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The Child Snatcher(s) (Child Abductor Trope / Meme): UL?

Homo Aves said:
I have a friend like that too, oddly.
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It's a curse, the opposite of the man who always attracts women who start out wonderful and turn out to be psychotic. :D
 
Bogeyman in other cultures

* Brazil - In Brazil, a similar creature with the same function (scare misbehaved children) exists as the "Sack man" (portuguese: "homem do saco"). It is portrayed as an adult male, usually in the form of a bum, or a hobo, wich carries a sack in his back (much like Santa Claus would), and collects children who are mean or misbehave to sell them. Parents may tell their kids that they will call the "Sack man" to collect them if they do not behave.

extrcted from HERE
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Urban legend reveals modern fears
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/nort ... 278797.stm


Some urban legends play on the fears of parents
From Belfast to Boston the story goes round that a child has gone missing in a shop and is found in the toilets with foreigners trying to alter their appearance.

It is every parent's nightmare and has one other underlying theme - it's not true, it is what is termed an urban legend.

There have been a spate of such claims being made to newsrooms across Northern Ireland in recent weeks with one common variant, that immigrants are the ones trying to abduct the child.

Police in Ballymena, County Antrim, had to speak out last week to dismiss one such story after reports of an attempted abduction in the town and there have been similar stores in the Greater Belfast Area.

Snopes.com, a website dedicated to urban legends and similar folklore, lists the rumour as being related to the growth of cities and an increased fears of the anonymity of day-to-day life.

Society

It lists such stories under the heading of Parental Nightmares, and with little wonder.

Combined with fears of "stranger danger" such a story can be round the school gates or office quickly with a remarkable amount of embellishment.

Likewise with the rise of the internet and text messaging such a warning can be around a community before it can be debunked.

The relayer of the story may have heard it from a friend whose wife/husband heard it from an employee at the store or a witness.

The story doing the rounds in Northern Ireland can be read as a warning to parents not to take your eyes off your children for a minute or they may be snatched.

While such advice is sensible, there have been no kidnappings from supermarkets in Northern Ireland and the police press office have been debunking such stories for the last two years.

Spaces

Dr Mikel J. Koven from the International Society for Contemporary Legend Research said how such stories begin can rarely be traced, but they say something about society.

"We don't know where they start - it's impossible to trace them back to the very first time they're used and I don't know if that is an important activity, about where they come from, but what is important is what they say about society.

"This one is clearly a story of fear perhaps about an increase in Gypsies or the Traveller population that's more noticeable, but it is certainly fear of the other and toilets are liminal spaces - they are in-between spaces not quite the shop or the supermarket, a place where you get family food, it is just off to one side - the margins of society.

"Likewise having the assailants as Travellers, who are also off to one side of society."

Other urban legends which may strike fear into the heart of parents include a police officer cyberstalking a young girl to show her how vulnerable she is and how a babysitter high on drugs believes a baby is a turkey and cooks it in the oven. Likewise these are all untrue.
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In regards to the van, one day my small son was playing in the front yard when a man pulled up and tried to talk him into accepting a ride - not realizing I was just around the corner of the house and could see the whole thing. He sped off. He was also driving a white van.
 
escargot1 said:
You didn't get the number?
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No, it happened too fast. I could only report a white van, which might be why they're so often implicated. They're so featureless and generic

Luckily my son immediately knew something was wrong and backed away, saying no, while I ran to get him. I still feel relief about that!
 
Remembered from school days.... we had a talk about "stranger danger" and why we shouldn't talk to strangers etc. I don't remember if it was a deliberate planned talk or whether it was related to a suspected abduction. However, the upshot of it was a few days later one of the boys in my class was seen getting into a van... possibly white :D in the middle of the day with an adult. Cue many children running to our class teacher to tell her - turned out, he was being met by a relative for a doctors appointment. My memory is of an exasperated teacher trying to praise us for being observant whilst probably thinking "pesky kids"
 
ramonmercado said:
Urban legend reveals modern fears
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/nort ... 278797.stm


Some urban legends play on the fears of parents
From Belfast to Boston the story goes round that a child has gone missing in a shop and is found in the toilets with foreigners trying to alter their appearance.

