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Tales Of A Flat Earth

Mythopoeika said:
Another thing we have learned from observing it in free fall - liquids naturally form spherical globs. It's only a small leap of the imagination to extend that (and the process by which it happens) to the shape of planets.
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That's the thing... if you start to go by what is observable, you start to see that the world is round.

Ever debated with a Flat Earther on the topic? Interesting stuff. Reminds me of when I argue with Vegans... you are in the wrong, you are stupid, you are blind... just accept what is being told to you, and all will be fine. Their arguments are built on emotion rather than fact or logical deduction. Also, the last time I looked at Eric Dubay's Flat Earth forum, it was hilariously paranoid! One post that questioned anything... you're the enemy, and get banned! Bizarre to observe.

Of interest, the original forum was deleted. He has since set up a new forum here: http://ifers.ace.st/ . He certainly seems to be a key proponent of the movement.
 
I think the wildlings are a myth. The ice wall is the end of the world and the Night's Watch are there to keep the westerosians from getting too close
 
Daenarys said:
That's the thing... if you start to go by what is observable, you start to see that the world is round.

Ever debated with a Flat Earther on the topic? Interesting stuff. Reminds me of when I argue with Vegans... you are in the wrong, you are stupid, you are blind... just accept what is being told to you, and all will be fine. Their arguments are built on emotion rather than fact or logical deduction. Also, the last time I looked at Eric Dubay's Flat Earth forum, it was hilariously paranoid! One post that questioned anything... you're the enemy, and get banned! Bizarre to observe.

Of interest, the original forum was deleted. He has since set up a new forum here: http://ifers.ace.st/ . He certainly seems to be a key proponent of the movement.
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How can you argue with vegans? Surely their veganity (hope this is a word :) ) is a personal moral choice and nothing to do with argument or evidence?
Though I understand Vegan and veggie disgust for taking life, I've always thought it was a bit snooty, like saying that we're somehow better than cats and dogs and lions and such :)
 
Squiddy said:
How can you argue with vegans? Surely their veganity (hope this is a word :) ) is a personal moral choice and nothing to do with argument or evidence?
Though I understand Vegan and veggie disgust for taking life, I've always thought it was a bit snooty, like saying that we're somehow better than cats and dogs and lions and such :)
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For some, it is balanced and reasonable. For a lot, though, it is a need to control their lives. It then makes them feel morally superior, and then they want to control others. Here is a good blog post on it:




http://www.fathead-movie.com/index.php/2013/01/28/why-people-hate-vegans/
 
Flat earth debate is still causing fights in Canada
Police, firefighters called in after flat Earth debate turns heated
Man angered by suggestion Earth is flat threw propane tank into fire, police say
CBC News Posted: Jun 14, 2016 5:09 PM ET

A family argument over whether the Earth is flat or round became so heated that one of the participants threw a propane cylinder onto a campfire, prompting an intervention by firefighters.

The dispute over a question most considered resolved centuries ago boiled over around 10:30 p.m. Monday at St. Lawrence Park in Brockville, Ont.

Police said a 56-year-old Brockville man was at a campsite with his son and his son's girlfriend when the woman began insisting that the Earth is flat.

The older man insisted the Earth is round.

It's not clear if anyone at the campfire put forth the argument that the Earth's equatorial bulge makes it not perfectly round, but instead a shape known as an oblate spheroid.

Nevertheless, police said the man became so enraged he began throwing objects into the campfire, including a propane cylinder.

Brockville firefighters were called to put out the campfire. By the time police arrived at the scene, the man had left.

Brockville police are looking for the man and say they expect to charge him with mischief.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/flat-earth-debate-leads-to-fire-police-call-1.3634692
 
paranoid420 said:
It's not clear if anyone at the campfire put forth the argument that the Earth's equatorial bulge makes it not perfectly round, but instead a shape known as an oblate spheroid.
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I know news articles like to put that tidbit in there, but the Earth is also closer to round than the acceptable manufacturing tolerance for billiard balls.
 
I thought that was an excellent comment to put in. However I believe the billiard ball thing refers to smoothness, not roundness.
 
As a slightly interesting side issue, it was many post-renaissance and subsequent 'enlightenment' writers who attributed belief in a flat planet to peoples of the middle ages when in fact it was a widely known and held belief that the Earth was a globe in even late Roman times.

But then it seems to have been a common practice from the 16th century to attribute all sorts of beliefs/practices to the so-called 'dark ages' that never existed in the mediaeval era - witch ducking, droit de seigneur, flat earthism etc. It's a fascinating subject, as many of our current ideas about past times are very, very misinformed due to writings about these times from later eras.
 
Known among scholars, but what about the man on the street?
 
Xanatic* said:
I thought that was an excellent comment to put in. However I believe the billiard ball thing refers to smoothness, not roundness.
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Earth's Equatorial diameter is 12,756 km.
Its Polar diameter is 12,714 km.
That's a difference of just 42 km, which is about 0.3 percent of either diameter.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Billiard_ball#International_pool
"According to WPA/BCA equipment specifications, the weight may be from 5.5 to 6 oz (156–170 g) with a diameter of 2.250 inch (57.15 mm), plus or minus 0.005 inch (0.127 mm)."

According to my calculations, the max/min difference is about 0.4 percent of the diameter.

