Francis Hotel, Bath

Paul_Exeter said:
The hoaxes are now becoming so plausible will we be able to tell what is genuine in the future? I think this will become an increasing problem for Forteans. That said, can ghosts be captured on camera? There are very few photographs or video clips I can think of that defy explanation (although that Eeworth Pond woman needs explaining).
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Whenever I see a photo or film clip purporting to be a ghost, the first question I always ask is 'why were they recording?' If it's security footage or doorbell footage then there's an obvious answer, but then, why look at it? What made them check over the footage - security cameras are rarely monitored and doorbell footage is only looked at if there's a reason. If it's a camera that's just pointing in some random direction, why? Why is it even there?
 
catseye said:
Whenever I see a photo or film clip purporting to be a ghost, the first question I always ask is 'why were they recording?' If it's security footage or doorbell footage then there's an obvious answer, but then, why look at it? What made them check over the footage - security cameras are rarely monitored and doorbell footage is only looked at if there's a reason. If it's a camera that's just pointing in some random direction, why? Why is it even there?
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True, and that often occurs to me. However sometimes when the problem seems to be poltergeist type activity, it would make sense to set up cameras in empty rooms, especially if you have noticed things being rearranged during your absence or overnight and you want to find out what's causing it.

Obviously there are some cases where a home security system has sent an alert to the home owner to let them know that movement has been detected, so presumably that is why they have checked the recording.

It does make you wonder how many things get seen by security cameras but never get noticed because the footage is never checked.

Slightly more puzzling to me are the occasions where people have posted something they have filmed on their phone while they are experiencing something creepy and the phone camera is filming their own face as they are reacting rather than capturing their environment. It's as if they want to show people how scared they are instead of possibly capturing the 'ghost' on camera.
 
CharmerKamelion said:
True, and that often occurs to me. However sometimes when the problem seems to be poltergeist type activity, it would make sense to set up cameras in empty rooms, especially if you have noticed things being rearranged during your absence or overnight and you want to find out what's causing it.

Obviously there are some cases where a home security system has sent an alert to the home owner to let them know that movement has been detected, so presumably that is why they have checked the recording.

It does make you wonder how many things get seen by security cameras but never get noticed because the footage is never checked.

Slightly more puzzling to me are the occasions where people have posted something they have filmed on their phone while they are experiencing something creepy and the phone camera is filming their own face as they are reacting rather than capturing their environment. It's as if they want to show people how scared they are instead of possibly capturing the 'ghost' on camera.
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Thank The Blair Witch Project ...


blair.jpg
 
CharmerKamelion said:
True, and that often occurs to me. However sometimes when the problem seems to be poltergeist type activity, it would make sense to set up cameras in empty rooms, especially if you have noticed things being rearranged during your absence or overnight and you want to find out what's causing it.

Obviously there are some cases where a home security system has sent an alert to the home owner to let them know that movement has been detected, so presumably that is why they have checked the recording.

It does make you wonder how many things get seen by security cameras but never get noticed because the footage is never checked.

Slightly more puzzling to me are the occasions where people have posted something they have filmed on their phone while they are experiencing something creepy and the phone camera is filming their own face as they are reacting rather than capturing their environment. It's as if they want to show people how scared they are instead of possibly capturing the 'ghost' on camera.
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I always used the 'why are they filming' criterion to tell which clips on those 'funny film clips' programmes were genuine. Filming your child on the swings and they do something funny - not suspicious. Filming a random stretch of river and someone 'amusingly' falls in - set up.
 
Was thinking about that screaming hotel ghost hoax footage whilst on the train today (rather nice sunny Winter's day journey from deepest Cornwall to Exeter and back). Kudos to the production quality and he had a lot of people fooled/wanting to believe. But he was also well and truly called out in the comments and only the most ardent believers could refute the evidence it was hoaxed. So, as already stated, the job of an investigative Fortean is only going to get more difficult as AI gets ever better.

However, what also struck me is the creator sticking to his guns and arguing that it is genuine. You have to ask why? It has already had millions of views and the average YouTube user won't give a t* ss if it is genuine or not, it will be all about the thrill and the parallels with fiction e.g the Paranormal Activity movies thus and it will continue to rack up even more views...

