Thylacines (Post-1936 Sightings)

Mungoman

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The one thing that stands out in that article is the reminder that we, The British, really fucked up with Australasia in general. Australia, New Zealand and Tasmania were home to such a fascinating array of visually improbable creatures. The fact that the platypus is both venomous and looks like a ridiculous fake of creature is the clearest example of that.

Marsupials are fascinating, and localised to this area of the Earth. The Empire just wanted to clear out land for farming and for more penal colonies, never truly questioning what they were destroying in the process. The Thylacine being almost certainly hunted to extinction may seem carelessly inhumane, but when you hear how collectors picked apart the body of the 'last' aboriginal Tasmanian man like a trophy creature it hardly seems unusual in comparison.
Yeah Nah C.I. - Australians have done it. Go back to the first explorations with Banks, and the English were enthralled with our Flora and Fauna. The major problem with the Poms were the rats on their ships. The majority of extinct Australian animals are island animals and their demise was due to predation by rats.

I do have a problem though with their propensity for stocking zoological gardens - both private and public. I see sulphur crested Cockatoos caged in the soft watery climes of Britain and it infuriates me - knowing that these large birds have the capability to live as long as mankind (just imagine a gregarious, long lived animal used to heat and aridity with a territory of one thousand squares miles living solely in a cage in a manor somewhere.)

The major fuck-ups were by Currency lads and lasses who wanted a bit of 'Home' to shoot or chase, and the Agricultural Companies who wanted shot of the true Australian. Australia had to push until 1860 to get the courts of London to acquiesce to the idea of Terra Nullius.It was refused a number of times but the Aussies kept coming back with it.

So Nope. Mea culpa mate.
 

Brig

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Lately my wife and I have observed some really bazzare behavior amoung mostly squirrels, but also rabbits, chipmunks and possums. That sit in the middle of the road (usually country state roads) and lick the yellow dividing stripe. At times they act dizzy or disoriented and actually run under a passing car rather than away from it. What on earth is in that yellow paint that attracts these critters and are they getting a "hy" from it?
 

CuriousIdent

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Yeah Nah C.I. - Australians have done it. Go back to the first explorations with Banks, and the English were enthralled with our Flora and Fauna. The major problem with the Poms were the rats on their ships. The majority of extinct Australian animals are island animals and their demise was due to predation by rats.

I do have a problem though with their propensity for stocking zoological gardens - both private and public. I see sulphur crested Cockatoos caged in the soft watery climes of Britain and it infuriates me - knowing that these large birds have the capability to live as long as mankind (just imagine a gregarious, long lived animal used to heat and aridity with a territory of one thousand squares miles living solely in a cage in a manor somewhere.)

The major fuck-ups were by Currency lads and lasses who wanted a bit of 'Home' to shoot or chase, and the Agricultural Companies who wanted shot of the true Australian. Australia had to push until 1860 to get the courts of London to acquiesce to the idea of Terra Nullius.It was refused a number of times but the Aussies kept coming back with it.

So Nope. Mea culpa mate.

You realise that broadly I'm agreeing with you Mungoman.

The sheer notion that we should shove hundreds of people who we had deemed criminals (sometimes for the most trivial of offenses), many of whom were already sick or carrying disease gained either from poverty stricken and inhumane conditions in much of London or from life in overcrowded British jails likewise not fit for human habitation, into the enclosed conditions of a boat for months on end was basically create the perfection conditions for a MASSIVE germ bomb.

To export said sickness, disease (and, yes, Rats too) to a whole new continent which had never had the opportunity to form a natural immunity to such things was a hugely destructive an act. Granted, not exactly intentionally destructive. The goal wasn't biological warfare or anything, but nonetheless it did have a definite effect. I don't think any of us would seriously debate against that.

And yes, the notion of the land being free to claim is one which was inherent to the Age of Empire. This wanky attitude that if you just put a flag in it it's yours, regardless of how much you're slashing and burning a habitat to achieve that, has never worked out well. The more human territory expands, the less space for the local wildlife to live in remains is hardly rocket science. But it's seeing phrases like 'pushing the Black Line back' in Tasmania that I find particularly troubling. This notion that because native people didn't have access to firearms that we could just do what we wanted remains something to be ashamed of as a people.
 

