J.R.R. Tolkien

Yithian

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Maybe.
Now he's in adverts for some mobile firm.

I'm sorry but I can't suspend my disbelief and imagine that guy as Bilbo.

He's also punching way above his weight in those ads.

Not seen the ads, but generally you have to accumulate a lot of credibility before you can expend some on advertising and not be lessened as a professional for it.

Did Lemmy do any TV ads? If so, he would have got away with it as you know the money would be spent at the bar, on his mates or buying military memorabilia--and who can begrudge a man that?

Likewise, John Cleese. Several ads--some faintly amusing at least--and you know he has to pay off all those grasping ex-wives.

I'm not quite at the Bill Hicks level, but if it looks like you'll do anything your agent throws at you, you're off the artistic register. I like Cederic Bandersnatch, but he's become painfully ubiquitous in recent years.
 

Mythopoeika

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Likewise, John Cleese. Several ads--some faintly amusing at least--and you know he has to pay off all those grasping ex-wives.
That's probably the real reason why he's emigrating. 3 ex-wives! A glutton for punishment.
 

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I also dislike Martin Freeman as an actor but he was actually really good in the Fargo television series. Not Bilbo material though.

I tried watching the Hobbit films. The Lord of the Rings movies were so well interpreted from the books it seems surprising to me that all involved in the Hobbit films so totally misinterpreted that book. The attempt at Radagast particularly stands out in my memory as egregiously misinterpreted. Despite trying to watch all 3 films I couldn't make it to the end of any of them.
 

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Not seen the ads, but generally you have to accumulate a lot of credibility before you can expend some on advertising and not be lessened as a professional for it.

Did Lemmy do any TV ads? If so, he would have got away with it as you know the money would be spent at the bar, on his mates or buying military memorabilia--and who can begrudge a man that?

Likewise, John Cleese. Several ads--some faintly amusing at least--and you know he has to pay off all those grasping ex-wives.

I'm not quite at the Bill Hicks level, but if it looks like you'll do anything your agent throws at you, you're off the artistic register. I like Cederic Bandersnatch, but he's become painfully ubiquitous in recent years.

I don't think I've ever seen that before, but yeah, looks like he did some ads. He was also in some movies like "Eat The Rich" which I remember being okay although I was a teenager when I saw it.
You'd think a man that played Bilbo in a massive movie wouldn't need to play a guy in an ad for Vodafone or whatever it is.
 

Anonymous-50446

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Did Lemmy do any TV ads? If so, he would have got away with it as you know the money would be spent at the bar, on his mates or buying military memorabilia--and who can begrudge a man that?
 

titch

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I only got this for the pictures, and they are not that good.
IMG_20180916_0706121.jpg
 

Yithian

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Really?

I rate Alan Lee quite highly. His pictures always seem 'tonally' right--in both senses of the word.

Can you give us a peek?
 

titch

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Really?

I rate Alan Lee quite highly. His pictures always seem 'tonally' right--in both senses of the word.

Can you give us a peek?
This is the worst offender in my eyes, glorfindal and the balrog, the balrog looks pathetic, and there is no sense of action or movement .
IMG_20180916_0757574~2.jpg
 

Yithian

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I agree. I like the background and setting, but not the figures.
 

Mythopoeika

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Alan Lee is normally pretty good.
I met him once, years ago.
That picture above...the human figure is not so believable, but the Balrog is OK.
 

titch

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I will be very surprised if this Tolkien biography is anything but rubbish.
 

Yithian

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Why has Hollywood decided that overly melodramaticised biopics of historical or (worse) contemporary characters are what audiences really want? They used to be the preserve of low-budget daytime production companies.

I know this marks me out as a not-so-old fogey, but I simply refuse to view such films.

The same goes for superhero movies (a product and driver of societal infantilisation), all of the ones I've seem are risibly repetitive in terms of plot and characterisation. They were bad enough when they just looked like Michael Bay movies with 'fan service', but I have even less appetite for films with a clunky 'political' message crowbared in.

Get off my lawn!
 

Megadeth1977

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Why has Hollywood decided that overly melodramaticised biopics of historical or (worse) contemporary characters are what audiences really want? They used to be the preserve of low-budget daytime production companies.

I know this marks me out as a not-so-old fogey, but I simply refuse to view such films.

The same goes for superhero movies (a product and driver of societal infantilisation), all of the ones I've seem are risibly repetitive in terms of plot and characterisation. They were bad enough when they just looked like Michael Bay movies with 'fan service', but I have even less appetite for films with a clunky 'political' message crowbared in.

Get off my lawn!
Wow superhero movies are just a fun escape for an hour or two and definitely don't turn people into permanent children and not every thing has to be taken seriously and for God sake man enjoy life a little.
 

