The Pentagon Finally Admits It Investigates UFOs

INT21

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Feinman,

Agreed, and as I said, it is his choice.

However most people who have had a bad experience would not mention having had one on a public forum if they did not wish people to at least show an interest in it/them.

'Those who have a secret to keep usually keep it a secret that they have a secret to keep'.
 

feinman

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It's strange; I felt compelled to dig through the articles and interview people who had also had experiences, but at other times I cannot bring myself to think about it. I should give a synopsis of what I think is going on with UFOs.. I'll do that soon.
 

michael59

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Feinman,

Agreed, and as I said, it is his choice.

However most people who have had a bad experience would not mention having had one on a public forum if they did not wish people to at least show an interest in it/them.

'Those who have a secret to keep usually keep it a secret that they have a secret to keep'.

What am I being secretive about? I was responding to other posts that seemed to find it easier to accept everything but what a whole village of people were saying. Even the fact that governments are/have been taking notice to the point of releasing footage and speaking out about it.

Why is it easier to accept that thousands if not hundreds of thousands of people across the globe are mistaking balloons, or smudges on a lens, or faulty radar equipment, or sunlight, or Chinese lanterns for space craft, than it is to listen and take note that something must be going on and has been going on for centuries?
 

INT21

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Michael,

I think you are seeing things from a different perspective, at least to my own.

If I had seen something unusual (which I have), and posted about it (which I did) I would expect others to ask questions. This is how it generally works.

I agree that many thousands of people have reported seeing things that do not fit into the identifiable categories.

And I am also of the opinion that there does appear to be something going on that we do not understand. I have never said otherwise.

It is a fact though that there are very many people who do mistake lanterns for ufo. Even though lanterns have a few quite distinctive characteristics.

The thing that always has to be born in mind is that if, and it is a big if, there are actual ET types or some other as yet unknown phenomena that we don't know about, then any government that does find out about it will definitely not let anyone know.

Would You ? If so, can you explain your reasoning for doing so,

In this day of computer graphics etc, it is almost impossible to be sure that any pictures released by anyone are actually real.
 

eburacum

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Well, these objects will remain UAP until they are identified positively, which probably will never happen. That doesn't rule out conventional but unidentified aircraft.

Secondly this reinforces the observation that Elizondo used false pretences to gain their release; not that this really matters, since this sort of thing needs to be examined in the public arena, even if the eventual conclusion is that these are conventional craft.
 

feinman

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Secondly this reinforces the observation that Elizondo used false pretences to gain their release; not that this really matters, since this sort of thing needs to be examined in the public arena, even if the eventual conclusion is that these are conventional craft.
I agree.
 

eburacum

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Taking the last analysis first (since this is the only one that is based on the analysis of data from a recorded sensor) Knuth and his colleagues have assumed that the movement of the Nimitz Tic-Tac at the end of the clip was an actual movement of the unknown object. In fact this occurred when the FLIR sensor was changing magnification, at which point the FLIR sensor lost sensor lock and therefore lost track of the object. Most likely the object did not move sideways at all, as the Navy has suggested elsewhere.

In other words, the analysis of the Nimitz event is bullshit. Since all the other analyses are based on much less concrete data, I suspect they are bullshit too.
 

feinman

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Taking the last analysis first (since this is the only one that is based on the analysis of data from a recorded sensor) Knuth and his colleagues have assumed that the movement of the Nimitz Tic-Tac at the end of the clip was an actual movement of the unknown object. In fact this occurred when the FLIR sensor was changing magnification, at which point the FLIR sensor lost sensor lock and therefore lost track of the object. Most likely the object did not move sideways at all, as the Navy has suggested elsewhere.

In other words, the analysis of the Nimitz event is bullshit. Since all the other analyses are based on much less concrete data, I suspect they are bullshit too.
We'll have to see. The Nimitz encounter is apparently just one encounter analyzed. Not looking good for terrestrial craft theory; the Navy isn't answering Congressman Mark Walker's questions, either..
 

feinman

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'Member, these things were also tracked on radar from the Princeton and elsewhere..:

"According to Kevin Day, the Princeton’s senior radar operator at the time, his screen showed well over 100 AAVs over the course of the week. “Watching them on the display was like watching snow fall from the sky,” he says in his first-ever on-camera interview, for HISTORY’s “Unidentified: Inside America's UFO Investigation.”
According to Day, the AAVs appeared at an altitude greater than 80,000 feet, far higher than commercial or military jets typically fly. Initially, the Princeton’s radar team didn’t believe what they were seeing, chalking up the anomalies to an equipment malfunction. But after they determined that everything was operating as it should and they began detecting instances in which the AAVs dropped with astounding speed to lower, busier airspace, Day approached the Princeton’s commander about taking action.
“I was chomping at the bit,” he says. “I just really wanted to intercept these things.”

