Pathological / Compulsive Lying

[Floyd1]

2) "If I say this, I'll get a dopamine hit and feel good for a fleeting moment..." (Of course, the compulsive/pathological liar doesn't think it through in these terms, but this is what I think is going on beneath the surface.) An outside observer can see no outside objective benefit for the liar. Everything the liar gains is subjective and internal.

I could tell everyone that I am an F1 Driver but I'd know that it wasn't true. I can't comprehend how that would make anyone 'feel good' (I'm not saying that you are wrong, I just don't understand their reasoning).
(Speaking as someone who once had a compulsive lying girlfriend).

 

[ramonmercado]

The plot thickens regarding campaign finance fraud allegations.

GOP Rep. George Santos, the newly elected House member from New York who has admitted to fabricating his work and education history, is now being accused of extensive campaign finance violations.

Monday’s allegations come in a complaint the nonpartisan Campaign Legal Center filed with the Federal Election Commission, which could proceed with a formal investigation into Santos. The complaint broadly accuses Santos ― who is already facing other federal and local investigations into lies about his background ― of using his 2022 campaign funds to cover personal needs, lying about how his campaign spent money and hiding the origin of his campaign funds.

Santos, the new complaint claims, has been “knowingly and willfully concealing the true sources of his campaign’s funding, misrepresenting how his campaign spent its money, and illegally paying for personal expenses with campaign funds. Particularly in light of Santos’s mountain of lies about his life and qualifications for office, the Commission should thoroughly investigate what appear to be equally brazen lies about how his campaign raised and spent money.”

Santos’ campaign finance reports contain numerous red flags, the watchdog notes. One is his claim that he loaned $705,000 to his own campaign, even though 2020 records indicate he only had $55,000 to his name. His claims that he earned millions in 2021 and 2022 from a consulting business are “vague, uncorroborated, and non-credible in light of his many previous lies,” the group alleges.

The FEC last week demanded that Santos provide more information about contributions and certain donors to his campaign, according to CNN.

In its complaint, the Campaign Legal Center also flagged dozens of expenses in Santos’ records totaling exactly $199.99 ― just one cent under the amount for which the FEC requires itemized receipts.

“The sheer number of these just-under-$200 disbursements is implausible,” the group says, “and some payments appear to be impossible given the nature of the item or service covered.”

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/george-santos-campaign-violations_n_63bc4cbce4b0ae9de1c05ada

He continues to lie about saying he was Jewish and his mother, she wasn't even in the US on 9/11. Maybe she lied to him.

Congressman George Santos has admitted to having been "a terrible liar" when confronted with his embellished resume in a new TV interview.

The embattled Republican told TalkTV's Piers Morgan he had made mistakes under pressure but his lies were not about "tricking the people". Instead, he said, it was about "getting accepted by the party here locally". ...

He reiterated his claim that he had never said he was Jewish, and repeated what he described as a "party-favourite joke" by describing himself as "Jew-ish".

Challenged over a claim that his mother was in the South Tower of the World Trade Centre in New York City on 9/11, Mr Santos said: "That's true. I won't debate my mother's life as she's passed in [2016] and it's quite insensitive to try to rehash my mother's legacy," he said.
He added: "She wasn't one to mislead me... I stay convinced that's the truth." ...

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-64712914

 

[Mikefule]

I'm not sure if this is the right thread, but here's an observation on "unnecessary lying" for no material gain.

I ride a Moto Guzzi V7 ii Stone. That is pretty much the cheapest and least glamorous motorbike made by Moto Guzzi. However, it has the key features associated with the marque: an air cooled in line V twin motor, a shaft drive, and a "traditional" look. It looks good, sounds good, and attracts attention. People come up to talk to me about it.

Back in the 1970s, the Moto Guzzi 850 Le Mans was supposedly the fastest production motorbike in the world. It was a "big beast" and carried a lot of credibility.

Today, as I was sitting outside a cafe, a middle aged very respectable couple came up to me, ostensibly to tell me how much they admired my Guzzi.

It quickly became apparent that the real reason was to humble brag about their 10 bikes ("mostly Ducatis...") and to tell me that they once owned a Moto Guzzi Le Mans 850.

Funny thing is, no one has ever come up to me to say that they used to own a Moto Guzzi California, or Nevada, or Griso, or Norge, or any of the many other models that Guzzi have made in their 102 year history. However, countless people have told me they used to have an 850 Le Mans.

Of course, it is possible that some were telling the truth, but come on: they can't all have once owned the one model of classic Guzzi that everyone knows about. When I was in the owner's club, only a few owned, or had owned, the 850 Le Mans. It was the Holy Grail of Guzzis.

