Have We Heard The Warning Bell? An All Electric Future

INT21

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#1
A couple of days ago there was a report that America had been caught installing Trojans on Russian power grid installations.

Not a very friendly act, especially by a country that is trying to use the potential for dodgy software on Chinese communications products to damage that countries economy.

But it does seen a huge coincidence that three South American countries should lose all their power at the same time.

As most are aware, power does not come from one centralised source. There are many power generating stations in each country. The weak point is the grid.

Now, it has not yet been accertained just what caused all the grids in all three countries to fail simultaneously. But it would look like an attack on the grid control is a likely culprit.

Was this a practice run by a country that has installed Trojans ? Possibly to try an attack on some countries that are less likely to respond with extreme force ?

Take this a step further.

In an all electric civilisation, automated cars, internet of things etc, What would happen if ALL the power was turned off ?

How do you cripple an area ? Easy, knock out all the sub-stations and cell phone towers.

INT21.
 

skinny

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#2
FOOOOOOOOSIL FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUELS!!
Think somebody's stockpiling it yet? hm
there was a report that America had been caught installing Trojans on Russian power grid installations.
Was there now?

Where's the report? Is it published like? I couldn't locate a hyperlink in the text. Or was it on the news? Was it on the twitter feed? Got a link?
 

Schrodinger's Zebra

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#3
A couple of days ago there was a report that America had been caught installing Trojans on Russian power grid installations.

Not a very friendly act, especially by a country that is trying to use the potential for dodgy software on Chinese communications products to damage that countries economy.

But it does seen a huge coincidence that three South American countries should lose all their power at the same time.

As most are aware, power does not come from one centralised source. There are many power generating stations in each country. The weak point is the grid.

Now, it has not yet been accertained just what caused all the grids in all three countries to fail simultaneously. But it would look like an attack on the grid control is a likely culprit.

Was this a practice run by a country that has installed Trojans ? Possibly to try an attack on some countries that are less likely to respond with extreme force ?

Take this a step further.

In an all electric civilisation, automated cars, internet of things etc, What would happen if ALL the power was turned off ?

How do you cripple an area ? Easy, knock out all the sub-stations and cell phone towers.

INT21.
The first thing Mr Zebra and I did when we heard about the power cut in South America was come to the same conclusion... "hmm, are they testing out the population's response to a major power cut by trying it out on less developed countries?"

Not that we're cynics or anything. But as you say, there isn't just one power station involved in something like this.

If all the power was turned off, there would be mass panic. Not least, unfortunately, because a lot of people would be unable to access Facebook / Twitter and would therefore be unable to function as human beings.



FOOOOOOOOSIL FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUELS!!
Think somebody's stockpiling it yet?
We are... we've got some coal left over in our bunker from last winter... :D



Where's the report? Is it published like? I couldn't locate a hyperlink in the text. Or was it on the news? Was it on the twitter feed? Got a link?
Seconded... link would be nice, please @INT21
 

EnolaGaia

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#4
To date, it's the Paraguayan power authority who's offered the most detailed account of the failure. They claimed a fault in one of the Argentinian power distribution services' networks triggered a disengagement / shutdown in all the generators at the Yacyretá hydroelectric complex jointly operated by Paraguay and Argentina - the largest single power generation node in Argentina's overall grid-of-grids.
 

INT21

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#6
I first heard it on two of the news channels I watch. CNN was one, I can't remember the other. There are five I visit.

Anyway, I'll give you something to plug into your browsers. It throws up a few reports on the subject.

=possible+american+interference+with+russian+power+grid&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8

You need to put 'https://www.google And '.com/search?q' in front of the =

Sorry to be so obtuse, but this site won't accept it in full. So just cut and paste.

I entered 'possible american interference with russian power grid' into my browser.

INT21.
 

INT21

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#7
Enola Gaia,

Seems feasible.

They clearly need to work on their back up systems.

INT21.
 

Schrodinger's Zebra

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#8
I first heard it on two of the news channels I watch. CNN was one, I can't remember the other. There are five I visit.

Anyway, I'll give you something to plug into your browsers. It throws up a few reports on the subject.

=possible+american+interference+with+russian+power+grid&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8

You need to put 'https://www.google And '.com/search?q' in front of the =

Sorry to be so obtuse, but this site won't accept it in full. So just cut and paste.

I entered 'possible american interference with russian power grid' into my browser.

INT21.

Thanks... I found this link which hopefully works.. https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/15/us/politics/trump-cyber-russia-grid.html



I struggle to function on a daily basis as it is! And that's without using FaceTwit or whatever. :D
 

INT21

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#9
Zebra, thanks for adding the link.

However....

I clicked on it. Halfway through loading the page (New York Times) my screen froze and left me with the message 'loading data from google.tagmanager.com

And it locked at that point.

I had to crash out using the on/off button.

Coming back just now I find my Avast protection system had been disabled.

Creepy.

Which branch of the NSA did you say you worked for ?

INT21 ;)
 

INT21

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#10
Another electric snippet.

I hear that the people who supply California with electric (PG&E ?) are considering turning off the power grid to avoid a repetition of last years fires.

How will California manage without the power ?

INT21.

