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Tunguska

This documentary just aired here in Australia - well worth watching IMO - though it does not reach a definite conclusion. It's all the better for it, I think,

http://youtu.be/HXfvhJoNi90
 
To be quite honest I'm not surprised that they've found meteorites there. You find them everywhere around the globe - so Im not convinced it was a comet. But Im still not sure what it was that actually caused that explosion.
 
I also consider this unconvincing. There seems to be nothing linking those three meteorites with the Tunguska event. Furthermore without a chemical analysis, I don't see that anything shows those 3 meteorites are even from the same impact. The description of the river makes it sound as if it could have transported stones from far away that then just ended up in the same place.
 
Xanatic* said:
I also consider this unconvincing. There seems to be nothing linking those three meteorites with the Tunguska event. Furthermore without a chemical analysis, I don't see that anything shows those 3 meteorites are even from the same impact. The description of the river makes it sound as if it could have transported stones from far away that then just ended up in the same place.
Click to expand...

Yes, good analysis. Welcome to the forum Xanatic*
 
Thank you, I'm glad to be here. :D
 
I just couldn't get access to my old account.
 
Can you give us a summary please George? Don't have time to go through 93 pages....
 
Apologies, here goes...

A situation developed above earth between a highly respected ET race and a negative one. The friendly ones called for assistance from a large Nordic (ET race) Ship that was in our solar system. The negatives damaged the Nordic ship which forced it into our atmosphere where it eventually exploded above ground. The book mentions that the Nordics love using crystals. A few years ago, people began finding crystals and gemstones with strange patterns within the blast area...

62-f2b747d304.jpg
 
Do they provide any more photos of these unusual crystals?
 
lordmongrove said:
Nice doc on the great Siberian explosion.
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Yes: it's very good. I watched this early last week, and meant to post about it here, but forgot to do so. Thanks for having sorted that.

I was astounded by the (ongoing) sort-of fan club aspect within Russia regarding this phenomenon. The forensic testing of the still-downed trees for extraterrestrial 'shrapnel' was conceptually fascinating (as was the trawling of the 'new' lake- I didn't quite follow whether this was bottomed-out (both metaphorically and literally).

A very Russian-style no-frills documentary: loved it.
 
Ermintruder said:
Yes: it's very good. I watched this early last week, and meant to post about it here, but forgot to do so. Thanks for having sorted that.

I was astounded by the (ongoing) sort-of fan club aspect within Russia regarding this phenomenon. The forensic testing of the still-downed trees for extraterrestrial 'shrapnel' was conceptually fascinating (as was the trawling of the 'new' lake- I didn't quite follow whether this was bottomed-out (both metaphorically and literally).

A very Russian-style no-frills documentary: loved it.
Click to expand...

I think it was a comet or meteor. The UFO nuts just made themselves look silly.
 
but it has a new question: How does a meteor reach escape velocity while in atmosphere?
 
The "iron asteroid passing through rather than impacting" theory is interesting. However, I don't understand why there shouldn't be some sort of trace iron(?) residue settling onto the landscape beneath its path from material ablated off the asteroid body as it passed through the atmosphere. If there were such a residue settling down from above one would think it would be possible to test for a "shadow" or "footprint" of increased iron(?) residue in the soil (etc.) beneath the projected flight path.
 
This Science Alert article provides some more details on the iron asteroid transit / no impact theory:

https://www.sciencealert.com/scient...y-about-the-colossal-tunguska-event-explosion
It includes a brief note on the iron residue issue I asked about earlier ...

The lack of iron debris is also explained by this high velocity, since the object would be moving too fast, and would be too hot, to drop much. Any mass lost would be, the researchers said, through the sublimation of individual iron atoms, which would look exactly like normal terrestrial oxides.
Click to expand...
 
Here are the bibliographic details and abstract for the published paper ...