Conclusion: many, most, or possibly all, of these people who tell me that they once had an 850 Le Mans are pointlessly lying to a stranger.

They gain nothing tangible from this, and they certainly get no validation back from me. I smile and say, "Did you?" and that's about it.

This seems to be a biker's version of "I used to be in the SAS". The biggest regiment in the Army is the Ex SAS, closely followed by the "Former 2 Para.".

It seems common to tell lies to complete strangers for no other reason but that it feels good to say something glamorous about yourself knowing you are unlikely to be challenged.

 

[Floyd1]

I'm not sure if this is the right thread, but here's an observation on "unnecessary lying" for no material gain.

I ride a Moto Guzzi V7 ii Stone. That is pretty much the cheapest and least glamorous motorbike made by Moto Guzzi. However, it has the key features associated with the marque: an air cooled in line V twin motor, a shaft drive, and a "traditional" look. It looks good, sounds good, and attracts attention. People come up to talk to me about it.

Back in the 1970s, the Moto Guzzi 850 Le Mans was supposedly the fastest production motorbike in the world. It was a "big beast" and carried a lot of credibility.

Today, as I was sitting outside a cafe, a middle aged very respectable couple came up to me, ostensibly to tell me how much they admired my Guzzi.

It quickly became apparent that the real reason was to humble brag about their 10 bikes ("mostly Ducatis...") and to tell me that they once owned a Moto Guzzi Le Mans 850.

Funny thing is, no one has ever come up to me to say that they used to own a Moto Guzzi California, or Nevada, or Griso, or Norge, or any of the many other models that Guzzi have made in their 102 year history. However, countless people have told me they used to have an 850 Le Mans.

Of course, it is possible that some were telling the truth, but come on: they can't all have once owned the one model of classic Guzzi that everyone knows about. When I was in the owner's club, only a few owned, or had owned, the 850 Le Mans. It was the Holy Grail of Guzzis.

Conclusion: many, most, or possibly all, of these people who tell me that they once had an 850 Le Mans are pointlessly lying to a stranger.

They gain nothing tangible from this, and they certainly get no validation back from me. I smile and say, "Did you?" and that's about it.

This seems to be a biker's version of "I used to be in the SAS". The biggest regiment in the Army is the Ex SAS, closely followed by the "Former 2 Para.".

It seems common to tell lies to complete strangers for no other reason but that it feels good to say something glamorous about yourself knowing you are unlikely to be challenged.

I've never understood this lying business, but it seems to me that lying about bikes (to a biker) is a very risky one. I'm sure they could be easily caught out with a few questions.

As for the army- just ask them what their army number was. If they stutter and stammer or even slightly hesitate, just walk away.

 

[JahaRa]

Hi all, I know it might not be exactly fortean but definitely a human condition topic, but does anyone know much about the psychology of compulsive lying? I have long been intrigued by it as i have been on the receiving end of this behaviour in the past and never quite knew what to make of it. Is it just plain attention seeking (seems likely and yet not likely, aagh!) or is it a make-the-world-seem-better-by-creating-illusions sort of thing?
I am a compulsive creature myself in some ways ie sticking rigidly to routines and having particular ways of doing things, my habits are often screwy but not to the point where they impact heavily on my life. Still with the knowledge of why these compulsions take me, i have never fathomed compulsive lying. It just seems to cause so much damage and hurt, my boyfriend unfortunately had a long term relationship with a CL and it has really affected him.
In my experience people who do it range from the nervous type who lies to make themselves look more interesting to the quite cuckoo who just doesnt seem to have much grasp on 'reality' as such.

What do you all think? Any ideas would be gladly appreciated, but no fibs!! hehe.

Smiles and little furry kittens to everyone. :miaow:

Wow, I have known a whole family of compulsive liars. I married one of them when I was young and my brain wasn't fully formed. My ex used to say of his mother "She would rather climb up a tree backwards to tell a lie than to stand on the ground and tell the truth." It is a weird image but I soon found it to be accurate. There was an incident where someone asked her a question when the whole family was present and she lied. It was a huge blowup from almost everyone, until someone pointed out that it could not be true and insisted she tell what actually happened. And it was shocking that we would have given her a hug and been happy with her if she had told the truth to begin with. Of all of her 6 kids I only found one who was not pathological but he did get caught in some lies (the kind you tell your wife when you are meeting your boyfriend for the weekend). There was definitely a screw loose in my ex-mother-in-law's brain and she taught her kids some bad habits that most of them never overcame. (my ex just divorced his 7th/8th wife for the second time - I thought they were a perfect match, I guess that's why he married her twice).

