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Rational Vs. Irrational Superstitions

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Anonymous

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Ok. So I was thinking about superstitions (I imagine there's half a dozen threads on them already and someone will bump this on later...). I came up with the following thought:

Superstitions can be divided into two types -

1) Rational Superstitions. Things which seem dumb, but have a perfectly 'logical' explanation attached to them. Eg,
Third light from a match/ligher is bad luck (apparently because if you were in the trenches, it took that long for a sniper to get a bead on you in the dark...).

Walking under ladders is bad luck (because it's plausible that someone has walked under a ladder only to have a bucket/person/whole ladder fall on them).

Putting new shoes on a table (where they're defenseless from breakfast spillage?).

Opening an umbrella indoors (which is just hazzardous).

'Red sky at night...' or the whole cows lying down thing (It only takes a few observations of weather conditions/ animal behaviour in the evening and morning to spot a pattern), etc.

Basically, anything where there might have been an archetypal event where the doing of that act or observing of that phenomenon lead directly to a mishap.

2) Irrational superstitions. Things that seem just as dumb, but I can't see any such plausible archetype (though that doesn't stop me adhering to one or two of these.
Eg, Money spiders - when and where did someone first equate the appearance of a small arachnid on their hand with the sudden loss/gain of money?

Saluting magpies to ward off bad luck - I've got into the habit of doing this, but even in the past, when magpies were seen as far more portentious and ominous, who decided that any sinister influence they had could be pacified by acknowledging them respectfully? It's a wierd one. You couldn't do it by accident. No-one could have seen a magpie, saluted it, then 'realised' that nothing unlucky had happened to them after a while, and so decided it was safest to do that every time... could they?

Horse-shoes. Lucky? Why? A rabbit's foot I can understand - you'd have been lucky to have caught the rabbit in the first place, but horse-shoes is just wierd.

Are these actually 'rational' ones that I'm just not bright enough to see the archetype behind, or are they as inexplicable as I'm making them out to be?
 
101 said:
... A rabbit's foot I can understand - you'd have been lucky to have caught the rabbit in the first place...

But the rabbit had four feet and they didn't bring it a lot of luck.

A fairly rational superstion:

Whistling in the theatre is supposed to be bad luck because in the early days a lot of the men who flew the scenery on ropes were ex-sailors and they used whistling to communicate with one another.

Consequently, whistling on stage could cause confusion and a lead to a large piece of scenery descending onto you.
 
I think the irrational ones go back to pagan beliefs:horseshoes, new moons through glass, black cats and white rabbits, not wearing green wedding dresses or green in general,not bringing white and red flowers into a house (very ancient source that one), in fact I read somewhere the ladder thing comes from the Celtic beleif that pointy topped doorways were wrong (can't rememeber why tho) and not to do with gallows or paint pots falling on your head.
 
When I was a bairn, I visited a mate who's house was being renovated. Ladders everywhere.
To avoid walking under a long ladder outside, I stepped onto a low wall. Thus avoiding bad luck.

I fell off the wall (which was only low on his side, I fell on the other side!) and cracked my head...

Now I walk under ladders...
 
Re: Re: Rational vs. Irrational Superstitions

Timble said:
Whistling in the theatre is supposed to be bad luck because in the early days a lot of the men who flew the scenery on ropes were ex-sailors and they used whistling to communicate with one another.

Consequently, whistling on stage could cause confusion and a lead to a large piece of scenery descending onto you.
Er, sort of. Actually it a nautical superstition that whistling on board a vessel is bad luck. There seem to be two strands to this:

1. At one time sail handling orders in the RN were given by whistles from the bosun's call, so any other whistling would be confusing or dangerous.

2. There was also a superstition that evil folk with magical powers could 'whistle up a wind' (meaning a storm), so it was felt safer not to whistle, just in case!
 
My grandmother refused to have lillies in the house, I don't know how true this is but according to my mom it was because at one time they were regarded as funeral flowers.
 
Ever see Bugs Bunny cartoons when someone pretends to be dead? They always hold a lilly...
 
Horseshoes

Isn't the reason horseshoes are lucky something to do with them being made of Iron, and thus able to ward off evil spirits or something?
 
I read a story once about why horsehoes are "lucky" aparently the devil appeared (dressed as a pretty maid) to a very religious blacksmith, the blacksmith realised the pretty maid was not what she appeared to be, and slapped some horseshoes on "her" feet, and ever since that day the devil doesn't like horsehoes, so you hang one over your door to keep the devil out ...
 
Putting new shoes on a table is supposed to look too much like the old custom of placing the dead person's shoes on their coffin at a wake, and so tempts fate.

I never, ever used to put white ribbons in my daughters' hair because they were used in the laying-out of babies. It's a nursing superstition, and again seems to be about tempting fate.
 
I think that may be a later "rationalisation" of some fairy lore, as the devil often takes the place of the folk in later stories and the fear of iron is often attributed to them. There was a theory among folklorists during the fashion for survivals that this reflected a deep-seated memory of the arrival of the first iron-age cultures in britain and the bronze-age people being defeated and driven underground, taking up residence in the tumuli and living in fear of the iron-weilders. It is no longer taken seriously, but it is a nice thought.

I think (and this is pure speculation) that it may be that the shape of the horseshoe is also relevant, reflecting the form of the holed stones that were said to protect against witchcraft and against being hag-ridden when hung above a bed.
 
p.younger said:
And what about throwing spilled salt over your shoulder, how did that get started?

Arn't one's opposing thoughts supposed to be personified as a devil on one's left shoulder and an angel, or 'guiding conscience' on the right. hence, ,to throw spilled salt over the left shoulder is to throw salt (and bad fortunne) in the eyes of temptation/ the devil?
 
Used to wonder if the association of salt with magical practice may have stemmed from practical considerations. As a student I spent some time living in a pretty vile bedsit. One of the big problems was that there were large gaps along the bottom of the wall in the kitchen through which slugs would gain access. The solution (though probably not optimal) was to get a large container of salt and use it to create a ring of salt along the edge of the kitchen.

Imagine the following scenario. You are wanting to perform some mystical conjuration (which will probably lead to you falling unconscious and hallucinating ;) ) in some dark, cold, damp location. One of the likely hazards will be slugs. (As well as ill-considered summonings of the demon Astaroth. ;) ) What do you do to prevent yourself waking up covered in mystical silvery trails? You draw a protective ring around yourself with salt! If you're feeling a bit artistic you might even do a pentagram.

The above is clearly nonsense (or is it?) but it's been bouncing around at the back of my brain for many years, and now it's had the opportunity to escape to the wild. :)
 
I looked the salt thing up in one of my folklore books last night, but I have completely forgotten what it said. I think the devil was on the left shoulder because the left side is the weaker one and generally considered somewhat sinister.

I can't see why salt would make a better circle of protection than other materials, though. I suppose it is possible that the deliberate intention involved in obtaining salt and marking the floor with it is as important as the fact it is salt you use. Perhaps it has to do with it's relationship with the sea?
 
In ancient times salt was relatively rare and precious - in fact roman soldiers were sometimes payed in salt - the etymology of 'Salary' shows the importance of salt(=sal).
 
Breakfast said:
I looked the salt thing up in one of my folklore books last night, but I have completely forgotten what it said. I think the devil was on the left shoulder because the left side is the weaker one and generally considered somewhat sinister.

Sinister means left. Dexter is right. cf. dextrous etc.
 
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