Drugs: Creative aid or hinderence

A

Anonymous

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decadnids said:
I never said he did write songs ON DRUGS - I mearly mentioned that taking drugs had probably influenced the beatles later works.
right. Well THAT I'd be inclined to agree with. I thought this was about being creative ON drugs or has the thread moved on some what?
 
A

Anonymous

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Ah, I thought the thread was

Drugs : Creative aid or hinderence,

and as such am looking at the point of view of people experiencing drug effects.
 
A

Anonymous

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decadnids said:
Ah, I thought the thread was

Drugs : Creative aid or hinderence,

and as such am looking at the point of view of people experiencing drug effects.
whereas the impression I got came from Dagon who started the thread was all about doing stuff whilst ON drugs. I most likely got that impression from Dagon's opening line in the first post on this thread;

"Some people seem to assume that anything weirdly creative or fantastical or a bit off the wall were created under the influence of drugs. "

hence....:)
 
A

Anonymous

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decadnids said:
ah yeah, fair enough ;)

i see, direct influence.
exactly.

I mean, did John Lennon take drugs, is a little like asking is the pope catholic??? That side of the debate is kind of a given. Anyone can have a trip and write about it if they feel that way inclined. big deal. I think to get to the core of it, we're talking direct influence as you put it, yeah. thats were the meat and bones of it really is. Naked Lunch for example. Not some one pill popping to get through a busy tour...the average office worker does that! If we took that attitude then we'd be booking someone for drunk driving on a Thursday because he'd had a few beers on a Saturday. Not exactly the same thing, aye?

Anyone remember those pictures of a spider's web, when the spider was on drugs?
 

McAvennie

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Edward said:
MCAvennie/IJ

Can you explain your stance?

I'm just trying to understand, because i'm very much of the opposing view and don't understand, unless of course someone hasn't seen past the stereotypes and media hype.

Just interested.
In my personal experiences the people I've known who smoke dope - we are generally talking this I assume - have been people doing it for some kind of coolness.

At school you were supposedly hard or cool if you did drugs :hmm:
It just pissed me off the whole attitude of either I'm hard and bad cos I smoke dope OR I'm so zany and wacky and do such crazy stuff when I do drugs. It just seemed quite sad to me. The first category covered those who weren't actually hard but wanted to be seen to be hard and the second category were those who weren't actually cool but wanted to be seen to be cool. It just seemed quite sad to me, attention seeking, an attempt to be accepted/liked.

In University days it actually died down, I knew a lot less people who smoked dope then but the majority that I did know just seemed to be doing it because it is what you are expected to do to conform with the 'student' stereotype. As IJ has said it seems to be an individuality thing but how individual can it be if everyone is doing it?

I am not preachy and I'm not going to tell people not to do drugs (although I did break the ice with my g/f when I first met her by throwing her last cigarette behind the bar and telling her to stop smoking - which she did :cool: ). It just pisses me off when people who do do drugs hear my opinions of them and say stuff like 'Well, you've obviously never done drugs' like if I did I'd suddenly be enlightened as to how cool and better I'd feel. Quite frankly it's as insulting as saying to a homosexual 'Yeah, but you've just never been with a woman'.

But, who cares. If people wanna do drugs let them, just don't think you're any better or cooler because of it.
 
A

Anonymous

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McAvennie said:
It just pisses me off when people who do do drugs hear my opinions of them and say stuff like 'Well, you've obviously never done drugs' like if I did I'd suddenly be enlightened as to how cool and better I'd feel. Quite frankly it's as insulting as saying to a homosexual 'Yeah, but you've just never been with a woman'.
yes fair points -
and I can see that from your experience, there are a lot of people who have done drugs purely to be "cool".

what pisses me off, is that people assume that all people who take drugs are "wanting to be cool, or hard etc"
as this isnt always the case.

When I talk about drug use, I dont believe for a moment that taking drugs will enhance a persons social standing, or that it will automatically make them "cool" - as that just aint true. And I definately think that some people are drawn to experimentation with such substances, and some people are just not interested, which is totally fair enough.

like everything, people have to discover things on their own merit - personally, I refused to smoke dope for years when all my mates where doing it.

I ended up smoking pot out of a natural curiosity of what it would be like to experience something that I had read about and researched before hand - and likewise, with every other substance I have taken, I have first made it a priority to research it as much as possible before taking it.

I know where you are coming from tho, as people do "bash down" pills and what not willy nilly, with out any real regard for the reasons why they do it.

