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'Moonraker's Dolly'—Braces Or Not?

Zeke Newbold said:
Even if you are of the opinion that Dolly never had braces, or anything suggestive of such in this film,then you still have to account for the fact that so many, so many people out there are adamant that she did
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So many, many people "remember" things incorrectly. Myself included. I totally thought that the A-Team Van was all black - but it wasn't. My toy A-Team Van as a kid was all black though.

How many people here remember that Mandela died in prison? I didn't. And I wonder how many people in South Africa remember that?

Lots of people "remember" watching JFK being shot live on TV. Except that it wasn't shown on TV until years later via the Zapruder film.

My brother and I have diametrically opposed memories of certain childhood events - so one of us is wrong. I'm just not sure which one of us.

This is just a silly internet flash in the pan, there are more interesting things to explore.
 
Zeke Newbold said:
and to me constitutes the only really significant `Mandela effect` issue there is
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To a great extent, I do agree.

Zeke Newbold said:
regardless of what the explanation for it turns out to be
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Indeed...

Kingsize Wombat said:
So many, many people "remember" things incorrectly
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You are spot-on with this observation.

However: there are some stubborn aspects associated with the so-called 'Mandela' Effect.

Let me attempt to convey what I mean: and in so doing, it will be in connection with the man himself. Or not.

I have a strong recollection of having seen what I felt was a wince-making encounter on UK television between Mandela and the 90s pop-group The Spice Girls (see http://spicegirls.wikia.com/wiki/Nelson_Mandela).

What I believe I saw depicted was an encounter between them both, which at first approximation (from that fan Wiki) states:

He (Mandela) famously met the Spice Girls along with Prince Charles (The Prince of Wales) in 1997 whilst they were in South Africa. When asked about the Spice Girls, he famously said "They are my Heroes". "One of the greatest moments of my life".
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But when I ask other people about this, they either:

  • insist that this was not shown on television, but just reported in the tabloids, or;
  • ridicule the suggestion that such an encounter ever took place at all
Then the plot thickens further. The Wiki article cited above states:
This event was also spoofed on an episode of the Channel 4 Comedy show, "Star Stories".
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So did I see a televised spoof or the real thing, on tv? (despite not yet finding anyone so far that personally-shares such a memory).

And to further compound things, I've no memory of Prince Charles having been present, in my memory of what I saw (or believed I saw) on tv.

Apologies, this is not meant to deflect this thread from Dolly's braces (which I still deeply-believe I somehow saw at the cinema). But I believe it's another odd slant regarding memories of, and about, Mandela....and the so-called effect, now named after him.
 
Ermintruder said:
I have a strong recollection of having seen what I felt was a wince-making encounter on UK television between Mandela and the 90s pop-group The Spice Girls (see http://spicegirls.wikia.com/wiki/Nelson_Mandela).
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Well, TV footage of that encounter exists:

Of course I have no way of knowing if that was shown in your neck of the woods or not. I never knew about that until now, but few things at the time annoyed me more than the Spice Girls so I might have blocked it out.

The whole thing just demonstrates how feeble our recollections are.
 
Kingsize Wombat said:
So many, many people "remember" things incorrectly. Myself included. I totally thought that the A-Team Van was all black - but it wasn't. My toy A-Team Van as a kid was all black though.

How many people here remember that Mandela died in prison? I didn't. And I wonder how many people in South Africa remember that?

Lots of people "remember" watching JFK being shot live on TV. Except that it wasn't shown on TV until years later via the Zapruder film.

My brother and I have diametrically opposed memories of certain childhood events - so one of us is wrong. I'm just not sure which one of us.

This is just a silly internet flash in the pan, there are more interesting things to explore.
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And I may have mentioned this before on the inaccuracy of memory but it's worth doing it again. In 2001, I think, my wife and I were travelling in New Zealand, and by total coincidence my parents were travelling the other way around the world and we all met at a Thai restaurant towards the top of a skyscraper in Auckland. I brought this up in conversation a while back and none of the other three could remember it! (My parents are elderly but my wife and I remember different things!). However, I had photographs to prove it. Without those pics three quarters of the group would have had an inaccurate memory. Not scientific evidence, but suggestive of the fact that memories are a very inaccurate tool for areas like this. Add in the length of time since the release of the film, other factors such as 'chinese whispers' (if that term is allowed!) and, well, my opinion is that it's the case that the braces were never there. Hey ho.
 
