Men Chatting Up Female Strangers (Advances; Obtaining Personal Info; etc.)

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catseye

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Cat calling and wolf whistling is a bit 'old school' these days, especially when it involves making your sexism public. Why catcall when you can simply send her a picture of your erect member (if you know someone who knows her mobile number)? Cuts out all that tedious 'having to take her for a drink' bit - you can get right to what's really on your mind!

I know I come over as a man hating feminist here, but I'm really not at all. I was just brought up in a an era where girls had to be good, seen and not heard, and any attention from a man should be met with giggling and coyness, even if he patted your bottom and tried to peer down your blouse. Today's young women won't stand for any of that sort of thing, hopefully (although it still happens) - but there's a more insidious form of sexual bullying available to those who go for that sort of thing. See Incels, unwanted sexting, revenge porn, etc.
 

Coastaljames

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I'm not doubting you ladies, it's just a personal observation, I haven't heard it for years...
I'll be honest...I don't think I've ever heard it! (Disclaimer - I was born in 1976)

It would seem incredibly odd to see and hear...and I'm sure I'm not the only bloke that would pull another guy or a bunch of guys up for it if I did hear it!
 

Coastaljames

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Cat calling and wolf whistling is a bit 'old school' these days, especially when it involves making your sexism public. Why catcall when you can simply send her a picture of your erect member (if you know someone who knows her mobile number)? Cuts out all that tedious 'having to take her for a drink' bit - you can get right to what's really on your mind!

I know I come over as a man hating feminist here, but I'm really not at all. I was just brought up in a an era where girls had to be good, seen and not heard, and any attention from a man should be met with giggling and coyness, even if he patted your bottom and tried to peer down your blouse. Today's young women won't stand for any of that sort of thing, hopefully (although it still happens) - but there's a more insidious form of sexual bullying available to those who go for that sort of thing. See Incels, unwanted sexting, revenge porn, etc.
Good post. And no you don't come across as man-hating. Idiot-hating maybe...lol.
 

catseye

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I mean, I can be as daft and prone to misunderstanding as the next person, and also to taking off with an idea. I think most people on this forum have behaved extremely well in this conversation - and most of the male fraternity have been gratifyingly horrified at the sort of thing women have to put up with sometimes.

Just as I am horrified occasionally at some of the things men have to put up with - but more usually at the hands of other men than women.
 

Coastaljames

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I mean, I can be as daft and prone to misunderstanding as the next person, and also to taking off with an idea. I think most people on this forum have behaved extremely well in this conversation - and most of the male fraternity have been gratifyingly horrified at the sort of thing women have to put up with sometimes.

Just as I am horrified occasionally at some of the things men have to put up with - but more usually at the hands of other men than women.
It's just a case of respecting each and not being an arsehole right?


That's pretty much it...doesn't matter who you are, where you are, or who you're dealing with. Just don't be an arsehole.


(Or, if you're like me, you literally cannot not be an arsehole, then avoid people...for everyone's sake ;))
 

Ringo

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What is this Incels that people keep mentioning? On second thoughts, I'm the father of a young girl and so I'm not sure i want to know.
 

Coastaljames

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Nothing exciting...weird American thing...Incel = Involuntary Celibates.

Normally young, white, males that find it difficult to attract or engage in a relationship with females. So then spend all their energy being hateful to women (wanking in their Mum's basements) with each other online rather than actually sorting their shit out to become a decent person that women would find attractice.

Peculiarily American. Very odd.
 

Yithian

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An incel is a sexually frustrated young man who fails to attract women. The subtext is that this lack of success is not (perhaps not exclusively) his fault; it's seen as a product of the unreasonable/unattainable demands and expectations that society and modern women place on men.

I see nothing new in the complaint--only the label.
 

Cochise

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I had a lot of travelling time yesterday and hence a lot of thinking time and I've decided to recuse myself from this thread.

It's difficult to discuss human reactions without causing offence, I haven't reached that standard

I know my life experience, as it were, has been unusual. I can only speak for myself and to a lesser extent people I've known. On reflection I realise that some of the women I've known (colleagues as well as friends) probably would react as most of the ladies in this discussion have, others I know would not. Because I've seen them in action. I'll leave it there.
 