Yithian

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Wow superhero movies are just a fun escape for an hour or two and definitely don't turn people into permanent children and not every thing has to be taken seriously and for God sake man enjoy life a little.

And I assure you that I do enjoy life--but not with superhero movies. I confess that I haven't seen one for a few years, but I always found them hackneyed and formulaic. Comic books needn't be, by the way, but the attempt to adapt, sweeten and distill them into a two-hour, sequel-friendly package tends to generate tripe.

Watchmen was filled with promising seeds, but ultimately it failed in the delivery.
 

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Sundry Tolkien thoughts, or My Tolkien Journey...

My first experience of Tolkien was semi-mythical in that my dad owned 60s copies of LOTR and The Hobbit and said I'd like them, or LOTR at least, "when I was older"; I was in primary school at the time and loved anything fantastical. I accepted this at the time and it meant that the book acquired an almost Necronomicon-esque weight for a decade or so before I read it in my teens. I saw the Bakshi animation when I was maybe 9 or 10 and absolutely loved it and repeatedly watched it, to the point where I could probably quote along with it if I watched it now, despite not having seen it for 20ish years. I was put off by the orcs being film negatives whilst the main characters were animated, if rotoscoped but put up with this as I loved it so much. I still remember it fondly and would probably enjoy it if I watched it again now, though it's messy and rough around the edges.

Soon after I was given A Tolkien Bestiary by David Day, which lists places and events as well as creatures and people, essentially an encyclopedia with many, may illustrations. I devoured this obsessively the way you do in childhood, around the same time I was doing the same thing with the Warhammer Fantasy Roleplay Guidebook and supplements.

Due to listening to my dad, I didn't read The Hobbit until I was 11-12 and loved it, though should have read it sooner (was reading "adult" non-fiction much younger) and would probably have loved it more then. Didn't eventually read LOTR until I was 17, spent many a happy hour sat in the shade at the bottom of the garden, next yo our rabbit pen reading it one summer. Despite being a little "old" for first read of LOTR I absolutely loved it, cried at the end (wimp) and was devastated when I thought Shelob had killed Frodo. It essentially marked the end of my childhood reading, at least of fiction - a few weeks later I saw a documentary on Wilde, then bought the complete works and read them obsessively and for several years became a Literary Snob who refused to read "mere" genre fiction.

I initially didn't reread LOTR due to wanting to "give it some breathing room" before returning, I decided it was an exception above my snobbery, I also wanted to immerse myself in literary "classics" and do some catch up. After some time the delay became due the increasingly nagging doubts that if I returned to LOTR I wouldn't love it as much as I had done. I was young and you change quickly then and I;d just greatly widened my reading horizons. I delayed my reread until after the final Jackson film came out and attempted it again in my mid-20s whilst actually travelling around NZ, which seemed like the perfect time.

It turns out my instincts where correct, I found the book fine but dull, poorly paced and simultaneously over and underwritten. Tolkien is fond of often stilted archaisms and is in my opinion a functional prose writer. I forced myself to get halfway and then admitted defeat, this was done with some sadness but I think it was the best decision, I decided I'd rather retain my happy memories of reading it the first time than tarnish them. At this remove I don't regret the decision, at the point I still have far more potent memories of the initial read than of the second one, of which I can only recall mild boredom and disappointment. I had similar experience, albeit more muted attempted to reread The Hobbit just prior to the first film and likewise gave up, though this time much more quickly.

I still have enormous affection for both books The Bestiary and the Bakshi and will certainly return to the latter two but probably never the former. I loved and still love Bakshi's use of the archaic dialogue from the books, which Jackson excised to a greater degree; even if I found it harder to (re)read. If Tolkien is your thing in any way I'm not attempting to shit on it and the LOTR in particular has that almost indefinable "X Factor" that many great works of art have, however flawed they may be. I attempted The Silmarillion in a flurry of post LOTR enthusiam and gace up after three pages, to date I've read more of Finnegans Wake, the observation that it is "an Elvish telephone directory" ring true for me, never attempted Lost Tales as a result, despite buying it.

I've gone on longer than I meant to so will leave out further observations and will comment (no doubt at length) on the Jackson films.
 

pandacracker

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Mmmm... whimsy. A much underrated art form. I think Oliver Postgate had mastery of it.

I read the book in my early teens, I seem to remember laughing out loud at the part when Chrysophylax Dives attacks the knights without waiting for them to finish their formal challenges.:mattack:
 

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I really enjoyed farmer Giles, but the smith of Wooton wotsit passed me by, I think it has layers and meaning that I just couldn't fathom.
 

Frideswide

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Farmer Giles of Ham, Smith of Wooton Major - especially the latter. Also Tree and Leaf and the poems too.
 

pandacracker

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With regard to his poetry I just found this recording of Tolkien himself murdering (in my humble opinion) one of my favourites of his.

 
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