(Edited for typo)
 
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EnolaGaia

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#11
... I hear that the people who supply California with electric (PG&E ?) are considering turning of the power grid to avoid a repetition of last years fires. ...
They've already begun doing this:

https://www.wsj.com/articles/pg-e-s...-resort-area-to-prevent-wildfires-11560046802

PG&E's biggest problem right now isn't pissing off some thousands of customers on a temporary basis. It's the unanimous conclusion their power lines and the manner in which they operated them caused last year's wave of fires. The estimated scale of PG&E's liabilities is in the billions of dollars.
 

maximus otter

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#12
...it does seen a huge coincidence that three South American countries should lose all their power at the same time.

...it has not yet been accertained just what caused all the grids in all three countries to fail simultaneously.
While the precise cause has yet to be established, the blackout originated at a transmission point between two power stations in the country’s northeast “when the system was getting too much power,” Lopetegui said. A chain of events then caused a total disruption, he said.

[Argentine Energy Secretary] Lopetegui did not rule out the possibility of a cyberattack but said it was unlikely.

Argentine energy experts said that operational and design errors probably played a role and that the system should have isolated the local failure before it cascaded so disastrously.

Juan Balda, a native of Argentina who is head of the electric engineering department at the University of Arkansas, speculated that a short circuit in a transmission line — caused perhaps by a fallen tree limb or lightning — set off a “domino effect,” tripping a series of protective circuits that shut down power plants one after another. A similar chain of events led to a blackout in the U.S. Northeast and Canada in 2003.

While energy officials defended the Argentine power system as “robust,” the grid had been known to be in a state of disrepair, with substations and cables that were insufficiently upgraded as power rates remained largely frozen for years.

https://www.apnews.com/60ecd65067ec43c28c29a412f452b488

maximus otter
 

RaM

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#13
We get more than our fare share of power cuts, a few years back we had one lasting
3 or 5 days cant remember which over Christmas, near bankrupt the local pub as it
was all electric as are many houses round about gas only being connected round
here after most of the place was built, we have gas so spent lots of time boiling water
and such for those that had not, it was interesting that's for sure but it was not like
a total power failure as water and basic phone was ok being powered from outside
the area, I have also been in 2 supermarkets when the power as gone off, they close
the doors to people coming in and ask those inside to have a guess at what the bill
should be and just accept what ever you say, but long term if power goes of I suspect
it will soon end up as mob rule and we are clucked.

According to what we were told if your lights go off then on there as been a fault and the system
as reconnected the power, it will try this 3 times then give up, so 3 flickers and you are out.
 
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#15
Power grids and cyber wars/

Over the past weekend, The New York Times reported that US Cyber Command has penetrated more deeply than ever before into Russian electric utilities, planting malware potentially capable of disrupting the grid, perhaps as a retaliatory measure meant to deter further cyberattacks by the country's hackers. But judging by Russia's response, news of the grid-hacking campaign may have already had the immediate opposite effect: The Kremlin warned that the intrusions could escalate into a cyberwar between the two countries, even as it claimed that Russia's grid was immune from such threats.

https://www.wired.com/story/russia-cyberwar-escalation-power-grid/
 

INT21

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#16
RaM,

Aren't you power cuts usually down to Welsh Nationalists knocking down the pylons ?

INT21 ;)
 

RaM

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#17
Apparently round here it's down to swans that migrate from Russia for the winter flying into
the cables, so the Russians do have a hand in it, but it does not do the bird they had in the hand
much good they don't get to use the same one twice, they come ready cooked and likely
taste like chicken. Which is just as well for the locals as we wont have anything to cook the bugger on.
 

INT21

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#19
Maximus otter,

So probably a cascade effect as experienced in Canada a few year back ?

INT21.
 

Frideswide

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#20
I'm constantly amazed at the way these swans manage to fix the plastic explosives in just the right point on the pylon.

INT21 ;)
they porbably dropped an intact passport at the scene just for good measure! :)
 

RaM

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#21
Small power lines big bird wingspan big enough to bridge earth and a high voltage phase
bang flash cooked bird, tasty if you like your swan well done.
 

INT21

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#22
Shocking !!

Anyway, one aspect that many do not appear to take into consideration (I'm assuming this, don't know for sure) is that what will happen to our tax system when the all electric cars appear ?

At the moment they are tax free. They don't use heavily taxed petrol or Diesel; or even lower taxed LPG.

So the coffers will have to be topped up from some other source of taxation.

All you non driving folks who thought you were sitting pretty will get to share the pain.

I believe it's referred to as 'a level playing field' .

INT21 :)
 

brownmane

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#26
In 2008, southwestern Ontario had a brown-out for about 4 hours. My stove is electric, so I couldn't cook. My neighbours had a gas bbq so they were ok. BUT, they had an electric can opener and I had a manual one. SO, if the electricity was out longer, I did have a bargaining chip.:nelly:

I also always have some cash on me. A million dollars in a bank is worth nothing if your only way of accessing it is with a debit card.
 

Tribble

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#27
Major power failures have been reported across large areas of the UK, affecting homes and transport networks.

National Grid said it was caused by issues with two power generators but the problem was now resolved.

Blackouts were reported across the South East, Midlands, South West, North East and Wales.


https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-49300025

(Do a search for "cyberattack" on Twitter. Quite a few people are blaming Russia for this... but that's for the Conspiracy Theory section)
 

INT21

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#28
Tribble.

A certain country has been found to be trying to instal dodgy software in people's power systems; and it wasn't Russia.
 

INT21

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#30
Maybe these events will demonstrate how easily an electric world can be brought to it's knees.
 
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