U.S. Military: UFO Investigations, Knowledge & Disclosure(s)

charliebrown

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Nick Pope might not be popular in the UK, but in the U.S., the History TV channel gives Nick a lot of air time.

I guess like Bob Lazar, you either love them or dislike them which is a personal choice.
 

stu neville

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Nick Pope might not be popular in the UK, but in the U.S., the History TV channel gives Nick a lot of air time.

I guess like Bob Lazar, you either love them or dislike them which is a personal choice.
Nothing to do with like or dislike. His claims have been thoroughly investigated and proven to be at best exaggerated and at worst fabricated.

As for the History Channel - well, they give a lot of people airtime...
 

charliebrown

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Recently on Nevada Public Radio ( NPR ), former senate majority leader and creator or AATIP Harry Reid claims that he was disappointed in the Pentagon’s UAP answer.

Harry claims we have a chance to learn so much, and this thing about scaring the population is not his way of thinking.

Harry claims “ I am not afraid so bring it on “.

So, the question is if UAPs are real, are you scared ?

Since I have been about 200 yards from a UAP, I just assume it is a part of the world we live in and I just continue on.
 

ChasFink

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Nothing to do with like or dislike. His claims have been thoroughly investigated and proven to be at best exaggerated and at worst fabricated.

As for the History Channel - well, they give a lot of people airtime...
Give me the good old days when the History Channel was all Nazis all the time.

As far as Nick Pope goes, I'm so tired of him that even the sound of his voice gets on my nerves. In fact, I find myself prejudiced against people who just sound like him.
 

Comfortably Numb

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I guess like Bob Lazar, you either love them or dislike them which is a personal choice.
At least we have freedom of choice - happened to be reading a news report earlier, where that remains an impossible dream for so many.

Yes, we may all disagree on certain aspects of such an eclectic subject and would be extremely weird if we didn't.

Speaking of such strangeness... I was looking for the online copy of a Charles Fort letter recently and as an experiment, removed the prerequisite quotation marks to expand the search, i.e., instead of:

"Charles Fort" letter

I ran a search for:

Charles Fort letter

...and the following came up, because it's a letter and contains both Fort Myer and signed by Charles.

I had your good self in mind, when this resulted... :)

693b09d7080752b743be66af67f0a672 (1)_resize_91.jpg
 

CharmerKamelion

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Good one, Comfortably Numb! In the spirit of "Peanuts", such a staple of my childhood, I am tempted to say "Good grief!"
 

stu neville

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Give me the good old days when the History Channel was all Nazis all the time.
A letter to Viz magazine some years ago read (from memory):

"Dear History Channel
Just so you are aware, there was a lot of history prior to 1939, and there has been quite a lot since 1945. Thought you might like to know.
yours etc"

..or words to that effect. These days it's right up there with Animal Planet in peddling dubious stuff.
 

charliebrown

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It seems the disbelievers of UAPs out number the one believer which seems to be me, and maybe when feinmen was here.

What would it take for you to believe in UAPs ?
 

EnolaGaia

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It seems the disbelievers of UAPs out number the one believer which seems to be me, and maybe when feinmen was here.
What would it take for you to believe in UAPs ?
I firmly believe in Unexplained Aerial Phenomena, having witnessed them multiple times (sometimes with other witnesses).

I do not believe in the interpretation of UAPs as extraterrestrial spacecraft, absent any hard evidence that points to the ETH as a reasonable hypothesis.
 

CharmerKamelion

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It seems the disbelievers of UAPs out number the one believer which seems to be me, and maybe when feinmen was here.

What would it take for you to believe in UAPs
I am open-minded about the origin of UAPs, as I try to be about most other phenomena. To be honest, speaking as someone who has never seen one, I tend to believe there is more to them than we currently understand - and I do feel it is likely that there are things we are not being told. The reasons for 'non-disclosure' (of .... whatever) might be various and complicated, and in my experience any attempt to discuss them with an attitude of "what if?" usually results in people losing patience, because there's no "proof". Very frustrating. I imagine even moreso if you are someone who HAS had an experience.

