Doctor Who 2 (Avast! There Be Spoilers!)

Roger Nowell

Chief Scrobbler
Joined
Nov 19, 2018
Messages
115
Reaction score
230
Points
43
Location
East Yorkshire, England.
Shades of Douglas Adams with that frog. Could easily have been mice.
 

GNC

King-Sized Canary
Joined
Aug 25, 2001
Messages
30,506
Reaction score
16,795
Points
309
The frog seems to be controversial, but otherwise this was a well-received episode, possibly because it's the first where everyone has really settled (just took nine episodes!) and it felt like it was its own thing at last. For a show about grief, they could have been dour and depressing, but the fact they went wacky instead is a far more original way of dealing with it. I thought it was probably the best so far (supplanting the witchfinding), but then again, I like that story where Bertie Bassett was the villain.
 

Peripart

Antediluvian
Joined
Aug 1, 2005
Messages
5,721
Reaction score
3,313
Points
259
Yes, apart from the frog, I thought it was the best yet. I guess the frog was knowingly and even "ironically" rubbish, bur it was still a touch silly. Much to like, all the same.

Only real downsides otherwise for me were the continued overuse of the Sonic Screwdriver, and the setting - 21st century Earth again!
 

stu neville

Commissioner.
Staff member
Joined
Mar 9, 2002
Messages
11,886
Reaction score
5,089
Points
284
Shades of Douglas Adams with that frog. Could easily have been mice.
There were a couple of sly Adams references - "The frilly bit of Norway", etc.

I agree, frog aside, it was the best one yet. But the frog was crap. It wasn't even a convincing frog. Hartley Hare was more realistic.
 

Roger Nowell

Chief Scrobbler
Joined
Nov 19, 2018
Messages
115
Reaction score
230
Points
43
Location
East Yorkshire, England.
(ABOVE) Hartley Hare was far stranger than anything in the Whoniverse
 

Analogue Boy

The new Number 6
Joined
Aug 10, 2005
Messages
10,541
Reaction score
9,388
Points
309
It's all a bit derivative though. Mirror as a portal?
I know it’s difficult not to be but I did groan at ‘the frilly bits’ and no, lets not leave the frog aside. It was the shittest thing I've seen in Dr. Who for decades.
Actually, I thought the crap Specsavers pilot hud in the ship eater episode was a budget low until I saw that. Oh... and the lanterns. They were cutting edge weren’t they. Where did they get the props - The Range?

It looks filmic because whoever is doing the post and grading is doing a great job of making this stuff look high budget. But the frog. Imagine if it had been an animated frog Mary Poppins style. That would have actually been brilliant.
 

Roland Deschain

All things serve the beam
Joined
Sep 8, 2015
Messages
479
Reaction score
734
Points
99
I wasn't going to view but my missus put it on. Trippy s**t not good, clever or otherwise just plain s**t .
A whole universe (with all the potential of said universe) manifests in some dull Scandinavian hamlet and is so further dull no one notices the family is missing. Cue some emotive stuff from the comic who is bizarrely the only actor worth watching and yawn another episode over too soon.

Please can a dalek shoot the doctor ASAP and force another total reboot .
 

Peripart

Antediluvian
Joined
Aug 1, 2005
Messages
5,721
Reaction score
3,313
Points
259
I wasn't going to view but my missus put it on. Trippy s**t not good, clever or otherwise just plain s**t .
A whole universe (with all the potential of said universe) manifests in some dull Scandinavian hamlet and is so further dull no one notices the family is missing. Cue some emotive stuff from the comic who is bizarrely the only actor worth watching and yawn another episode over too soon.

Please can a dalek shoot the doctor ASAP and force another total reboot .
A bit harsh, but I agree that Bradley Walsh has been a standout in this series.
 

Yithian

Parish Watch
Staff member
Joined
Oct 29, 2002
Messages
30,015
Reaction score
36,088
Points
309
Location
East of Suez

Dinobot

Justified & Ancient
Joined
May 19, 2015
Messages
3,142
Reaction score
3,305
Points
159
Location
Broadcasting from the moon...
No need for chip pissing or aggression here--I know most contributors here well and nobody is anti-homosexual.

I don't watch Dr Who, but the historical James I was portrayed by his contemporary opponents as irritatingly (and inappropriately) effeminate.

https://tudorstuartperspectives.wordpress.com/2015/11/20/the-effeminate-king/
The point of recent posts isn't his sexuality, merely the presentation of it for cheap laughs (as far as I can see), and discussion of this episode seems to have taken a life of its own.

