If All Doubt Were Gone...

SkepticalX

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I'm thinking back on how many times I've seen this question asked on UFO forums of one type or another in the last 20 years. (Dr. Wu - seems like Carol Nistri used to ask it at least once a month :) ).

It's hard to know how exactly I would feel. My feeling is that, even if the aliens came in peace, they couldn't help but cause significant upheaval. A lot of human endeavors would be rendered obsolete overnight if someone suddenly showed up with all the answers. It might solve a lot of our problems but it would likely also be demoralizing.
 

dr wu

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^Carol Nistri...now that's a name I haven't heard in a long time..a long time.
;)
 

KerryDF

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The more I think about it, the more Kenneth Arnold's UFO account seems a remarkably good match for an aircraft like the Grumman B-2.

"flat like a pie pan", "shaped like a pie plate", "half-moon shaped, oval in front and convex in the rear", "something like a pie plate that was cut in half with a sort of a convex triangle in the rear"

View attachment 23220

Arnold died several years before the B2 was launched, but his Wiki page does state that he admitted that his sighting bore some resemblance to "flying wing" type aircraft. That would still be highly anomalous for a 1947 encounter though!
Not too anomalous, the Northrop XB-35 was already flying by then and who knows what classified projects were around at the same time.
 

feinman

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I don't know if these things even have biological bodies anymore --or what type of life or existence they have.. Or where they are coming from.
 

kamalktk

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either by government disclosure or one of these things exposing itself to the full glare of the world's media
I wouldn't be worried if that's how it happened. I expect any aliens capable of getting here would be able to wipe us right out as soon as they arrived if they felt like it, and the fact they were here but hadn't wiped us off the planet would mean they didn't intend to.

Our telescopes seeing a giant mothership approaching would be a different matter.
 

eburacum

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I expect any aliens capable of getting here would be able to wipe us right out as soon as they arrived if they felt like it, and the fact they were here but hadn't wiped us off the planet would mean they didn't intend to.
That is exactly what worries me. If the Extraterrestrial hypothesis is true (it isn't), they have been here for at least seventy-three years, and they have been allowing themselves to be seen intermittently all that time. That is like someone coming into your house, and occasionally peeking out from behind a cupboard. Sure they are aliens, but that is a fucking weird thing to do.
 

feinman

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Fish say: "what is that weird camera looking at us?" "Why don't they stay down here and talk about fish stuff with us?" There were a number of landings in the 19th century and in the '40s. Civilians have been shooting at them for a long time; I suspect the militaries have too. Watch the crazy Simians from a distance.
 

marhawkman

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I believe that if space aliens wanted to wipe out the human race they would not attack us as we expect but maybe engineer a virus and do it that way (only joking). If there is intelligent life out there then I'm sure they would have rules about contacting primitive species in order not to scare them or change their progress, until they have been educated through sci fi films and books. Just a thought.
This is one of the weird things. What do we know about intelligent life outside Earth? We don't have any verifiable facts.

Sure there's thousands of testimonies, but they're not verifiable facts. Thus the majority of the question is unanswerable. The nature of first contact with aliens will determine how people react. We don't know that.

Will they come to Earth and just eat everyone? Elachi in Star Trek Online reproduce by taking living humanoids and infecting them with Elachi fungus which consumes the infected person. I made a picture:
Will they be a race of angels who want peace and companionship(and will encourage everyone to worship their god)?

Will it be like Battle: Los Angeles(where the aliens are basically here to strip-mine Earth and don't really care about Humans at all)?

Will it be like Earth: Final Conflict(where the aliens do care about Humans, but ask nicely for us to be their servants)?

That would drastically alter the perception people have of the event, and change how they behave in response.
 

feinman

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Visitations from a more advanced intelligent agency may not produce the kinds of "verifiable" facts some (who haven't had an experience with them) might want; if they were a natural phenomenon not under intelligent control, then we could et those "facts" in time, as with ball lightning, etc. They've been repeatedly on radar and other systems, while seen visually, have a program of obvious surveillancr, and have been seen by many thousands, sometimes during mass sightings. They've even flown over the Capitol repeatedly. Those are facts.
 

marhawkman

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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1952_Washington,_D.C._UFO_incident

There are interviews with pilots who saw them and radar operators; they say they were real objects.
Why would Truman discuss UFOs at "every conference" with the military if they were weather balloons or test craft..
The key question is usually not "did you see something?" but more often "what did you see?"

There's a famous account which apparently really was a bunch of US servicemen freaking out about a weather balloon and unloading at it.
 

feinman

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The key question is usually not "did you see something?" but more often "what did you see?"

There's a famous account which apparently really was a bunch of US servicemen freaking out about a weather balloon and unloading at it.
Sure that happens, but all kinds of real stuff happens too.
 

INT21

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(where the aliens are basically here to strip-mine Earth and don't really care about Humans at all)?

.
So, pretty much like many large corporations.
 

michael59

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I haven't been smoking anything I promise but a stupid thought just occurred to me (as they are want to do).

