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Survivalist Fiction/TEOTWAWKI Stories?

Jerry_B said:
Polar shift shouldn't cause any end of the world scenarios.
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I too agree that it shouldn't cause any major problems but I can't help thinking that it might lead to various smaller problems which we haven't really thought of (a disruption to our protection from solar flares for example). I am by no means informed and I hope that it would just mean that we all have to buy new compasses. :confused:

As Alan Davies said on TV show QI, "I don't care what you say. I'll still live in South London!"
 
Ringo_ said:
Jerry_B said:
Polar shift shouldn't cause any end of the world scenarios.
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I too agree that it shouldn't cause any major problems but I can't help thinking that it might lead to various smaller problems which we haven't really thought of (a disruption to our protection from solar flares for example). I am by no means informed and I hope that it would just mean that we all have to buy new compasses. :confused:
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It depends on How and Why the poles shift. If a massive asteroid strike shifts the Earth's crust then we would have problems!

Or some massive adjustment in the earth's core might also cause a massive outbreak of vulcanism, with huge lava flows and ash-filled skies blotting out the sun...

But in both cases a new compass wouldn't help - magnetic compasses would still indicate the (new) magnetic poles, and gyro compasses would still relate to the (possibly new) rotation of the earth. New maps might well be needed though!
 
rynner2 said:
It depends on How and Why the poles shift. If a massive asteroid strike shifts the Earth's crust then we would have problems!

Or some massive adjustment in the earth's core might also cause a massive outbreak of vulcanism, with huge lava flows and ash-filled skies blotting out the sun...
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Velikovsky came up with a lot of evidence for this (collision with a planetary body) happening more than once in prehistory in his 'Worlds in Collision', only he seems to think that Venus was the culprit.

One particular piece of evidence that has always intrigued me is the 'flash freezing' of the mammoths of northern Asia.
 
Ravenstone said:
But if we're talking "Let's repopulate the planet" (nightmare scenario for women ;) )
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and also for more than a few men...




rynner2 said:
Or some massive adjustment in the earth's core might also cause a massive outbreak of vulcanism
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(Survivors would all start looking like Leonard Nimoy.)

;)



There are lots of books you can get on self-suffiency (simple wind or steam powered generators, basic blacksmithing and carpentry etc) but most of the "survivalist" stuff seems to geared more to people using some major catastrophe as justification for all sorts of antisocial activities, mostly shooting lots of other people. In the documentaries, it's usually people with bunkers full of dehydrated soup and lots of guns. There seems to be a lot of people in the American Midwest who want to eat dehydrated soup, but more importantly shoot anyone who comes near their dehydrated soup.
 
I've been dreading any type of EOTW situation since buying a 'survival tin' with instructions on how to give enemas and gut sliugs.
 
ramonmercado said:
I am also a bit peeved at the mystical direction the series has taken but the writing is superb and the post apocalypse tropes keep things going. Perhaps the powers are creatures from another dimension or parallel universe.

Another good post apocalypse novel by Stirling is The Peshwar Lancers. But the Apocalypse occurred in the 19th century.

The Peshawar Lancers is an alternate history, steampunk, post-apocalyptic fiction adventure novel by S. M. Stirling, with its point of divergence occurring in 1878 when the Earth is struck by a devastating meteor shower. The novel's plot takes place in the year 2025, at a time when the British Empire has become the powerful Angrezi Raj and is gradually recolonizing the world alongside other nations and empires that were able to survive. The novel was published in 2002, and was a Sidewise Award nominee for best long-form alternate history.
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Peshawar_Lancers
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Unfair of me, perhaps, to have conceived such a dislike of the “Dies The Fire” cycle in the direction it has taken. In part, it’s just so unlike Stirling’s material as I had come to love same – though goodness knows, authors are free to “evolve and change !” Just, various things – as well as the whole “beyond-this-world-powers” premise -- about the way it’s gone, turn my stomach. For one, I find the big highly-traditional-Catholic presence in the post-Change world, a bit hard to take – whilst seeing the reasons per plot, for that coming about. (Had me wondering once or twice, whether the author had turned conservative-Catholic, and was using his novels to “push” that religious position.) And – the parallels drawn gleefully and at length by some fans, with the Arthurian legends, have been a turn-off for me. If I want to read about the doings / issues / problems of Arthur and his cohorts, I’ll do so via the original and authentic stories, thank you – not made-over into stuff about a bunch of dorks in Oregon in the early 21st century.

