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Mr. Spock

C.O.T.

C.O.T.

Devoted Cultist
Joined
Dec 29, 2020
Messages
157
Location
Spain
Hi, do you think that Mr Spock is one of the most charismatic fictional characters of the past century, as Dracula, Sherlock Holmes or others fictional characters? But..from were come his energy? What makes him interesting? What do you think.
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It is because of Spock that I became a Trekkie fan. I think what drew me to the character was because he is half human. He had internal conflict within the character and always questioned who he was - human or Vulcan. It sets up a perfect platform to question what it is that makes us human.

Data from TNG has also been one of my favourite characters for the same reason. His character allows for the same exploration of humanity.
 
I'm not much of a trekkie, but Leonard Nimoy's loss affected me quite a bit. To me, he was more the star of the show than Shatner ever was. His appearances in the most recent movies were a joy, much better than everything happening around him. It's what Nimoy brought to what one might think would be an unsympathetic and distant character that made us relate to him. Perhaps we'd all like to be more in control of our feelings, and perhaps we all struggle with them occasionally.

Nimoy played Spock for decades, but I never felt the integrity of the characterisation was violated, even though he sometimes did lose control when there was good reason. In contrast, Zachary Quinto's Spock felt to me like a whiny brat who was barely keeping it together pretty much from the beginning. Quinto dismantled in one movie what Nimoy had built over half a century.
 
I agree totally, when we talk about Spock we talk about Nimoy work, agree too that Spock was the center and kirck seemed a secondary when confronted.
Spock was sorrounded whit a mistery that was quite eerie. I confess that i was secretly suspecting that he would become an evil character, something as the android characters in alien.
 
The other actors on TOS just did acting but Nimoy was responsible for a lot of the creation of vulcan culture and characteristics.
 
PeteByrdie said:
I'm not much of a trekkie, but Leonard Nimoy's loss affected me quite a bit. To me, he was more the star of the show than Shatner ever was. His appearances in the most recent movies were a joy, much better than everything happening around him. It's what Nimoy brought to what one might think would be an unsympathetic and distant character that made us relate to him. Perhaps we'd all like to be more in control of our feelings, and perhaps we all struggle with them occasionally.

Nimoy played Spock for decades, but I never felt the integrity of the characterisation was violated, even though he sometimes did lose control when there was good reason. In contrast, Zachary Quinto's Spock felt to me like a whiny brat who was barely keeping it together pretty much from the beginning. Quinto dismantled in one movie what Nimoy had built over half a century.
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I think that Nimoy recognized that Spock was important to a lot of fans. He has never rejected his character as some actors do when "typecast". He took Spock seriously and this, I think can be seen in @Victory's post 3 link to an interview with Nimoy. It is also important, I think, that writers and directors did work alongside with Nimoy to stay true to the character. That is a major undertaking after decades, the tv series and films stayed true.

I also enjoyed Spock's dry sense of humour.
 
The Spock character was, I think, one of Roddenberry's best inventions. Casting Nimoy was another stroke of brilliance, right up there with putting Nichelle Nichols on the bridge as an officer. Ol' Leonard nailed the character in the pilot(s), and then went on to develop Spock in the best way possible. I don't think many other actors would have been so believable as a half alien "science officer".
 
To me the thing that made Spock popular with the fans is that he was always the outsider: not at all at home among humans, and not entirely comfortable among Vulcans, either. In other words, he was someone that geeky science fiction fans could identify with in those days before The Big Bang Theory made them cool. He was unfamiliar with the proper way to express emotions, and like many fanboys was uncomfortable when women expressed attraction. But he was cool, an intelligent and respected officer, and that gave the outsiders in the audience hope for themselves.

A lot of female fans found him attractive, in part because he was intelligent and successful, but not constantly trying to get in their pants - which made them want to get in his pants. This was mirrored by the dynamic between him and Nurse Chapel. (By the way, there was a LOT of Spock-based erotic fan fiction back when the show was still new.)

Since I don't recognize the reboot movies as existing in the same multiverse as TOS, I'm more forgiving of Quinto's Spock - but yeah, he's no Nimoy.
 