What if nearly all paranormal events are just "time slipping" - as in, there could be a fundamental flaw or adverse side effect of the universe which sometimes causes time to overlap and bleed through. How many different supernatural or paranormal experiences/subjects, thought to be subjects in their own right, could be caused by such a flaw:

Deja vu, Clairvoyance
Time slips/Glitches in the matrix/Dimensional slips (obviously)
Bigfoot (seeing early hominids)
UFO's (seeing vehicles from the future)
Ghosts (People from the past or future)


i know I'm clutching at straws but the idea amused me - instead of having a raft of "paranormal" things, what if they were all just demonstrations of one thing which we are becomging increasingly aware of. Maybe the paranormal things are the symptoms and the time slipping universe is the actual illness.
You're not alone with those thoughts. I also have a feeling that Shadow people are ET/alternate dimension related.
 

michael59

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That is exactly what worries me. If the Extraterrestrial hypothesis is true (it isn't), they have been here for at least seventy-three years, and they have been allowing themselves to be seen intermittently all that time. That is like someone coming into your house, and occasionally peeking out from behind a cupboard. Sure they are aliens, but that is a fucking weird thing to do.
Of course it's weird. They are nothing like us at all. You cannot attribute or attach our morals and belief system to them because they're alien. That would be a fucking weird thing to do.

I do believe they walk among us and have for a very long time. I can't say I know in what capacity or to what extent. I do know that they don't need our "permission" to do so. Their technology is far more advanced than ours. They can do whatever they want whenever they want. We have no way of stopping it from happening.

I think they came and said, "Here's what is going to happen. We are going to study and experiment on all types of flora and fauna and take whatever we want. If you keep quiet and don't interfere in any way. We will "allow" you to act like you are still the one in charge." And I don't think they just approached President Churchill with this offer. I believe they approached leaders from every first world country.

First world countries: North America and West Europe. Belgium, Canada, Denmark, France, West Germany, Greece, Iceland, Italy, Luxembourg, the Netherlands, Norway, Portugal, Spain, Turkey, the United Kingdom, and the United States.
 

marhawkman

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Of course it's weird. They are nothing like us at all. You cannot attribute or attach our morals and belief system to them because they're alien. That would be a fucking weird thing to do.

I do believe they walk among us and have for a very long time. I can't say I know in what capacity or to what extent. I do know that they don't need our "permission" to do so. Their technology is far more advanced than ours. They can do whatever they want whenever they want. We have no way of stopping it from happening.

I think they came and said, "Here's what is going to happen. We are going to study and experiment on all types of flora and fauna and take whatever we want. If you keep quiet and don't interfere in any way. We will "allow" you to act like you are still the one in charge." And I don't think they just approached President Churchill with this offer. I believe they approached leaders from every first world country.

First world countries: North America and West Europe. Belgium, Canada, Denmark, France, West Germany, Greece, Iceland, Italy, Luxembourg, the Netherlands, Norway, Portugal, Spain, Turkey, the United Kingdom, and the United States.
If we're going down that rabbit hole, when did it start? Is this a new thing or something people didn't record as well in the past?
 

INT21

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How would people react in that case? Well... Independence Day seems like a good example.
You do know it is all fantasy ?

No aliens are coming. Yes, the enemy is amongst us, it is our own incapability to control the population.

That is what will finish us off.
 

eburacum

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I think they came and said, "Here's what is going to happen. We are going to study and experiment on all types of flora and fauna and take whatever we want. If you keep quiet and don't interfere in any way. We will "allow" you to act like you are still the one in charge." And I don't think they just approached President Churchill with this offer. I believe they approached leaders from every first world country.
First world countries: North America and West Europe. Belgium, Canada, Denmark, France, West Germany, Greece, Iceland, Italy, Luxembourg, the Netherlands, Norway, Portugal, Spain, Turkey, the United Kingdom, and the United States.
Wait - Turkey? Greece? Italy? Belgium?
To believe this we have to be aware that many of these countries are economic and/or political rivals. There is no reason that they would all agree to keep the secret if they could use it for political leverage against their enemies.

Not to mention that the Russians, Chinese, Indians and Islamic states have large populations who are potential witnesses, and who have little to no reason at all to support this act of deception. Most of the Earth's land surface is occupied by persons who do not live in this 'first world' you mention, so would not be party to any coverup.
 

marhawkman

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Wait - Turkey? Greece? Italy? Belgium?
To believe this we have to be aware that many of these countries are economic and/or political rivals. There is no reason that they would all agree to keep the secret if they could use it for political leverage against their enemies.

Not to mention that the Russians, Chinese, Indians and Islamic states have large populations who are potential witnesses, and who have little to no reason at all to support this act of deception. Most of the Earth's land surface is occupied by persons who do not live in this 'first world' you mention, so would not be party to any coverup.
Yeah grand conspiracy theories need to be so complete that NO ONE knows, or they're the most valuable secrets in the world. I mean just look at all the political bickering in the last few months. Imagine if someone actually had credible proof that a rival politician was receiving backing from an alien intelligence...
 

michael59

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If we're going down that rabbit hole, when did it start? Is this a new thing or something people didn't record as well in the past?
:D

IDK, like I said, I have no idea to what extent or capacity they have infiltrated our little blue planet. Sadly, I really don't have much of an imagination when it comes to making up or completing conspiracy theories. There are a lot of them out there. One is that they have always been here. The one I where I refer to President Churchill supposedly said that any contact or sightings of UFO's is to be kept secret.