I agree, he writes splendidly; but that’s not enough to keep me riveted, if the content strongly not to my taste. Seems I haven’t the temperament for real fandom -- quite a few of Stirling’s truly red-hot fans assert (it seems with complete truth) that if he were to write the equivalent of the “List of Huntingdonshire Cabmen”, it would be for them un-put-down-able. In parallel with the “DTF” series, Stirling is now writing a series about vampires – for me, the most boring fiction topic on earth. Out of a sense of duty, I acquired his first “vampire” book – I managed to get as far as the end of Chapter 1...

I loved “The Peshawar Lancers” – found the “universe” thereof, a fascinating and engaging one. Would greatly wish that he’d written a series set in that universe (he has in fact done one short story with that setting). Another IMO superb “stand-alone” novel of his, is “Conquistador” – this one not apocalypse-related, but a “parallel-universes” gig. Once again, a scenario, based on which I would have loved a whole series.
 
For one, I find the big highly-traditional-Catholic presence in the post-Change world, a bit hard to take – whilst seeing the reasons per plot, for that coming about. (Had me wondering once or twice, whether the author had turned conservative-Catholic, and was using his novels to “push” that religious position.)
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My problem with it as well! Obviously the Catholic faith is used by the Portland regime to keep people down but decent people like Matilda believe in it, not just Catholicism but the most consevative aspects of it.

Stirling however counterposes Wicca to this: a free loving society where women are totally equal.

I think the catholic thing has something to do with the dffeent aspects of the powers.

Yeah, I would like to see Peshwar and conquistador continued.

I actually like Vampire novels but it just didn't seem right for Stitling so I've avoided it so far.

Bring back Draka!
 
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Yes -- Arminger's, and Portland's, oddities being as they are, Catholicism (of sorts) would clearly be high-profile there; but Catholicism seems to ride high in many other parts of the post-Change world, too. Maybe how it would be liable to be in such a real-life situation, just because of the Catholic Church's uniform-and-global traits...

In the DTF series, I certainly cheered for the Wiccans -- a very much more human-and-humane set-up. Still, as said, I've let them all get on with it, without me on the sidelines.

Stirling fans often express the opinion that which part of his body of work you most like, is apt to depend on just when you discovered him. That would seem to be true of me -- I came upon him during his so-far "middle period" -- that of Peshawar, Conquistador, and the Island trilogy -- and those were the works of his, with which I fell in love.

Had never heard of "Draka", before getting into the "Yahoo" SMS message board / list (which for various reasons, I have lately forsaken). Duly tried the Draka novels -- and, of all utterly unexpected things (given all read on "Stirling / Yahoo", about the mega-high degree therein of gruesomeness / cruelty / sadism) -- I found them just a bit boring. I struggled through "Marching through Georgia"; and went on to "Under The Yoke" -- which I found only fairly attention-holding, despite its "many moments". Found self doing some skimming-and-skipping of UTY; figured that must go back and read the book thoroughly, as deserved; never have done -- so far, end of the Draka road for me. As Stirling fans go, reckon I'm a very pale and sad apology for one.
 
A story I read in my youth was Davy by Edgar Pangborn:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Davy_(novel)

Worth a look, although it is post nuclear holocaust (sorry).

Edit: Sorry, but Wikipedia has broken the URL rules again. Oh well...
 
ramonmercado said:
For one, I find the big highly-traditional-Catholic presence in the post-Change world, a bit hard to take – whilst seeing the reasons per plot, for that coming about. (Had me wondering once or twice, whether the author had turned conservative-Catholic, and was using his novels to “push” that religious position.)
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My problem with it as well! Obviously the Catholic faith is used by the Portland regime to keep people down but decent people like Matilda believe in it, not just Catholicism but the most consevative aspects of it.

Stirling however counterposes Wicca to this: a free loving society where wome are totally equal.

I think the catholic thing has something to do with the dffeent aspects of the powers.

Yeah, I would like to see Peshwar and conquistador continued.

I actually like Vampire novels but it just didn't seem right for Stitling so I've avoided it so far.

Bring back Draka!
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I've read Taint in the Blood and Stirling has brought his own twist to the Vampire trope. Its really an SF book, the Vampire powers are based on being able to tweak probability on the quantum level. They are the real rulers using puppets which would explain a lot.

The vampires were originally a sub-species who lorded it over humanity up to 14,000 yrs ago. (Not everything is explained in this book.) Then they interbred with humanity and now they are trying to purify the bloodline again.

Recommend it.
 
ramonmercado said:
For one, I find the big highly-traditional-Catholic presence in the post-Change world, a bit hard to take – whilst seeing the reasons per plot, for that coming about. (Had me wondering once or twice, whether the author had turned conservative-Catholic, and was using his novels to “push” that religious position.)
Click to expand...