You mentioned feinman. I wonder where he went? I know he was convinced by the experience that he had had. I hope he is ok.
 
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Ringo

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I believe that most of us here are open to the idea of UAP and a great deal of us would relish hard evidence of Unidentified craft under intelligent control (I for one). However, the majority of evidence presented does not pass muster. It seems, unfortunately, that die hard believers are willing to accept anything as "evidence" and then just SHOUT IN CAPITALS when someone suggests that all may not be as it seems, labelling anyone with a counter argument as "non-believers". Just because we debate the evidence doesn't make us non-believers. We want to believe.

For instance, I do not take all witness testimony at face value. People make things up, misremember and some are just crazy. People lie. And regardless of the back story or how believable a story is, if the picture/video is obviously of a street lamp or a lens flare then the testimony is rendered irrelevant.

Some may have genuinely witnessed what they claim yet without evidence their stories are hearsay and inadmissable. The vast majority of images/videos presented are manipulated, misinterpreted or indeed just fabricated and so when somebody new turns up here, frothing at the mouth with excitement over AFOAF's video, we err on the side of caution rather than just believing everything we are told.
 

charliebrown

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Well,

I don’t really think we are dealing with extraterrestrials.

WW II British intelligence agent, Ivan T. Sanderson found that since the planet earth is 3/4th water, about 80% of UFO reports were connected to water.

Ivan strongly believed that there is an underwater civilization on planet earth which makes sense.

But I also believe that we are dealing with some kind of alternate reality because of reports of UFOs phasing in and out of sight.

I don’t really think humanoids could travel thousands of light years no matter how advanced they could be.

And then there is the movie Dune where space was folded with “ spice “.
 

skinny

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I believe that most of us here are open to the idea of UAP and a great deal of us would relish hard evidence of Unidentified craft under intelligent control (I for one). However, the majority of evidence presented does not pass muster. It seems, unfortunately, that die hard believers are willing to accept anything as "evidence" and then just SHOUT IN CAPITALS when someone suggests that all may not be as it seems, labelling anyone with a counter argument as "non-believers". Just because we debate the evidence doesn't make us non-believers. We want to believe.

For instance, I do not take all witness testimony at face value. People make things up, misremember and some are just crazy. People lie. And regardless of the back story or how believable a story is, if the picture/video is obviously of a street lamp or a lens flare then the testimony is rendered irrelevant.

Some may have genuinely witnessed what they claim yet without evidence their stories are hearsay and inadmissable. The vast majority of images/videos presented are manipulated, misinterpreted or indeed just fabricated and so when somebody new turns up here, frothing at the mouth with excitement over AFOAF's video, we err on the side of caution rather than just believing everything we are told.
This.

Also, Think about this. The senior membership here on this website would have to be the most reliable of folk on the English speaking earth to listen to concerning UAP and it’s possible causes. They’ve been invested in the focus for ten times longer than any government, cabinet minister or state senator, who can not possibly have anything to hide regarding UAP because for the most part they know less about any of it than anyone who can read a book on the subject. Your Popes and Greers are the ones with an agenda to hide - whether it be the almighty dollar or dubious public attention seeking for its own sake. Yes.
 

Aether Blue

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I believe that most of us here are open to the idea of UAP and a great deal of us would relish hard evidence of Unidentified craft under intelligent control (I for one). However, the majority of evidence presented does not pass muster. It seems, unfortunately, that die hard believers are willing to accept anything as "evidence" and then just SHOUT IN CAPITALS when someone suggests that all may not be as it seems, labelling anyone with a counter argument as "non-believers". Just because we debate the evidence doesn't make us non-believers. We want to believe.

For instance, I do not take all witness testimony at face value. People make things up, misremember and some are just crazy. People lie. And regardless of the back story or how believable a story is, if the picture/video is obviously of a street lamp or a lens flare then the testimony is rendered irrelevant.

Some may have genuinely witnessed what they claim yet without evidence their stories are hearsay and inadmissable. The vast majority of images/videos presented are manipulated, misinterpreted or indeed just fabricated and so when somebody new turns up here, frothing at the mouth with excitement over AFOAF's video, we err on the side of caution rather than just believing everything we are told.