It is every parent's nightmare and has one other underlying theme - it's not true, it is what is termed an urban legend.

There have been a spate of such claims being made to newsrooms across Northern Ireland in recent weeks with one common variant, that immigrants are the ones trying to abduct the child.

Police in Ballymena, County Antrim, had to speak out last week to dismiss one such story after reports of an attempted abduction in the town and there have been similar stores in the Greater Belfast Area.
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Yep, I live in Belfast and have heard this story has happened in 3 or 4 different shopping centres over the past 6 weeks or so. The Polish are generally blamed. Mass hysteria and fear of anything different, as usual.
 
Some real life child snatching.

Guatemala pushes for DNA tests of kids adopted in U.S.
http://www.newsdaily.com/stories/tre5b7 ... -adoption/

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

By Sarah GraingerPosted 2009/12/08 at 12:57 pm EST

GUATEMALA CITY, Dec. 8, 2009 (Reuters) — For three years Olga Lopez desperately searched for her baby daughter who was snatched from her home in Guatemala, until her face appeared in government paperwork for an international adoption.


Lopez, along with two other mothers who also believe their children were stolen and put up for U.S. adoption, pushed Guatemala to ask the U.S. Department of Justice to track down the babies and give them DNA tests so they can be returned.

"I recognized my daughter from her photo in the adoption files but there's always the possibility that it's not her. I don't want to live in doubt. I want a DNA test," Lopez said.

So far there has been no response from U.S. authorities, Lopez says. U.S. officials would not confirm they had received a formal request from Guatemala.

Guatemala, a small Central American country of 13 million people, used to have the world's highest per capita adoption rate, with 5,000 children sent abroad each year. Private lawyers charged up to $50,000 to handle an adoption and sometimes forged papers or paid mothers to sell their children.

In December 2007, Guatemalan authorities introduced tough new rules to crack down on baby traffickers. A newly created adoption authority has not allowed a single international adoption since.

Some 3,000 cases that started under the previous adoption system are still in progress, with prosecutors promising to meticulously examine the files for fraud. So far, about half have been completed successfully, and the rest will likely be resolved by the end of January, said a spokesman for the new adoption authority.

But Loyda Rodriguez suspects the new system has cracks. Her 2-year-old daughter, Anyeli, was playing on the porch in the outskirts of Guatemala City when a woman grabbed her and sped off in a waiting taxi. Like other mothers whose babies were taken, she began scouring government adoption records to look for her daughter. She believes the baby was adopted by a couple in Missouri in December 2008.

Guatemala's Attorney General's office asked the United States in April of this year to test the three children, all adopted under the old system, after activist Norma Cruz went on a hunger strike to draw attention to the mothers' plight.

Cruz wants Guatemalan courts to nullify the adoptions.

STOLEN CHILD FOUND

The U.S. Embassy in Guatemala requires couples to have records of two matching DNA tests to issue a visa for an adopted child, but DNA results are sometimes faked by laboratories colluding with child traffickers, said Cruz's organization of mothers, called the Survivors Foundation.

The new government adoption agency prioritizes local adoptions over international ones. But Guatemala said last month it would start sending babies abroad again on a limited basis, since some children have not found local homes.

Cruz says that problems persist despite the new controls.

"The networks behind illegal adoptions haven't been disbanded and they're still operating because they've been making exorbitant amounts of money. This is a million dollar business," said Cruz.

Cruz began her campaign after Ana Escobar found her 8-month-old daughter, who had been kidnapped at gunpoint, in a government office in charge of handling adoptions about to be sent off to the United States.

Escobar recognized her daughter Esther by the crooked little fingers on both her hands and confirmed her identity with a DNA test in 2008 and got her baby back.

