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New / Non-Traditional Corpse Treatment & Interment Strategies

Looking for somewhere to bury your stiff? You might be out of luck!!!

When there is no more room in hell
the Dead shall walk the Earth

Seems like we are running out of places to bury people in the UK - lucky I'm immortal but I do feel sorry for everyone else.

Last Updated: Thursday, 15 January, 2004, 15:23 GMT

Burial law consultation unveiled


Reusing old graves is the government's preferred option for tackling the problem of overcrowded cemeteries.

The idea is being put out to public consultation but ministers say families could be allowed to opt out.

Home Office Minister Paul Goggins said there could be a "pressing problem" if long-term action is not taken.

The consultation will look at all the rules covering burials in England and Wales which have developed over the past 200 years.

There are currently different rules for public and church land and there are no laws covering burials on private land.

Under the new proposal, bodies could be exhumed and reburied at a deeper level to allow new coffins to be laid on top.

The government acknowledges there could be cultural and religious objections to graves which are more than one burial deep.

But the consultation document says there is "absolutely no question" of making reuse compulsory.

Families could be given the chance to opt out and war graves would be exempt, it says.

Launching the paper, Mr Goggins said: "There is pressure on space and so the question is: should we bring in new powers to reuse burial grounds?

"This is not a massive crisis today but if we don't look at it in the long term, it will become a pressing problem."

Decomposition time

The minister said there would be questions about how long somebody should have been buried before reburial was considered.

The document asks whether 100 years might be appropriate - to ensure only skeletal remains were affected.

Alternatively, there could be a "scientific approach" where the effect of local soil on decomposition could be assessed.

Mr Goggins added: "This is a hugely sensitive issue.

"Legislation has been founded on a piecemeal basis over 200 years and I think everybody is agreed there is a need for reform."

New inspectors?

The Home Office will this year conduct a survey of all 25,000 burial grounds in England and Wales to look at shortage of space and other problems.

Research seven years ago suggested inner London burial grounds would be full by this year - but the government cannot say what the current situation is.

They are also looking at creating new inspectors to ensure burial grounds comply with the law and set standards.

The consultation was welcomed by Anne Viney, chief executive of Cruse Bereavement Care.

Sensitivity sought

She said the move was part of a more open and healthier approach to death and bereavement.

"Some people will feel sensitive about the issue of graves being re-used at all, irrespective of whether they are their personal, family graves," she said.

"We are looking for sensitivity and sustainability."

The consultation comes three years after the Commons environment select committee report called for reuse of graves.

The committee attacked the government for allowing many cemeteries to become so run-down as to "shame all society" in their lack of respect for the dead.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/politics/3398007.stm

Emps
 
Personally I would like to be buried at sea. I'm perfectly serious about this. Seems a sensible alternative bearing in mind the above situation.

Bill Robinson
 
This Grave Is For Life crap is so recent.... and if people say that it's a christian thing to want your body buried undisturbed then refer them to Augustine of Hippo!

GRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRARGH!!!!:hmph:
sometimes I want to kick people very very hard.

Kath

PS I think I've had to much sugar!:D
 
if if IF!!!

If I ever get a chance to produce a corpse [mine, that is!] I want to have my un-autopsied, un-embalmed badass self to be buried way up high in a tree.

Of course, it's ILLEGAL to do so where I live. The state I live in demands embalming to be performed before burial... so much for "the land of the free."


Trace Mann
 
overwhere? will the uk do?

I think it's about 70-75% depending on where you are.

Kath
 
Dammit, I was planning my own pyramid too....

But people should be more respectful of the dead, like not putting plastic windmills and worse on the graves...(as in an urban cemetry I know. Im my village cemetry they are certainly not allowed!)

How about re introducing vultures to this country and having Parsee burials??

Woodland burials are a good idea too.

I believe we should all be buried in a fashion that will cause maximum enjoyment and interest for archaologists of the future...
 
stonedoggy said:
overwhere? will the uk do?

I think it's about 70-75% depending on where you are.

Kath
Yes, the UK. Don't you read minds, Stonedoggy? :D Sorry.

That or burial at sea, donating one's body to science or the Body Farm, (I'm thinking of doing that!):blah:
Course your family is then stuck for what to do about a memorial where they can go and 'visit' like people do with graves now. :(
 
midnight - love the body farm idea.....

my main confusion was that I can't remember where you are so overthere could be anywhere :)


Kath
 
Midnight sez:
Course your family is then stuck for what to do about a memorial where they can go and 'visit' like people do with graves now

Oh, like the kids visit now! Two generations past, and you're just takin' up space.


