Holloman Landing

Human_84

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#1
One of the most prolonged rumors in the UFO world happened in the 1960's where a bonafide alien craft descended upon Hollowman Air Force base while Eisenhower was present and military cameraman on the ready. The president boarded the craft, a friendly meeting took place and a treaty was signed. As the story goes, a few short seconds of this footage was purposefully leaked into a documentary which depicts a craft descending from high altitude.

We have this footage from the story which refuses to die BUT I've never once heard anyone question the glaringly obvious -- the linchpin seems to be the rock formations seen in the background. Forget about Eisenhower and the treaty: these land/rock formations either do, or do not exist in the vicinity of Holloman. My time spent on Google Earth turned up nothing. We have a lot of great minds here on the forum and I'd like to see another rigid analytic, someone like EnolaGaia take a stab at this mystery. If they aren't mountains then perhaps they're on flatter ground and the cameraman is on a mountain?

(scene begins around 25 seconds)

Holloman.png
 

eburacum

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#2
I see a white dot descending, probably a weather or target balloon. No aliens. This is not evidence of Eisenhower meeting aliens at all.

Note that Eisenhower's meetings were supposed to have happened in the fifties, not the sixties, although another non-presidential visit by aliens is supposed to have happened in 1964. By which time the president was LBJ.
 

Human_84

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#3
I see a white dot descending, probably a weather or target balloon. No aliens. This is not evidence of Eisenhower meeting aliens at all.
Not relevant to the question posed. I'm wondering if anyone else can successfully match up the video to the actual land formations in that region to prove whether the footage even took place there.
 

EnolaGaia

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#4
Holloman AFB is surrounded by hills, many of which exhibit elevated ridges or rills as well as recessed arroyos.

The film excerpt in the video is essentially useless for setting the location - most particularly because the ridge line is out of frame.

For there to be any reasonable chance of identifying the location as one of the hills surrounding Holloman, you need to determine the date and time of day when this film was allegedly made. These facts would help by indicating which direction the camera was facing at the time.

Another - possibly better - set of clues might be distilled from the dark lines visible in the far foreground. Holloman's long been used as a test range, and there are all sorts of tracks across the landscape. If the pattern of ground lines in the film could be matched to some old track or earthwork it could facilitate identifying the right place.

I don't see anything in the photos that clearly indicates Holloman is the filming site. I wouldn't be surprised to learn this footage was shot at Edwards.
 

INT21

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#6
Look up the location on Google Earth.

Then search for matching items.
 

Fahrenheit 451

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#7
I'm thinking a Chinese lantern ... descending as the flame burns out. Does one of the experts know if that's consistent with the invention of the Chinese lantern?
 

Zeke Newbold

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#8
As always this whole rumour consists of a dispiritng tangle of vague suggestions and counter-suggestions: a few dates for Eisenhower's contact have been suggested - 1954, 1955 and 1964 - and even something circa 1971, but just involving Air Force personnel. Some argue that all of them happened.

The 54/64 alleged Holloman encounter sounds appropriately absurd. The beings - somewhat uniquely - had big noses and were carrying translators. They signed a pact that was exclusively with the U.S of A - and not `the Earth` in general - don't you know. Their craft was malfunctioning but - luckily - they managed to get it repaired at the airbase!

Nicer looking Nordics had been involved at an earlier time... Yadayadyada.

The video could show lots of things, of course. The still pictures are more interesting - as they either show what they appear to show, or are an outright hoax. Does anyone know anything of their provenance?

And, by the by, does anyone recall a photo (doing the rounds in UFO books in the 70's) of an American president (Eisenhower? Roosevelt? Johnson?) with two other men - carrying an alleged alien corpse between them. It looked rather like some sort of long limbed monkey. I have not seen this picture for a long long time - decades. It seems to have vanished, like the Thunderbird-in-a-barn picture.

