The 15-Minute City Conspiracy

[Endlessly Amazed]

But those of us who DO drive them love them because they are quirky and odd. It's like driving a comfortable go-kart. Corners are SO much fun.

I would like to point out that I can no longer drive my Mini to work because the city council restricts the number of parking spaces that the University can have, so the University's answer is to ban people who live in certain postcodes from having parking permits. My post code is on that list because there is sufficient public transport to serve the campus. Well, there used to be. Originally there was a bus route that ran from the supermarket 5 minutes' walk away directly to my building, but Covid killed that one, and the new bus only goes to the middle of town and then you have to connect with another bus. It's about an hour's journey. I can walk it (and have done) in an hour and 5 minutes. There is a train, but only two an hour, with a 15-minute walk to/from the station at each end. Which is why I am a cycle commuter (admittedly on powered bikes) - just under 20 minutes on a good day, just over 25 minutes on a busy one. And my son drives my Mini to his work instead, ten minutes away...

Yes.

Before I retired, my workplace was 5 miles from my home. I had a car and could have driven, but it would have taken more than one hour each way. I took public transportation which still took an hour each way, but it was much easier than dealing with traffic in a car. My journey: walk to bus stop, take bus to train station, take train to work area, walk to work.

 

[Tunn11]

Yes we do. Still quite a number of the 'classic' version which was produced from 1959 (as the Morris Mini Minor) in various forms but retaining the main bodyshell, up until production ceased in 2000.
View attachment 63819

Then there is the version which has been being produced by BMW (who bought the rights to the trademark).
Since 2001 it was marketed as the Mini Hatch or Mini One and has been through 3 generations, with the 3rd still in production, and each generation has had various body styles.
I don't like them. They are a bloated version of the classic that they emulate, and having driven one I know they go well, and handle good too, but are quirky and odd.
View attachment 63820

I would offer that the original 'classic' mini would be ideal for the proposed '15 minute city' as they were small and nippy, had good economy, but you'd probably get uncomfortable attempting a long drive, or going on the motorway.

Don't forget the Wolsley Hornet and tthe Riley Elf A mini with a flash radiator and a boot (Or trunk as @Ronnie Jersey would call it)

 

[eburacum]

As far as I can see, if this is a conspiracy, it is a wholly positive one. We must reduce our dependence on cars. If the planning authorities attempt to implement it without the alternatives in place, such as public transport, exceptions for the disabled and infirm, working-from-home and the existence of local amenities, that is incompetence. But the idea itself is highly desirable.

 

[Trevp666]

Don't forget the Wolsley Hornet and tthe Riley Elf

I wasn't forgetting them - neither was I forgetting the 'countryman' and 'clubman' variants, or the vans or pick-ups!
Also, the 'custom' made vehicles.
Like the one specially made for Ringo Starr which they fashioned the rear into a hatchback so he could put his drums in.

Sorry for straying ever so slightly off topic.
But these would be ideal for a 15 minute city.

 

[Ronnie Jersey]

Don't forget the Wolsley Hornet and tthe Riley Elf A mini with a flash radiator and a boot (Or trunk as @Ronnie Jersey would call it)View attachment 63831

Yes, we do call it a 'trunk' - and a 'booty' is a whole different thing!

 

[Tunn11]

The problem is that the car offers freedom. I can at any time take the car and travel easily to any destination in the country and some beyond without the need for any difficult planning. I can also carry or bring back a lot of stuff or other people. There will of course be a cost in terms of fuel, tax, etc. But, I could choose to drive from Kent to Inverness now if I wanted to.

As it stands if I want to travel from Kent to Inverness on public transport now it would cost far more, require a deal of planning to avoid spending the night on a station platform and would cost even more with more people and be awkward if I had to take a lot of stuff.

I doubt that any public transport system will ever offer that degree of freedom and I doubt that I will suddenly want to take half the house to Inverness but it's easy to feel that my freedom is being taken.

Currently public transport even for small journeys is such rubbish, especially if you don't live in a city that it is easy to see how, 15 minute cities, restricting car usage, etc. is alarming people. Of course we will be promised alternatives! However these alternatives need to be in place first because nobody in their right mind will believe in them otherwise.

 

[Tunn11]

Yes, we do call it a 'trunk' - and a 'booty' is a whole different thing!

Yes, plunder.

 

[Mythopoeika]

Currently public transport even for small journeys is such rubbish, especially if you don't live in a city that it is easy to see how, 15 minute cities, restricting car usage, etc. is alarming people. Of course we will be promised alternatives! However these alternatives need to be in place first because nobody in their right mind will believe in them otherwise.

For me to get to work via public transport, it would take a complex journey of more than 2 hours each way (more, in reality).
By car, it takes about 40 minutes.
I can't do all of my job from home - a significant part of my job is hardware testing and configuration in a lab.
I hate driving, but it would not be feasible for me to go back to using public transport.

 

[hunck]

For me to get to work via public transport, it would take a complex journey of more than 2 hours each way (more, in reality).
By car, it takes about 40 minutes.
I can't do all of my job from home - a significant part of my job is hardware testing and configuration in a lab.
I hate driving, but it would not be feasible for me to go back to using public transport.