I did find this, but I have no idea if it's authentic or debunked already. :dunno:

Eisenhower, who was president from 1953 to 1961, is known to have had a strong belief in life on other planets.


Extra-terrestrial: Eisenhower, who was president from 1953 to 1961, is known to have had a strong belief in life on other planets

The former five-star general in the United States Army who commanded the Allied Forces in Europe during the Second World War, was also keen on pushing the U.S. space programme.

His meeting with the cosmic life forms is said to have taken place while officials were told that he was on vacation in Palm Springs, California, in February 1954.

The initial meeting is supposed to have taken place with aliens who were 'Nordic' in appearance, but the agreement was eventually 'signed' with a race called 'Alien Greys'.

Mr Good added: 'We know that up to 90 per cent of all UFO reports can be explained in conventional terms. However, I would say millions of people worldwide have actually seen the real thing.'

According to classified documents released by the Ministry of Defence in 2010, Winston Churchill may have ordered a UFO sighting to be kept secret.

The UFO was seen over the East Coast of England by an RAF reconnaissance plane returning from a mission in France or Germany towards the end of the war.

Churchill is said to have discussed how to deal with UFO sightings with Eisenhower.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...etings-aliens-pentagon-consultant-claims.html

Then there is this that I posted in another thread topic and I apologize in advance because I'm not tech savvy enough to link to it so I will have to re-post it here....

A Threat Unmet

Internet talking heads like to cast doubt on these accounts, proposing spurious theories of ghost aircraft lacking transponders lurking in restricted DoD airspace. Clearly they have not interviewed the pilots and radar operators who encountered these objects at close range. Had they done so, they would find no ambiguity, doubt or confusion. Fravor’s wingman told me, and Fravor agreed, “We didn’t stand a chance against it.” I cannot imagine Navy F-18 pilots saying that about any Russian or Chinese fighter. These sobering words from badass Navy combat pilots should be taken to heart by DoD officials and Congress.

Indeed, the radical and technologically superior nature of these craft is a common theme for Navy pilots on both coasts. In the famous “Gimbal” video posted by The New York Times, one of the pilots is heard to exclaim, “There’s a whole fleet of them out there!” He was referring to a V-shaped formation of smaller craft approaching the fighters as they observed a larger “mothership” in the video. At close range, these bizarre craft appear to be black cubes, the corners of which are touching the inside of transparent spheres a mere six feet in diameter. There are no discernable air inlets, exhaust, wings, or means of lift or propulsion, yet they have been tracked at supersonic speeds and seem able to remain aloft indefinitely. They could hardly be more strange and alien in appearance or behavior. Yet an obdurate DoD bureaucracy is making almost no effort to determine the origin of these craft or their means of propulsion.

If we knew for certain that the Russian or Chinese militaries had leapfrogged the United States technologically, there would be an uproar, much as there was when the Soviet Union launched Sputnik, the world’s first man-made satellite. Fearful of falling behind, the public grew restive and Congress promptly responded by increasing spending for NASA and bolstering science-education programs. These initiatives paid handsome dividends 11 years later when Neil Armstrong set foot on the moon, arriving courtesy not only of a new space vehicle but thousands of patented new technologies that strengthened U.S. industry and leadership in science and technology.
https://www.legion.org/magazine/248354/threat-unmet

I wish I did have a writer's imagination. I'd probably sleep better at night.

Okay, so, I went first down the rabbit hole, I'd say at least six feet deep, :D but you did say "we".

It's your turn. :wink2:
 

michael59

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Wait - Turkey? Greece? Italy? Belgium?
To believe this we have to be aware that many of these countries are economic and/or political rivals. There is no reason that they would all agree to keep the secret if they could use it for political leverage against their enemies.

Not to mention that the Russians, Chinese, Indians and Islamic states have large populations who are potential witnesses, and who have little to no reason at all to support this act of deception. Most of the Earth's land surface is occupied by persons who do not live in this 'first world' you mention, so would not be party to any coverup.
Maybe, they each thought they were the only ones approached by ET? In other words, they thought if they said anything they alone would be annihilated by ET?

There was no internet back in the 40's. Heck, there were hardly any televisions. I think land lines were a luxury back then too. :D We didn't get a TV until 1970 and I'm one of John Logie Baird's great granddaughters. Even then, we still had to go the neighbor's to use the phone. :)

What I am trying to explain is that it was most likely all done in secret and they thought they were alone in the interaction with these beings. It most likely included a demonstration of they're (ET's) power.

I certainly would not want to be the leader of any one of these countries and think that I could come forward and explain what happened to me to the rest of the world,

I have a hard enough time trying to explain myself to you. :hspin:
 
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