Ilkley Moor Alien Photo (Yorkshire; December 1987)

Jokers Wild

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To me it looks like a large upright stone. The 'legs' and the long arm on the right look like an optical illusion created by the pale shapes in front of it. /And the head section really looks as though it's some way behind.

There's obviously something there , it looks like a small alien holding something
what he/she is holding I don't know ? ( a stun gun perhaps ) .

it says the pic was in a book about little people/fairies , aren't fairies small humanoid looking creatures .
 
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BS3

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LOL

dude what are u smoking ? ..... a ROCK ,seriously !

There's obviously something there , it looks like a small alien holding something
what he/she is holding I don't know ? ( a stun gun perhaps ) .

it says the pic was in a book about little people/fairies , aren't fairies small humanoid looking creatures .

It's probably a man holding a plastic bag (see discussion above)
 

catseye

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I just had another read of the original witness story. It is another case in which the witness under hypnosis describes Spielberg's ET, right down to its two large pointed toes (another being Colin Wright of the A70 abduction). Read it again and see for yourselves.

It might be that he did see something strange and his subconscious could only relate it to ET, but given the other doubts I call shenanigans
I posed the questions, somewhere on this site, years ago, about hypnosis. I was walking past my daughter's room and thought I saw a ginger cat (which we didn't have) curled up asleep on her dressing table. I went back and investigated and it turned out to be a hat, that my brain had interpreted as a sleeping cat (possibly because we had a load of cats at that time, although not one that fitted the profile of the 'sleeping ginger cat'). I wondered if I'd been hypnotised at that point AFTER I'd seen what I perceived as a 'sleeping cat', but BEFORE I went back and checked what it really was - what would I have described under hypnosis? I would have reported, under hypnosis, seeing that mysterious cat...

In other words, if you see something but don't understand or correctly perceive what it is, hypnosis isn't going to suddenly make you understand what you saw, it's going to make you build on the lack of understanding.
 

Coal

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In other words, if you see something but don't understand or correctly perceive what it is, hypnosis isn't going to suddenly make you understand what you saw, it's going to make you build on the lack of understanding.
Exactly this, once the brain has perceived and stored that perception, hypnosis won't be able to find the orginal data (as it were). It's gone.

Building on this - it's well established that when people retrieve a memory, it is essentially extracted and then re-written back into memory and it been shown that information introduced at the point of recall/reconsolidation can be incorporated into the memory and the next recall will contain said information - essentially memory becomes (potentially) corrupted when recalled. This might show up as a drift in 'that memory' vs. ‘some ground truth'.

I wonder if doing this via hypnosis has the same effect - so if the hypnotist uses leading questions or introduces a hypothesis (“Do you think it was aliens?”), that corrupts/changes the memory?
 

catseye

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Exactly this, once the brain has perceived and stored that perception, hypnosis won't be able to find the orginal data (as it were). It's gone.

Building on this - it's well established that when people retrieve a memory, it is essentially extracted and then re-written back into memory and it been shown that information introduced at the point of recall/reconsolidation can be incorporated into the memory and the next recall will contain said information - essentially memory becomes (potentially) corrupted when recalled. This might show up as a drift in 'that memory' vs. ‘some ground truth'.

I wonder if doing this via hypnosis has the same effect - so if the hypnotist uses leading questions or introduces a hypothesis (“Do you think it was aliens?”), that corrupts/changes the memory?
I wouldn't even think that the hypnotist would NEED to introduce a hypothesis if the experiencer has had time to dwell on the event they will have formed many hypotheses of their own and I would think that these would come roaring to the fore during a hypnosis session. So a question like 'tell me what you saw' is going to get interpreted as 'tell me what you think you saw.'

I have many many doubts as to the efficacy of hypnosis in cases like this. Actually, in almost all cases.
 

BS3

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Exactly this, once the brain has perceived and stored that perception, hypnosis won't be able to find the orginal data (as it were). It's gone.

Building on this - it's well established that when people retrieve a memory, it is essentially extracted and then re-written back into memory and it been shown that information introduced at the point of recall/reconsolidation can be incorporated into the memory and the next recall will contain said information - essentially memory becomes (potentially) corrupted when recalled. This might show up as a drift in 'that memory' vs. ‘some ground truth'.

I wonder if doing this via hypnosis has the same effect - so if the hypnotist uses leading questions or introduces a hypothesis (“Do you think it was aliens?”), that corrupts/changes the memory?

I think I've previously mentioned the psychologist who did a lot of work with Australian WWI veterans. He found not only that their memories, even of such a singular and traumatic period in their lives, changed over time as they retold stories, but after the release of the 1981 Peter Weir film Gallipoli they unconsciously modified their memories to fit the film, rather than their own real life experiences.
 

Coal

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I think I've previously mentioned the psychologist who did a lot of work with Australian WWI veterans. He found not only that their memories, even of such a singular and traumatic period in their lives, changed over time as they retold stories, but after the release of the 1981 Peter Weir film Gallipoli they unconsciously modified their memories to fit the film, rather than their own real life experiences.
Most interesting, didn't know about that one. You don't by any chance know the author of that study?

