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Improbable Derren Brown Stunt

Can't remember if we had a thread on this already but one of his more recent ones, I think it was called "Push" was very intriguing to watch. Can't say much more without giving the premise away but was very well edited and opened up a crate of moral worms. Netflix I think.
 
Cloudbusting said:
I like Derren Brown, but having seen a one of his shows I'm convinced he occasionally uses stage stooges.
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I don't know much about magic or illusions, despite having a passing interest (I have a couple of books; one called 'How to be a Mind Magician' did help me work out how a couple of Brown's tricks are done!) but I do doubt he uses stooges;

Firstly, I don't think he would make such a big deal about saying he doesn't use them if he did, it would be easier not to put that statement in and risk looking like an out and out liar.

Secondly, we all know how bad people are at keeping secrets; imagine how many actors and stooges he would have used in his career, one of them WOULD have blabbed to the papers by now, someone out there would love to run a 'I WAS LYING DERREN BROWN'S STOOGE!' headline!

I will also say, I'm not THAT bothered if he does; I mean, we all know magic isn't real, if we enjoy it and it's good entertainment, that's all that matters, but I've always got the impression that Brown is a man of some integrity and that 'misdirection and showmanship' wouldn't include much, if any, outright lying.
 
Fluttermoth said:
I don't know much about magic or illusions, despite having a passing interest (I have a couple of books; one called 'How to be a Mind Magician' did help me work out how a couple of Brown's tricks are done!) but I do doubt he uses stooges;

Firstly, I don't think he would make such a big deal about saying he doesn't use them if he did, it would be easier not to put that statement in and risk looking like an out and out liar.

Secondly, we all know how bad people are at keeping secrets; imagine how many actors and stooges he would have used in his career, one of them WOULD have blabbed to the papers by now, someone out there would love to run a 'I WAS LYING DERREN BROWN'S STOOGE!' headline!

I will also say, I'm not THAT bothered if he does; I mean, we all know magic isn't real, if we enjoy it and it's good entertainment, that's all that matters, but I've always got the impression that Brown is a man of some integrity and that 'misdirection and showmanship' wouldn't include much, if any, outright lying.
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Totally get what you're saying, I just couldn't see how a couple of his 'tricks' were achievable without them.

I agree that I don't really care either way though. :)
 
Cloudbusting said:
Totally get what you're saying, I just couldn't see how a couple of his 'tricks' were achievable without them.
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And THAT is what we call, skill.

When the audience see no other possible explanation than plants/stooges, they will inevitably call it as such. Which is great for us because it means, once again, you're looking in the wrong direction.
 
My sister made me watch an episode, but it was such rubbish I couldn't believe it. Here's a bloke 'tied' to the tracks on a heritage railway, with a preserved Class 122 bearing down upon him at no more than 5mph. The track on this line is so wonky I wouldn't trust any train at faster than walking speed. How could anyone think they were in danger in such a situation?
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Ringo said:
When the audience see no other possible explanation than plants/stooges, they will inevitably call it as such. Which is great for us because it means, once again, you're looking in the wrong direction.
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My son said earlier; maybe he DOES use stooges, and then makes them forget all about it!

I mean, I have seen Derren make people forget things, so...

(we don't really think this, but it is a great hypothesis :) )
 
I live in GLasgow - I like urban. But I don't like London.
 
I remember one episode of Brown's American series where he hypnotized a woman in a Las Vegas bar (a bar instantly recognizable to anyone who's been there) to think her car in the parking lot was a different color than it really was. However, they didn't mention his greatest feat of mind control in that episode: convincing the home audience that the Fireside Lounge at the Peppermill diner, a pleasant but tiny watering hole, was a "Las Vegas nightclub".
 
So if anyone is still in any doubt, it's The Chiltern Firehouse owned by Andre Balaz.
 
Now just wondering who Andre Balazs is, and why we need to know.
 
Just watched Derren Brown's The Push on Netflix.
I know it was made a few years ago, but I'd not seen it before.
The premise was pretty mind-blowing but, overall I just didn't believe it.
I couldn't believe anyone would be as naïve and well malleable as the victims of this show.
Anyone else feel this show strained the credulity a bit too much?
 
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blessmycottonsocks said:
Just watched Derren Brown's The Push on Netflix.
I know it was made a few years ago, but I'd not seen it before.
The premise was pretty mind-blowing but, overall I just didn't believe it.
I couldn't believe anyone would be as naïve and well malleable as the victims of this show.
Anyone else feel this show strained the credulity a bit too much?
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One thing that didn't feel 'right' in 'Apocalpse'/convincing that bloke he was essentially in George Romero's Day Of The Dead was that he didn't try to attack any of the extras in zombie make up at any time. How did they manage to keep him from doing that? .. I appreciate it wouldn't ever be an attractive prospect for anyone to have to whack a zombie over the head but if he was that hypnotised into believing it was all really actually happening as the show portrayed it, surely flight or fight theory would have kicked in, especially in the closing scenes when he was tricked into running backwards and forwards from the helicopter whilst surrounded by the supposed undead.
 
The one where he goes to a Martial arts place and 'punches' one of the guys without actually touching him is a good one. Brown even does it from behind so the guy can't even see him doing it, but he still falls down and is winded.
 
I seem to remember Derren Brown talking about some of his tricks failing and how that never makes it to the TV. So obviously they only screen what works, and what works spectacularly. If, in the middle, some guy sits up and says "'ere, 'ang on a mo, I'm not having this!" and walks off, it won't make it onto screen.

So we've no real way of knowing when Derren cocks up.

