last post in .... then reappear under a new moniker.
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
Quite so. Be very wary if a new member called 'Lana' pops up in the next day or so.
 
A

Anonymous

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On second thoughts, how do we know that James and Alan are not, in fact the same person?
 

Spookdaddy

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Alan said:
.. there are many who will avenge their deaths and then turn their sights on the enemy within.
Do I detect the spirit of General O'Duffys Blueshirts still mincing, stiff-legged around Dublin looking for a war?
 
A

Anonymous

Guest
On second thoughts, how do we know that James and Alan are not, in fact the same person?


Well I know that you're only joking - but I've got a vaguely serious point here. James and myself certainly hold very different opinions on many subjects - but I really like reading his posts and his subjects are always interesting. He makes me think and that's what this site seems to be about.

Alan, by contrast, resorted to personal and nasty attacks. This is a great BB and we don't need that kind of thing.

Post away James. I hope you hit 1000 by Christmas.
 

harlequin2005

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I thought Dubbayew got into the Whitehouse be a less overt coup than LBJ. Tell you one thing, if I ever go for election,I'd like my brother Mycroft counting the votes for the tie-breaker...:D

De-mock-cra-see... what a curious word, anyone know what it means?

8¬)
 

rynner2

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An interesting story in the Sunday Telegraph today saying that an investigation into the voting in Florida, organised by various branches of the media, has been withheld from publication at this time.... The implication seems to be that the investigation showed that Al Gore should have won, but that in the interests of National unity in the present TWAT situation, it seems wiser not to reveal this right now.
 

ShadowPrime

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"Skeptical" Thinking

There is a school of thought, quite prevalent on this Message Board, that seems to hold that ANY theory that casts the USA, George Bush, etc, in a bad light, should be seen as possible/probable/likely, or as the result of truly skeptical thought, or as somehow more intelligent, more insightful, more perceptive, than that offered by the "My Country Right or Wrong" crowd. To that I have to say...rubbish.

Shadowy consipiracies are a lot of fun, of course, and any of us here are likely to enjoy a good yarn, but really now... sometimes we can all be too clever by half. I am reminded, sadly, of all those theories, so popular in the Muslim/Arabic world, pinning the WTC attacks on ...surprise!...the Israelis. Remember all those (now known to be apocryphal!) Jews who "didn't report to work on the 11th", because they were tipped off about the attacks? Total nonsense, of course, but if fit the preconceptions of the Muslims/Arabs who propogated the tale, and was thus eagerly gobbled up.

I find a lot of the discourse on the Board these days to be in that vein, only you can substitute the nasty Americans, or the nasty MIC, or the nasty American Masons, or the nasty New World Order, or the Nasty American GOP, in place of the Israelis/Jews. And here too, the eagerness to sieze on such theories really tells you a lot about the theorists, who simply MUST find a way to turn even this tragedy into an opportunity to take shots at their favorite targets.

Bottom line... a group of angry, intolerant, totally ruthless Islamic extremists decided to bring "their" war to American soil, and to slaughter as many Americans as they could manage (they would gladly have increased their 6-7K total a hundred...a thousand..fold if they could have) on live TV. And they MAY now be in the process of bringing disease to all sorts of oh-so-powerful mail carriers and mail clerks and office staffers and secretaries. And for that, they will ultimately be rooted up and eradicated..

Sometimes things are simply not that complicated.

Shadow
 

greenrd

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Actually, although you have a point, Shadow, I think of it as a more Fortean approach - looking into the marginalised stories or theories. If the evidence suggested a hidden, unreported Israeli or Muslim or even anti-capitalist conspiracy, I'd be interested in that too! But criticisms of official enemies are commonplace in the media, one doesn't have to look too far. It's a matter of getting past the accepted unquestioned "truths" and seeing what is really going on. There's no attempt to cover up the inhumanity of the Taliban (not any more!), so there is basically nothing to uncover there! There is by stark contrast plenty to uncover about the atrocities sponsored by the US and UK governments.

Scathing criticism of our own governments are also accepted in the mainstream media - but only in certain directions and in certain more open publications. For those that are interested in marginalised, Fortean stories and analyses relating to world events, one inevitably encounters "anti-American, anti-UK, anti-European" etc. theories. Those are rather misleading terms anyway - I don't hate America, I just hate violent imperialism - wherever it shows up.

And it's interesting that criticism of say past slavery or present police brutality is never called "anti-American", whereas criticism of present government policies is. Very selective! One can criticise aspects of a country - esp. its government - without hating the country as a whole.

Over the years, as wars recede into the past, we can see them more clearly, less clouded by ideology and propaganda. At the time anti-Vietnam protestors were vilified and called unpatriotic - now many people realise that they had a point. Likewise, the Gulf War is widely recognised on both left and right to have been about self-interested oil concerns, not about "liberating" Kuwait from "evil" Saddam (who used to be our ally).

Maybe in 20 years time we'll look at the war on Afghanistan in a very different light, too.
 

ShadowPrime

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Fortean Mindset?