Meanwhile this piece on Robert Emenegger (author: `UFOs Past, Present and Future` which was responsible for publicising the Holloman claim) seems to suggest that these rumours were being activley encouraged bty the powers-that-be at the time - as a psychops...or to be more optimistic (and generous) to soften the public up for First contact.

https://mysteriousuniverse.org/2019...ve-hollywood-footage-of-a-real-alien-landing/

I'm thinking a Chinese lantern ... descending as the flame burns out. Does one of the experts know if that's consistent with the invention of the Chinese lantern?
Sarcasm is the lowest form of wit, sir.
 

eburacum

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#9
Chinese lanterns have been around for hundreds of years- in China. In the West, they started becoming popular in the 90s.

If the film dates to the fifties or sixties, it is more likely to be a balloon than a lantern. I suspect it was a large military or meteorological balloon of the same kind that was filmed at Edwards AFB by colleagues of Gordon Cooper, and which may have been misidentified by the cameraman as a craft under conscious control. If it was actually filmed at Holloman, this may have acted as the core of a mythology that eventually included Eisenhower and a group of aliens arriving in 1964 for a brief holiday in New Mexico.

The Holloman story didn't appear until 1973, and it may be that this film was made much later than 64.
 

eburacum

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#10
And, by the by, does anyone recall a photo (doing the rounds in UFO books in the 70's) of an American president (Eisenhower? Roosevelt? Johnson?) with two other men - carrying an alleged alien corpse between them. It looked rather like some sort of long limbed monkey. I have not seen this picture for a long long time - decades. It seems to have vanished, like the Thunderbird-in-a-barn picture.

This one? There's no reason at all to think the people in this image are Eisenhower or Roosevelt; in fact Roosevelt probably couldn't stand like that.
 

Fahrenheit 451

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#11
As always this whole rumour consists of a dispiritng tangle of vague suggestions and counter-suggestions: a few dates for Eisenhower's contact have been suggested - 1954, 1955 and 1964 - and even something circa 1971, but just involving Air Force personnel. Some argue that all of them happened.

The 54/64 alleged Holloman encounter sounds appropriately absurd. The beings - somewhat uniquely - had big noses and were carrying translators. They signed a pact that was exclusively with the U.S of A - and not `the Earth` in general - don't you know. Their craft was malfunctioning but - luckily - they managed to get it repaired at the airbase!

Nicer looking Nordics had been involved at an earlier time... Yadayadyada.

The video could show lots of things, of course. The still pictures are more interesting - as they either show what they appear to show, or are an outright hoax. Does anyone know anything of their provenance?

And, by the by, does anyone recall a photo (doing the rounds in UFO books in the 70's) of an American president (Eisenhower? Roosevelt? Johnson?) with two other men - carrying an alleged alien corpse between them. It looked rather like some sort of long limbed monkey. I have not seen this picture for a long long time - decades. It seems to have vanished, like the Thunderbird-in-a-barn picture.

Meanwhile this piece on Robert Emenegger (author: `UFOs Past, Present and Future` which was responsible for publicising the Holloman claim) seems to suggest that these rumours were being activley encouraged bty the powers-that-be at the time - as a psychops...or to be more optimistic (and generous) to soften the public up for First contact.

https://mysteriousuniverse.org/2019...ve-hollywood-footage-of-a-real-alien-landing/



Sarcasm is the lowest form of wit, sir.
 

Fahrenheit 451

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#12
Lantern or weather balloon does still appear more likely to me (in this case) - whether you consider that a low form of wit (or not). The chances of this being an actual embassy of aliens in a flying saucer looks close to zero - let's be honest.
 

Human_84

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#13
Thank you all for your comments.

Good news and bad. The good news: I (probably) solved the mystery. The bad: I essentially burned an entire Sunday searching skylines from air force bases around the entire southwest. Here we go.

THE MODERN DAY BACKGROUND IMAGE:
My main screen capture below was snipped from Google Earth near ground level around these coordinates 32.853011, -106.081240 above the eastern tip of Holloman's 07/25 runway (the longest East-West runway on google maps). Runway numbers are indicated on this 'AIRFIELD OPERATIONS AND BASE FLYING PROCEDURES' PDF.

