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Bernadette's Face

Gerard, Bernadette's face is indeed a wax mask over her actual features. I've read this in Roman Catholic sources.

I'm not entirely certain about the hands, but I think they're also covered with wax.

Many people believe this is also true of Vladimir Lenin's corpse there in its grey mausoleum on Moscow's Red Square. But the Russian government traditionally always denied this.

But one of the things speaking in favor of a waxen Lenin is that when Lenin's body was first put on public display (in 1924, if memory serves) it quicky fell into decay. Taken away for "re-embalming" it was many months later returned for viewing as "good as new." (Some surely would say "as bad as new.")

And, NO, I am most assuredly NOT trying to compare Bernadette with Lenin. Far from it.
 
Dead Greek Orthodox monk baffles scientists 15 years after burial

Mon Mar 13, 1:03 PM ET

ATHENS (AFP) - Medical experts in the town of Lamia, central Greece, are puzzling over the body of a Greek Orthodox monk that was allegedly found intact 15 years after his burial.

"I believe this to be a sign from God," Bishop Nikolaos of the local prefecture of Fthiotida told a press conference in Lamia. "Even the monk's soft parts are intact," he added accoridng to the semi-state Athens News Agency (ANA).

The story of the deceased monk, Vissarionas Korkoliakos, has raised a media stir following his recent exhumation at Agathonos monastery.

Four local doctors summoned by Church authorities were unable to explain the alleged phenomenon. A fifth expert, an Athens coroner, wrote in his report that he has never seen such a case in his entire career, ANA said.

The church had also requested an opinion from head Athens coroner Philippos Koutsaftis, who declined to examine the body as the monk's death was not crime-related.

Hundreds of faithful are already flocking to the site where the monk's body was disinterred, ANA reported, but the local church is currently advising self-restraint.

"We do not intend to declare (this man) a saint, or to summon people to pray before him," Bishop Nicholaos said.

The monk's body will be placed in isolation in the monastery chapel "to let God speak through the passage of time," the bishop said.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20060313/od ... 0313180350
 
That's interesting - I'd always conceptualized the incorruptibility of the body as a possible indication of sainthood as a tradition of the Western Catholic tradition rather than the Eastern.

In fact there's even an old joke about this -

THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE WESTERN AND EASTERN CATHOLIC CHURCHES:

Western Church:

Dig, dig, dig.

Open coffin lid.

"The body's incorrupt - he's a SAINT!"

Eastern Church:

Dig, dig, dig.

Open coffin lid.

"The body's incorrupt - he's a VAMPIRE!"
 
Oh they had their vampire outbreaks in the west too ;)

The belief in the Greek vrykolas only died away in the early parts of the 20C.

------------
Dead Greek Orthodox monk baffles scientists 15 years after burial

General Science : March 13, 2006

Medical experts in the town of Lamia, central Greece, are puzzling over the body of a Greek Orthodox monk that was allegedly found intact 15 years after his burial, the semi-state Athens News Agency (ANA) reported on Monday.

"I believe this to be a sign from God," Bishop Nikolaos of the local prefecture of Fthiotida told a press conference in Lamia. "Even the monk's soft parts are intact," he added.

The story of the deceased monk, Vissarionas Korkoliakos, has raised a media stir following his recent exhumation at Agathonos monastery.

Four local doctors summoned by Church authorities were unable to explain the alleged phenomenon. A fifth expert, an Athens coroner, wrote in his report that he has never seen such a case in his entire career, ANA said.

The church had also requested an opinion from head Athens coroner Philippos Koutsaftis, who declined to examine the body as the monk's death was not crime-related.

Hundreds of faithful are already flocking to the site where the monk's body was disinterred, ANA reported, but the local church is currently advising self-restraint.

"We do not intend to declare (this man) a saint, or to summon people to pray before him," Bishop Nicholaos said.

The monk's body will be placed in isolation in the monastery chapel "to let God speak through the passage of time," the bishop said.

-------------
© 2006 AFP

www.physorg.com/news11683.html
 
Incorruptables

Somewhere I read that Western saints when exhumed are fresh looking; but Eastern Orthodox saints when exhumed exhibit a dry and mummified appearance. Wish I could remember where I read that. And the story about the Orthodox monk would seem to refute that.
 
Just sounds like propaganda that, doesnt it??
 
This thread hasn't had a bump for a while! However... since posting here some years ago now asking about the Fortean Times article about the Central or South American natural mummies, I just did a bit of Googling (ahem) and came up with something similar in Mexico: The Guanajuato mummies.

If you Google it yourself there's various websites, and a lot of inconsistency.

The thing is, this isn't the one I remember from FT! The Guanajuato mummies have been mummified because of the environmental conditions (apparently). It's very dry and warm, so the corpses dry out very fast (because they're above ground).

But the ones in FT were in a tropical climate, which made it all the more bizarre that the corpses had mummified. They put it down to the local diet of fruit (erm... that's just not going to work, is it!). They had corpses of babies in their romper suits. Oh I really do wish I could remember more about it!

You know how I feel, guys??? When some bizarre story like that grips you and just won't let go, even several years later?