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onetwothree

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Cor blimey guvnor!

These boards seem to be undergoing an assault from Second Wave Feminism. It's quite thrilling...in a retro kind of way!

I had just come round to seeing FTMB people as being, in essence, a bunch of suburban old codgers - the female version of which would be into knitting and that kind of stuff. But no...the FTMB is now the centre of Angry Wimmin's Revolt Against Phallocratic Patriarchal Oppression!

In keeping with this ambience, I intend to join a Gentleman's Club and wear one of those ties with M.C.P written on it, and carry a rolled up umbrella, and write angry letters to The Times about women who burn their bras and tell my (nonexistent) wife that I expect my supper on the table as soon as I get home from work. (Sigh!)

The trouble is, ladies, is that you might find that the younger gals - if they identify as feminists at all - have now moved on to the Fourth or Fifth wave (I've lost count) which is all, about deconstructing heteronormative narratives (or something) and calling Greer a `transphobe`

I suppose they just need their Consciousnesses Raised though!

Wow. Well, I feel really welcome here now. FFS.
 

James_H

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An incel is a sexually frustrated young man who fails to attract women. The subtext is that this lack of success is not (perhaps not exclusively) his fault; it's seen as a product of the unreasonable/unattainable demands and expectations that society and modern women place on men.

I see nothing new in the complaint--only the label.
I think the new thing is large online communities of them egging each other on. Elliot Rodger, the spree killer, was involved in these communities and is now referred to as 'Saint Elliot' by them.
 

cycleboy2

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As far as I can remember, this is one of the few threads I've not commented on. And after this non-comment I think I'll keep it that way. Along with diversions into politics, this thread (and the political correctness thread) has the potential to become, er, quite heated. Pip pip!
 
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As far as I can remember, this is one of the few threads I've not commented on. And after this non-comment I think I'll keep it that way. Along with diversions into politics, this thread (and the political correctness thread) has the potential to become, er, quite heated. Pip pip!
I have great expectations for it.
 

Min Bannister

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I guess the aspect which may be confusing to some is where the line of 'being an arsehole' lies.
Apparently so though if several different people are all saying pretty much the same thing with illustrations and explanations of exactly why it is arseholery, then it is difficult to see where the confusion still lies.
 

Coastaljames

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Wow. Well, I feel really welcome here now. FFS.
You are...absolutely most definitely!!!

I guess the aspect which may be confusing to some is where the line of 'being an arsehole' lies.
Call me old-fashioned but - "do unto others as you would have do unto them". Don't hurt people, don't make them feel like shit, don't hit them with sticks...because it wouldn't be nice if someone did that to us.
 

James_H

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Apparently so though if several different people are all saying pretty much the same thing with illustrations and explanations of exactly why it is arseholery, then it is difficult to see where the confusion still lies.
We had a poster here a while ago claim that they didn't see how the 'P' word for people of Pakistani descent was offensive - that it was merely a description, like 'yankee'. I've heard people in certain benighted areas of the United States say the same thing of the 'N' word for black people. I'm sure those people were sincere in their beliefs, even though they were dead wrong. So there are people out there who genuinely believe that whistling at a woman in the street is just a bit of banter, and don't realise that they're being an arsehole.

People will go to any lengths to justify their own behaviour to themselves and make themselves believe that they are not doing anything bad, because they don't want to think of themselves as a bad person. This commonly includes ignoring or demonising people who call them out on their behaviour – or, for example, telling they're being too sensitive. Anything to avoid blame resting on themselves.

I think this is interesting (if depressing): I don't know if the reason for it is to do with self-perception, or other's perception, or both.
1 in 3 College Men Admit They Would Rape, If We Don't Call It 'Rape'
 

EnolaGaia

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It seems to me that we've hit bedrock here, with the invocation of simple reciprocity as a guiding principle in social interactions and the acknowledgement that there are individuals whose capacity for self-reflection on their own actions is woefully underdeveloped.

Translation: It strikes me that this thread has run its fair course.
 
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