https://www.history.com/news/uss-nimitz-2004-tic-tac-ufo-encounter
 

eburacum

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The traces supposedly seen by Day do not seem to be available for analysis as recorded data, so it is difficult to say exactly what they were. I suspect that if the data were released, the answers might be forthcoming.
 

feinman

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The traces supposedly seen by Day do not seem to be available for analysis as recorded data, so it is difficult to say exactly what they were. I suspect that if the data were released, the answers might be forthcoming.
That data is not being released --even the original videos of the objects have not been released --Fravor saw a different recording of the Tic Tac than what was released, too. I suspect that it's the same reason Walker is being stonewalled.. They are alien --just like the object si the '40s and before; to release the data or answer the questions would be to admit to it.
 

feinman

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The traces supposedly seen by Day do not seem to be available for analysis as recorded data, so it is difficult to say exactly what they were. I suspect that if the data were released, the answers might be forthcoming.
You have to ask yourself why the data is never forthcoming --now, and after the Estimate of the Situation was created.
 

Tol from Leeds

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Not sure if this forum has followed the Admiral Wilson Leaks update recently but I found this courtesy of Richard Dolans website and he seems to be sure of its importance - https://theadmiralthomaswilsonufodocument.blogspot.com/
The blogger behind this is unidentified (The Dolos Group ?) and is firmly in the TTSA camp from reading between the lines but if true, and Dolan has staked his reputation on this (he interviewed Dr Eric Davis recently who is referred to in the leaks), it does seem a logical and well researched dissection of the memos in question .....
The most interesting blog is this one "How the Admiral Thomas Wilson UFO Document Exposed The Complicity Between Department of Defense Officials and Rogue Special Access Programs".
 

marhawkman

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'Member, these things were also tracked on radar from the Princeton and elsewhere..:

"According to Kevin Day, the Princeton’s senior radar operator at the time, his screen showed well over 100 AAVs over the course of the week. “Watching them on the display was like watching snow fall from the sky,” he says in his first-ever on-camera interview, for HISTORY’s “Unidentified: Inside America's UFO Investigation.”
According to Day, the AAVs appeared at an altitude greater than 80,000 feet, far higher than commercial or military jets typically fly. Initially, the Princeton’s radar team didn’t believe what they were seeing, chalking up the anomalies to an equipment malfunction. But after they determined that everything was operating as it should and they began detecting instances in which the AAVs dropped with astounding speed to lower, busier airspace, Day approached the Princeton’s commander about taking action.
“I was chomping at the bit,” he says. “I just really wanted to intercept these things.”

https://www.history.com/news/uss-nimitz-2004-tic-tac-ufo-encounter
Part of me wonders if this is mis-information.

That last line feels odd. You're just a RADAR operator. sure, curiosity makes sense, but the radarman doesn't decide whether jets get scrambled.
 

michael59

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Not sure if this forum has followed the Admiral Wilson Leaks update recently but I found this courtesy of Richard Dolans website and he seems to be sure of its importance - https://theadmiralthomaswilsonufodocument.blogspot.com/
The blogger behind this is unidentified (The Dolos Group ?) and is firmly in the TTSA camp from reading between the lines but if true, and Dolan has staked his reputation on this (he interviewed Dr Eric Davis recently who is referred to in the leaks), it does seem a logical and well researched dissection of the memos in question .....
The most interesting blog is this one "How the Admiral Thomas Wilson UFO Document Exposed The Complicity Between Department of Defense Officials and Rogue Special Access Programs".
This might just be a rehash of the info you have posted here but I thought I would add it just in case there are additional documents. It's quite lengthy, my eyes got tired. :)

https://theadmiralthomaswilsonufodo...exposes-department-of-defense-complicity.html
 

michael59

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Office of Naval Intelligence (ONI) Admits to "TOP SECRET" Records and "SECRET" Video From USS Nimitz "Tic Tac" UFO Incident

On October the 28th, 2019, long-time researcher and friend Christian Lambright submitted a Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) request to the US Navy’s (USN) Office of Naval Intelligence (ONI) for records relating to the famed USS Nimitz “Tic Tac” UFO encounter. In it, he stated:


“This is a request for records under the provisions of the Freedom of Information Act (5 U.S.C. 552) as amended including the E-FOIA amendments. Because I am unsure of what department or agency retains the records I am requesting, I ask that you forward a copy of this request to all locations that would have been in position to receive any of the material(s) detailed in the following paragraphs.

This request is to include all releasable portions of records and reports related to investigation of the detection of and encounter(s) with Anomalous Aerial Vehicles (AAVs) by personnel involved with the Nimitz Carrier Strike Group (CSG) operations off the western coast of the United States during the period of approximately 10-16 November, 2004. The designation ‘AAVs’ is used here because it appeared in a summary of these events, so there may also be other terms used in the material I am requesting.

