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Speaking In Tongues

Mythopoeika

I am a meat popsicle
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What do people think of speaking in tongues (aka glossolalia)?
Have you witnessed it happening, and did you think it was fake or genuine?

Myself, I once went to my mum's church (evangelistic baptist) some years ago - although I'm an atheist, my mum dragged me along because she wanted me to meet some people.
During prayer, one of the congregation started humming and started speaking in gibberish.
A few minutes later, another man stood up and said that God had told him to translate. He then reeled off the usual message about peace and love among all humankind etc. Nothing new or revelatory.

I've known these people for a long time - so I noticed immediately that both of these people were church elders.
Unfortunately, politeness prevented me from standing up and shouting 'it's a big fake!'.
I told my mum afterwords what I thought of it - a little 'play acting' to con the faithful - but my poor old mother was having none of it! She's blinded by faith and completely sucked in by the whole thing.
 
I went to my friends very Happy Clappy church once. It was almost cult like and very scary. People spoke in tongues and kept falling down, or fell down and couldn't stand up again.

They came to the Pastor who touched them and they all fell like sacks of potatoes.

I must admit I was quite un-nerved by it all and tried to remain detached but I could see how people got swallowed into the whole thing.

I'm not saying that God didn't touch them or anything because for them, I'm sure he did, but I think it was more a case of mass hysteria.

It frightened me rather than enlightened me. Something I hope not to see again in all honesty.
 
What has always confused me is that the phenomena of speaking in tongues is always assumed to be a gift of the Holy Spirit, after the Holy Spirit descended on the Apostles at Pentecost. However, there is an important distinction. At Pentecost, the Acts tells us, the apostles spoke and all those listening heard the Good News in their own mother tongue. So they weren't speaking gobbledegook. There was no translation required. Everyone understood exactly what was being said, in their own native language, whether Greek, Latin, Hebrew, or whatever. Not random ramblings requiring translation by someone else.

As I understand it (although I have no personal experience), glossollalia involves speaking, basically, gibberish.

So why is this considered to be a gift of the Holy Spirit?

Of course, one could go the other way and recall that, traditionally, possession by demons sometimes results in people spouting gibberish. ;)
 
We've chatted about this before. It's all b*ll*cks.
Ooops, sorry, dunno what came over me. :rolleyes:
 
I searched the forums for a similar thread, but couldn't find one - so I thought I'd start a new one. Sorry!
 
escargot said:
We've chatted about this before. It's all b*ll*cks.
Ooops, sorry, dunno what came over me. :rolleyes:

Don't panic, Escargot; it's the Spirits talking through you.

Yes...I can plainly see them....Whyte....Mackay....Bells....;) :D
 
You are so right Ravenstone.

When the God of Smirnoff talks to me and I spread his word, I'm the most witty, attractive and sexy being on the planet.

Of course as I'm speaking my own language no one appreciates what I'm on about. But it's true I tell you. All true!!! :D
 
Mytho M8, my controlling voices didn't mean that your choice of subject matter, and thus by inference your good self, was b*ll*cks, just that the 'phenomenom' of speaking in tongues is.

B*ll*cks, that is.

B*llocks, b*llocks, b*llocks.
There they go again. :rolleyes:

It's a very interesting subject, fully worthy of Fortean investigation.

B*llocks

Oops.
 
Ravenstone said:
What has always confused me is that the phenomena of speaking in tongues is always assumed to be a gift of the Holy Spirit, after the Holy Spirit descended on the Apostles at Pentecost. However, there is an important distinction. At Pentecost, the Acts tells us, the apostles spoke and all those listening heard the Good News in their own mother tongue. So they weren't speaking gobbledegook. There was no translation required. Everyone understood exactly what was being said, in their own native language, whether Greek, Latin, Hebrew, or whatever. Not random ramblings requiring translation by someone else.

It goes back to the Tower of Babel idea, I think. Before The Fall (and no I'm not talking rock groups here!) all people spoke the same language and were, presumably, all happy bunnies chattering happily together in paradise. But then some bright spark had the great idea of building a tower to God who got a bit sniffy about his space being invaded and cursed the lot of us with different languages, leading to conflict and generally unhappy bunnyness.

So, glossia-whatsit is the big guy's way of saying you're blessed and anyone who needs a translation obviously isn't in his good books.

Whether the people involved actually believe it is another matter. I've no personal experience either but I would guess that at least some of them really do believe. They may even be correct, but I'll still sit on my fence (and save my money!).

Alternatively I could be talking b*llocks (darn that snail!).

Jane.
 
:laughing:
B*ll*cks
 
mejane said:
It goes back to the Tower of Babel idea, I think.

Ooooo....that sounds like such a cop out! :D I bet that is what they say, now you mention it.

Still, not speaking in tongues, is it? Not in the true Acts of the Apostles way. My monies on demonic possession, I tell 'ee...:D

Wait til the fundies knock my front door again. I 'ave 'em, I will..

