Kelly / Hopkinsville (Kentucky) 'Goblins' Incident (1955)

[GNC]

This just struck me: you know those pictures of how the brain sees the body, with the big eyes, big ears, big hands, and small bodies, that sort of thing? They look an awful lot like those drawings of the goblins. Could they be related?

 

[stu neville]

Him?

(I used to teach him. He works in Morrison's now.)

 

[GNC]

That's the laddie! Hands are a bit bigger than I remember, but anyone see a resemblance? Especially the Evansville goblin a few posts above.

 

[Comfortably Numb]

Maybe we're looking at a distinct phenomenon with differing interpretations?

In this particular instance, we have two scenarios; although either may be true, one is perfectly plausible and the other patently absurd.

Which is infinitely more likely?

The Hopkinsville case is essentially two guys shooting at everything in sight and apparently in sound, including through the walls/roof, whatever, of their house.

It's hysterical borne of what they believe are threatening aliens, who have arrived on a flying saucer.

What other, 'element' is involved?

Are you suggesting it might actually be a genuine, reliably evidenced occurrence?

The other 'distinct phenomena' you cite as supporting evidence of an underlying correlation, Bigfoot, et al.

I trust we may cordially disagree, for I can discern no evidence it isn't in fact the exact antithesis.

 

[Comfortably Numb]

Are Raccoons bulletproof?

As noted, there seem to be different versions relating to what actually occurred when shots were fired. What isn't clear is when and where they originated and what came first, etc. I shall endeavour to clarify same.

 

[Comfortably Numb]

People who live in the sticks in Kentucky are very familiar with raccoons. Duh.

If people didn't make mistakes, perhaps particularly at night when they thought a flying saucer had just dropped by...

I guess the point is, see under 'anomalous mystery solved' in Fortean history and count the number of cases where this applied.

 

[stu neville]

The Hopkinsville case is essentially two guys shooting at everything in sight and apparently in sound, including through the walls/roof, whatever, of their house.

As were Ape Canyon and Honobia - terrified occupants shooting through walls and windows at glimpsed assailants who seemed unintimidated by gunfire.

What other, 'element' is involved?

This is my point - the essential scenario is very similar. Remote dwelling attacked by night by stealthy, agile entities.

 

[Comfortably Numb]

Remote dwelling attacked by night by stealthy, agile entities.

Looks like you might be right...

Just a quick mention...found some new case material and included therein:

"The callers then climbed up trees onto the roof of the house..".

Had they ran out of, 'float'..?

Shall see where this leads and update soon as.

 

[Kondoru]

Article says they fired up about 4 boxes of .22 ammo.

How many bullets is that?

 

[Mythopoeika]

Article says they fired up about 4 boxes of .22 ammo.

How many bullets is that?

800 rounds!

 

[Comfortably Numb]

800 rounds!

FFS!!!!

That surely can't be right.

UPDATE: From the earliest accounts, zero mention of floating entities, however...

[EDITED]
"...some (of the witnesses) saw them crawlng on their hands and knees...".

 

[Mythopoeika]

FFS!!!!

That surely can't be right.

UPDATE: From the earliest accounts, zero mention of floating entities, however...

"...a number of the creatures walked on their hands and knees...".

Depends on the size of box. Some have 100 rounds, some have 200.
So they shot off at least 400.
Which also sounds improbable.

 

[maximus otter]

Depends on the size of box. Some have 100 rounds, some have 200.
So they shot off at least 400.
Which also sounds improbable.

Most .22LR ammo comes in 50-round boxes, so four boxes = 200 rounds.

maximus otter

 

[Mythopoeika]

Most .22LR ammo comes in 50-round boxes, so four boxes = 200 rounds.

maximus otter

OK, thanks for the correction.
I only did a cursory search.
Even 200 rounds is a LOT.

 

[marhawkman]

Article says they fired up about 4 boxes of .22 ammo.

How many bullets is that?

at another point their neighbors claim to have only heard four shots. Hunh? Those don't fit together. Also the report in that clip above:

I chopped up the newspaper and rearranged the text to make it a bit easier to read.
View attachment 28980
It does have a few bits that you don't hear repeated a lot.

suggests the police officers did not see signs of much in the way of gunfire. They specifically noted how they found a hole in a screen covering a window that matched the claim that a shotgun had been fired through it. It doesn't talk about finding any other bullet holes, and even notes that the investigation was so quiet the only excitement came when someone accidentally stepped on a cat.

Also... the claim they fired off 4 boxes of pistol ammo is odd given that only one of them was using a pistol. Sutton had a shotgun, and Taylor had a .22 pistol. Using ONE pistol to fire 200 or more rounds? That might take all of 4 hours tbh... You'd probably have to stop and clean the gun multiple times. And again, the neighbor claimed he didn't hear that much gunfire.

