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The Separation Of Church & State

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Anonymous

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I believe the recent terrorist attacks on my country makes the strongest case for the SEPARATION of church and state! When people start commiting acts in the name of their God, atrocities happen. No God had thing one to do with this, this is a sruggle between man for power for man's own use! No God needs this kind of help for power, by the very definition of the word GOD! Christ, Jehovah, Allah, etc. killing innocents, ESPECIALLY children is an abomination in His eye. As a Christian, I weep, as I am sure any TRUE believer of any other faith must. No excuses for you that did this, but I must forgive you and pray for your soul, by the tenents of my God commands, May He Have Mercy On Your Souls! Everyone, no matter what faith, let us plead for a peaceful resolution so no more innocents die!
 
Agnostics like myself might well prefer to have no organized religion at all. History shows that religion has been behind many of the world's evils - I'm sure I don't need to make a list. (Even Bhuddism has been a cause of murders.)

Organised religion, however it was created, is maintained by control freaks who like to dictate how others should act and what they should believe. Of course, they don't see it that way themselves - they believe they are spreading truth and love, etc, and that "God is on their side". They appropriate everything that is good in society and claim that it comes from their God, and cannot spring from any other source (such as 'mere' human love).

But evil cannot come from God, they say, which leaves them the problem of explaining how God allows evil. This question has been debated for centuries, purely because there is no logical answer, so the debate will continue until religion finally fades away.

P.S. I have been known to give to charity, and I don't eat babies or covet my neighbour's ass. I'm prepared to believe in some aspects of the paranormal, but without accepting all the illogical baggage of ancient writings and doctrines that make up organised religions.
 
rynner said:
Agnostics like myself might well prefer to have no organized religion at all. History shows that religion has been behind many of the world's evils - I'm sure I don't need to make a list. (Even Bhuddism has been a cause of murders.)

Organised religion, however it was created, is maintained by control freaks who like to dictate how others should act and what they should believe. Of course, they don't see it that way themselves - they believe they are spreading truth and love, etc, and that "God is on their side". They appropriate everything that is good in society and claim that it comes from their God, and cannot spring from any other source (such as 'mere' human love).

But evil cannot come from God, they say, which leaves them the problem of explaining how God allows evil. This question has been debated for centuries, purely because there is no logical answer, so the debate will continue until religion finally fades away.

P.S. I have been known to give to charity, and I don't eat babies or covet my neighbour's ass. I'm prepared to believe in some aspects of the paranormal, but without accepting all the illogical baggage of ancient writings and doctrines that make up organised religions.
I endorse everything you say.
 
I reckon religion is more so what man does with God than what God does with man. God is not bound by religion but man binds himself with it.
 
I would say God did not "create man in his image" - we created him in our image. In other words he's a figment of our imagination.

My favourite theory of religion is Terry Pratchett's, in "Small Gods" ;)
 
Well here we have the old chestnut. God, and our inability to definitively prove his non-existence or existence. Personally I'll take Pascal's Wager...
 
I guess I - who is not a particularly religious person, I confess! - have two "problems" with the sentiments in this thread..

For one, the old saw that religion is behind many evils is, I think, a bit too simplistic...since I think any fair assessment would have to also assert that religion is also behind a great many GOOD deeds. I think, sadly, that is is easier to be spectacularly evil than to be spectacularly GOOD, and that colors our evaluations. Take this recent terrorist attack... putting aside the support network, perhaps two to three dozen people were able to inflict pain, both real and psychic, on a huge number of people, in a few short hours... can you think of an equivalent spectaculary GOOD act that could be "committed" in such a period of time? The "good" that religion has done, I would argue, accumulates in much smaller doses, but is nonetheless substantial. For example, I would argue that many of the basic views of what constitute human rights, etc, in the West, have grown out of Judeo-Christian culture.


In fact... and I know when I am out of my depth, and feel I probably am so here! ... most of the evils committed in the name of religion are actually perversions of the central tenets OF those religions. This is one of the central challenges in debating the "net worth" of religions...does one hold religions accountable for the barbaric excesses committed in their name? Even if those excesses are in direct contradiction to the true core values espoused by those religions? It is a tough call.

Lastly..and personally... I don't see any great contradiction with God "permitting" evil..but then again, I don't hold with an interventionist God (as many admittedly do). At a ridiculously simplified level, I see God in much the same role as a good parent at a Little League game... That parent prepares the child, teaches the rules, gives the child the skills to participate...and then allows whatever unfolds on the field to unfold. After all, at least in Christian thought, an eternal afterlife awaits... whatever transpires here occurs in the blink of an eye. How we accquit ourselves is all that matters... We choose good or evil, and so do those around us, and some good people come to bad ends, and some evil people "prosper"...but the game ends very quickly, in the cosmic sense, and then accounts are put to right.

I know this is all personal, and perhaps foolish fodder for a post here, but I felt (no offense) that a bit too much cynicism was creeping in... Evil committed in the name of any religion is terrible, but I am not ready to say that, in the net, religion has been a negative...

Shadow
 
I'm all for separation to stop evil governments claiming a higher authority for their actions, d-mn their eyes!
 
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