I used to know a lot of people who where really just interested in getting "out of their mash" - and I would associate with them due to the fact that I would normally see them when I was round "a dealers" house. so their stories of excessive drug use, and the general state of them, quickly made me realise that there are def. a few different types of drugs users.

Thats why I get pissed off when people tar anyone who has a voice about drug use with the same brush.
 
A

Anonymous

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Hook Innsmouth said:
Anyone remember those pictures of a spider's web, when the spider was on drugs?
yes, really interesting,

from memory, the one made under the influence of caffeine was the worst web.

the one on cannabis, looked ok, but it was as if the spider gave up,

the one on LSD looked proper good.

here is the link
http://www.cannabis.net/weblife.html
 
A

Anonymous

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I did break the ice with my g/f when I first met her by throwing her last cigarette behind the bar
I'm amazed she didn't break your arm.
Try doing that to me and I will.;)

Personal experiences:

Coke - tried once, didn't enjoy it, never bothered again.
Speed - tried once, horrible experience, definitly will never use again.
Dope - just too much hassle to get hold of, can't be arsed these days. When I did smoke it it wasn't to show off or to be seen to smoking. If people know you have some they expect you to share.

Hallucinogenics - tremendous fun but you have to be careful and have a supply you can trust or you're taking a risk. Use occasionally and in moderation, we've all seen brain-fried hippies.

I can see that use of some drugs might help stimulate the creative process by helping people to look at things differently but trying to be creative whilst under the influence is pretty pointless. Being out of your tree results in self indulgence so you might be enormously impressed with your idea for a six hour concept album based on The Silmarillion but everyone else's reaction just might be :rolleyes:
 
A

Anonymous

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Physick said:
Being out of your tree results in self indulgence so you might be enormously impressed with your idea for a six hour concept album based on The Silmarillion but everyone else's reaction just might be :rolleyes:
classic!!!
 
A

Anonymous

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McAvennie said:
In my personal experiences the people I've known who smoke dope - we are generally talking this I assume - have been people doing it for some kind of coolness.
Strangely, it does not surprise me that you don't count too many music lovers amongst your associates.
 

skinny

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Interesting subject. On the rare occasion that I get the opportunity to toke up I usually head out on my own for a few days and get as much distance as I can between myself and other humans and communication devices. Lecture pad and pen do for recording any insights that might happen by. Most times I can't be arsed and just lay back and goon out at the starfield, but from time to time I get ideas for my professional work that I jot down and follow up when I get back to civilisation.

Carl Sagan had a good take on the inspirational value of cannabis. Purportedly he wrote Dragons of Eden while high.

A Huffpost article with links to his 1969 essay on the subject.


Sagan advocates for medical use (Youtube).
 

skinny

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Is there a thread about him on this website? I'm a long time subscriber to Saganity.
 

McAvennie

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Strangely, it does not surprise me that you don't count too many music lovers amongst your associates.
I'm interested to know how Anonymous came to the conclusion I had no musical associates. At the time that was posted I was dating a bassist and spent most of my time at her parents house, heavy caners, who were still involved in the touring scene and had been in bands since the 60s.
 

paladax

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While I do not disagree that some people can abuse drugs I find this can apply to almost anything in life. People can get addicted to the endorphin's one gets from exercise, or the adrenaline one gets from performing risk taking activities.

I wouldn't say any of these things enhances creativity there have been some studies that show beer help enhancing the persons ability to laterally think. While other drugs like coffee/caffeine assistance help stay focused on a task.

Perhaps it is down to person perspective largely and I think it is unfair to say that all people who take drugs are loser wannabe's and wasting their money.
I say, people have free will, and whatever they choose to do with that, is their choice. Assuming they are not harming any other people of course.

There are many theories that psyclobin (magic mushrooms) assists people with depression and other such issues as it fills them with a "spiritual" feeling of wellbeing and happiness even after 1 "trip". However this would not hold true for all people I am sure.
Others would have a "bad trip" and it would mess them up further.

I personally found inspiration for a book one night long ago while toking outside and staring up at the stars. Never finished it mind... but that was even when sober.

I find that a lot of modern lifes "advances" tend to kill off creativity if you get addicted to it. TV, video games, movies, facebook, twitter, smartphones in general etc... the list goes on.

I think that creativity will find a way, if you are that way inclined. Whether or not you are sober or not. Some people being in an altered state of mind may think of a brilliant concept/idea that they might not have had given the same situation, but sober. Sometimes it is just having the time to stop and let your brain have 5 minutes to go off on one. Whereas a sober person would then start thinking of all the jobs they had to do.