ChasFink said:
Since I don't recognize the reboot movies as existing in the same multiverse as TOS, I'm more forgiving of Quinto's Spock - but yeah, he's no Nimoy.
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Quinto annoyed me by interpreting Spock as an angry person. Spock was only ever supposed to get angry under special circumstances.
 
Mandela effect aside I definitely remember reading that Spock's home planet was not called Vulcan, it was just where Vulcans lived. Then one day it became and always had been the planet Vulcan. I hate canonical history re-writers.
 
Bad Bungle said:
Mandela effect aside I definitely remember reading that Spock's home planet was not called Vulcan....
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I think you are almost correct. I seem to remember Vulcan was always the planet but the inhabitants were Vulcanians by name and became Vulcans later on.

One day I'll dig out the Star Trek encyclopedia double check, but in the early days of the Original Star Trek there was a lot of things in flux. Like the United Earth Space Probe Agency being the authority rather than Starfleet, only 12 "starship" class ships like the Enterprise and other such things.

Continuity as we know know it only came in the later series and was subsequently broken in places by 'Star Trek: Enterprise' and 'Star Trek: Discovery'
 
I think I read somewhere that Vulcan was used to imply Martian, seeing as how both names apply to the same planet in Earth history as we know it, or knew it before they started futzing with colliders and such. Or something.
 
Bad Bungle said:
Mandela effect aside I definitely remember reading that Spock's home planet was not called Vulcan, it was just where Vulcans lived. Then one day it became and always had been the planet Vulcan. I hate canonical history re-writers.
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suburban wolf said:
I think you are almost correct. I seem to remember Vulcan was always the planet but the inhabitants were Vulcanians by name and became Vulcans later on.

One day I'll dig out the Star Trek encyclopedia double check, but in the early days of the Original Star Trek there was a lot of things in flux. Like the United Earth Space Probe Agency being the authority rather than Starfleet, only 12 "starship" class ships like the Enterprise and other such things.

Continuity as we know know it only came in the later series and was subsequently broken in places by 'Star Trek: Enterprise' and 'Star Trek: Discovery'
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Yes, originally the planet was named Vulcanis and the natives Vucanians. I think the only reference on screen was when Harry Mudd said "You're part Vucanian, aren't you?"

Not a Mandela effect, just a tweak of the writer's guide.
 
Austin Popper said:
I think I read somewhere that Vulcan was used to imply Martian, seeing as how both names apply to the same planet in Earth history as we know it, or knew it before they started futzing with colliders and such. Or something.
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I don't know if Vulcan was ever used as a name for Mars, but it was the name of a hypothesized planet in orbit very near the Sun, whose gravity was supposed to explain irregularities in the calculated orbits of the known solar system. It turned out that Vulcan didn't exist, the "irregularities" being the difference between Newtonian and Einsteinian physics.

As for Star Trek, Spock's alien ancestry was not pinned down in early drafts of the series concept, being referred to as something like "possibly part Martian".
 
One thing about Spock that doesn't sit well with me now is his mixed ancestry. Relatively closely related species are not biologically compatible. It wouldn't bother me so much except that it's become a common trope in science fiction for humans to breed with aliens and it's never questioned, and Spock was the first example of this I remember.
 
PeteByrdie said:
One thing about Spock that doesn't sit well with me now is his mixed ancestry. Relatively closely related species are not biologically compatible. It wouldn't bother me so much except that it's become a common trope in science fiction for humans to breed with aliens and it's never questioned, and Spock was the first example of this I remember.
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isn't this part of the Big Reveal at the end of TNG?
 
Frideswide said:
isn't this part of the Big Reveal at the end of TNG?
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Wow. I didn't think I'd be the expert at answering things here, especially in reference to Trek series I'm not 100% familiar with.

I don't remember any reference to alien crossbreeding in TNG's ending, but there was in Enterprise: near the end of the series there was a baby produced by an artificial mixing of genetic material of a Vulcan and a human. Science minded fans have long speculated this would have been necessary with Spock, given the vast differences between human and Vulcan physiology. It would also explain why Spock is apparently more Vulcan than human. I believe TOS & TAS story editor D.C. Fontana agreed with this, but it was not made canon under her watch.

Of course, this does not explain the large number of apparently "natural" half-breeds in Trek and elsewhere.
 
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