THE 1960's VIDEO:
I screen grabbed the clearest frame from the highest quality version of the 1960's video that I could find, and then laid this image on top of a my present day Google Earth screen capture until it became apparent the cameraman was using a lens with approximately 10x optical zoom -- the reason why it took me so long to line up the imagery.

Holloman full frame 2-2.jpg

Animated GIF showing the blue-tinged 1960's Holloman footage in the center.
Holloman-moving-gif-2_2.gif

IMPORTANT NOTES:
  • The Google Earth viewing angle can't be aligned perfectly due to poor footage quality being used as the only reference.
  • The original footage time of day was probably a few hours earlier than the Google Earth imagery, resulting in lighter/altered shadows.
  • The original footage frame is at 100% opacity for an entire second in the GIF image. There's no blending trickery.
  • The "craft" can be seen in the lower middle portion of the frame.

SUMMARY:
The footage WAS, in my opinion, unquestionably shot from Holloman air force base. To be clear and for purposes of this thread I'm not suggesting that the event took place as described above, but only that the footage in question was indeed shot here.
 

Zeke Newbold

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#15
Thank you all for your comments.

Good news and bad. The good news: I (probably) solved the mystery. The bad: I essentially burned an entire Sunday searching skylines from air force bases around the entire southwest. Here we go.

THE MODERN DAY BACKGROUND IMAGE:
My main screen capture below was snipped from Google Earth near ground level around these coordinates 32.853011, -106.081240 above the eastern tip of Holloman's 07/25 runway (the longest East-West runway on google maps). Runway numbers are indicated on this 'AIRFIELD OPERATIONS AND BASE FLYING PROCEDURES' PDF.
.
Great work Human! And don't worry about your Sunday. I mean it's a Sunday isn't it! What were you going to do? Help Auntie Dierdre choose a new sweater at a local jumble sale? Watch repeats of `Mrs Brown's Boys` on Netflix?

Know that your efforts are appreciated. We can't pay you - but you'll have a place in Ufological Valhalla when you die.

Meanwhile someone needs to do some equivalent detective work on the image itself. It appears (`appears` - Ebaracum!) self-luminous, which rules out a lot of things. I'm fairly sure that Chuese lanterns were'nt in recreational use in the America of the fifties and sixties (otherwise they would have taken their place in the Blue Book roster of easy explanantions - alongside swamp gas, etc).

Just to be sure: I don't give much credence to the Eisenhower-pressing-palms-with-benevolent-star -people back story - but this just may be a `no-smoke-without-fire` scenario.
 

EnolaGaia

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#16

This one? There's no reason at all to think the people in this image are Eisenhower or Roosevelt; in fact Roosevelt probably couldn't stand like that.
If I'm not mistaken, that photo has been most widely cited as dating from the 1930's or 1940's, and the two guys in trench coats are allegedly Nazi German operatives.
 

eburacum

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#17
A white weather balloon would look 'self luminous' in contrast with the darker mountains.
 

eburacum

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#18
If I'm not mistaken, that photo has been most widely cited as dating from the 1930's or 1940's, and the two guys in trench coats are allegedly Nazi German operatives.
It looks like a fairly poor example of photomanipulation, to me. But it certainly has been around for a long time- at least the 70s.
 

GNC

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#19
And the "alien" is a grafted on photo of a circus performer, I remember reading?
 

EnolaGaia

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#20
It looks like a fairly poor example of photomanipulation, to me. But it certainly has been around for a long time- at least the 70s.
Here's the most detailed summary I've found on the origin of the 'Silver Alien' photo.

http://forgetomori.com/tag/aliens/page/3/

It apparently originated in a Cologne newspaper in 1950. The men holding its hands have been variously claimed to be associated with Mexican police, the SS, the FBI, and the KGB.
 

Fahrenheit 451

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#21
Mystery posed and solved - how nice! And all why I had a nice lunch with Belgian beer . So the location is perhaps bona fide - but the footage doesn't seem to be - is that the consensus?

Neither of which has direct bearing on the reality of a Presidential contact that may or may not have happened. But this myth is now deep rooted it seems.

It's very hard to see current Presidents being allowed or trusted with such a role.
 