On behalf of Tigerhawk (my other half) I can say that James' over-the-top performance may have been done in the style of panto, but came across as a negative manner. Not everyone sees Panto, or gets the why it seems so popular. It seems that there are people who see one point and people who see another. But swearing at people who have another opinion to yours is not a reasoned or logical response. May I suggest this particular episode of Doctor Who not be discussed further? We don't want it to get out of hand...
 
Last edited:

Naughty_Felid

kneesy earsy nosey
Joined
Mar 11, 2008
Messages
7,413
Reaction score
9,362
Points
294
The point of recent posts isn't his sexuality, merely the presentation of it for cheap laughs (as far as I can see), and discussion of this episode seems to have taken a life of its own.

On behalf of Tigerhawk (my other half) I can say that James' over-the-top performance may have been done in the style of panto, but came across as a negative manner. It seems that there are people who see one point and people who see another. But swearing at people who have another opinion to yours is not a reasoned or logical response. May I suggest this particular episode of Doctor Who not be discussed further? We don't want it to get out of hand...
I didn't swear at him it was an exclamation of my frustration that camp in the effeminate sense = negativity, it doesn't in my experience.

I agree, although fun, DW has been poorly written and lazy this season. I didn't particularly find James OTT, he was hardly Larry Grayson or the truly lovely John Inman in my opinion.

Camp people get an awful look of stick, even these days, which is wrong. I apologize if I've upset Tiger and Dino and I'm happy to withdraw from this thread.
 

Dinobot

Justified & Ancient
Joined
May 19, 2015
Messages
3,142
Reaction score
3,305
Points
159
Location
Broadcasting from the moon...
It wasn't the swearing at Tigerhawk (I've heard that expression before, and I know what it means), it was the swearing in general (it detracts from the argument when used by either party), it was the OTT portrayal that got some people annoyed, and then the apparent (deliberate or not) offhanded responses by some here or elsewhere that annoys people. Here endeth the sermon, and onto more pleasant pastures!
 

Yithian

Parish Watch
Staff member
Joined
Oct 29, 2002
Messages
30,015
Reaction score
36,088
Points
309
Location
East of Suez
Nobody needs to vacate the thread and no topic need be dropped, we just need everybody to assume that everybody else is all right even if they're 'wrong' on some particular point.

Please.
 

Dinobot

Justified & Ancient
Joined
May 19, 2015
Messages
3,142
Reaction score
3,305
Points
159
Location
Broadcasting from the moon...
I meant that we stop discussing one episodes portrayal and continue with the rest of the brilliant Doctor Who...
 

Anome

Bibliomancer
Joined
May 23, 2002
Messages
5,531
Reaction score
592
Points
194
Location
Left, and to the Back
That was a great episode, I really enjoyed it.... until the frog appeared. It was great again after that too.

"Grandad"

I'm not crying, you are....
Like I said...not getting out alive...
 

stu neville

Commissioner.
Staff member
Joined
Mar 9, 2002
Messages
11,886
Reaction score
5,089
Points
284
I meant that we stop discussing one episodes portrayal and continue with the rest of the brilliant Doctor Who...
One thing to add, which seems to have been overlooked amid the fray - I particularly liked the way James' "divine right" mentality was scripted, and portrayed. Very low key, ie someone with the absolute confidence in his own special-ness and thus no need to trumpet it (see what I did there?). Had they painted him the other way it would inevitably have drawn contemporary parallels, and that subtlety would have been lost.

Anyway - that frog really was crap. And there's a logic-hole there - if it kept appearing as that which someone missed the most, when it was just the Doctor and it, surely it should have appeared as that which the Doctor yearned for most? That could have had enormous potential.

Unless the Doctor really misses an unconvincing frog*.

*and not of the Officer Crabtree from 'allo 'allo type. We can move on from camping it up now.
 

OneWingedBird

Beloved of Ra
Joined
Aug 3, 2003
Messages
15,654
Reaction score
6,955
Points
284
Curious youtube find about the doctor who knock off videos of the 90s.


I remember a friend having these though I never watched them, curiously for all the slating the reviewer gives them for being blatent rip offs, he doesn't mention the cover strapline 'Who is the Stranger?'.
 