CuriousIdent

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Lately my wife and I have observed some really bazzare behavior amoung mostly squirrels, but also rabbits, chipmunks and possums. That sit in the middle of the road (usually country state roads) and lick the yellow dividing stripe. At times they act dizzy or disoriented and actually run under a passing car rather than away from it. What on earth is in that yellow paint that attracts these critters and are they getting a "hy" from it?

Curious. Not to mention potentially suicidal, of course. Not that they're going to know it. I've never seen this specifically myself, but I suppose there could be something in the paint which is attracting their attention.
 

EnolaGaia

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... What on earth is in that yellow paint that attracts these critters and are they getting a "hy" from it?
It's probably not the yellow paint / tape itself that's attracting animals, but rather something that collects in the middle of the road so as to provide a convenient access point.

Convenience may derive from either (e.g.) affording a lot of something in a small area or allowing the something to be accessed more easily / effectively than would be the case on the sides of the road.

An example of the former would be road kill bits lying out in the open for small scavengers to take. An example of the latter would be a puddle of salt / mineral solution that an animal can lick or lap up easily.

The salt / mineral angle is particularly relevant to larger wildlife (e.g., deer; elk; moose). An open flat area covered in liquid / melted anti-icing materials with high salt content provides a virtual salt lick.
 

Brig

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This spring-summer season has been especially hot and rainy. We have been near flood conditions three times since March. I'd have to think most road salt has been washed away. Our roads are built so the center is slightly elevated for water run off s well. I do not know what is attracting the animals but what ever it is makes them unattentive and often loony acting resulting in a lot of flattened fauna. Crows, hawks and buzzards are having a field day. My worry is this: Many people in this area hunt and eat what they kill. I wonder if this stuff could effect them?
 

Mungoman

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You realise that broadly I'm agreeing with you Mungoman.

The sheer notion that we should shove hundreds of people who we had deemed criminals (sometimes for the most trivial of offenses), many of whom were already sick or carrying disease gained either from poverty stricken and inhumane conditions in much of London or from life in overcrowded British jails likewise not fit for human habitation, into the enclosed conditions of a boat for months on end was basically create the perfection conditions for a MASSIVE germ bomb.

To export said sickness, disease (and, yes, Rats too) to a whole new continent which had never had the opportunity to form a natural immunity to such things was a hugely destructive an act. Granted, not exactly intentionally destructive. The goal wasn't biological warfare or anything, but nonetheless it did have a definite effect. I don't think any of us would seriously debate against that.

And yes, the notion of the land being free to claim is one which was inherent to the Age of Empire. This wanky attitude that if you just put a flag in it it's yours, regardless of how much you're slashing and burning a habitat to achieve that, has never worked out well. The more human territory expands, the less space for the local wildlife to live in remains is hardly rocket science. But it's seeing phrases like 'pushing the Black Line back' in Tasmania that I find particularly troubling. This notion that because native people didn't have access to firearms that we could just do what we wanted remains something to be ashamed of as a people.
Your last paragraph CI.

The initial idea of Terra Nullius was, I think, troubling for Arthur Phillip, also for the Crown. as I said, it was 62 years later that the British Court finally accepted the Australian push from the Governors General (who, until then, had all been military men). Wasn't there a world wide Depression around about then, which would've answered a few questions concerning ethics and probity behind the tardy yet final decision.

And fire arms? there is a notion that the flogging priest, Rev. Samuel Marsden, for some reason took fire arms to New Zealand and equipped the Maori with Rifles, making it a fait accompli for a warlike nation of people...A pity the Australian Aborigine didn't get the same attention.

The Kalkadoon people of Queensland unfortunately had the valor, but not the rifles...stone axes and shovel headed spears are no comparison against the munitions of the squatters and other sundry Currency Lads.

History eh...Unfortunately the Zeitgeist, the fashion of the day, paints it with a sullied hue - even today it happens.

Anyway.

We have a glorious country - lets do our best to keep it that way.
 

Andy Saunders

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Wow, thanks for posting Lord- especially the Lloyd Poke footage from 1990? So maybe they were around then? Does make you wonder......
 

oldrover

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There's a lot of very good stuff at that link. I once tried to track down James Malley for something, I think it was to do with Rex Davis of the Davis photo. I think they knew each other, and were both involved with Guiler's boiler (which Griffiths deals with at the link). Never found him though. But got what I needed elsewhere.
 

oldrover

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Firstly, thanks for posting this, it has a line in it which I am going to quote in a paper I'm writing at the moment. It is just perfect, so again thanks.

