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Spanish Coins That Significantly Predate Columbus Found In The Utah Desert

Wreckless

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Mystery of the Spanish coins that predate Christopher Columbus by 200 years and have been found deep in the Utah desert
  • Spanish treasure that predates the arrival of Columbus has been found in Utah
  • The two coins, one minted in Madrid, were uncovered at Glen Canyon park
  • One is dated to 1200s, long before Columbus first arrived on the coast in 1492
By LUKE ANDREWS FOR MAILONLINE
PUBLISHED: 06:02 EDT, 9 May 2019 | UPDATED: 12:11 EDT, 9 May 2019

Spanish treasure that predates the arrival of Columbus by 200 years has been found in a US national park.

The two coins, one minted in Madrid in 1660 and the other made around the 1200s, were found lying on the floor at Glen Canyon National Recreation Area, Utah.

Their presence in the desert remains unexplained and no information has been released about whether they were found with other artifacts.


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https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...s-Utah-desert-predate-Columbus-200-years.html
 
so not a sealed context then?
:headbang:

Edit to add that it's a lovely report!
 
This is fascinating, but for me it represents a fundamentally-unprovable postulation (unless there is other contextualisation)

Why couldn't a 1660s Spaniard simply have brought with them to the Americas a 1200CE coin? By definition, a 13thC coin could easily have been in the pocket of a 17thC explorer...otherwise we might not have as many linearly-inherited examples as we do today.

In almost the same sort of anachronistic way as the Kensington Runestone may date from the 1890s rather than the 1360s?

(EDIT @Frideswide - I typed this just whilst you posted your comment!!!)
 
This is fascinating, but for me it represents a fundamentally-unprovable postulation (unless there is other contextualisation)

Why couldn't a 1660s Spaniard simply have brought with them to the Americas a 1200CE coin? By definition, a 13thC coin could easily have been in the pocket of a 17thC explorer...otherwise we might not have as many linearly-inherited examples as we do today.

In almost the same sort of anachronistic way as the Kensington Runestone may date from the 1890s rather than the 1360s?

(EDIT @Frideswide - I typed this just whilst you posted your comment!!!)
I know, I'm always carrying around 400-year-old coins myself. :p
Well OK, joking aside, I do have a 218-year-old gold coin right here in front of me, but I don't make a habit of carrying it about.
 
I have a few 2000 year old ones, and a couple in the 200 year range. Any good?
 
Another story about immigration from the Daily Mail, I see. :)

Possily a hoax, either by the person who "found" the coins, or by someone who left them there to be found.

Possibly dropped accidentally in modern times, as some people carry that type of thing in their wallets as a charm or memento.

Possibly carried as a charm or memento by an early settler, then lost.

Possibly traded by early settlers then lost by a native. If it was no longer legal tender, might it have been of more value to the natives than to the Europeans? They may have taken some old coins to trade, just as later explorers took trading beads.

It is well known that Europeans and Chinese landed in the Americas before Columbus. However, it seems unlikely that Columbus would have received the credit that he did if the Spanish had colonised the place a couple of centuries before,
 
I have an 1887 shilling on my keychain. (hole already drilled before I got it). No context whatsoever - I just like it.
 
I know, I'm always carrying around 400-year-old coins myself. :p
Well OK, joking aside, I do have a 218-year-old gold coin right here in front of me, but I don't make a habit of carrying it about.
Way back then, I surely would have these precious coins with me at all times, specially if I was a soldier like Ermintruder said.

The time gap between the coins and the lack of other ones, in my opinion, points to a collector. The creepy part is what the poor former owner did when he realized he lost both through a hole in his pocket.

In my several pages long of things to buy (mostly books) is a 640 réis Brazilian silver coin from 1695 -- the first year of round coins minted here, in my country (there are some controversial square ingots from the about 30 years the Dutch had a colony in the Northeast that are older, but they are not round and I'm not willing to become homeless, selling my house to get one--also, what if the tiny tiny thing falls out of my pocket?)

Edit: so many errors, never post without rereading while you are high on coffee.
 
I know, I'm always carrying around 400-year-old coins myself. :p
Well OK, joking aside, I do have a 218-year-old gold coin right here in front of me, but I don't make a habit of carrying it about.