 

[stu neville]

It doesn't talk about finding any other bullet holes...

..not to mention that many shots would mean a carpet of shell casings.

 

[Austin Popper]

Everybody needs to sleep at night.

Yup, just another bunch of dipshit hillbillies.

 

[Comfortably Numb]

If fortunate enough, does anyone remember when they were little and watching children's TV...

"Now today's lesson, boys and girls, is all about...".

Well, this is a tale highlighting, as I have emphasied from some 20+ years research experience, how we always need to, if possible, uncover the earliest published evidence.

Because, of course, the original story often becomes embellished over many years.

A notable example was only during past week or so regarding the Betty and Barney Hill 'alien abduction' case, where on that thread I noted the popularised account - citing history.com - of how under hypnosis, Betty recalled being led up a ramp to the spaceship by two ET 'greys'.

It's complete nonsense, in her 'hypnosis sessions, she never claimed anything remotely like this!

And so it goes.

Nevertheless, I did not anticipate the Hopkinsville case having parallels.

Essentially, if we go right back to the initial newspaper reports, which include pivotal interviews with the witnesses, an entirely different perspective evolves.

Although I did have a look into the newspapers.com archives some time ago, what seems to have changed since, are a number of additional and related reports now becoming available.

So, where do we start... perhaps like any good story, at the very beginning.

In general - not always consistantly reported - from circa 8-10 separate newspaper stories in the ensuing few days, these are some of the differences which seem quite profound:

Did the creatures emerge from a spaceship right after it landed?

No, it was about 45 minutes later before 3-4 were observed, soon followed by the others, totalling around 10-14.

Were they 3-4ft tall?

Some appeared to be smaller than this.

What happened when the cretures reached the house?

Some of them climbed trees, onto the roof. Subsequently, a scratching noise was heard.

Did they walk upright?

Not clear at present, however, some of the witnesses distinctly recall them crawlng on 'hands and knees'.

Were their descriptions of facial characteristics?

Yes, they differ and will explain in more detail soon as.

How many shots were fired at the creatures?

Quoting witness testimony, only around 8, or so (slightly uncertain at present) and initially fired into the air as warning shots.

Were any of the creatures hit?

Possibly believed to be the case on one occasion - needs further clarification.

Were bullets seen to 'bounce off' the creatures, or did they seem to be protected by a 'force field'?

There's no mention of anything like that.

Were the creatures seen to be floating when first observed, or at any time?

There is no reference to anything like this, whatsoever.


All of which is hopefully helpful and my intention is to upload an entire copy of every related article as a .pdf file and provide a link, so you can fully assess the contents.

Today's story was called, 'Down the Rabbit Hole' and what a decidedly curious experience it has been.

 

[Comfortably Numb]

And again, the neighbor claimed he didn't hear that much gunfire.

As noted, a scenario supported by the first newspaper accounts

This is the first uploaded, related report (full page, because it's so much easier and less time consuming than trying to isolate one article), from 'The Indianapolis Star', 23 August, 1955.

www.forteanmedia.com/Hville_01.pdf

 

[marhawkman]

As noted, a scenario supported by the first newspaper accounts

This is the first uploaded, related report (full page, because it's so much easier and less time consuming than trying to isolate one article), from 'The Indianapolis Star', 23 August, 1955.

www.forteanmedia.com/Hville_01.pdf

"if they come back, I'm not going to let anyone know about it." hmmm that is a very interesting quote.

Also this one explicitly says "green" and "glowing". also... "You can't see them except in the dark"? He seems to be saying they become invisible in bright lights?

also relevant: it basically says the police didn't find any physical trace of the green men".

 

[Nosmo King]

also relevant: it basically says the police didn't find any physical trace of the green men".

Well if they did it would be undeniable proof that aliens exist surely

 

[Comfortably Numb]

Also this one explicitly says "green" and "glowing". also... "You can't see them except in the dark"? He seems to be saying they become invisible in bright lights?

also relevant: it basically says the police didn't find any physical trace of the green men".

It was 1955 and one 'popularised perception' was that aliens were, 'ittle green men who came in flying saucers from Mars'.

Within articles written about the case in more recent years, there are references to this very point you highlight, commenting how the media were more interested in selling stories of the expected 'little green men', than what had actually been claimed by the witnesses.

Going back to our initial newspaper publications, a second upload and this one is particularly important. It comes from the wonderfully entitled, 'Clarkesville Leaf-Chronicle', dated 24 August, 1955 and explains the origin of what may be significant, early sketches.

www.forteanmedia.com/Hville_02.pdf

 

[Comfortably Numb]

The following is a newspaper article from the 'Madisonville Messenger (Kentucky)' published on 22 August, 1955.

