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Erdstall Tunnels

OneWingedBird

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Apologies if we have a thread on this already, nothing is searching up for 'Erdstall' - I hadn't heard of these before.

Seems like when an archeologist doesn't know what something was for they always pin it on 'ritual'. :rofl:

These unexplained passages number in the thousands, and are located in a mix of European countries.

There are around 2,000 known erdstall tunnels throughout Europe, with the highest concentrations in Bavaria (some 700), and Austria (another 500). They have also been found in France and Great Britain. Researchers are at a loss as to their origins and uses.


There are countless earthen tunnel systems around the world, but a few features distinguish erdstall tunnels. The term “erdstall” is German, loosely translating to “earth stable” or “mining tunnel.” The label has come to be associated with a very specific variety of human-made subterranean passages. Generally speaking, an erdstall system is made up of narrow tunnels that have been carved into a smooth, ovular shape, aligned either vertically or horizontally. The passages tend to be notably tight, measuring only a few feet tall by a few feet wide. Some of the discovered erdstall tunnels contain crude structures in their terminus that could have been benches, although who would have wanted to sit there in the dark is unknown.

Another aspect of the tunnels are choke points called “schlupfs” or “slip outs.” These uncomfortably tight holes would act as transition points between portions of the passages dug at a higher or lower elevation, requiring anyone passing through to contort and squeeze their way by. Erdstall tunnels are also notable for having only one point of entry and exit, usually tucked away in the footprints of old settlements, or even hidden in the wilderness. This feature made the air flow through the tunnels nearly non-existent.

Atlas Obscura

These things scare me, do not like tight closed spaces like that, can imagine a bit too well getting stuck in one of these.
 
Perhaps change the title's spelling to 'Tunnels' to make future searching easier?

Edit: Yith - done.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
...nothing is searching up for 'Erdstal

No great surprise - the search function here is next to useless.


Nice little article thanks - and yeah, I wouldn't much care to be in them! Not a fan of small spaces.
 
I've run across mention of the erdstall tunnels over the years, but I can't say I've ever found much info about them other than they exhibit similar features and are surprisingly numerous.

IMHO the biggest problem in evaluating the phenomenon is convincing oneself they actually represent uniformly-executed and widespread artifice, as opposed to just being numerous examples of seemingly / misleadingly similar 'digs'.

To the (very limited) extent materials have been found within them that can be carbon-dated, the results don't match up with the timeframes associated with the great European plagues. A mania for rural hiding places might have linked the erdstalls with some widespread historical event, but the evidence doesn't seem to point to plague as the motivating factor. Another anti-plague factor is that the geographic range of the erdstalls doesn't correlate with areas hardest hit by the historical plagues.

The relative paucity of materials found within the erdstalls is surprising in and of itself. Some summary accounts note the tunnels are notably 'clean', as if they were deliberately well-maintained or cleared after usage.

The small interior dimensions - especially with respect to the bottleneck transition points widely cited for the erdstalls - makes me wonder whether they weren't intended for people to use, but were instead intended as holding pens for animals / livestock.

It's always seemed to me the erdstalls are too numerous / ubiquitous to have served as significant ritual sites, and they must have had some more prosaic / practical purpose.
 
IMHO the biggest problem in evaluating the phenomenon is convincing oneself they actually represent uniformly-executed and widespread artifice...

I'd never heard of them before but yes- this was my first thought.
 
The small interior dimensions - especially with respect to the bottleneck transition points widely cited for the erdstalls - makes me wonder whether they weren't intended for people to use, but were instead intended as holding pens for animals / livestock.

It's always seemed to me the erdstalls are too numerous / ubiquitous to have served as significant ritual sites, and they must have had some more prosaic / practical purpose.

It's as good a theory as any (I don't particularly have one) but I can't imagine why they'd put in human sized seating areas or vertical joins between passages that you have to stand up to get through if they were for animals.
 
It's as good a theory as any (I don't particularly have one) but I can't imagine why they'd put in human sized seating areas or vertical joins between passages that you have to stand up to get through if they were for animals.

All descriptions I've ever seen of the choke points / bottlenecks ('schlupfs') indicate they were consistently aligned for vertical transitions. This has always made me wonder whether they were a clue to something relating to a fluid or vapor level within the tunnel(s).

For example ... If water were readily available, flooding lower areas of the tunnels could effectively seal off the higher areas. The problem with this (as a general explanation) lies in the fact many of the erdstall segments get progressively deeper as one moves away from the entrance.* For such cases, flooding would only yield a markedly inconvenient cistern.