Well, Greenrd, while I suspect you and I would agree on very little politically, I enjoyed your civil and thought-provoking response, even as I have to take issue with it, to some extent...

You feel that at least some of the "conspiracy theorists" are motivated by a Fortean mindset, and that may well be so, but I feel a greater number are simply going with what comes naturally - a desire to cast the West in general, and the USA/Great Britain in particular as the bogeymen in just about any situation, and are casting that in a Fortean light as a means of justifying it.

Maybe I truly don't understand the Fortean perspective. I am all for innovative, "outside the box" thinking, the weighing of all possibilities, etc... but on the other hand, I am not in favor of a mindset which considers ALL possibilities as equally likely, in actual opposition to the evidence at hand. Ocham's Razor is a uselful tool, I think, even if it is not foolproof.

Just as I have no desire to simply assume that everything the US govt puts forth is fact, or to adopt an attitude that every act of the US govt is altruistic, purely motivated, etc., so that I simpy deny any unpleasant fact that might indicate otherwise, I have no desire to come at this from the opposite perspective, to assume that every significant act is the result of the US govt's malevolence, that any act, no matter how seemingly clearly explainable, must in fact have a sinister, hidden explanation that puts blood on the hands of the American govt.

I think some on this board are very much in that camp, and they offer the defense that any scenario, no matter how ill-supported by fact, is somehow insightful, clever, "Fortean", etc, precisely because it DOES fly in the face of fact, and especially because it makes the US out to be evil. Someone who came on here and said "there is no way the US govt could be involved in anything untoward because it is always good and right" would doubtless be flamed for their naivete (SP? :blah: ), their close-mindedness, but it seems those coming from the other end of the perspective, who see George Bush meeting with Henry Kissinger and the X-Files Smoking Man on 10 September, planning the WTC attacks as they secretly sell airline stocks and buy up stock in Bayer in anticipation of a run on Cipro, are lauded for their skeptical, grounded, "Fortean" mindset.

Again, I point to the conspiracy theories flourishing in the Arab/Muslim world, laying the WTC attacks at the feet of Israeli intelligence, claiming Jews, tipped off in advance, did not show up for work on 11 September.... were these folks being Fortean? I think not..rather, they were constructing an explanation, in opposition to the facts, that played into their preconceptions re the Israelis/Jews as the "root of all evil". I feel some on this board are similarly motivated re the US govt, and wrap themselves in a Fortean cloak when really they are simply giving vent to anti-US/anti-Western prejudices that were well-entrenched long before the 11th.

Ah well... I have beaten this particular dead horse long enough (another trait of mine!)...

;)


Shadow
 

harlequin2005

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I agree with much of what the Shadow says. But part of the Fortean mindset is to examine the excluded, the 'damned'.

Could it be that vested American interests have let through the bombers?

Could it be a sub-Watchmen plot by some third party to genererate some unknown result?

Could it be an Israeli plot?

and my favourite, i.e. most likely one:-

Could it be some mad, not in the clinical sense, zealot, holed up in some cave supported by a personal fortune, topped up by family, who neededn't share his beliefs, but familiy is family, who managed to use holes in the system to take control of a number of airplanes with plastic box cutters, and really has no strategy beyond spreading discord and launching the world in to a holy war, where it doesnt matter that everyone can die, since the blessed will go straight to Allah?


Note, I'm also going for the longest sentance on the boards award with the above






8¬)
 

uair01

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Theorizing about social media coordinated sabotage:

Social media was used to motivate, organize and coordinate movements like the Arab Spring and Black Lives Matter. Of course, coordination can also lead to conspiracy theories like QAnon, twitter mobs that police political correctness and riots that lead to death and destruction. For better or worse, coordinated behavior is likely to increase, creating more and more quickly moving mobs. The use and abuse of such mobs is only just beginning. One insidiously clever prospect is the use of seemingly benign coordination to bring down a power grid. What if everyone turns on their air conditioner and lights at the same time? In How weaponizing disinformation can bring down a city’s power grid, Raman et al. discuss how such a scenario could be generate by something seemingly as simple as sending fake coupons!

https://marginalrevolution.com/marg...ocial-media-to-bring-down-the-power-grid.html
 

Swifty

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Theorizing about social media coordinated sabotage:

Social media was used to motivate, organize and coordinate movements like the Arab Spring and Black Lives Matter. Of course, coordination can also lead to conspiracy theories like QAnon, twitter mobs that police political correctness and riots that lead to death and destruction. For better or worse, coordinated behavior is likely to increase, creating more and more quickly moving mobs. The use and abuse of such mobs is only just beginning. One insidiously clever prospect is the use of seemingly benign coordination to bring down a power grid. What if everyone turns on their air conditioner and lights at the same time? In How weaponizing disinformation can bring down a city’s power grid, Raman et al. discuss how such a scenario could be generate by something seemingly as simple as sending fake coupons!

https://marginalrevolution.com/marg...ocial-media-to-bring-down-the-power-grid.html
Seeing as the last post in this thread was nearly 19 years ago, I think you deserve some sort of dedication award :).
 
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