Rather reminded me of that Sheffield schoolboy and his photo of a "fleet of UFOs":

"It was a grey Sunday morning in March and the trio were fooling around in a field near the British Oak pub five miles from Sheffield City Centre. Today the pub is surrounded not by trees but by modern housing developments. In unannily similar circumstances to those described by Stephen Darbishire, Alex was taking experimental pictures with his new camera - snaps of a dog, of Stuart jumping into the air, of a stone being thrown and then, lo and behold... a formation of flying saucers! Five in all, hanging in the air, with dazzling white blobs emerging from their dark saucer-shaped fuselages. “I got my camera up and took a shot of them,” Alex told the Derbyshire Times. “A second or so later they disappeared at terrific speed towards Sheffield.”

The Ufologists of the day embraced his photo as genuine, despite being a pretty obvious fake to 21st Century eyes, and he stuck to his story until he eventually recanted and then recanted his confession and produced a new, 2014 UFO photo, Dr David Clarke has the full story:

https://drdavidclarke.co.uk/secret-files/alex-birch-ufo-photos/

Just felt this was relevant as it helps us see into the mind of our Nemesis: The Hoaxer.
 
Paul_Exeter said:
Just felt this was relevant as it helps us see into the mind of our Nemesis: The Hoaxer.
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Nemesis? Hmm... Perhaps we need to try to understand The Hoaxer? Try to help him come to terms with his need for attention? Help him see the error of his ways and find a better path in life, bringing light instead of darkness, clarity instead of obfuscation. From now on my watchword will be 'Hug a Hoaxer'.
 
CharmerKamelion said:
Nemesis? Hmm... Perhaps we need to try to understand The Hoaxer? Try to help him come to terms with his need for attention? Help him see the error of his ways and find a better path in life, bringing light instead of darkness, clarity instead of obfuscation. From now on my watchword will be 'Hug a Hoaxer'.
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I think the motive is probably money made from several million views. I wonder how much that amounts to.
 
Do they actually make money 'per view' though? Or is it that having lots and lots of views makes you more attractive to advertisers who will pay you to be able to stick adverts in your site? In which case it's not the number of single views per se, it's the people that 'follow' you, who subscribe and like and generally keep coming back to see what you've done.
 
catseye said:
Do they actually make money 'per view' though? Or is it that having lots and lots of views makes you more attractive to advertisers who will pay you to be able to stick adverts in your site? In which case it's not the number of single views per se, it's the people that 'follow' you, who subscribe and like and generally keep coming back to see what you've done.
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Serious money if you have a film budget to find:

view.jpg


https://www.thinkific.com/blog/youtube-money-per-view/

Because of the nature of the video it will be watched all the way through which matters as partial views don't count. He doesn't have channel advertising but he has brought over 12,000,000 views to his site promoting his films.
 
Paul_Exeter said:
Serious money if you have a film budget to find:

View attachment 86212

https://www.thinkific.com/blog/youtube-money-per-view/

Because of the nature of the video it will be watched all the way through which matters as partial views don't count. He doesn't have channel advertising but he has brought over 12,000,000 views to his site promoting his films.
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Thank you! I wondered how it worked. But how do they get paid? Does YouTube pay, or advertisers...YouTube is free to watch, so where is the money coming from? (I'm fascinated by all this).

ETA I googled it and it still seems it's money from advertisers. So do the Tubers get paid directly or do they have to wait for advertisers to cough up?
 
catseye said:
Thank you! I wondered how it worked. But how do they get paid? Does YouTube pay, or advertisers...YouTube is free to watch, so where is the money coming from? (I'm fascinated by all this).

ETA I googled it and it still seems it's money from advertisers. So do the Tubers get paid directly or do they have to wait for advertisers to cough up?
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YouTube pay and even send a trophy when you hit a million subscribers and so on. Even if the video you watch doesn't have adverts it is still driving traffic to YouTube and then people stay and watch content with advertisements. There are 14-year-olds* putting up cooking videos who have millions of subscribers and tens of millions of views which has to beat a paper round...!

You can see why the BBC and independent television channels are worried

*there are strict rules and guidelines in place and an adult has to manage the money etc.
 
Paul_Exeter said:
YouTube pay and even send a trophy when you hit a million subscribers and so on. Even if the video you watch doesn't have adverts it is still driving traffic to YouTube and then people stay and watch content with advertisements. There are 14-year-olds* putting up cooking videos who have millions of subscribers and tens of millions of views which has to beat a paper round...!

You can see why the BBC and independent television channels are worried

*there are strict rules and guidelines in place and an adult has to manage the money etc.
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I have a friend who is a 'tuber and makes loads of money from doing it. I still don't really have much of an idea how it all works. But then, I look hideous in videos and have nothing to say, so I don't expect it's going to impact me in any way. I'm just curious!
 
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