Nicholas Chare, oh deary me. A series of repeated errors that offers nothing valuable into the thylacine's history beyond the very overdue observation that trappers tales have been taken and used uncritically.
 

maximus otter

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As a general request, can we please have a digest/relevant extract from the news report rather than just a link, so that we can establish whether a report is worth the time spent loading and reading it.

maximus otter
 

Andy Saunders

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Also on the History channel last night was 'Extinct or alive' saw Forrest Galante travel to Cape York Queensland looking for Tigers- not much about Tigers however the sheer vastness of Australia was quite apparent from the episode, anyway Mr Galante interviewed Brian Hobbs who claimed to have seen a family of Tigers on two separate occasions ( this was in 1980s) however this was not indicated in the episode- an oversight perhaps, and a chap called 'Jimbo' who claimed to seen them by the village dump ( which was basically a hole in the ground), again the isolation of the place was eye opening, Dr Sarah Abel was also on the programme and the technology she was using to find anything was cutting edge... overall a tad disappointing l felt oh well the search continues l suppose.
 

Kingsize Wombat

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Strange but that didn't make the news here in Australia at all! Though it could still show up during the day here, I suppose.

Below is a cropped version of the pic in question. Interesting for sure, but certainly not proof.

Capture.PNG
 

Mythopoeika

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Strange but that didn't make the news here in Australia at all! Though it could still show up during the day here, I suppose.

Below is a cropped version of the pic in question. Interesting for sure, but certainly not proof.

View attachment 14081
That really does look like a Tazzie.
 

Mungoman

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Could be a slightly mangy dingo though, as their overall body shape is not dissimilar to a thylacine.
Can't see any stripes on the mystery creature's back.

View attachment 14084
I don't think that that is a Thylacine. The snout and forehead has little resemblance, the tail doesn't taper, the connection of the tail to the rump reduces in size, and the elongation of the hip to the tail is not to be seen.

I think that this fellow is a well aged fox.
 

Fluttermoth

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It's probably not the yellow paint / tape itself that's attracting animals, but rather something that collects in the middle of the road so as to provide a convenient access point.

Convenience may derive from either (e.g.) affording a lot of something in a small area or allowing the something to be accessed more easily / effectively than would be the case on the sides of the road.

An example of the former would be road kill bits lying out in the open for small scavengers to take. An example of the latter would be a puddle of salt / mineral solution that an animal can lick or lap up easily.

The salt / mineral angle is particularly relevant to larger wildlife (e.g., deer; elk; moose). An open flat area covered in liquid / melted anti-icing materials with high salt content provides a virtual salt lick.
Sorry to distract from the Thylacine discussion, but could it be anti-freeze? That tastes very sweet, apparently, and attracts a lot of animals.
 

Kingsize Wombat

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I don't think that that is a Thylacine. The snout and forehead has little resemblance, the tail doesn't taper, the connection of the tail to the rump reduces in size, and the elongation of the hip to the tail is not to be seen.

I think that this fellow is a well aged fox.
I'm going to have to agree after googling images of mangy foxes and dingoes. The absence of stripes also is a worry.
But the biggest concern here is the location - an almost suburban area. Foxes love the outskirts of human habitation Capture.PNG .
 

CuriousIdent

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Interesting. I mean it does look plausible as a Tasmanian Tiger as positioned in the image. Though with its head facing us like that it's impossible to say whether it has the facial profile we'd be looking for.

One thought though. Is it implausible at this point that Thylacines may have cross-bred with another marsupial - either at some point in the distant past (before being declared extinct) or through a small number of survivors in generations after that point.

What I mean is, when we see modern sightings like this, is what we are seeing truly a 'Tasmanian Tiger' or another cross-bred creature, which has inherited markings or body shape from having a thylacine as an ancestor?
 

oldrover

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Interesting. I mean it does look plausible as a Tasmanian Tiger as positioned in the image. Though with its head facing us like that it's impossible to say whether it has the facial profile we'd be looking for.

One thought though. Is it implausible at this point that Thylacines may have cross-bred with another marsupial - either at some point in the distant past (before being declared extinct) or through a small number of survivors in generations after that point.

What I mean is, when we see modern sightings like this, is what we are seeing truly a 'Tasmanian Tiger' or another cross-bred creature, which has inherited markings or body shape from having a thylacine as an ancestor?
In a nutshell it's absolutely impossible.
 
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