 

[JahaRa]

I'm not sure if this is the right thread, but here's an observation on "unnecessary lying" for no material gain.

I ride a Moto Guzzi V7 ii Stone. That is pretty much the cheapest and least glamorous motorbike made by Moto Guzzi. However, it has the key features associated with the marque: an air cooled in line V twin motor, a shaft drive, and a "traditional" look. It looks good, sounds good, and attracts attention. People come up to talk to me about it.

Back in the 1970s, the Moto Guzzi 850 Le Mans was supposedly the fastest production motorbike in the world. It was a "big beast" and carried a lot of credibility.

Today, as I was sitting outside a cafe, a middle aged very respectable couple came up to me, ostensibly to tell me how much they admired my Guzzi.

It quickly became apparent that the real reason was to humble brag about their 10 bikes ("mostly Ducatis...") and to tell me that they once owned a Moto Guzzi Le Mans 850.

Funny thing is, no one has ever come up to me to say that they used to own a Moto Guzzi California, or Nevada, or Griso, or Norge, or any of the many other models that Guzzi have made in their 102 year history. However, countless people have told me they used to have an 850 Le Mans.

Of course, it is possible that some were telling the truth, but come on: they can't all have once owned the one model of classic Guzzi that everyone knows about. When I was in the owner's club, only a few owned, or had owned, the 850 Le Mans. It was the Holy Grail of Guzzis.

Conclusion: many, most, or possibly all, of these people who tell me that they once had an 850 Le Mans are pointlessly lying to a stranger.

They gain nothing tangible from this, and they certainly get no validation back from me. I smile and say, "Did you?" and that's about it.

This seems to be a biker's version of "I used to be in the SAS". The biggest regiment in the Army is the Ex SAS, closely followed by the "Former 2 Para.".

It seems common to tell lies to complete strangers for no other reason but that it feels good to say something glamorous about yourself knowing you are unlikely to be challenged.

That sounds like the plethora of tall blonde, blue eyed midwestern women I have met who claim to be the granddaughter of a Cherokee Princess.

 

[Mikefule]

It quickly became apparent that the real reason was to humble brag about their 10 bikes ("mostly Ducatis...") and to tell me that they once owned a Moto Guzzi Le Mans 850.

Funny thing is, no one has ever come up to me to say that they used to own a Moto Guzzi California, or Nevada, or Griso, or Norge, or any of the many other models that Guzzi have made in their 102 year history. However, countless people have told me they used to have an 850 Le Mans.

Of course, it is possible that some were telling the truth, but come on: they can't all have once owned the one model of classic Guzzi that everyone knows about. When I was in the owner's club, only a few owned, or had owned, the 850 Le Mans. It was the Holy Grail of Guzzis.

Conclusion: many, most, or possibly all, of these people who tell me that they once had an 850 Le Mans are pointlessly lying to a stranger.

So I stopped off at a local Honda dealer yesterday. Literally within 30 seconds of my walking into the showroom, a customer came up to me, "You're on the Guzzi are you? I used to have a Le Mans 850..."

Don't worry, I'm not going to report every instance in this forum, but it amused me that on my next ride with a break after posting the above, it happened.

 

[ramonmercado]

He continues to lie about saying he was Jewish and his mother, she wasn't even in the US on 9/11. Maybe she lied to him.

Congressman George Santos has admitted to having been "a terrible liar" when confronted with his embellished resume in a new TV interview.

The embattled Republican told TalkTV's Piers Morgan he had made mistakes under pressure but his lies were not about "tricking the people". Instead, he said, it was about "getting accepted by the party here locally". ...

He reiterated his claim that he had never said he was Jewish, and repeated what he described as a "party-favourite joke" by describing himself as "Jew-ish".

Challenged over a claim that his mother was in the South Tower of the World Trade Centre in New York City on 9/11, Mr Santos said: "That's true. I won't debate my mother's life as she's passed in [2016] and it's quite insensitive to try to rehash my mother's legacy," he said.
He added: "She wasn't one to mislead me... I stay convinced that's the truth." ...

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-64712914

He's up before the beak.

The Department of Justice has filed criminal charges against Rep. George Santos (R-N.Y.), CNN is reporting.

The charges haven’t been announced, but the controversial member of Congress is expected to appear as soon as Wednesday at federal court in New York’s Eastern District.

A request for comment to Santos’ office was not immediately returned.

ABC News reported that the nature of the charges are unclear since the charges are under seal. CNN is speculating that the charges could be connected to allegations of false statements in Santos’ campaign finance filings and other claims that have been the subject of investigations by the FBI and the Justice Department’s public integrity prosecutors in New York and Washington.