Dinobot

Justified & Ancient
Joined
May 19, 2015
Messages
3,142
Reaction score
3,305
Points
159
Location
Broadcasting from the moon...
One thing to add, which seems to have been overlooked amid the fray - I particularly liked the way James' "divine right" mentality was scripted, and portrayed. Very low key, ie someone with the absolute confidence in his own special-ness and thus no need to trumpet it (see what I did there?). Had they painted him the other way it would inevitably have drawn contemporary parallels, and that subtlety would have been lost.

Anyway - that frog really was crap. And there's a logic-hole there - if it kept appearing as that which someone missed the most, when it was just the Doctor and it, surely it should have appeared as that which the Doctor yearned for most? That could have had enormous potential.

Unless the Doctor really misses an unconvincing frog*.

*and not of the Officer Crabtree from 'allo 'allo type. We can move on from camping it up now.
That would be Adric, surely? Those were the fifth Doctors "dying" words...
 

GNC

King-Sized Canary
Joined
Aug 25, 2001
Messages
30,506
Reaction score
16,795
Points
309
But the frog was a sentient universe's version of what it thought was a frog - it wasn't supposed to convince the Doc or us.
 

gordonrutter

There must be a set character limit to this opt...
Staff member
Joined
Aug 3, 2001
Messages
3,564
Reaction score
4,992
Points
184
Apparently this was what was originally going to be used instead of the frog...E29D52C9-7B24-4D4A-8D75-4BB64379220B.jpeg
 

stu neville

Commissioner.
Staff member
Joined
Mar 9, 2002
Messages
11,886
Reaction score
5,089
Points
284
But the frog was a sentient universe's version of what it thought was a frog - it wasn't supposed to convince the Doc or us.
Yet it could accurately replicate human beings to the degree that they could fool loved ones?

Nope, don't buy that. It could have rendered a way more accurate frog.
Apparently this was what was originally going to be used instead of the frog...View attachment 13426
..and that's what happened to Pob when he grew up.
 

Zeke Newbold

Carbon based biped.
Joined
Apr 18, 2015
Messages
940
Reaction score
1,809
Points
139
Curious youtube find about the doctor who knock off videos of the 90s.


I remember a friend having these though I never watched them, curiously for all the slating the reviewer gives them for being blatent rip offs, he doesn't mention the cover strapline 'Who is the Stranger?'.
It's just an uptight American fanboy just not getting it.

I loved The Stranger and back in the late Nineties collected all products - videos and CDs (there were more than he mentions). I gathered that they were not best taken as Who products but would bebetter enjoyed as interessting examples of provincial British science fantasy (much of the series is set in Nottingham). Following an initial attempt to replicate Who they then sped offoin an interesting tangent of their own like a sort of downbeat and gritty version odf Saphire and Steel perhaps. Colin Baker - who wobbled as the Doctor - really came into his own as Solomon, the `Stranger`.

On the basis of the audio-Cds, which worked best, I always thought that The Stranger would make a cracking radio show!
 

GNC

King-Sized Canary
Joined
Aug 25, 2001
Messages
30,506
Reaction score
16,795
Points
309
Yet it could accurately replicate human beings to the degree that they could fool loved ones?

Nope, don't buy that. It could have rendered a way more accurate frog.
It did render people backwards, though.

I don't mind works that use absurdity to reach for profundity, plenty of accomplished material does, from Art Spiegelman's Maus to the cartoons of Don Hertzfeldt to Paul Schrader's film First Reformed, it's a legitimate item in the artistic arsenal. It's used in full knowledge not everyone is going to go along with it, but if you exercise your imagination you can reap the rewards.
 

OneWingedBird

Beloved of Ra
Joined
Aug 3, 2003
Messages
15,654
Reaction score
6,955
Points
284
It's just an uptight American fanboy just not getting it.

I loved The Stranger and back in the late Nineties collected all products - videos and CDs (there were more than he mentions). I gathered that they were not best taken as Who products but would bebetter enjoyed as interessting examples of provincial British science fantasy (much of the series is set in Nottingham). Following an initial attempt to replicate Who they then sped offoin an interesting tangent of their own like a sort of downbeat and gritty version odf Saphire and Steel perhaps. Colin Baker - who wobbled as the Doctor - really came into his own as Solomon, the `Stranger`.

On the basis of the audio-Cds, which worked best, I always thought that The Stranger would make a cracking radio show!
If accurate, it struck me as a crying shame that the director veered into actual IP theft - if he hadn't, he might well have had a place with the show when it eventially returned as others did.
 
Top