I have many many doubts as to the efficacy of hypnosis in cases like this. Actually, in almost all cases.
I'd go further and suggest that a psychologist/hypnotist that introduced false memories of (say) abuse, is far outside the ethical boundaries they are supposed to keep inside of. Imagine if such false memories then caused PTSD? Or a family break up?
 

SimonBurchell

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Most interesting, didn't know about that one. You don't by any chance know the author of that study?


I'd go further and suggest that a psychologist/hypnotist that introduced false memories of (say) abuse, is far outside the ethical boundaries they are supposed to keep inside of. Imagine if such false memories then caused PTSD? Or a family break up?
I recall a family breakup happening in the case of a lady who "found out" through hypnosis that she had been sexually abused by her father when she was a child; she cut off all contact with her father and never told him why. Only when he died did she confide in her mother, who revealed that her father was medically incapable of the supposed abuse. Terrible.
 

BS3

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Most interesting, didn't know about that one. You don't by any chance know the author of that study?


I'd go further and suggest that a psychologist/hypnotist that introduced false memories of (say) abuse, is far outside the ethical boundaries they are supposed to keep inside of. Imagine if such false memories then caused PTSD? Or a family break up?

It was Alistair Thomson, in particular his book Anzac Memories and the earlier journal article Anzac Memories: Putting Popular Memory Theory into Practice in Australia. One of his central points was that we actively 'compose' memory, usually in a way that allows us to live comfortably with it. There was a particularly interesting study of a veteran, Fred Farrall, who found his memories strongly at odds with the 'official' narrative.
 

Ronnie Jersey

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It's probably a man holding a plastic bag (see discussion above)
Could be. I've looked at this photo many times, and all the different versions on the internet which are available, and this plain black and white version seems to be the hindquarters of a large dog just looking at it from the back:

1655902121490.png


The head, I think, is a bunch of blurs from the foliage behind it, and if you cover the head and just look at the form, it seems very dog-like to me.
Just a thought.
 

catseye

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It was Alistair Thomson, in particular his book Anzac Memories and the earlier journal article Anzac Memories: Putting Popular Memory Theory into Practice in Australia. One of his central points was that we actively 'compose' memory, usually in a way that allows us to live comfortably with it. There was a particularly interesting study of a veteran, Fred Farrall, who found his memories strongly at odds with the 'official' narrative.
And this is why I automatically discount any case which came about as the result of 'recovered memories during hypnosis'. The things that the brain can conjure up for itself during the actual event are as nothing to what it can come up with under hypnosis.
 

charliebrown

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I am suspicious in that this person had a camera handy available to make sure he took a picture for evidence.

In the 1980s, did you walk around with a camera ?

Smartphones with cameras did not appear until very early 1990s.
 

EnolaGaia

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I am suspicious in that this person had a camera handy available to make sure he took a picture for evidence.
In the 1980s, did you walk around with a camera ?

According to his initial account, "Spencer" was taking an early morning walk across the moor to visit his father-in-law. He allegedly took the camera with him in case he found an opportunity to get a nice snapshot of the moor. He also took a compass as a precaution in case he encountered fog. It may seem strange to carry the camera if he thought there could be substantial fog, but some accounts claim he thought a foggy moor scene would be worth photographing. I'm not sure whether this excuse about a foggy scene being photo-worthy came from "Spencer" himself or one of his defenders.
 

catseye

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If that's a dude in the pic he needs a plastic surgeon

come on man , that's not a guy .

even though the pic is grainy you can tell it's NOT a human being
Maybe have a look a pareidolia. It could be ANYTHING and everyone projects what they think they see onto a shape until they are unable to see it as anything else. Could be a person, could be a dog, could be a shape made from rocks, it could be almost ANYTHING. Pretty sure it's not an alien though. But it could be.
 

Jokers Wild

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Maybe have a look a pareidolia. It could be ANYTHING and everyone projects what they think they see onto a shape until they are unable to see it as anything else. Could be a person, could be a dog, could be a shape made from rocks, it could be almost ANYTHING. Pretty sure it's not an alien though. But it could be.
LOL

you ENGLISH crack me up
 

Sid

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Maybe have a look a pareidolia. It could be ANYTHING and everyone projects what they think they see onto a shape until they are unable to see it as anything else. Could be a person, could be a dog, could be a shape made from rocks, it could be almost ANYTHING. Pretty sure it's not an alien though. But it could be.
Thought I'd have a closer look at this pic, and two things got my attention. . .

If it was faked, then why does the left 'hand' show a splayed (fanned) grass rake like image with multiple fingers?

My eyes also hint at a 'hidden' line (possible image break) between the two arrows that I've marked on the image ~ or could it just be a trick-of-the-eye/brain thing?

1655974455791.jpeg
 

Jokers Wild

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Thought I'd have a closer look at this pic, and two things got my attention. . .

If it was faked, then why does the left 'hand' show a splayed (fanned) grass rake like image with multiple fingers?

My eyes also hint at a 'hidden' line (possible image break) between the two arrows that I've marked on the image ~ or could it just be a trick-of-the-eye/brain thing?