Of course all of this is just my opinion. And may only ever hold true for me within the confines of my own little reality..... and I write all this while on my lunchbreak and watching tv on my smartphone next to me. :p
 

GingerTabby

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^^My late parents would have agreed. Both were life-long early risers. My father used to say the best time to see the world around you was early in the morning before some idiot had the opportunity to come along and ruin it.
 

skinny

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While I do not disagree that some people can abuse drugs I find this can apply to almost anything in life. People can get addicted to the endorphin's one gets from exercise, or the adrenaline one gets from performing risk taking activities.

I wouldn't say any of these things enhances creativity there have been some studies that show beer help enhancing the persons ability to laterally think. While other drugs like coffee/caffeine assistance help stay focused on a task.

Perhaps it is down to person perspective largely and I think it is unfair to say that all people who take drugs are loser wannabe's and wasting their money.
I say, people have free will, and whatever they choose to do with that, is their choice. Assuming they are not harming any other people of course.

There are many theories that psyclobin (magic mushrooms) assists people with depression and other such issues as it fills them with a "spiritual" feeling of wellbeing and happiness even after 1 "trip". However this would not hold true for all people I am sure.
Others would have a "bad trip" and it would mess them up further.

I personally found inspiration for a book one night long ago while toking outside and staring up at the stars. Never finished it mind... but that was even when sober.

I find that a lot of modern lifes "advances" tend to kill off creativity if you get addicted to it. TV, video games, movies, facebook, twitter, smartphones in general etc... the list goes on.

I think that creativity will find a way, if you are that way inclined. Whether or not you are sober or not. Some people being in an altered state of mind may think of a brilliant concept/idea that they might not have had given the same situation, but sober. Sometimes it is just having the time to stop and let your brain have 5 minutes to go off on one. Whereas a sober person would then start thinking of all the jobs they had to do.

Of course all of this is just my opinion. And may only ever hold true for me within the confines of my own little reality..... and I write all this while on my lunchbreak and watching tv on my smartphone next to me. :p
Nice post. Welcome to the board.
 

skinny

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^^My late parents would have agreed. Both were life-long early risers. My father used to say the best time to see the world around you was early in the morning before some idiot had the opportunity to come along and ruin it.
Or wait until midnight when you can reflect and then put it all behind you and move onto a productive night's work. I find darkness can be relaxing and mentally stimulating too. Lots of people do. I wrote virtually all of my university assignments during the hours between 10pm and 8 in the morning. Have had to adjust my nocturnal habits these days with little people demanding my attention at dawn's crack. I do like a brisk morning walk.

4:20 ~ "gives you a whole new way of looking at the day".
 

Mungoman

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My first incidence of drug consumption was when I was eighteen, which was out of curiosity, and which allowed me a different reality of myself and the world for a number of hours. I enjoyed that effect and also the humour that I experienced.

I found that work and drugs didn't mix, so I relegated them to Friday evenings, allowing me twenty four hours to fit back into the worlds reality.

I loved reading, music, nature, in fact anything sensory that I could enhance to a different reality from it's prior existence.

I stopped taking any and all psychotropics after three or four years because that reality seemed a bit stagnant, i.e., it was becoming the same old thing each time.

To a degree, it enhanced for a time what my perceptions were of the world and it allowed me a different insight, which I could appreciate, and still do. I also saw a number of casualties, which was an insight in it's self.

Now, I settle for a nice red after a meal - that'll do me.
 

skinny

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My first incidence of drug consumption was when I was eighteen, which was out of curiosity, and which allowed me a different reality of myself and the world for a number of hours. I enjoyed that effect and also the humour that I experienced.

I found that work and drugs didn't mix, so I relegated them to Friday evenings, allowing me twenty four hours to fit back into the worlds reality.

I loved reading, music, nature, in fact anything sensory that I could enhance to a different reality from it's prior existence.

I stopped taking any and all psychotropics after three or four years because that reality seemed a bit stagnant, i.e., it was becoming the same old thing each time.

To a degree, it enhanced for a time what my perceptions were of the world and it allowed me a different insight, which I could appreciate, and still do. I also saw a number of casualties, which was an insight in it's self.

Now, I settle for a nice red after a meal - that'll do me.
Yes, the cautionary tales were being told all around me at the same age, and I got to meet some very off the wall characters in all sorts of 'communities' during those years. Interesting how many of my old tokebuddies have turned out. People you would've thought to have descended into hell by their dumb behaviour at the time found their way clear to great success in life in terms of productivity and social success. Not me, mind you. But many did.

We must do Friday some time, MM. ;)
 
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