I have argued some hypothetical possibilities in this thread, but the trip from "hypothetical" to "proven" is almost as far as from Kansas to the nearest stars, or perhaps even to parallel universes.

Ringo's post is really the gold standard for parsing this phenomenon.
 

stu neville

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I have argued some hypothetical possibilities in this thread, but the trip from "hypothetical" to "proven" is almost as far as from Kansas to the nearest stars, or perhaps even to parallel universes.
With Fortean analysis, in the absence of concrete proof (which by definition such phenomena are) all potential explanations have to be considered, albeit with a sliding scale of probability assigned. When there are so many unknown variables involved, even the probability aspect is debatable, so all possibilities are on the table.

See my signature :) .
Ringo's post is really the gold standard for parsing this phenomenon.
I agree. Accept hypotheses and then test them to pieces is all we can do.
It seems, unfortunately, that die hard believers are willing to accept anything as "evidence" and then just SHOUT IN CAPITALS when someone suggests that all may not be as it seems, labelling anyone with a counter argument as "non-believers".
Exactly so. You can accept subjective testimony as completely sincere whilst querying the perceived events as related by the testifier.
 

charliebrown

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According to Politico, the Pentagon wants the newly formed U.S. Space Force to take over tracking and investigating UAPs.

The Space Force is saying “ No “ because they feel like studying UAPs will make them a laughing joke for existence.

I don’t think you can say “ No “ to the Pentagon ?
 

EnolaGaia

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According to Politico, the Pentagon wants the newly formed U.S. Space Force to take over tracking and investigating UAPs.
The Space Force is saying “ No “ because they feel like studying UAPs will make them a laughing joke for existence.
I don’t think you can say “ No “ to the Pentagon ?
"The Pentagon" is a catch-all label for DOD and the armed services. The US Space Force is one of the armed services, not something separate from "the Pentagon."
 

charliebrown

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Fox TV on August 19th on Tucker Carlson’s Originals, The UFO Files: Chasing the Truth, Tucker will show Dr. Michio Kaku not seen video from the Department of Homeland Security taken in Puerto Rico.

According to Tucker, Dr. Kaku will tell the audience that what he has seen throws out the window all known physics.

Tucker feels like his program will put more pressure on the Pentagon about UAPs.
 

Roland Deschain

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Not sure if this has been posted before.

Drones or UAV swarming American warships. The site is full of ads but read down and it has loads of documents etc and is interesting. I’m sure it has something to do with US Navy testing out state of the art radar / tracking but the FBI get involved and civilian ships get investigated so maybe not.

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zo...us-drones-off-california-over-numerous-nights
 

ramonmercado

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Some 70 years of striving for proof and still none?

And despite such sheer incompetence, you are still in a job?

No... in all seriousness, it doesn't work like that.

I have eventually managed to upload 50 of the 200+ 'triangular UFO' reports I acquired with permission from the NUFORC some 20 years ago, with stated intention of evidencing a snapshot of that specific aspect of our UFO enigma.

The point being that none could be explained as a misunderstanding re, 'flying saucers', or stars, or anything which typically came to mind as a rational explanation, especially so, 'stealth aircraft'... made no sense given the accounts.

They are now online at:

www.forteanmedia.com/TR001.pdf

until:

www.forteanmedia.com/TR050.pdf

@feinman and myself share the intrigue, we differ on whether any evidence of ET involvement has been kept secret.

If it hasn't, then innocent people are being accused of heinous acts and that's surely unacceptable.

That stated, all I perhaps have to offer is that seemingly inexplicable snapshot.

And this.

View attachment 40597

Why?

Because I know the background and it's a judgement call.

Same as everyone else's on the subject.

This ticks all the boxes, a commissioned painting by a witness who I know was in such a senior position (think deputy District Attorney) he could never go public.

'Well, Scott, the interview panel believes we are about to make an imminent promotion appointment. Is there anything you would like to add?'.

'No... except did I tell you about the gigantic triangular UFO which silently came towards my car and then hovered over it, before departing at lightning speed'?