EnolaGaia

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#22
... So the location is perhaps bona fide - but the footage doesn't seem to be - is that the consensus? ...
Having done some geo-rummaging myself, I don't think the location has been established yet.

Human_84's contemporary photo image is definitely the eastward end of runway 25.

I'm not convinced the hillside area he highlighted is the same as the background to either of the video segments. More specifically, I can't correlate the distinct rill / arroyo or foreground features in the videos with either the vista from runway 25's end nor features gleaned from satellite / aerial photos.
 

EnolaGaia

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#23
There are a couple of other points I'd like to mention in this context ...

From the 1940's onward Holloman was an R&D center. They performed a lot of testing for (e.g.) missiles, aircraft, and munitions. I'd also point out that Holloman was the testing and launching site for the late 1950's Project Excelsior high altitude balloon flights.

I wouldn't be surprised to learn the mystery descending object represents a test object down range.

Another problem I'm having is maintaining confidence that the grainy original video was shot from ground level. The more I look at it the more it seems to have been filmed from an elevated or aerial position.

Another aside ... Close examination of the descending bright dot seems to indicate the bright dot has barely visible horizontal extensions - e.g., wings on a conventional aircraft. I also note the odd way it drops suddenly at first, then stabilizes its altitude.

Both these characteristics match the July 1950 sighting at Holloman described, photographed, and illustrated by the witness at:

http://www.project1947.com/folio/apro_holloman.htm
http://www.project1947.com/folio/holloman_ufo.htm

This makes me wonder if the video represents the latter photographs / film taken in that July 1950 incident (well before Eisenhower became president).

Furthermore ... Contrary to what some ufologists claim, the July 1950 and multiple other sightings at Holloman from 1947 - 1953 were included in the Project Blue Book listings.
 

Fahrenheit 451

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#24
Given the number of high ranking Nazi's that joined the USA - perhaps the Presidential contact was in effect a continuation of the supposed German links with Aliens, their technology and the Nazi's more esoteric research?

We look at everything through a modern lens but 1945 wasn't that far away and the use of Atomic weapons and their testing, must have heightened external interest.
 

EnolaGaia

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#25
Given the number of high ranking Nazi's that joined the USA - perhaps the Presidential contact was in effect a continuation of the supposed German links with Aliens, their technology and the Nazi's more esoteric research? ...
One would have to establish presidential contact first, and it's pretty apparent the alleged involvement with Eisenhower doesn't match up with likely events. The majority of the 1947 - 1953 Holloman sightings were before he became president, and the commonly cited meeting date of 1964 was years after he'd left office.
 

Human_84

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#27
Having done some geo-rummaging myself, I don't think the location has been established yet.
I think it will become more apparent when viewing the animated GIF at full screen. Try saving it then zooming in, or holding control+mouse-wheel-up if on google chrome. I've done another animated GIF image for a second angle which is coming soon, so please view this new one at full screen too. Pick any single feature in the modern day image and then notice how the video frame contains that same feature in the same location.


Another problem I'm having is maintaining confidence that the grainy original video was shot from ground level. The more I look at it the more it seems to have been filmed from an elevated or aerial position.
Excellent point and it turns out you may be right according to the context given on this video:
 

Human_84

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#28
Not the greatest Holloman landing smoking gun, but you may find it interesting. I'm offering the possibility that one of the three camera angles was shot from this location, but this is merely an after thought and of little importance.

shrubbery in foreground.jpg

In the image below, I've inserted a white horizontal plane 1250 meters above sea level (just above the runway) to highlight the small rise in elevation.
Holloman full frame 2 new angle.jpg
 
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Human_84

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#29
One last animated GIF which I now believe was shot from a helicopter closer to the present day southern outskirts of Alamogordo.

Present day Google Earth imagery:
Hollowman full frame 3.jpg

Animated GIF showing the blue-tinged 1960's Holloman footage in the center. This appears to be another camera angle. Note that the lower portions of the blue-tinged frame do not line up as well as the top portions due to the lens' focal length on the original footage verses Google Earth's inability to zoom; but I'm still certain it's the right place.
Holloman-moving-gif-2.gif
 
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