Information supportive of my request comes from a former pilot and now writer who has publicly stated he was allowed to see an exhaustive classified ONI report on these events prior to an article he published in 2015. Other supportive information comes from a contractor/analyst who has stated that an investigation had been conducted by a “GS-15” with the Office of Naval Intelligence.

If any records responsive to my request originated with another agency and require review or handling by that agency, I request that I be informed appropriately of the agency(ies) involved and actions in this regard.

I also request that ANY and ALL partially releasable information be forwarded to the appropriate agency(ies) specified for review, if any, and that I be informed appropriately of actions in this regard.

In order to help determine the category in which to place this request, please know that I am a private individual requesting records for noncommercial research and study purposes. Therefore, I believe this request belongs in the “all other” fee category. However, I am willing to pay reasonable search and reproduction fees up to a maximum of $50.00 over and above the ‘2 hours’ research time and first 100 pages free’ provisions of the FOIA for costs associated with this request if necessary.

If my request is denied in whole or in part, I ask that you explain all deletions by reference to specific categories of exempted information, but as required by law, release any segregable portions that are left after the exempted material has been redacted. I also request that redactions be made using blackout not white-out.”


Less than two months later, on December 9th, 2019, the ONI’s FOIA/PA Coordinator, Camille V’Estres, sent Lambright her reply. Her letter states, in part:

“This is a final response to your Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) request of October 28, 2019, addressed to the Office of Naval Intelligence (ONI). Your request was assigned the above referenced Department of Navy FOIA number. You request all releasable portions of records and reports related to investigation of the detection of and encounter(s) with Anomalous Aerial Vehicles (AAVs) by personnel involved with the Nimitz Carrier Strike Group (CSG) operations off the western coast of the United States during the period of approximately 10-16 November, 2004.

Our review of our records and systems reveal that ONI has no releasable records related to your request. ONI has searched our records for responsive documents. We have discovered certain briefing slides that are classified TOP SECRET. A review of these materials indicates that are currently and appropriate Marked and Classified TOP SECRET under Executive Order 13526, and the Original Classification Authority has determined that the release of these materials would cause exceptionally grave damage to the National Security of the United States. Specifically, under Section 1.4, the materials would trigger protections under subcategory c), the Intelligence Activities of the United States, as well as the Sources and Methods that are being used to gather information in support of the National Security of the United States. In addition, the materials would trigger protections under subcategory e), Scientific and Technological Matters related to the National Security of the United States. For this reason, the materials are exempt from release under the (b) (1) Exemption for Classified Matters of National Defense. As a result these records may not be released and are being withheld.

We have also determined that ONI possesses a video classified SECRET that ONI is not the Original Classification Authority for. ONI has forwarded your request to Naval Air Systems Command to make a determination on releasability…”

From there, Ms. V’Estres goes on to offer Lambright his standard rights of appeal, and a non-determination of fee waiver.


Read the rest at the link below, please...


http://ufos-documenting-the-evidenc...ice-of-naval-intelligence-oni-admits.html?m=1
 

michael59

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The Navy cryptically says it has top-secret UFO briefings that would cause 'exceptionally grave damage' to US national security if published

The Navy says it has material about UFOs that, if released, "would cause exceptionally grave damage to the National Security of the United States."

The Navy said it "discovered certain briefing slides that are classified TOP SECRET" in response to a freedom-of-information request, which asked about a series of videos that showed pilots baffled by mysterious, fast objects in the sky.

The Navy previously confirmed it was treating these objects as UFOs - which means they are being treated as unexplained but not necessarily extraterrestrial.


https://amp.businessinsider.com/nav...to-ufo-sightings-would-damage-security-2020-1
 

maximus otter

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US Navy submarine ‘encountered 500mph Nimitz UFO in ocean’ 4 years after sighting

A former United States Air Force intelligence expert claims he found reports of a Los Angeles-class submarine seeing an unidentified submerged object in "2007 or 2008" that travelled at 550mph underwater. It supposedly matched the description of the USS Nimitz UFO.

Mike Turber, an intelligence expert who claims to have worked in the USAF, claims the craft was actually created by the US military.

And in an exclusive chat with Daily Star Online, he suggested the craft is capable of hurtling at astonishing speeds in both the air and sea.