Of paramount Importance, as it is:

a) a detailed report, published next day

b) seemingly the genesis of our story regarding "four boxes (200) .22 cartridges" being fired at the creatures and "ricocheting off the little men like they would off a steel plate", whilst also noting, "Investigating officers reported they found only two empty .22 cartridges in the area".

Evidently therefore, these claims originated from Lucky Sutton and were not embellished by the newspaper.

The question of whether this seemingly one-off anecdote is an enormous 'tall-tale' by Sutton and a rationale why he might have thought that necessary, we can come back to.

Still absolutely nothing whatsoever, so far, within any newspaper reports in the following days, concerning that pivotal, asserted enigma of those creatures having an ability to 'float' and presumably this central case feature is s later addition?

It will doubtless eventually make its debut in our evidential timeline.

Uploaded as .jpg files (they would not save as preferred .pdf files)

Page 1 of the article
www.forteanmedia.com/Hville_03.jpg

Page 2 of the article
www.forteanmedia.com/Hville_04.jpg

 

[Comfortably Numb]

A snapshot, from the 'Madisonville Messenger (Kentucky)', as at 24 August, 1955.

'Step Right Up Folks, Step Right Up...'

The family's decision to charge an 'entry fee' for curious visitors, was reportedly met with some distain and resultant loss of credibility within the local community.

Personally, I can't see it being any different from one, or more, farmers in the UK, who apparently realised the commercial opportunity and charged similar to view a 'crop circle, which had 'mysteriously' appeared overnight on their land.

www.forteanmedia.com/Hville_05.pdf

 

[stu neville]

Personally, I can't see it being any different from one, or more, farmers in the UK, who apparently realised the commercial opportunity and charged similar to view a 'crop circle, which had 'mysteriously' appeared overnight on their land.

The main difference is that- regardless of provenance - the crop circle would be tangibly there to see.

 

[Comfortably Numb]

The main difference is that- regardless of provenance - the crop circle would be tangibly there to see.

So was the Sutton house though.

You seem to know this case well, what do you make of this early documented evidence appearing to unravel what was effectively taken for granted as hardcore testimony.

Where are our floating creatures!?

For myself, that was a real puzzle.

 

[SimonBurchell]

The must-read for Hopkinsville is "Close encounters at Kelly and others of 1955" by Isabel Davis and Ted Bloecher. Get a hard copy, the Kindle formatting is all over the place, making it unreadable, unless it has been fixed in the last year or so.

It is as close to the original encounter as we can get now, anything after the contents of the book is supposition. Among other nuggets, there were not vast numbers of entities, the witnesses only claimed to have seen one at a time, maybe two in one instance, so it could have been repeat sightings of the same being.

 

[stu neville]

So was the Sutton house though.

The house, yes - the alleged phenomenon, no.

You seem to know this case well, what do you make of this early documented evidence appearing to unravel what was effectively taken for granted as hardcore testimony.

As you say it demonstrates the importance of going back to source as much as possible. It's become a slightly debased concept but this is precisely the sort of case for which Occam's Razor is the best examination tool. Strip away the later elaborations and conclusions based on supposition and concentrate on what was said at the time.

Agree the floating motif is the intriguing one.

Edit - Simon got there first

 

[Comfortably Numb]

Agree the floating motif is the intriguing one

First reference to our floating creatures... have eventually found an article which relates. Fast forward to...

1978!

At least confirmation it existed at that point and the following article cites another, which appeared in the May 1978 edition of the, 'International UFO Reporter'.

So... where did the IUFUR get their story from...

Courtesy of 'The Cincinnati Enquirer', 16 June, 1978:

www.forteanmedia.com/Hville_06.pdf

 

[EnolaGaia]

A snapshot, from the 'Madisonville Messenger (Kentucky)', as at 24 August, 1955.
www.forteanmedia.com/Hville_05.pdf

This article claims the witnesses described the UFO that landed as being the size of a No. 2 wash tub. This would be on the order of 25 inches in diameter and 12 inches deep.

I don't recall seeing any other report that was this specific about the appearance and size of the alleged UFO.

It's never been clear to me when during the incident any of the folks could have seen and evaluated the UFO's size. Was it Billy Ray Taylor (who first reported the object to the others) who had the opportunity to view and evaluate the object?

Courtesy of 'The Cincinnati Enquirer', 16 June, 1978:
www.forteanmedia.com/Hville_06.pdf

The 1955 Madisonville article notes the Suttons charged a fee to see the farmhouse and that it was reported as many as 2,000 people came as far as the entrance to the property. However, the writer admits not knowing how many of these visitors may have actually paid the admission fee. This part of the early report clashes with the following ...

This much later Cincinnati article ends by stating:

... the investigators agreed that the Buttons and Taylor, simple farm folks, were not the type to invent such an elaborate hoax. And they did not attempt to exploit the incident.

(Emphasis Added)