I've got a mid-Victorian penny in the back of my wallet--a lucky token and a pleasantly weighty disc when a coin-toss is required.

I suppose I could cause mischief with it next time I'm far from Blighty's shores.
 
I dare you to go and plant them on Oak Island.

Well, that's game changer! We need more data! It's a bobby dazzler! It's an 'inge! No way! Boots on the ground!

etc etc
 
This week there's been an update from the National Park Service (to whom the coins were delivered by the hiker who found them).
Centuries old Spanish Coins Now Believed to be From Modern Coin Collection

Glen Canyon National Recreation Area’s investigation of centuries old Spanish coins turned into the park has provisionally concluded the coins are authentic. However they were probably part of a modern coin collection, perhaps accidentally or intentionally dropped by a visitor to Lake Powell. A hiker in the Halls Crossing area discovered two small coins and turned them into the park for further study. The coins are being stored in a climate controlled environment to protect them and are not on public display. Spanish coin experts Dr. Fernando Vela Cossio and Luis Fernando Abril Urmente assisted with the identification.

The park visited the site where the coins were found and believes their presence near Halls Crossing is modern, based on three observations. First, the dates of the two coins are widely divergent (1662-1664 and 1252-1284) and are significantly earlier than the Dominguez and Escalante Expedition of 1776, the first known Spanish presence in the area. Second, the coins were found in a scatter of modern houseboat trash that included 15 United States coins dating from 1974 to 2016. Third, the coins were found in a canyon bottom, a setting unlikely to preserve ancient deposits. The lack of nearby places having potential to contain ancient deposits suggests the coins are not associated with 17th or 18th century Native Americans or Spanish explorers.

The coins do tell two important stories. First, the visitor who found the coins and turned them into the park showed great respect for the history and resources in the park and instead of keeping them, ensured everyone could learn about the coins. Second, the coins’ exact location and what they were found with has contributed to educated guesses about their history. This is why archeological artifacts should be left in place and reported to the land management agency: where they are is just as important as what they are.

SOURCE: https://www.nps.gov/glca/learn/news/centuries-old-spanish-coins.htm
 
The news story cited in post #1 (and many others) don't bother to mention any of the following particulars found in the earliest news article (20 April) on the coins ...

The mystery began last September when a hiker from Colorado made the discovery near the Halls Crossing Marina on Lake Powell. Park officials are keeping the exact location secret because of the possibility there are other undiscovered artifacts in the area. They’ve been keeping the two coins under wraps, too — deliberately not publicizing the find — because they aren’t sure yet what to make of it.

... the coins were found in a popular tourist area that has at times been underwater in the decades after the Glen Canyon Dam was built in the 1960s. The Colorado hiker, whose identity is being kept confidential, told the park service that he spotted the coins just lying on the ground. ... “There was a lot of trash around," ... "He thought they (the coins) were maybe medallions from a wine bottle or something. So, modern trash.

EXCERPTED FROM:
https://www.ksl.com/article/4653589...ologists-investigate-rare-find-at-lake-powell
 
Why would someone go off hiking with part of their coin collection?
 
Why would someone go off hiking with part of their coin collection?

( :poet: ... Crosses Mytho's name off the list of this week's nominees for both the Reading Comprehension and Connecting Dots gold star distribution .... :evillaugh: )

- The discovery site was near a marina.
- The discovery site has intermittently been submerged under Lake Powell's waters during the last 50-some years.
- The coins were found amidst trash attributed to a houseboat.
 
Why would someone go off hiking with part of their coin collection?
When you just bought them for an insane price in a store. You wouldn't believe the tenacity that small expensive things have to find holes anywhere they are carried.
 
When you just bought them for an insane price in a store. You wouldn't believe the tenacity that small expensive things have to find holes anywhere they are carried.
Woohoo! I just got these rare coins that cost me a mint! Let's celebrate by hitchhiking across the USA!
 
Woohoo! I just got these rare coins that cost me a mint! Let's celebrate by hitchhiking across the USA!
Never underestimate the naivety of people. I am not rich enough for rare coins, but my small, expensive pendrives more than once found their way to freedom.
 
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