My problem with it as well! Obviously the Catholic faith is used by the Portland regime to keep people down but decent people like Matilda believe in it, not just Catholicism but the most consevative aspects of it.

Stirling however counterposes Wicca to this: a free loving society where wome are totally equal.

I think the catholic thing has something to do with the dffeent aspects of the powers.

Yeah, I would like to see Peshwar and conquistador continued.

I actually like Vampire novels but it just didn't seem right for Stitling so I've avoided it so far.

Bring back Draka!
Click to expand...

I've read Taint in the Blood and Stirling has brought his own twist to the Vampire trope. Its really an SF book, the Vampire powers are based on being able to tweak probability on the quantum level. They are the real rulers using puppets which would explain a lot.

The vampires were originally a sub-species who lorded it over humanity up to 14,000 yrs ago. (Not everything is explained in this book.) Then they interbred with humanity and now they are trying to purify the bloodline again.

Recommend it.
 
Does anyone know what would happen to GPS signals in an end of the world scenario? Going back to "everyone vanishes", as a pose to "polar shift" type events.

The satellites are up there, and the Tom Tom is powered by the car battery, so would they still work? And for how long?
Having thought about it, if there are no other cars on the road to take into consideration, a road atlas would suffice as you could just come to a halt on the motorway as you pondered your course. Actually, if there are no other cars about and the weather is fine, it might be nice to cycle down the motorway. It's not as if you need to be back for work come Monday morning.
 
davidplankton said:
Does anyone know what would happen to GPS signals in an end of the world scenario? Going back to "everyone vanishes", as a pose to "polar shift" type events.

The satellites are up there, and the Tom Tom is powered by the car battery, so would they still work? And for how long?
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Yes, they would continue to work for a while.
They need maintenance though - recalibration and boosting back up into correct positioning. If the people who normally do that are gone, eventually the GPS system will break down.
Of course, if Earth is hit by a huge asteroid, there may be enough ejected mass that it may affect the GPS satellites (hitting them or blocking line-of-sight signals). Depends on the cause of TEOTWAWKI, really.
 
Jerry_B said:
Anyway, you could try Richard Matheson's novel 'I Am Legend'...What about Cormac McCarthy's 'The Road'?
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I've now read them both. Thanks for the suggestions.

I am Legend was a surprise as having seen the film I obviously had some idea of what it was about. However, I did as you suggested and tried to ignore the film versions in my head. I have to say that I enjoyed it but I was really frustrated with the lead character who spent most of his time spilling whisky in the carpet. Nice twist though.

The Road was fantastic. It took a long time to get used to the authors style but after a while I found that I enjoyed his short excerpts. I couldn't put it down and when I did, I was thinking about it all the time. I found the dialogue boring, as not much was said but I suppose as the title suggests, the story was in the journey.

Right, what's next on the list?
 
ramonmercado said:
gncxx said:
ramonmercado said:
Jerry_B said:
'The Death of Grass' by John Christopher.
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An excellent novel.
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The film version, No Blade of Grass, is worth a look if you can find it.
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Its here:http://veehd.com/video/4567628_No-Blade-of-Grass-1970
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Just watched it, excellent film, esp in the way it portrays the breakdown of civilisation. I reckon it provided some inspiration for Mad Max with the biker gangs.
 
Yeah, its very Mad Max in places. Good to see it as a forerunner of all those eighties post-apocalypse movies. Ahead of its time. Plus Nigel Davenport is always great.
 
The Horde: French Zombie Movie. Fast moving zombies. Cops go on revenge gig to wipe out drugs gang in high rise. Things go wrong. Then the zombies arrive. Great old guy who thinks hes back at Dien Bien Phu a lot of the time but he really kicks zombie ass. Reminds me of Ernest Borgnine in Escape From New York.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RxkvXs5O ... re=related
 
Panic In Year Zero (1962).
A family of four leaves Los Angeles for a camping trip just before nuclear bombs destroy the city. As lawlessness prevails, the father must fight to keep his family alive.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hSGEiXO5894
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Starring and directed by Ray Milland with Frankie Avallone as a sub Mad Max road villain. Shows how nasty things could get, murder, rape. Suffers a bit from a lack of real special effects but worth watching.
 
Frankie Avalon played Milland's son, he wouldn't go Mad Max on anyone (except the Beatles). Not a bad movie, though, as you say.
 
gncxx said:
Frankie Avalon played Milland's son, he wouldn't go Mad Max on anyone (except the Beatles). Not a bad movie, though, as you say.
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Oooopa I got them mixed up!
 
OneWingedBird said:
How is it that no-one has ever made a movie of A Canticle for Leibowitz? :(
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There are quite a few great books that should be turned into films, yes.
That's one of them.
 
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