Burial at sea would seem to be ecologically friendly, but doesn't really give a feel for your bones being "at rest".

Creamation seems like the best solution.

Either that, or sell plots to sportsfans to be buried in the structure of th new local sports stadium a' la Jimmie Hoffa. They could even help defer costs and avoid burdening the taxpayer! Of course, that would give the team a huge incentive to have a winning season! Wouldn't want to displease the spirits of your ancestors!!
 
Stonedoggy, my fault. I'm just kidding you. ;)

Philo T said:
Either that, or sell plots to sportsfans to be buried in the structure of th new local sports stadium a' la Jimmie Hoffa. They could even help defer costs and avoid burdening the taxpayer! Of course, that would give the team a huge incentive to have a winning season! Wouldn't want to displease the spirits of your ancestors!!

Oh, that is priceless!! Too bad they just finished renovating Soldier Field in Chicago.
There's another thing I've heard of, nice idea.

Artificial reefs to be made from human ashes

A funeral home is giving people the chance to have their ashes made into an artifical reef off the US coast.

McAlister Smith Funeral Home in Charleston is working on the project with Atlanta's Eternal Reefs Inc.

For $850, the equivalent of £590, the reef company will include ashes in a dome-like structure.

The ashes are mixed with concrete in the structure, which will be sunk in 45 feet of water about 10 miles from Charleston, South Carolina.

A plaque honouring the deceased is included in the price, although cremation must be paid for separately.

Funeral home manager Brad Evans says: "We thought this was a great idea because of how Charleston relates to the water.

"Some people scatter their remains at sea or at the beach, but this will create a permanent memorial."

Bob Martore, who co-ordinates the state's artificial reef programme, says: "We have memorial reefs named after people, but we've never actually had people in the reefs themselves."

Eternal Reefs has mixed the remains of about 60 people so far, says company president Don Brawley.
 
No one cared too much in the old days- before cemetries everyone had to cram in the same tiny parish graveyard, and if unidentifyable bones got dug up they were just chucked back in or even left lying round. I lived in a little village in the late 60s/early 70s that had a small round graveyard, when bones were found during gravedigging the digger would just toss them inside the graves enclosed with iron railings, there were quite large pieces of skull and other bones lying round in clear view. My mother complained to the vicar and they all disappeared, I think she was a spoilsport, they didn't bother me at all!
It isn't seen as wrong (as a general cultural thing) in the UK for old bones to be moved, discarded, studied or even played with, causing clashes with other cultures when Brit archaeologists turn up and want to run off with the ancestors!
 
Midnight:
The mob's been building artificial reefs for years, yet they're still maligned by the forces of law and order!


There's all sorts of things you can do with ashes. Like creating diamonds with them, as LifeGem does. (Couldn't find a online link for them, odd.)

Although I do appreciate the reminder of the naturalness of mortality that you get from say, digging up the old bones and collecting them in a crypt in the churchyard.
 
Philo T said:
Midnight:
The mob's been building artificial reefs for years, yet they're still maligned by the forces of law and order!
:rofl: :rofl:

There's all sorts of things you can do with ashes. Like creating diamonds with them, as LifeGem does. (Couldn't find a online link for them, odd.)
Although I do appreciate the reminder of the naturalness of mortality that you get from say, digging up the old bones and collecting them in a crypt in the churchyard.
I like this one, have you heard of it:
http://www.cnn.com/2000/HEALTH/10/31/body.farm/

I understand it's hard to get in there because they have so many donors! So they have to have a fence around the joint because people are dying to get in....!:heh: Sorry.
 
Cremation and dispersal seems like the only way to do it, IMHO.

Aside: After Ben died we needed to get his box of ashes back from California (yup, a box, I mean who needs an urn?). The mortuary asked me if I wanted to take his remains on the plane as a carry-on.

I was virtually speechless. It was like a question that would lead to some "wacky" scenario out of a sit-com. Suffice to say I let them handle the shipping. :rolleyes:
 
I think I'm going to be burried with a spoon, so that if I get dug up by the 29th century version of Tony Robinson they can get all confused and say that it's 'ritual'.
 
I'm not sure why moving bones should be a problem now - it didn't used to be, and in many places still isn't. That fancy graveyard in New Orleans - the one you see in all the movies - routinely rotates people out of the tombs because there's only so much space. If your family wants to keep you there, they have to keep paying. It's the same way with many cemeteries in Europe. If we didn't insist on embalming people, the problem would solve itself. As for memorials - put up a plaque or something in a place that would mean something to your loved one. I can think of worse memorial to me than a dedicated wastebasket on the River Walk, or a "Peni Griffin shelf" at the library.