On the possibility of through passage of asteroid bodies across the Earth’s atmosphere
Daniil E Khrennikov, Andrei K Titov, Alexander E Ershov, Vladimir I Pariev, Sergei V Karpov
Monthly Notices of the Royal Astronomical Society, Volume 493, Issue 1, March 2020, Pages 1344–1351,
https://doi.org/10.1093/mnras/staa329

ABSTRACT
We have studied the conditions of through passage of asteroids with diameters 200, 100, and 50 m, consisting of three types of materials – iron, stone, and water ice, across the Earth’s atmosphere with a minimum trajectory altitude in the range 10–15 km. The conditions of this passage with a subsequent exit into outer space with the preservation of a substantial fraction of the initial mass have been found. The results obtained support our idea explaining one of the long-standing problems of astronomy – the Tunguska phenomenon, which has not received reasonable and comprehensive interpretations to date. We argue that the Tunguska event was caused by an iron asteroid body, which passed through the Earth’s atmosphere and continued to the near-solar orbit.

https://academic.oup.com/mnras/article-abstract/493/1/1344/5722124?redirectedFrom=fulltext
 
how fast would it have to be moving to do that though? hmm.. actually... an object going in the opposite orbit from Earth would have an effective velocity that's insane.
 
It has an interesting comment about that theory though and why some people don't buy it. The grazing approach would seemingly create a more linear debris pattern while the actual pattern is radial. IE the trees felled by the Tunguska event point outward from a central point. This seems to indicate that the shockwave which felled them was uni-directional.
 
More on the "Grazed By An Iron Asteroid" Theory.

In the early morning of June 30, 1908, a massive explosion flattened entire forests in a remote region of Eastern Siberia along the Tunguska River.

Curiously, the explosion left no crater, creating a mystery that has puzzled scientists ever since — what could have caused such a huge blast without leaving any remnants of itself?

Now Daniil Khrennikov at the Siberian Federal University in Russia and colleagues have published a new model of the incident that may finally resolve the mystery. Khrennikov and co say the explosion was caused by an asteroid that grazed the Earth, entering the atmosphere at a shallow angle and then passing out again into space.

“We argue that the Tunguska event was caused by an iron asteroid body, which passed through the Earth’s atmosphere and continued to the near-solar orbit,” they say. If they are correct, the theory suggests Earth escaped an even larger disaster by a hair’s breadth. ...

Instead, Khrennikov and colleagues say a different scenario fits the facts. They say the explosion must have been caused by an iron meteorite about the size of a football stadium. This must have passed through the upper atmosphere, heated rapidly, and then passed out into the Solar System again. The shock wave from this trajectory was what flattened trees.

The shock wave would have caused an explosion of about the right magnitude, and any vaporized iron would have condensed into dust that would be indistinguishable on the ground. Crucially, this scenario would not have left any visible asteroid remnants.

It could also explain reports of dust in the upper atmosphere over Europe after the impact. ...

https://astronomy.com/news/2020/10/tunguska-explosion-in-1908-caused-by-asteroid-grazing-earth
 
ramonmercado said:
More on the "Grazed By An Iron Asteroid" Theory.

In the early morning of June 30, 1908, a massive explosion flattened entire forests in a remote region of Eastern Siberia along the Tunguska River.

Curiously, the explosion left no crater, creating a mystery that has puzzled scientists ever since — what could have caused such a huge blast without leaving any remnants of itself?

Now Daniil Khrennikov at the Siberian Federal University in Russia and colleagues have published a new model of the incident that may finally resolve the mystery. Khrennikov and co say the explosion was caused by an asteroid that grazed the Earth, entering the atmosphere at a shallow angle and then passing out again into space.

“We argue that the Tunguska event was caused by an iron asteroid body, which passed through the Earth’s atmosphere and continued to the near-solar orbit,” they say. If they are correct, the theory suggests Earth escaped an even larger disaster by a hair’s breadth. ...

Instead, Khrennikov and colleagues say a different scenario fits the facts. They say the explosion must have been caused by an iron meteorite about the size of a football stadium. This must have passed through the upper atmosphere, heated rapidly, and then passed out into the Solar System again. The shock wave from this trajectory was what flattened trees.

The shock wave would have caused an explosion of about the right magnitude, and any vaporized iron would have condensed into dust that would be indistinguishable on the ground. Crucially, this scenario would not have left any visible asteroid remnants.

It could also explain reports of dust in the upper atmosphere over Europe after the impact. ...

https://astronomy.com/news/2020/10/tunguska-explosion-in-1908-caused-by-asteroid-grazing-earth
Click to expand...
i visualise that as a bit like the way you have to start a ramjet? Some external force / reaction is necessary to get the body up to the speed where the ramjet ignites - could the friction with the Earth's atmosphere have caused the meteorite to 'ignite' as it were and fire off in a different direction?
 
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