“There was a submarine situation – that report will probably come out further down the line,” he explained. “It (the tic-tac object) was travelling at 550mph. As far as I know, it was a Los Angeles-class submarine. I believe it was around 2007 and 2008. It was kind of in passing when someone mentioned it – I thought it was just a torpedo. But, apparently not.”

https://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/weird-news/navy-submarine-encountered-500mph-nimitz-21357187

maximus otter
 

hunck

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US Navy submarine ‘encountered 500mph Nimitz UFO in ocean’ 4 years after sighting

A former United States Air Force intelligence expert claims he found reports of a Los Angeles-class submarine seeing an unidentified submerged object in "2007 or 2008" that travelled at 550mph underwater. It supposedly matched the description of the USS Nimitz UFO.

Mike Turber, an intelligence expert who claims to have worked in the USAF, claims the craft was actually created by the US military.

And in an exclusive chat with Daily Star Online, he suggested the craft is capable of hurtling at astonishing speeds in both the air and sea.

“There was a submarine situation – that report will probably come out further down the line,” he explained. “It (the tic-tac object) was travelling at 550mph. As far as I know, it was a Los Angeles-class submarine. I believe it was around 2007 and 2008. It was kind of in passing when someone mentioned it – I thought it was just a torpedo. But, apparently not.”

https://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/weird-news/navy-submarine-encountered-500mph-nimitz-21357187

maximus otter
I'm somewhat doubtful - the fastest manmade object seems to be the Russian VA-111 Shkval jet powered torpedo which can reportedly reach 200mph using 'supercavitating' technology. Submarines can reach around 50mph. The black marlin has been known to reach speeds of over 65mph.

Without supercavitating, resistance from water must be enormous.
 

Mythopoeika

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I'm not sure how they would accurately measure its speed at 500 mph. They could do a rough calculation, but it would be based on a small sample as it whizzed past.
 

Patrick30

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I’ve had an eye out for ufo phenomenon since I was a wee lad in the 60s.
So far, nothing. My Fortean life is extremely boring.
If I was gonna keep looking tho, the 4 corners area around Farmington would be good place to hang out if I was looking to get probed, or skinwalked, or just see something weird and unexplainable.
Lots of “energies” there, real or imagined. The place def has an otherworldly vibe.
I love the area, and am seriously considering moving in that direction.
Tho I’m considering Alamosa in the San Louis moreso than the 4 corners. Kinda has the same otherworldly vibe, but a bit more H2O in the environment, a tiny bit of agriculture, so a bit more “normal”. In the San Louis, the aliens stick mostly to mutilating livestock.
 

marhawkman

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I'm somewhat doubtful - the fastest manmade object seems to be the Russian VA-111 Shkval jet powered torpedo which can reportedly reach 200mph using 'supercavitating' technology. Submarines can reach around 50mph. The black marlin has been known to reach speeds of over 65mph.

Without supercavitating, resistance from water must be enormous.
Unless they used a textured skin. One idea that's been floated for a while is that of carefully texturing the skin of an object so that as it moves it creates tiny vortices that work much like bearing in reducing resistance. How that would work at 500 MPH is a good question, but it feels like the sort of question DARPA has probably already asked themselves.
 

Mythopoeika

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Unless they used a textured skin. One idea that's been floated for a while is that of carefully texturing the skin of an object so that as it moves it creates tiny vortices that work much like bearing in reducing resistance. How that would work at 500 MPH is a good question, but it feels like the sort of question DARPA has probably already asked themselves.
One of the reasons for the dappled texture on a golf ball?
 

marhawkman

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One of the reasons for the dappled texture on a golf ball?
that is the same basic principle in action.

With Golfballs people figured out by experimentation THAT it works before figuring out why. Golfballs used to be smoothly round, but people noticed that new balls didn't fly as far as used ones that had dents and scratches. Then someone made balls with dimples and those worked even better.
 
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blessmycottonsocks

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" I don't believe we can reverse engineer UFO materials."

Agreed. If you believe UFOs to be alien technology, capable of interplanetary travel, they are so far in advance of our knowledge that it would be the equivalent of giving Alexander Graham Bell an iPhone and expecting him to reverse-engineer that!
 

marhawkman

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" I don't believe we can reverse engineer UFO materials."

Agreed. If you believe UFOs to be alien technology, capable of interplanetary travel, they are so far in advance of our knowledge that it would be the equivalent of giving Alexander Graham Bell an iPhone and expecting him to reverse-engineer that!
A lot of people speculate that alien technology uses mechanical engineering principles that are unknown to us. The key reason to want to study their tech is to figure out HOW it works. Even if you can't duplicate it, learning how/why it works might teach you how to make something similar.

Alexander Graham Bell would probably understand the concept of micro-circuitry, but the mechanics of how to make them would probably be outside his comprehension. They don't really require materials he doesn't have, but machinery and tools he doesn't have.

Applying this logic to UFOs... welll… maybe the hulls of UFOs aren't solid metal but an advanced sort of electromechanical propulsion. Kinda like printed circuits or microcircuits, but metal.
 
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