Don’t worry, no-one is going to make you stop driving - you’d be forced into unemployment.

 

[hunck]

Yes.

Before I retired, my workplace was 5 miles from my home. I had a car and could have driven, but it would have taken more than one hour each way. I took public transportation which still took an hour each way, but it was much easier than dealing with traffic in a car. My journey: walk to bus stop, take bus to train station, take train to work area, walk to work.

Don’t attempt to do anything about the traffic congestion though or you’ll soon be getting abuse & death threats for STAMPING ON MY FREEDOMS.

 

[Victory]

I do think there is a conspiracy element to it.

The massive money behind Uber loves the 15 minute city concept.

"Abandon your cars citizens!
If you really must go to see a friend in the other part of the city, get an Uber."

And the purse holders behind that massive money know who to pay to advance their agenda.

The powers that be want as much of our activity to be monitored.
So they push it online, by credit card, in a traceable cab, on a traceable phone etc.

Because what can be monitored can be be more easily controlled than that which is unknown.

 

[sherbetbizarre]

The powers that be want as much of our activity to be monitored.
So they push it online, by credit card, in a traceable cab, on a traceable phone etc.

Because what can be monitored can be be more easily controlled than that which is unknown.

What sort of activity are they looking to control?

 

[hunck]

I do think there is a conspiracy element to it.

The massive money behind Uber loves the 15 minute city concept.

"Abandon your cars citizens!
If you really must go to see a friend in the other part of the city, get an Uber."

And the purse holders behind that massive money know who to pay to advance their agenda.

The powers that be want as much of our activity to be monitored.
So they push it online, by credit card, in a traceable cab, on a traceable phone etc.

Because what can be monitored can be be more easily controlled than that which is unknown.

Your banking transactions can be & are tracked already without any involvement of 15 minute cities.

 

[Victory]

What sort of activity are they looking to control?

Creative ideas and socio-political activity that conflicts with their ideas and activities.

Tangent removed—mods.

 

[hunck]

Your banking transactions can be & are tracked already without any involvement of 15 minute cities.

Unless you pay cash for stuff that is, which would make your spending habits harder to track.

 

[Endlessly Amazed]

I do think there is a conspiracy element to it.

The massive money behind Uber loves the 15 minute city concept.

"Abandon your cars citizens!
If you really must go to see a friend in the other part of the city, get an Uber."

And the purse holders behind that massive money know who to pay to advance their agenda.

The powers that be want as much of our activity to be monitored.
So they push it online, by credit card, in a traceable cab, on a traceable phone etc.

Because what can be monitored can be be more easily controlled than that which is unknown.

Although I agree, I hesitate to publicly state it because of the difference between my interpretation and the CT's interpretation.

Uber: To see an opportunity to make a profit from prospective government decisions is within the bounds of normal human behavior. To influence those decisions in order to make a profit is also within the bounds of normal human behavior, although it is ethically wrong. To bribe government officials to make public-welfare decisions which will only benefit the briber is illegal.

I think the penalties of prison and fines are not nearly preventative enough. Send them to the UK's version of Anacostia to perform their 50 years to life (eligible for parole in 50 years ) of confined public service.

 

[maximus otter]

If l were to be deprived of a car by government decree, large parts of my life would simply be ended.

Visiting the in-laws in western Scotland would become an expensive travel nightmare, relying on at least two train changes and a taxi at each end. And that assumes that the trains would be on time for connections (hollow laugh…) The expense would be appalling.

My shooting activities would end. Even if l were allowed on public transport carrying firearms - ha! - no such public transport will ever serve the rural locations where these activities occur. My trips to the rifle range on a Sunday are the only time in the week when l get to socialise with others and enjoy myself. What will replace that for me, aged 67 and with no independent means of travel? A walk up our boarded-up High Street with its numerous charity shops, vape stores, nail bars and Turkish barbers?

Public transport around here is dire, with fewer and fewer services in operation. I’m someone who enjoys bus journeys, but l can’t rely on being able to get home. Three times in the last three weeks l’ve arrived at bus stops to make a connection, only for the electronic signs to change to Cancelled. No warning; nothing on the bus company’s app. Stranded? Tough. One such incident involved my wife having to sign off from working from home, and drive a 40-mile round trip to rescue me.

My instruction to the political parties would be this: Run on an honest platform of “We’re going to take your cars away”, and learn whether we approve.

maximus otter

 

[Trevp666]

If they were designing a '15 minute city' on a blank sheet of paper though, would they only make provision for cars to reach the outskirts and then have a decent, well-run, public transport service 'baked in'?
And special access roads only for commercial vehicles to carry out their business.
It shouldn't be too difficult to create a place in which you could get around and do everything you need within a small area I expect, but where the idea would struggle to persuade/convince people is once you start looking at the things that fall outside of the 'expected requirements', such as when you might go to the shops and buy a large amount of anything, more than what you could be expected to physically transport by yourself back to home, or when people come to visit you by car for a week with luggage etc, or any of the things previously mentioned upthread that would be difficult to carry out without access to a vehicle of your own.

 

[hunck]

If l were to be deprived of a car by government decree, large parts of my life would simply be ended.