*NOTE: It's never been clear to me whether there's any preferred, much less dominant, pattern of elevation change (upward versus downward) in transiting the schlupfs as one moves deeper within the tunnel(s). Some get progressively lower, whereas some have both up-schlupfs and down-schlupfs (in series, moving away from the entrance). I've never seen a depiction indicating a consistent upward trend. Then again, only a few of the erdstalls have ever been rendered in a 3D style.

In a similar vein ... The single entrance and poor ventilation motif wouldn't be so weird if the tunnels were used for smoking meats (whatever ... ). Carry in the goods, arrange them, build and tend a smoldering fire back toward the entrance, and wait ... However, I've not seen consistent reference to (e.g.) evidence of fires or smoke residues like one would expect if this were the case.

The vertically-transitioning bottlenecks could have served as crude but effective portals to block animal movements. Some animals won't willingly try to venture down a vertical hole. It would only take a single modest wood post / chunk inserted into the vertically-oriented hole to effectively lock down any animals on the other side.

The pictures I've seen of the alleged 'seating areas' are consistent with seating having been the builders' intention, but I've not seen any example that couldn't be interpreted as serving some other purpose (e.g., bases for cross-timbers supporting a horizontal shelf or platform).

As I mentioned earlier, I'm still uncertain whether all the erdstall tunnels really represent a single phenomenon in the first place.
 
No great surprise - the search function here is next to useless.
Well...to some extent. It has it's uses.

There is, of course, an extremely-effective alternative mechanism available, which I presume you do all know about?
 
I don't think it's ever worked for me!
No, it has the capability of being able to work, and can do usefully (eg searches for all entries made by a specific member) but I tend to find that an outsource approach seems to work well.

1. Go to the main Google seach page https://www.google.co.uk

2. Type into the seach-entry field (for example)
bunyip -nessie
site:forum.forteantimes.com

3. This results in a rapid reliable search, limited just to within the specific source that is the FTMB forum, returning all results that include reference to the word "bunyip", but excluding all references to the word "nessie"

This type of approach is remarkably-effective. If you haven't tried it, try it, and be surprised.

It relies upon Google's merciless indexing and retentiveness, coupled with it's (propriatory and supra-patentable) search algorithms.


 

This type of approach is remarkably-effective. If you haven't tried it, try it, and be surprised.
And then see how many adverts you get for Bunyip-related products! :twisted:

Google is evil!!!
 
No, it has the capability of being able to work, and can do usefully (eg searches for all entries made by a specific member) but I tend to find that an outsource approach seems to work well.

1. Go to the main Google seach page https://www.google.co.uk

2. Type into the seach-entry field (for example)
bunyip -nessie
site:forum.forteantimes.com

3. This results in a rapid reliable search, limited just to within the specific source that is the FTMB forum, returning all results that include reference to the word "bunyip", but excluding all references to the word "nessie"

This type of approach is remarkably-effective. If you haven't tried it, try it, and be surprised.

It relies upon Google's merciless indexing and retentiveness, coupled with it's (propriatory and supra-patentable) search algorithms.


Hmm...that's a bit of graft...I just don't bother searching...
 
And then see how many adverts you get for Bunyip-related products! :twisted:

Google is evil!!!

Ok @rynner2 ....

Here is a totally non-tracking / personally-untracing alternative procedure

1. Go to the main DuckDuckGo* seach page https://duckduckgo.com/


2. Type into the seach-entry field (for example)
bunyip -nessie
site:forum.forteantimes.com

3. This results in a fairly-rapid reliable search, limited just to within the specific source that is the FTMB forum, returning all results that include reference to the word "bunyip", but excluding all references to the word "nessie"


*
DuckDuckGo, the search engine that doesn't track you.

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Advertising networks have hidden trackers on most internet sites. Google alone has trackers on 75% of the top million sites! Unless you prevent it, you're being tracked on all these sites. Then, your profile is made available for advertisers to bid on, allowing them to target you with their ads wherever you go.

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In a similar vein ... The single entrance and poor ventilation motif wouldn't be so weird if the tunnels were used for smoking meats (whatever ... ). Carry in the goods, arrange them, build and tend a smoldering fire back toward the entrance, and wait ... However, I've not seen consistent reference to (e.g.) evidence of fires or smoke residues like one would expect if this were the case.

If not for smoking meat then how about for ageing cheeses? Cave-aged cheese is somewhat of a niche product today ( or rather, a more expensive version ) but perhaps back when these tunnels were created it was the only way they made it.
Having only one small entrance would make the entire cheese store easy to protect from thieves and scavenging animals.
 
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