View attachment 56428
The Alien isn't holding anything at all
It's his hand .

he said that the creatures who abducted him had huge/enormous hands .

This creature in the photograph proves it .
 
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EnolaGaia

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My eyes also hint at a 'hidden' line (possible image break) between the two arrows that I've marked on the image ~ or could it just be a trick-of-the-eye/brain thing?

Here's an annotated version of your image, showing the location of two vertical and two horizontal such "seams" in the image.

X-1655974455791.jpeg

Notice that the one you originally highlighted actually truncates / cuts off the image of the humanoid figure's upper appendage.

Unfortunately, this expanded and colorized image is so heavily pixellated it's difficult to tell whether the additional 3 lines are "in" the photo versus being artifacts of the image's manipulation.

Still, there's no question the vertical seam you noted truncates the left edge of the figure, omitting part of the upper "arm" on that side.
 

Eponastill

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LOL

dude what are u smoking ? ..... a ROCK ,seriously !

There's obviously something there , it looks like a small alien holding something
what he/she is holding I don't know ? ( a stun gun perhaps ) .

it says the pic was in a book about little people/fairies , aren't fairies small humanoid looking creatures .

Well you may be surprised to hear I believe in all sorts of things that normal people think are crazy. Including fairies. But I'd be surprised if you could take a photo of a fairy. I don't think they're that sort of thing.

If you ask me, grainy photos are prime for simulacra. It's what our brains are programmed to do, pick out meaning from patterns in our environment (so we don't get eaten by tigers). So without all the fiddling about with fake colour I reckon a distant rock isn't a bad guess. It doesn't look so very different from the other rocks.

And who knew that aliens would be humanoid and carry stun guns - what are the chances they'd look just like us and our weapons :) You carry on believing though, no one on this board will be bothered much either way in my experience.
 
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catseye

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I have a theory that, should aliens come among us, they would be so different to us that we wouldn't even realise what we were looking at. Should they wish to be visible at all, that is. Anything with sufficiently advanced technology to travel to distant planets is not going to fulfil the approved sterotypes of 'little green men'.
But my big question is still - why the hell would anything from beyond our galaxy want to come here?
 

Sid

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The Alien isn't holding anything at all
It's his hand .

he said that the creatures who abducted him had huge/enormous hands .

This creature in the photograph proves it .
No 'Jokers Wild,' I never suggested that 'it' was holding anything. . . as I said it's left 'hand' shows a splayed (fanned) grass rake like image with multiple fingers. I'm also wondering ~ now having had another look at it, why are parts of it's image dark green - almost black, and yet other adjacent parts are light green, it doesn't appear to be shadows as the dark patches are formed on both sides of the image?
 
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Ronnie Jersey

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I have a theory that, should aliens come among us, they would be so different to us that we wouldn't even realise what we were looking at. Should they wish to be visible at all, that is. Anything with sufficiently advanced technology to travel to distant planets is not going to fulfil the approved sterotypes of 'little green men'.
But my big question is still - why the hell would anything from beyond our galaxy want to come here?
Same reason we travel to other planets. And if they are traveling here, they are probably curious about all the different life forms, plant life, our oceans that cover our planet (they have been seen many times coming out of our oceans and lakes and rivers). Most of all they must be wondering why our planet is so overpopulated, and the continual wars.
Just my opinion though.
 

charliebrown

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When people claim hoax, I always ask myself why would a person hoax this situation ?

What does the hoaxer get out of fooling everyone , an ego trip or money ?

Did Spencer receive any compensation from his reported sighting. ?
 

eburacum

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But my big question is still - why the hell would anything from beyond our galaxy want to come here?
[rant]
Don't get 'galaxy' and 'solar system' mixed up. Lots of people make that mistake, including some science fiction writers such as Terry Nation, the creator of the Daleks.

Galaxies are huge collections of hundreds of billions of stars, and trillions of planets, and include billions of solar systems.
Solar systems are collections of planets around particular stars; about half of all solar systems contain only one star, others contain two or more. Aliens (if they are indeed visiting us) come from another solar system (since they don't seem to exist in our own). They almost certainly do not come from another galaxy.
[/rant]
 

BS3

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On the large 'hands', to repeat my earlier points:

The large 'hand' seen on the right arm is just a bag. You can see it's a bag because it suddenly gets much thinner at the 'wrist" point. One explanation might be that ETs have oddly skinny wrists; the other is that the 'wrist' is just the point where he's clutching the handles of the bag, which is probably just a supermarket plastic bag or similar. The left arm is held a bit forward and may actually be steadying him on something, or just maintaining balance.
 

catseye

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[rant]
Don't get 'galaxy' and 'solar system' mixed up. Lots of people make that mistake, including some science fiction writers such as Terry Nation, the creator of the Daleks.

Galaxies are huge collections of hundreds of billions of stars, and trillions of planets, and include billions of solar systems.
Solar systems are collections of planets around particular stars; about half of all solar systems contain only one star, others contain two or more. Aliens (if they are indeed visiting us) come from another solar system (since they don't seem to exist in our own). They almost certainly do not come from another galaxy.
[/rant]
But they might.<cheeky grin>
 
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