(Editing by Eric Beech)
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I had a real creepy experince once cycling back years ago when I was 11 or 12 from tennis .

This must of been summer but it was quite dark / late - any way it was thankully only 4-5 miles back to my house but between half way I noticed this white transit van ( the typical ford one ) and thought nothing of it till I noticed they still semed to be driving quite slow i.e. when they could of overtaken me on the straight.

Naturally I speed up a bit , but up until the last mile, that damm van followed me all the way , just like those cars do on the Tour De France except further away.

Its the only time that happened ,but it was something I never forgot given how surreal it seemed at the time i.e. unless they were planning to run me off the road / shoot me , or where sight seeing - I really dont know why any one would do that with a cyclist .

Perhaps they thought I would tire and stop - which might well have case if Id lived say 20 miles away as opposed to the 5 - but there was no chance in hell I was stopping to find out.
 
There's an understandably controversial Philip K. Dick story called The Pre-Persons, in which the basic premise is that 'abortion trucks' come to pick up unwanted children and 'take them to the pound'. :?
 
I have a memory of an event that my familiy swears never happened.

I was about 3 or 4, and playing at the local park, which was at most 5 minutes walk from my parents house. It was warm, the sky was blue, it must have been the summer. I can't remember being with my older brother, or my friends.

I was approached by two people, a man and a woman. They both had brown hair, and were wearing sunglasses, and brown suits - a very heavy, almost velvet material. It seemed wrong to wear it (or at least I view it that way now).

The man crouched down and addressed me by name - he said they were my mum's cousins, and they'd come to take me home. They used my mum's name when they said this. I find it difficult to recall the woman now, just the man.

If you can imagine Men in Black with brown suits, that's what they looked like.

I refused, and went home, and told her that her cousins had come to get me. She didn't know what I was talking about.

Now, I remember all of this with a very dreamy quality to it. The imagery is very impressionistic, if that makes sense. My mum doesn't recall me telling her this, though I remember her being concerned at the time.

So, a vivid dream perhaps, that over the years my mind has confused for reality? Or something else?
 
Sounds like our old friends the Bogus Social Workers. Difficult to pin down, probably don't exist, but you appear to have actually spotted a pair!
 
I think you dreamed it, if only because most parents wouldn't let a child of 3 or 4 play alone in the park. ;)
 
Mine did. Definitely by 5 even if i've got the dates a bit wappy. Maybe a bit harder to pull off without getting in trouble in the early 80s though rather than the early 70s.
 
escargot1 said:
I think you dreamed it, if only because most parents wouldn't let a child of 3 or 4 play alone in the park. ;)
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I'd tend to agree with you there, if not for the wealth of times when I definitely wasn't dreaming when we were allowed out to the park. I must stress, this park was incredibly close to us. I'd probably be able to walk there from door to park in a minute, I'm allowing for time as a child to dawdle. Thinking more about it, as my father must have been at work, my older brother must have been at school, and it must have been late spring or early summer then it strikes me as being May or June 1984, meaning I was 5 and my mum would have been at home wiht my baby brother. If I wasn't old enough to go on my own at that age, I was certainly old enough to sneak out to the park.

However, I do lean more towards the dream interpretation. That it wasn't inconsistent with my behaviour probably contributes to the reality of it.

Interestingly, they wanted to take me home. I have always felt a little uneasy, as if I didn't quite belong, and used to wonder if I had been adopted - so wondering if this is all related?

Something to tell teh psychotherapist anyway... ;)
 
A genuine case.

A baby kidnapped from her sleeping mother's arms shortly after birth has been found by the family through an astonishing coincidence 17 years later, South African police have said.

A 50-year-old woman has been arrested and charged with kidnapping after students noticed a remarkable likeness between the 17-year-old and her younger biological sister, who started attending the same school this year.