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I've said it before but someone should tweak a fan edit and just CGI some braces on Dolly .. I agree it would have improved the scene ..
 
What I've always found intriguing about the Mandela Effect is that its always stuff that is borderline significant. Like its the Berenstain Bears or "Luke, I am your father". But its never something huge, like people remember seeing JFK shot on TV, but its never "JFK was never shot and he served two terms and ended the cold war and we developed a moon base." Or "the twin towers were destroyed by crashing UFOS, not aeroplanes"

Its always just on the edge of believable. Just enough so that people don't think they are crazy.

Like this Dolly braces thing, its always "Did Dolly have braces?" not "Moonraker was a totally different film about a nuclear attack in the Dover/Deal area of Kent".

Where are all the people that remember living in a world where we had moonbases built by Kennedy or that Moscow was destroyed in nuclear fire. Or even that Russia was the first country to land a man on the moon? Why aren't there Frenchmen crawling out of the Alps swearing blind (in German) that Hitler won World War 2? Why is the Angevin Empire not a world power today? For that matter where are the people that claim the Statue of Liberty used to be a tribute to Julius Ceaser? Why is it just people saying "My lunchbox used to be slightly different" Is it because that would be too unbelievable and this "symptom" relies solely on things being just plausible enough to be true?
 
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Matthew1034 said:
What I've always found intriguing about the Mandela Effect is that its always stuff that is borderline significant. Like its the Berenstain Bears or "Luke, I am your father". But its never something huge ...
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That's a very good point.

I suspect it has to do with the memories being of small, peripheral, and / or relatively insignificant details that aren't sufficiently 'burned into' memory to leave you certain what happened. If the memory is tentative / weak, it's a lot easier to start second-guessing your recollection(s) - especially if others are claiming something contrary to what you remember (or thought you remembered).
 
If I haven't posted this already, there's another digital manipulation story associated with Bond. I'm not sure how reliable it is but it is a good story. It involves a pair of gloves and a potential million dollar reshoot.

How Daniel Craig nearly ruined Skyfall with a nice pair of gloves
The kind of mistake that can happen when you're bored of playing Bond.

As behind-the-scenes anecdotes go, this is a humdinger.....
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http://www.independent.co.uk/arts-e...fall-with-a-nice-pair-of-gloves-a7118216.html
 
Matthew1034 said:
What I've always found intriguing about the Mandela Effect is that its always stuff that is borderline significant. Like its the Berenstain Bears or "Luke, I am your father". But its never something huge, like people remember seeing JFK shot on TV, but its never "JFK was never shot and he served two terms and ended the cold war and we developed a moon base." Or "the twin towers were destroyed by crashing UFOS, not aeroplanes"

Its always just on the edge of believable. Just enough so that people don't think they are crazy.
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Whoa! Hang on! The `Mandela Effect` gets its name from people who claim to remember Nelson Mandela dying in prison in the 1980's! You can hardly get any more `huge` than that!

If that had happened then Apartheid may never have ended and someone else would have been president of Soutbh Africa from the late eighties up to the early noughties -which would have had multiple geopolitical significances!

In fact, it is for this very reason, that I have always regarded this aspet of the supposed phenomena -including it's very name - as something as an embarrasment.(People must have confused the death of Biko in police custody with the fact that Mandela was seriosly ill whilst in prison and required surgery).

There are also people who claiim to recall the world map being substantially different - particularly around Australia and South America!

But, yes, it is those small, niggling details - such as a whole lot of people thinking that the Monopoly mascot guy sported a monocle, or not knowing that C3PO had a silver leg - that are more convincing, and which point to some interesting psychological syndrome, along the lines of mass confabulation, that impress me.
 