I personally would prefer to be composted - I mean, honestly, isn't that what a dead body is *for?* Dust has to return to dust or the dust runs out, for pity's sake. (Did you know most dust is sloughed dead skin cells? So that's one line of the Bible that literally is true.) North Carolina is presently the only state in the U.S. which doesn't require embalming, which is why Mulder was buried there when he was presumed dead, for those of you who were wondering why he didn't go to a family plot in Massachusetts. Cremation has nasty toxic byproducts and is not as tidy as most people think. Experiments with dead bodies have revealed that, while an untreated body can be recycled into the environment in as little as a week, an embalmed one hangs around indefinitely, doing no one any good.

My paternal grandparents got around this problem by willing their bodies to science. I'm not sure what was done with them, or what will be left at the end of the process; but if you are used to, for example, train cadaver dogs or study the process of decomposition, your chances of rotting down nicely are pretty good. I think medical cadavers are eventually cremated. Anyway, Gramma was represented at her funeral by a table made by Grampa, a table cloth made by Gramma, a vase of lilies, and a photograph. Her memorials sat in the front pew, except for the littlest ones, who were carried off to the church nursery to play.

That's good enough. If your best memorial is a carved rock and a hole in the ground, you might as well not have lived.
 
i think getting stuffed would be better, then either being used as in a "living museum" (maybe with animatronics?) scene, or you can take them home (bit like early s. american/ pacific cultures).

then your ancestors are still with you (to get get passed down the generations)

(ps i may have posted elsewhere something similer elsewhere)
 
i like the diamond idea but in real life... would you really want to spend however many thousands it was (i looked for a link too, couldn't find) to give someone a shiny jewel? Would you want to wear it?? Not sure.

anyway what i wanted to mention was St Anne's churchyard in Soho, in London - at the bottom of Wardour St on the left as you go south into Chinatown.

See how it's about 6 feet above street level, apparently this is because of the bodies all piled on top of one another in the Victorian era. Also didn't the Victorians come up with all the laws about burying people (like about 6ft under and stuff) because everytime they dug a hole in a graveyard they were digging up someone else from a couple of months ago to stick in the most recent body.

Well my preference is for the cardboard box in a forest. (I previously thought cremation but i'll take your word for it Peni that it's bad for the environment)

Sorry, my usual 'i think i heard this somewhere' vague, unsourced and possibly even not true stuff:(
 
Peni said:
North Carolina is presently the only state in the U.S. which doesn't require embalming, which is why Mulder was buried there when he was presumed dead, for those of you who were wondering why he didn't go to a family plot in Massachusetts

My paternal grandparents got around this problem by willing their bodies to science. I'm not sure what was done with them, or what will be left at the end of the process; but if you are used to, for example, train cadaver dogs or study the process of decomposition, your chances of rotting down nicely are pretty good. I think medical cadavers are eventually cremated. Anyway, Gramma was represented at her funeral by a table made by Grampa, a table cloth made by Gramma, a vase of lilies, and a photograph. Her memorials sat in the front pew, except for the littlest ones, who were carried off to the church nursery to play.

That's good enough. If your best memorial is a carved rock and a hole in the ground, you might as well not have lived.


I think it's optional in Upstate New York, the only problem is that most funeral homes won't accept your body if it isn't embalmed.


I once thought of donating my body to science, but what if they use it to help create bio-weapons, or some kind of viral weaponry? I know the chances of that happening are slim, but there is a chance none the less! Screw them and their so-called science, say I!

Trace [Neo-Luddite, when it comes to Forensics!] Mann
 
What do people with non-biodegradable prostheses usually do for disposal of their bodies?

Surely burial is out unless you want the parts to still be there in 2000 years time? I guess being dead you might not be too bothered, but the idea of it is weird to think about while you're still alive.

Cremation will take out some types of prosthesis if not always completely (eg breast implants, which can leave a splodge in the incinerator).

I suppose there's the option to just dispose of the fleshy parts. Maybe I'm just being overly sentimental about morphology...
 
The Heavenly Globe of Tears

Forget your cremations, being embedded in artifical gem stones, etc. this is the kind of thing Forteans need:

http://www.bullworks.net/invest/globe.htm

If I don't find something better (I'm still angling on being shot into space - I'm not sure if that will be a capsule of ashes or just how I die but.........) I'm bloody well going to have this done!! My backup to these is still having myself cooked and eaten by my friends and family but I'm still unsure about the legality of that.

[edit: Just make sure you read the fine print!!]