DNA tests have confirmed that the older girl is the daughter of Celeste and Morne Nurse. ...

http://www.rte.ie/news/2015/0227/683197-stolen-baby-south-africa/
 
A South African woman who allegedly kidnapped a baby from a hospital and raised her for 17 years was released on bail yesterday in a sensational case in which authorities are struggling to protect the privacy of a girl who apparently had no idea of what had happened.

Magistrate Mark Engel said the accused woman is not a flight risk and has no previous convictions, but ordered her to stay away from the girl she raised. She was freed on $425 bail.

The woman cannot contact her husband either, with whom she raised the child, as he is now a witness in her trial, prosecution spokesman Eric Ntabazalila said. ...

http://www.irishexaminer.com/world/bail-for-woman-in-south-african-kidnap-case-316918.html
 
Today we call them Grey's. Today we call them invaders from outer space. When throughout ancient Europe they were called Fairies, or Fairy Folk. Numerous stories of Pixies, Elves and every other kind of Folklore'ish type of creature terrorized our ancestors. Stealing our babies. I think it, as Graham Hancock does, that the Folklore of yesterday, is the Alien Grey's of today.
 
Well put Jim but I feel there are nature spirits and little people that are not related to ETs and their presence here.
 
Is there a child snatcher in south Dublin? Probably not. Here’s why
Oatlands College was on alert this week. But rumours and false alarms far outnumber real abduction attempts
Fri, Jan 29, 2016, 11:00

‘Dear parent, we don’t want to alarm you but we are aware of a possible attempted abduction of a student in the area. Please talk to your son about travelling safely to and from school.”

The message from Oatlands College, in Mount Merrion in Co Dublin, was sent on Monday morning. It was never intended to be widely dispersed. But it was quickly posted on Facebook and, by Wednesday, had been shared more than 1,800 times.

The alleged incident related to a younger secondary student, but the message also made its way to parents with children at the neighbouring Oatlands Primary School.

Oatlands College moved swiftly to protect its children. Its principal, Caroline Garrett, says that its Stay Safe policy swung into operation. The school reported the allegation to the Garda, which advised it to issue a text alert.

Parents wanted more information, but the school rightly sought to protect the child at the centre of the alleged incident. “Heightened alert,” said one Facebook poster. “A near successful abduction,” said another. “Watch your kids in the area.”

On Wednesday St Andrew’s College, a fee-paying secondary school about two kilometres away, in Booterstown, sent a letter to parents stressing that although such events are rare, children should be aware of their personal safety. It asked parents to ensure that their children travel in groups, especially in unfamiliar areas, and that they don’t talk to or accept lifts from strangers.

The story also appeared on newspaper and parenting websites. There was an understandably alarmed reaction online.

Rumours
Although the report has, rightly, been taken seriously, a number of signs in this case – including that the Garda, although aware of the case, has not publicly sought assistance; and that an official statement from Oatlands College steers clear of language such as “near successful abduction” – suggest that a child snatcher might not have been lurking outside the school.
The number of attempted child abductions is far outweighed by the number of rumours and stories about the topic – and now social media further amplifies such stories. The archetypal image of men in white vans, cruising the country in search of children to abduct, has an ancient provenance, but it is out of proportion to the real risks that children face.The story is found, in one form or another, all over the world, and still has the power to grip the public imagination.

Between October 1998 and January 1999 various newspapers, including The Irish Times, reported more than 60 “suspicious approaches” to minors, most of which were regarded as attempted abductions.

Reports came from Dublin, the midlands, Dundalk, Cork and Donegal. One paper reported that an English-registered white van had been trying to abduct children in Wexford. ...

http://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-...outh-dublin-probably-not-here-s-why-1.2515120
 
A South African woman has been found guilty of kidnapping a two-day-old baby in 1997.

Police accused her of fraudulently claiming to be the girl's biological mother since snatching her from a hospital in Cape Town.

The 50-year-old woman was arrested last year after suspicions were raised when there was a similar-looking girl at the child's school.

DNA tests then proved that the two girls were sisters, police said.