But yes, virtually everyone I know says 'oh, I'm not susceptible, I couldn't be hypnotised, I'm too strong willed...' etc etc, but then falls for some scam or marketing ploy or conspiracy theory. Humans are not nearly as independent minded as they think they are. At base, we are all animals looking for a leader.
 
I went to a physio some years back and her friend knew DB when he was quite young. She said that her friend’s brother a very macho sort used to keep on about how he couldn’t be hypnotised. DB put him under a couple of times but he swore he was just kidding him on by raising his arms or whatever he was asked to do so DB put him under and got him to put on his sister’s make up.

Brother not amused, Physio and her friend thought it hilarious. She said DB was a nice guy.

Unlike the guy I was reading about in a book on stage magic. The story was of a magician in the 1950s who would perform some sort of levitation trick on stage. He would invite a child up from the audience to confirm there was no mechanism out of sight of the audience. There was a mechanism, but he whispered to the child words along the line of: “Say anything you little shit and I’ll skin you.” The child would look shocked, say there was nothing and return to his/her parents. These were the days when a kid would not be believed if they said what really happened. What a ******!

The same book had an interesting little experiment in it. Ask someone to reply very quickly to three questions. (Or try yourself)

What colour is snow?

What colour is cotton wool?

What do cows drink?

The answers will probably be: white, white and milk. But cows drink water. The white/drink connection is made very quickly.
 
Tunn11 said:
I went to a physio some years back and her friend knew DB when he was quite young. She said that her friend’s brother a very macho sort used to keep on about how he couldn’t be hypnotised. DB put him under a couple of times but he swore he was just kidding him on by raising his arms or whatever he was asked to do so DB put him under and got him to put on his sister’s make up.

Brother not amused, Physio and her friend thought it hilarious. She said DB was a nice guy.

Unlike the guy I was reading about in a book on stage magic. The story was of a magician in the 1950s who would perform some sort of levitation trick on stage. He would invite a child up from the audience to confirm there was no mechanism out of sight of the audience. There was a mechanism, but he whispered to the child words along the line of: “Say anything you little shit and I’ll skin you.” The child would look shocked, say there was nothing and return to his/her parents. These were the days when a kid would not be believed if they said what really happened. What a ******!

The same book had an interesting little experiment in it. Ask someone to reply very quickly to three questions. (Or try yourself)

What colour is snow?

What colour is cotton wool?

What do cows drink?

The answers will probably be: white, white and milk. But cows drink water. The white/drink connection is made very quickly.
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Cows do drink milk. At least very young cows do.
 
Swifty said:
One thing that didn't feel 'right' in 'Apocalpse'/convincing that bloke he was essentially in George Romero's Day Of The Dead was that he didn't try to attack any of the extras in zombie make up at any time. How did they manage to keep him from doing that? .. I appreciate it wouldn't ever be an attractive prospect for anyone to have to whack a zombie over the head but if he was that hypnotised into believing it was all really actually happening as the show portrayed it, surely flight or fight theory would have kicked in, especially in the closing scenes when he was tricked into running backwards and forwards from the helicopter whilst surrounded by the supposed undead.
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I haven't watched this at all, but if someone really believed they were in a zombie apocalypse they would probably kill the extras.

Maybe they believed they were in a live roleplay of an apocalypse?

I sometimes have zombie apocalypse or similar type dreams - weirdly enough they are actually exhilarating and enjoyable.

I don't think I would find a real zombie apocalypse enjoyable - so presumably it is like an unreal apocalypse I am experiencing in my dream....
 
Earthly oddity said:
I haven't watched this at all, but if someone really believed they were in a zombie apocalypse they would probably kill the extras.
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Both episodes are the entire show/experiment including hacking the guy's phone and staging false media TV broadcasts with the help of famous broadcasters to prime him to be suggestible .. he's on a bus with fans (under cover actors) going to a rock concert .. meteor shower pyrotechnics with emergency vehicles, a hypnosis intervention then he wakes up in an abandoned military base with actors he has to interact with and more .. it's interesting.
 
Swifty said:
One thing that didn't feel 'right' in 'Apocalpse'/convincing that bloke he was essentially in George Romero's Day Of The Dead was that he didn't try to attack any of the extras in zombie make up at any time. How did they manage to keep him from doing that? .. I appreciate it wouldn't ever be an attractive prospect for anyone to have to whack a zombie over the head but if he was that hypnotised into believing it was all really actually happening as the show portrayed it, surely flight or fight theory would have kicked in, especially in the closing scenes when he was tricked into running backwards and forwards from the helicopter whilst surrounded by the supposed undead.
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I have watched this a couple of times and tracked down a lot of chatter about it on the internet. Like you I have my doubts, not least because the central character did once want to be an actor. Also the pyrotechnics were a bit weak to be honest, guess there is a limit to what you can do with actual living humans and presumably wildlife on the outdoor set. Then yes, he was very restrained and his fight or flight seemed to be lacking and instead he was very easily led from one scenario to the next. Also, I felt the acting of some of the extras was a bit "daytime tv" at best.

He has gone on the record to say none of it was scripted and he believed it all but then perhaps he had his 15 minutes of fame for the cost of a non-disclosure clause (remember, he had wanted to be an actor). There were claims that the experience had motivated him to 'get off his arse' and start a new career, but then being the central character in a tv show watched by millions may well have had the same effect regardless. You have to ask if it is legally possible to essentially abduct an adult without their consent and put them through an experience that could scar them mentally for life? Also that all the actors and extras were happy to go along with this? Personally, I think not and the only surprise for him were the actual events, i feel he knew some outline details beforehand

(I will have to track down the links and sources to all of the above, has been a little while now)
 
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