Emps
 
I'd like to be stuffed and mounted.
Then when I'm dead I think the only fitting send off would be some kind of temple or pyramid with all my family and friends bricked up inside with me. Obviously we'd only need a small chamber for them but I reckon that something like the Taj Mahal would be just spiffy.
 
Re: The Heavenly Globe of Tears

Emperor said:
[edit: Just make sure you read the fine print!!]

Emps

:rofl: :D

I prefer the stuffed and mounted option myself ;)

Jane.
 
Re: Re: The Heavenly Globe of Tears

mejane said:
I prefer the stuffed and mounted option myself ;)

Theres a joke or two in there somewhere ;)

Anyay how about this option:

Warm approval for a cold end

From AP
February 10, 2004

STOCKHOLM: Rather than bury or burn bodies after death, a Swedish company has come up with a chilling alternative – freezing them in liquid nitrogen, then using soundwaves to smash the brittle remains into a powder.

Concerns about the environmental impact of cremation, where a body is incinerated at high temperature, and burial, in which a body can take many years to decompose, has led Swedish firm Promessa Organic AB to the new solution.

The process involves flash-freezing bodies to – 18C, then dipping them in liquid nitrogen with a temperature of -196C. The bodies, extracted from the super-cold solution, are brittle as glass and broken down with bursts of sound to leave a powder substance.

From there, all water is removed in a vacuum chamber before the remains are moved through a metal screen that filters away any precious metals in fillings or remnants of pacemakers and other implants that may have survived the freezing process.

"The method is based upon preserving the body in a biological form after death, while avoiding harmful embalming fluid," said Susanne Wiigh-Maesak, a biologist and head of operations at Promessa, based in Goteborg, 475km southwest of Stockholm.

She said the authorities in nearby Joenkoeping were ready to start operating its first freeze-drying facility in the next couple of years. She has also applied for a patent for the process in 35 countries.

The remains, she said, could be then cremated or buried in a coffin crafted from corn starch. The small casket could be placed in a shallow grave - about 30cm deep - where oxygen and bacteria would take about a year to break them down and return them to the soil.

"On top of the grave you can set a plant, that is taking advantage of the nutrients in the 'compost'," Wiigh-Maesak said, adding that she herself would very much like to become a white rhododendron.

http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/common/story_page/0,5744,8632669%5E29677,00.html
 
Cremation is illegal in Greece. So is burial at sea. So is almost every other means of getting rid of your mortal remains, except burial (you could donate yourself to science, but what do you think they do with the leftovers? Yep, bury them!).
THIS IS SO STUPID!
Personally, I don't care what they do with the remains. What about dog-food?
 
ebay!

Ecological and cost effective. Ooops, and illegal. Damn.

Hey! Why not an organ futures market?!!! The only problem would be ensuring that someone in need doesn't actively try to make parts come onto the market.
 
I bet he got a shot out of this

Husband's ashes used for shotgun cartridges

By Auslan Cramb
(Filed: 16/02/2004)


The widow of an expert on vintage shotguns had her husband's ashes loaded into cartridges and used by friends for the last shoot of the season.


Joanna Booth organised the shoot for 20 close friends on an estate in Aberdeenshire after asking a cartridge company to mix the ashes of her husband James with traditional shot.

A total of 275 12-bore cartridges were produced from the mix and were blessed by a minister before they were used to bag pheasants, partridges, ducks and a fox on Brucklay Estate.

Mrs Booth, of Streatham, south London, said it was a marvellous day out and her husband would have loved it. "It was not his dying wish, but I remembered that he had read somewhere that someone had had their ashes loaded into cartridges and he thought it was very funny.

"One of our friends, a woman who had never shot before, got four partridges with James's marked cartridges."


Mr Booth, an independent sporting and vintage gun specialist for Sotheby's in London, died two years ago, aged 50, after 18 months in a coma following severe food poisoning.

Julian McHardy, of the Caledonian Cartridge Company in Brechin, Angus, said it was the first request he had received to put ashes in shotgun cartridges. "He was loaded in our Caledonian Classic, a 28 gramme load, No 6 shot with degradable plastic wadding."

Before the first drive, the cartridges were blessed by the Rev Alistair Donald, the Church of Scotland minister from the nearby village of New Deer, who said he had no qualms. "It was a perfectly normal scattering of ashes, a few words and prayers. After all, he had a lifelong interest in ballistics."

The special cartridges accounted for 70 partridges, 23 pheasants, seven ducks and a fox on Jan 31.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/mai...art16.xml&sSheet=/news/2004/02/16/ixhome.html

Emps
 
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