The kidnapped girl's parents, Celeste and Morne Nurse, called her Zephany, but the name she grew up with has not been revealed to protect her identity.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-afric...ng&ns_source=twitter&ns_linkname=news_central
 
JimELUCIER said:
Today we call them Grey's. Today we call them invaders from outer space. When throughout ancient Europe they were called Fairies, or Fairy Folk. Numerous stories of Pixies, Elves and every other kind of Folklore'ish type of creature terrorized our ancestors. Stealing our babies. I think it, as Graham Hancock does, that the Folklore of yesterday, is the Alien Grey's of today.
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Or a few to many pints.
 
We have had a bit of non-abduction trouble whilst travelling in our white van. A. Officer stops us to shine flashlight into our van in the middle of the night as we come home from working really late from a job in a light industrial district. They were after thieves who steal copper and other metal infrastructure materials. 2. Do not have car trouble in your old white van across the street from your local Homeland Security headquarters. They don't want you to park vans.
 
I just heard a bit of lore first-hand. As I posted on another thread, stolen children being forced to work as beggars is a large-scale problem in China. I was just talking to a colleague of mine here in Hong Kong who has a two year old son, she won't go to mainland China with him because she fears for his safety. Helicopter parenting is the norm in Hong Kong but perhaps her concerns are legitimate.

Anyway, she told me a story about how she was in a park (in Hong Kong) and a woman approached her and started asking her questions about her son. She (the mother) ran away, because she was afraid that the woman might be a child-thief who had a knock-out chemical on her skin or a spray of some kind that she could use to incapacitate her (the parent) while making off with her son. To me this is classic UL stuff (she also told me a FOAF about someone getting their kidneys stolen in Shenzhen after going to the toilet alone, which is a common story in Hong Kong) but there are stories all over the world of people using mysterious knock-out chemicals to perpetrate robbings, rapes etc (see stories about scopolamine use in Colombia, etc), so who knows?
 
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Yea, that's some interesting stuff. I first ran across the reference to scopolamine as a mind control substance. The knowledge seems to have morphed over to a kind of creeping awareness of it's power.
https://www.drugs.com/illicit/devils-breath.html

A similar but different rumor runs though South America about white couples stealing babies. Evidently this has been responsible for a couple of deaths where crowds attacked tourists.
 
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Gambeir said:
A similar but different rumor runs though South America about white couples stealing babies. Evidently this has been responsible for a couple of deaths where crowds attacked tourists.
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We've had posts about that here. Can't find them just now.
 
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Gambeir said:
Yea, that's some interesting stuff. I first ran across the reference to scopolamine as a mind control substance. The knowledge seems to have morphed over to a kind of creeping awareness of it's power.
https://www.drugs.com/illicit/devils-breath.html

A similar but different rumor runs though South America about white couples stealing babies. Evidently this has been responsible for a couple of deaths where crowds attacked tourists.

Should add here that in America there's no such thing as gypsies any longer. You're never going to hear anyone talking about gypsies. When I was child of about 5 or 6 I saw a long line of cars and trailers being escorted by the cops out of the city. I remember this very clearly and I asked my pop what was going on, and he said: "Gypsies." I took it that gypsies weren't a good thing, whatever they were. It was a big show for a 5 year old back in the day.
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In ancient Rome, slave children would be purchased to be used as beggars, and children who were in some way maimed or disfigured made more effective beggars, because they were more heart-rending. Perhaps slave children with physical infirmities ended up as beggars because they were "good for nothing else", and perhaps sometimes perfectly healthy children would be deliberately mutilated, to make them more tragic. In either case, the fate of such children when they became too old to be child beggars was probably the obvious one.
 
ramonmercado said:
We've had posts about that here. Can't find them just now.
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Here's one of a lynching in China:

A mob of parents have killed a book salesman and badly injured four of his colleagues after rumours spread that the men were a human smuggling ring.

China's official Xinhua news agency said the attack, at a primary school, occurred while the group handed out leaflets about a lecture.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/asia-pacific/8327219.stm
 
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