Bollards Damn, there's something wrong with the signal :D
 
Here's a babel fish each to stuff in your ear so you can understand what I'm spouting.;)
I used to do a hypnotism act at parties and such, one of the tricks was to tell a person that he's an alien (from the moon or mars to make it sillier) and another that he's a translator working for the world council...well you get the idea...point being that some people would come up with a pretty convincing sounding 'language', others more gibberish, exactly like speaking in tongues. The same mechanism seems to be at work under very similar circumstances ie. mesmeric and ecstatic states.
Conclusion: b*ll*ckssss.
During a lifetime one comes into contact with many languages, I've been to Welsh and French classes, watch German, Polish, and many other foreign satellite stations and had a keen interest in Egyptology. I'm crap at all of it but who knows how much is stored away apparentally forgotten, but maybe still accessible under the right circumstances?
Maybe I could come up with a grammatically convincing message from King Arthur by automatic handwriting.. but I suppose this belongs on another thread. :D
 
Anyone else remember Rowan Atkinson as an alien with a faulty translating machine, which stuck on the word 'b*ll*cks'? :laughing:

It's the funniest I've ever seen him. Laughed till I cried.

b*ll*cks
 
watching a program on cable last night, about hypnotism, and they showed a hypnotism class, somewhere in london. what struck me was the way that the hypnotists touched people on the forehead, while standing next to them, and they dropped to the floor. This is almost the same way that some evangelist types have people lined up, with a helper standing behind each person as they speak to them, then touch them on the head, and they "fall in the spirit". any thoughts on this?
 
Yeah, I saw a Paul McKenna special once where every 'takedown' was the forehead thing.

I had a bit of a scrape with a charismatic church a few years ago and experienced the 'Toronto Blessing' a few times. At the time it seemed like a seriously awesome religious experience, afterwards I realised it was a scam and really a trick that any decent stage hypnotist could duplicate, at least IMO.

A few years back I wrote an article about this for FT but they didn't print it:(
 
Wonder if that's how Derren does the telephone box trick?
 
Once you've made your selection of good subjects(sonambulists) then post-hypnotic suggestions allow you to 'wake' them or put them back into a deep trance at will on any chosen signal. This can be a touch on the forehead or a keyword, in fact any kind of implanted sign. Obviously this could harbour problems if you fail to remove all suggestions before ending the session!
In the charismatic service, all you need is one person to fall to the ground and the rest will follow the example because that's what they are shown will happen.
Hypnotic induction is based on a series of suggestions given to the subject, once one of those suggestions is shown to work, then the next is more likely to be acted upon, until a successful series will convince the subject that every suggestion (each now a 'command') will be acted on. So the subject really hypnotises himself.
 
i'd be interested in reading that if you can post it

It was published in Headpress a few issues back, there's been a lot of water under the bridge since then and I don't think I have an electronic copy anymore, but if I can find the Headpress issue I'll try and scan it when I get time over the weekend:)
 
O Wundrous Snail-like being, have you been checked for Tourette's Syndrome?

On topic, my personal experience is that it a self-delusion. Spent some time with Pentecostals back in my teens, saw it, and pretty much dismiss it.

Or, as S-Cargo would say: b*ll*cks!
 
Hedge, b*ll*cks! :D

:rolleyes: There goes that naughty spirit guide again.
 
two out of four ain`t bad, but that`s only average - I guess you`ve had a shock :eek!!!!:
 
sorry but very surprised to find I had posted so off thread - doh !:p
 
I can do gibberish, quite easily. I can put lotsa emotion behind it, so that it sounds like I really 'mean' something...Apparently this is a useless talent shared by a fairly small percentage of humanity.
Well, useless unless you use it to hoodwink a larger, more gullible percentage!
Honestly, why do folks think gibberish has to be deeply meaningful just 'cause they can't understand it?(this is also an issue I have with some forms of 'art')

(--Does it show that I don't buy speaking in tongues?):blah:
 
The fact that the speakers themselves do not understand what is being said, and need translators---well, THAT speaks volumes!:sceptic:
 
The fact that the speakers themselves do not understand what is being said, and need translators---well, THAT speaks volumes!

There was some research done in the 1950s that's documented in the book The Psychology of Speaking in Tongues. One of their findings was that when they taped someone performing glossolallia, then played it back individually to people who allegedly had the 'gift of interpretation', each person claimed it was saying something different.

The utterly bizarre part of this is that when they were challenged with this they didn't see anything wrong with it, as they believed that god had given each person a different interpretation.

I think it must have been a bit of an embarrassment though, 'cos after that they really didn't want to let themselves be taped again:D


Chockful - I found the article, it's in Headpress #19, unfortunately I can't get a decent page scan of it, the small type becomes illegible.
 
Well I went to my friend's happy clappy church once too, and guess what, It Happened To Me. So bollocks to you too.

I'm interested in the hypnotic suggestion angle, it certainly hadn't occured to me before. And I'm also interested in what comes out. I vaguely recall studies saying that it was usually repeated syllables/phrases.
 
lemonpie said:
Well I went to my friend's happy clappy church once too, and guess what, It Happened To Me. So bollocks to you too.

What exactly happened to you, Lemonpie?
Do tell.
 
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