That’s a big if. Since you’re not being deprived of a car by government decree you don’t need to march on Whitehall just yet.

That would eventually happen anyway, because the PTB would tell me I have to get rid of my ICE car and buy an electric vehicle. I wouldn't be able to afford one, so I'd end up unemployed.

Yes but the PTB are not forcing you to buy an electric car. It’s not going to happen any time soon. Second hand car sales to be banned? Don’t think so - we’d need an awfully big scrapyard for several million cars, not to mention putting several industries out of business.

 

[Trevp666]

Don't be too sure about what could be forced upon people though.
The 'car scrappage scheme' was brought in to encourage people to get rid of perfectly usable vehicles* and purchase new ones with a grant obtained through the scrappage.
This meant that many, many vehicles (of types that are now rapidly becoming valuable classics) ended up being taken off the roads when it would have been economically, as well as environmentally, more sound to keep them in use.
And as it turned out, the new cars we were encouraged to buy were not as 'green' as they had been made out to be.

(* perfectly usable vehicles because you could not qualify unless your vehicle being scrapped had a current MOT - I shit you not)

 

[Mythopoeika]

That’s a big if. Since you’re not being deprived of a car by government decree you don’t need to march on Whitehall just yet.

Sure. The government would only be indirectly involved in creating hardships.
Plausible deniability.

 

[Trevp666]

That’s a big if.

Indeed. We rarely agree on lots of things but I certainly do there. If my auntie had a cock she'd be my uncle. But she doesn't.

 

[Mythopoeika]

Yes but the PTB are not forcing you to buy an electric car. It’s not going to happen any time soon.

At this moment in time. How long before it does happen?

 

[Floyd1]

Don't be too sure about what could be forced upon people though.
The 'car scrappage scheme' was brought in to encourage people to get rid of perfectly usable vehicles* and purchase new ones with a grant obtained through the scrappage.
This meant that many, many vehicles (of types that are now rapidly becoming valuable classics) ended up being taken off the roads when it would have been economically, as well as environmentally, more sound to keep them in use.
And as it turned out, the new cars we were encouraged to buy were not as 'green' as they had been made out to be.

(* perfectly usable vehicles because you could not qualify unless your vehicle being scrapped had a current MOT - I shit you not)

It even happens with bicycles....

 

[gordonrutter]

Temporarily locked due to excessive wandering off topic.

 

[hunck]

Sure. The government would only be indirectly involved in creating hardships.
Plausible deniability.

OK so how are these ‘other players’ going to stop you or max driving your car?

At this moment in time. How long before it does happen?

I can’t give you a date but will stick with ‘not any time soon’. I’ll turn your question back to you - what date would you estimate for being forced to buy an electric car?

Indeed. We rarely agree on lots of things but I certainly do there.

That’s OK - you can’t help being wrong about lots of things!

 

[Mythopoeika]

OK so how are these ‘other players’ going to stop you or max driving your car?

At first, the government would say it's OK to continue driving a car within certain zones, but only if it meets certain specs.
Then, a few years after that, they'd tighten the specs to screen out more cars of a certain type.
Then, further down the line, they'd only permit electric vehicles. The WEF seem to want to impose this by 2050. I'll be dead by then, maybe.
Rinse and repeat.
People who break the rules will be monitored by ANPR and CCTV and perhaps fined. In extreme cases, their vehicles could be seized.

All of the above actions will make transport and free movement more expensive, which will ultimately lead to hardship,

 

[Trevp666]

That’s OK - you can’t help being wrong about lots of things!

I'm never wrong about anything!

 

[Lobeydosser]

At first, the government would say it's OK to continue driving a car within certain zones, but only if it meets certain specs.
Then, a few years after that, they'd tighten the specs to screen out more cars of a certain type.
Then, further down the line, they'd only permit electric vehicles. The WEF seem to want to impose this by 2050. I'll be dead by then, maybe.
Rinse and repeat.
People who break the rules will be monitored by ANPR and CCTV and perhaps fined. In extreme cases, their vehicles could be seized.

All of the above actions will make transport and free movement more expensive, which will ultimately lead to hardship,

It will be monitered by the digital id app on your phone - not from 2050, but from Dec 23rd 2023.
It's about monitoring and control, that and selling or should I say leasing you the means of transport (and selling your data of course).
I suspect you won't be allowed to own any means of transport in the long run (car, bike, horse etc) - everything will be a subscription.
No repairs allowed, no modifications allowed.
I see this trend also in computing - install your own software on your own computer ? No, you must download an "app" from the approved store - doing anything other is supicious behaviour and "wrongthink" , might hurt your social score....

 

[michael59]

Including Putin.

& Trudeau.

The cost of groceries has skyrocketed and now they have started closing down the cheap stores, like Walmart. They are closing 3 Walmart stores in Chicago, Illiniol, USA, all by March 10th.

https://www.nbcchicago.com/news/loc...3-chicago-area-walmarts-set-to-close/3069263/

I know one shut down in Edmonton, Alberta, Canada about a month ago with another 6 closing across Canada soon.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/business/walmart-canada-closures-upgrades-1.5950315