In other words, although the earth is an oblate spheroid, it is still rounder than the specifications lay down for a billiard ball! (It's probably smoother too.)

Anyway, those are the figures, feel free to check my working!
 
Xanatic* said:
I thought that was an excellent comment to put in. However I believe the billiard ball thing refers to smoothness, not roundness.
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Egg shaped billiard balls don't make for a very good game. ;)

/I bet it would be amusing though.
 
kamalktk said:
Egg shaped billiard balls don't make for a very good game. ;)

/I bet it would be amusing though.
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Who said anything about egg shaped?

The point I was making is that, if you shrink the Earth to the size of a billiard ball, it would probably be as good as, or better than, the average billiard ball as regards its roundness.
 
rynner2 said:
The point I was making is that, if you shrink the Earth to the size of a billiard ball, it would probably be as good as, or better than, the average billiard ball as regards its roundness.
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But where would you put the table?

This is interesting. I've often heard it said the Earth is not round but an oblate spheroid and this conjures the idea that the distortion is significant. I've even read the figures, without much thought about how they compare with other things we consider spherical.
 
rynner2 said:
Who said anything about egg shaped?

The point I was making is that, if you shrink the Earth to the size of a billiard ball, it would probably be as good as, or better than, the average billiard ball as regards its roundness.
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Well, an egg shape could be very smooth in that there could be very little deviation from a mathematical description of "egg shaped", but it would not be round. There is a conflation of the meanings of smooth and round for spheres. A perfectly round sphere is also perfectly smooth, but a cube could also have perfectly smooth sides but of course is not round.

The Earth would likely indeed make a good billiard ball of the gods once they hardened it up to relative inelasticity.
 
kamalktk said:
The Earth would likely indeed make a good billiard ball of the gods once they hardened it up to relative inelasticity.
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New theory! The dinosaurs were wiped out when a gigantic divine cue smashed into the Earth. The continents are still moving from the impact. Obviously, the Flying Spaghetti Monster was playing a drunken game of pool with Raptor Jesus.
 
PeteByrdie said:
New theory! The dinosaurs were wiped out when a gigantic divine cue smashed into the Earth. The continents are still moving from the impact. Obviously, the Flying Spaghetti Monster was playing a drunken game of pool with Raptor Jesus.
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I have documentary footage of what actually happened:
 
I'm going to blindly come out and suggest that it makes more sense for the Earth as well as other planets to be round ... stuff about gravity and stuff spinning *cough* and 'stuff' doesn't seem to lend itself to flat planes planets being formed to me ... I've never really taken flat earth theory seriously but a couple of people I know have come out as flat earthers today and I'm not sure how to feel about it (other than my initial instinct response which would be to piss myself laughing at them) .. they're very intelligent people otherwise so maybe the Earth is in fact flat ? .. I can't say for certain, I've never been to space etc ...


 
I've often thought the modern flat earth folk are making a point about how we accept things on faith for the most part and that a little more critical thought and checking things for ourselves might be no bad thing.
 
Coal said:
I've often thought the modern flat earth folk are making a point about how we accept things on faith for the most part and that a little more critical thought and checking things for ourselves might be no bad thing.
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I'm still not convinced by them but I think you're right on that. They're just having a bit of a laugh IMO.
 
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I've just discovered this thread. rynner2's Post #18 (concerning Joshua Slocum and President Kruger) reminds me of a sequence, treasured by me, in one of John Biggins's IMO splendid World War I-era novels, the hero of which is an officer in the then Austro-Hungarian navy (Austria-Hungary in those days, having an Adriatic seacoast). The hero -- in the Far East on personal business when World War I breaks out -- is trying to make his way back to his own country. He takes passage on a Dutch ship conveying Moslems from the East Indies, on pilgrimage to Mecca.

The ship's captain and officers are all members of a very extreme fundamentalist Calvinist sect, who are convinced -- on scriptural grounds -- that the earth is flat. (One wonders a little, at their being ready to aid and abet pilgrim devotees of what they must think a loathsome false religion -- but there you are.) The hero finds that the ship's navigation charts and manuals are predicated on the earth's being flat. He is rather worried that, this being so, the vessel is likely to end up somewhere like Tierra del Fuego, instead of Jeddah; but on further investigation, he discovers that the compilers of the navigational material have in fact made considerable compromises with Godless scientific error, and that said material is not all that greatly "off". Attempts by the hero to discuss flat-versus-round-earth issues with the mariners, just come up against total conviction on the part of the latter, that the hero is one of the enormous majority of mankind who believe the prevailing falsehoods, and will be damned for it.
 
A video which is supposed to show the earth ls flat.

 
They need to use a wider angle lense and have the horizon horizontal, otherwise they're trying my patience.


This is a photo from 35,000 feet, of a sunset, shot with a 35ml kit lense. I reckon I can see curvature plus the earth's shadow indicates curvature.


IMG_9229.jpg
 
Michael Bentine and his mates had it right "It's a square world"
 
If you go to the Burning Man festival and look across the playa you can see the curvature of the earth. You can also see the curvature driving across Interstate 80 between Elko, NV and Salt Lake City, UT crossing the Bonneville Salt Flats. (gawd-- that is a desolate stretch of highway.)
 
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