According to NBC News, two federal law enforcement sources confirmed back in December that prosecutors from the Eastern District of New York were examining Santos’ finances, including potential irregularities involving financial disclosures and loans he made to his congressional campaign.

In February, the FBI said that it was also looking into the case of a Navy veteran who accused Santos of stealing thousands of dollars from a GoFundMe campaign that was supposed to cover lifesaving surgery for the man’s service dog.

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/rep-...justice-department_n_645ac083e4b03e16f19f4ae8

 

[ChasFink]

He's up before the beak.

The Department of Justice has filed criminal charges against Rep. George Santos (R-N.Y.), CNN is reporting.

The charges haven’t been announced, but the controversial member of Congress is expected to appear as soon as Wednesday at federal court in New York’s Eastern District.

A request for comment to Santos’ office was not immediately returned.

ABC News reported that the nature of the charges are unclear since the charges are under seal. CNN is speculating that the charges could be connected to allegations of false statements in Santos’ campaign finance filings and other claims that have been the subject of investigations by the FBI and the Justice Department’s public integrity prosecutors in New York and Washington.

According to NBC News, two federal law enforcement sources confirmed back in December that prosecutors from the Eastern District of New York were examining Santos’ finances, including potential irregularities involving financial disclosures and loans he made to his congressional campaign.

In February, the FBI said that it was also looking into the case of a Navy veteran who accused Santos of stealing thousands of dollars from a GoFundMe campaign that was supposed to cover lifesaving surgery for the man’s service dog.

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/rep-...justice-department_n_645ac083e4b03e16f19f4ae8

We shouldn't discuss politics- and I believe simply mentioning Santos's apparent compulsive lying is not straying into those waters - but I just wanted to point out (if I haven't before) that I am lucky enough to have him as my congressman.

 

[maximus otter]

We shouldn't discuss politics- and I believe simply mentioning Santos's apparent compulsive lying is not straying into those waters - but I just wanted to point out (if I haven't before) that I am lucky enough to have him as my congressman.

A politician who tells lies? Does anyone else know about this?



maximus otter

 

[Spookdaddy]

A politician who tells lies? Does anyone else know about this?



maximus otter

It's all to do with nuance. There's a subtle difference between, 'that money was just resting in my account', or 'I do not recall ever having met a Miss Fifi La Bootstrap in person, and any payments made to that individual would have been in regard to legitimate party business' - and claiming to have fought at Guadalcanal in your pyjamas, discovered a new species of wolf, and to have once had a weekend job sewing all the sequins onto Liberace's suits.

 

[ChasFink]

claiming to have fought at Guadalcanal in your pyjamas, discovered a new species of wolf, and to have once had a weekend job sewing all the sequins onto Liberace's suits.

And some of the things he claimed were even stranger than this. So much bipartisan doubt was surrounding this guy that some even thought he was lying about being gay!

 

[Ronnie Jersey]

We shouldn't discuss politics- and I believe simply mentioning Santos's apparent compulsive lying is not straying into those waters - but I just wanted to point out (if I haven't before) that I am lucky enough to have him as my congressman.

How I wish I could say I was as lucky!

 

[escargot]

This is about the woman who killed herself after sending abusive tweets about Madeliene McCann's parents.
She was some kid of compulsive liar, or what her son calls a mythomaniac.

My mother, the troll: ‘I think she lost sight of the McCanns’ humanity’

In 2014, Brenda was approached by a Sky News journalist who asked her why she was trolling the McCanns on Twitter.

She was about to get into a car with her friend to visit a garden centre, and declined to comment.

The journalist then told her that she had been reported to Scotland Yard and her tweets were being investigated as part of a larger campaign of abuse against the McCanns.

“Well, that’s fair enough,” she said calmly.

But Brenda’s face gave her away. Her eyes blinked and her cheek twitched anxiously. Four days later, on 4 October 2014, Brenda killed herself.

Her trolling and subsequent suicide resulted in a number of newspaper stories: about the toxic culture of Twitter; the danger of people hiding behind avatars and fake names on social media; the biliousness of Brenda’s attack on the McCanns; and the tragedy of her death.

What could have led a woman to post hundreds of tweets attacking a couple she had never met, and why did she think there was nothing left to live for when she was caught out?

 

[cycleboy2]

This is about the woman who killed herself after sending abusive tweets about Madeliene McCann's parents.
She was some kid of compulsive liar, or what her son calls a mythomaniac.

My mother, the troll: ‘I think she lost sight of the McCanns’ humanity’

That's a truly moving, disturbing and finally uplifting story - how Ben finally came out of a very deep hole indeed.