To take the thread back to incorruptibles (although we did veer into mummies and the entire thread *does* start off with someone else wondering about those natural mummies), I was at Birmingham Oratory once and there's a glass coffin with a man inside it in his priestly robes. I wasn't sure if it was a corpse or if it was a wax model of a corpse. Is that something that "high Catholic" churches do? (they still do a Latin mass there). If birmingham has it's very own incorruptible, wouldn't we know about it? (and let's face it, seeing as Cardinal Newman vanished in his own coffin, the likelihood of someone staying in their coffin long enough to become incoruptible is unfortunately small).

Any takers?
 
Ended up here after a surf from the Rome destruction thread > Jacinta Marto > Incorruptibles...

Found a Top 10 Incorruptibles page and was initially quite amazed and fascinated, but you are effectively just looking at a macabre Madam Tussaud's really...

Creepy eyes this one though... :shock:

JacintaMartoexhumeduncorrupted.jpg
 
gncxx said:
Looks like her eyes are closed to me!

Yeh they almost certainly are. Pictures of her alive show she had a particularly hairy brow. Regardless, when you first scroll down the page and unexpectedly see the simulacra of those cold, iris-less eyes staring back at you it is pretty unsettling... :shock:
 
A great article in "The Atlantic" on the subject - oddly filed under "Technology":

The Saintliness of Undecayed Corpses

As darkness fell on August 29, 1104, the monks of Durham Cathedral Priory prepared to exhume their patron saint, Cuthbert. After two decades, their new cathedral was almost complete, and its centerpiece was a splendid shrine for the saint. In preparation for the ceremonial relocation, Cuthbert’s coffin had been removed from its old tomb. After a day of fasting and prayers, the monks summoned up the courage to open the coffin lid.

What they reported finding was astonishing, given that Cuthbert had been dead for more than 400 years. His corpse was not merely undecayed, but flexible and lifelike. It was as if the saint were not dead, but sleeping.


https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2017/10/saint-corpses/544241/

 
A great article in "The Atlantic" on the subject - oddly filed under "Technology":



https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2017/10/saint-corpses/544241/

There was a R4 programme a year or two ago which mentioned how much the Durham locals love their Saint. They pop into the Cathedral to chat with him and tell him their news. If they have problems they tell him about those too and ask for guidance. He came across as your mate's friendly, much older stepbrother who can mend bikes and do hard sums.
 
There was a R4 programme a year or two ago which mentioned how much the Durham locals love their Saint. They pop into the Cathedral to chat with him and tell him their news. If they have problems they tell him about those too and ask for guidance. He came across as your mate's friendly, much older stepbrother who can mend bikes and do hard sums.
Saint Cuthbert? I've never heard of anyone going to the cathedral for a chat with him but obviously I'm going to look into this..
 
There was a R4 programme a year or two ago which mentioned how much the Durham locals love their Saint. They pop into the Cathedral to chat with him and tell him their news. If they have problems they tell him about those too and ask for guidance. He came across as your mate's friendly, much older stepbrother who can mend bikes and do hard sums.

Sounds good to me :)
 

Missouri miracle? Hundreds travel to see nun’s exhumed, ‘incorrupt’ body​


/article completely without pictures.
/I did find an article with a picture here, where you can see her hannd is quite dessicated, just her face is preserved.

https://fox4kc.com/news/missouri-ne...eds-travel-to-see-nuns-exhumed-incorrupt-body
-----------------------------------------
The person at the center of the attention is Sister Wilhelmina Lancaster, who is described as the African American foundress of the Benedictine Sisters of Mary, Queen of the Apostles.

The sisters told the Catholic News Agency that after her death she was buried but not embalmed.

After four years, the sisters recently exhumed the body in a ceremony with plans to move her body to a final resting place inside their monastery chapel. The sisters expected to find bones in her cracked wooden coffin, but instead they found her looking not so different from when she went it.
 

Missouri miracle? Hundreds travel to see nun’s exhumed, ‘incorrupt’ body​


/article completely without pictures.
/I did find an article with a picture here, where you can see her hannd is quite dessicated, just her face is preserved.

https://fox4kc.com/news/missouri-ne...eds-travel-to-see-nuns-exhumed-incorrupt-body
-----------------------------------------
The person at the center of the attention is Sister Wilhelmina Lancaster, who is described as the African American foundress of the Benedictine Sisters of Mary, Queen of the Apostles.

The sisters told the Catholic News Agency that after her death she was buried but not embalmed.

After four years, the sisters recently exhumed the body in a ceremony with plans to move her body to a final resting place inside their monastery chapel. The sisters expected to find bones in her cracked wooden coffin, but instead they found her looking not so different from when she went it.

Not available in my area but this link works: https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/missouri-miracle-nun-body-catholics-b2345965.html
 
Classic fortean stuff. I was just reading the article about her on the Guardian. But that was mercifully without pictures. Goodness ramonmercado, when it said 'hundreds travel to see nun's body' I thought they'd just be peering at her through some glass. Not holding her flipping hand. That is pretty grim, that video. Or that is to say, it's a sight I was not expecting from 21st century America and I clearly didn't understand what these pilgrims were up for, nor what the nunnery would think appropriate.
In the Guardian article it mentions the Abbess saying "We think she is the first African American woman to be found incorrupt." Which I thought (yes a bit cynically) had an air of pride about it and I could just imagine the Abbess saying over tea "ooh yes, well my nunnery had the first African American woman found incorrupt, you know."
 
They should stake her before she's reinterred, just to be sure.
 
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