Zeke Newbold said:
In fact, it is for this very reason, that I have always regarded this aspet of the supposed phenomena -including it's very name - as something as an embarrasment.(People must have confused the death of Biko in police custody with the fact that Mandela was seriosly ill whilst in prison and required surgery).
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Yes - reckon that was it.
 
No. Here is how it goes. There's a parallel dimension where everything is shittier and slightly more lacklustre than the world we perceive.
Just look at the passport booth picture of yourself. As Alexei Sayle observed, this is not a reflection of you in a booth but a window into an alternate dimension which sees you older, with less glamour and saddled with the true burdens of what life does to you.

That slightly sadder dimension of Almost also created a Hadron Collider. Due to an administrative email error, it became known as The Hardon Collider but, although mails were sent, the people of that dimension said, 'Oh well, what the fuck does it matter?'

Anyway. At the exact same point we switched ours on, the Hardon Collider was also switched on which created a crossing of the streams which flipped our reality into their half-arsed that'll do Universe.

It explains a lot.
 
Ok, there is a strange land mass west of Australia...

Weird. Not. Totally solved with about 5 seconds on Google:

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Source: https://concordiaabchao.wordpress.com/2017/01/05/is-there-a-mysterious-island-west-of-australia/
 
Vardoger said:
Probably more wrong memories than Mandela effect, but then there's this video...

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This one has been explained away to my satisfaction. What you see to the left of Australia is not a new landmass - but a logo. It is the logo of the company that produces the globes, and they just happen to have placed it there.

Maybe some globe owner out there can confirm this?
 
Zeke Newbold said:
What you see to the left of Australia is not a new landmass - but a logo. It is the logo of the company that produces the globes, and they just happen to have placed it there.
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Where's new zealand on that globe?

Actually what is that video anyway? I mean I get they're saying it shows different geography than the world as we know it - but even i it does what's the significance of that particular piece of footage, what's the story behind it?
 
What 'time line' would that be?
 
I've never heard of this misremembered maps business before but now I've glanced at several youtube videos and its clearly an idea strongly held out there..what's really interesting is how merely suggesting an alternative memory can convince you you remember it that way too. The one that has now got me - in the last several minutes - is people pointing out how far east the south american land mass is from North America...and how it "used to be" almost directly beneath it. Now I'm convinced that was my perception too! But did I always think that way or has the idea just been implanted in my mind in the last ten minutes. Would I have ever noticed anything odd about their relative locations if I hadn't just watched those videos?
 
gattino said:
The one that has now got me - in the last several minutes - is people pointing out how far east the south american land mass is from North America...and how it "used to be" almost directly beneath it. Now I'm convinced that was my perception too!
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My perception too.
I just checked on Google maps, and South America is waaay over to the East.
I suspect that this variation may be the difference between a flat projection and a projection on a globe.
 
Well I think part of the claim of a mandela effect is that *all* the maps, even historical ones, "now" show it the way it apparently is and not how we thought it was. I can see how the mind might play tricks in this case..If I just looked at a map of the Americas now without having any concept of the Mandela effect, I suspect it would look perfectly normal to me..that is I'm not anticipating anything being out of place so my thoughts don't give it any consideration. But when I'm looking to SEE if it looks wrong I then start giving attention to their relative positions and imagining the alternative version seems more correct. That's to say I've now been prompted to think how it may look wrong.
 
Agree with the above posts. I think a lot of this is just a reflection of the woeful geographical ignorance of a lot of North Americans, in particular. Also the diferences between the appearance of maps on a globe and flat maps.

However, I can't account for the lack of New Zealand on the map in `Dazed and Confused`!Likewise there's a woman on Facebook who grew up in Galveston inTexas who is adamant that Pelican Island, off the coast there is radically different than the one she knew as a child. (I've been trying to post the link for this but, for some reason it just doesn't take. Just Type in Mandela Effect, Galveston. New Pelican Island and that should take you there). Either she's totally barmy, or there's more to this than one might at fisrt suppose.
 
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