'Scott, we'll...erm...let you know our decision in due course'.

When I shortly upload the other 150, contemporary accounts and confirm, does that actually make any difference?

May I suggest it's a significantly further true reflection on matters?

There was a UK documentary, 'Billion Dollar Secrets', broadcast in 1999.

It featured research into US 'black budget' programmes which was undertaken by Nick Cook, a British aviation journalist and correspondent for 'Jane's Defence Weekly'.

The following is a transcript of discussions between Nick Cook (NC) and Lt. Gen. George Muellner (GM):

NC: General, I've just spent a couple of days in Southern Colorado, where a lot of apparently credible witnesses are reporting sightings of apparently unconventional aircraft, and I mean things like huge black triangles, silent helicopters, all kinds of extraordinary craft.

Should we be looking to the USAF for whatever is going on in this place?

GM: Well, the only programmes that I'm aware of that we have operating out in that environment... obviously are 117s operate out of Holloman... they're triangular shaped, obviously they're black and they operate at night quite frequently and so on.

All of the rest of the aeroplanes we have operating down in the Holloman area in particular are all conventional airplanes.

So, I don't know of any other development programmes or anything else that's going on down in that area or in southern Colorado in general, or for that matter in the New Mexico area.

We don't have anything of significance operating there.

I can tell you as an aviator though, quite frequently it's very, very difficult to discern what a platform is. B-2 for instance, if you're looking near co-altitude with it, it just seems to disappear into the background.

NC: But again, these people are describing things that literally hover over them sometimes, seemingly unmistakable sightings of these things.

GM: Well, I'll tell you, if they can get me the name of the contractor and whosoever operating, I'd love to put them under contract to develop some of these things.
(End)

UFOs are real.

There's no need for a cover-up scenario because they are intangible.

An attack on Holloman AFB. Possibly UFO related.

The main gate at Holloman Air Force Base in New Mexico has reportedly been closed after multiple suspects attempted to force their way through it on Wednesday evening.

In a news release sent to local station KTSM about 11:00 p.m. on Wednesday (1a.m. ET on Thursday), the base said "multiple suspects crashed their vehicle" while attempting to storm the gate, which has reportedly been closed until further notice.

"Earlier this evening, multiple suspects crashed their vehicle while attempting to force their way through the gate. The capabilities of our personnel and resources ensured there is no further threat to the safety and security of Team Holloman," the base said in a statement.

The base, which was established in 1942, is located around six miles from the small city Alamogordo in New Mexico, which is situated in the Chihuahuan Desert and bordered by the Sacramento Mountains.

Holloman said that further updates would be issued once they became available. Newsweek has contacted the air force base for comment.

According to the facility's website, the base "supports national security objectives by deploying worldwide to support peacetime and wartime contingencies," and provides support to "more than 21,000 military and civilian personnel."

https://www.newsweek.com/new-mexico-holloman-air-force-base-gate-multiple-suspects-1620889
 

charliebrown

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This is my opinion in that I notice on the U.S. History Channel Ancient Aliens, speakers like Nick Pope, Luis Elizondo, and Leslie Kean usually end by saying we need more information from the Pentagon.

The only person who asked the right question was the late Stanton Friedman who said we need to ask what do the UAPs want from us.

This is the question to ask !
 

Comfortably Numb

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The only person who asked the right question was the late Stanton Friedman who said we need to ask what do the UAPs want from us.

This is the question to ask !
I corresponded with Stanton at length.

We agreed on some points, although... inevitably not others!

Regarding:

Post in thread 'Kenneth Arnold (Seminal UFO Sighting; June 1947)' https://forums.forteana.org/index.p...nal-ufo-sighting-june-1947.64162/post-2100161

Perhaps there has obviously never been and never can be any revelation of a 'clandestine' cover-up of 'flying saucers', of which the 'founding father, actually goes to lengths alerting never existed in the first place?
 

Comfortably Numb

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Nick Pope might not be popular in the UK, but in the U.S., the History TV channel gives Nick a lot of air time.

I guess like Bob Lazar, you either love them or dislike them which is a personal choice.
As regards Nick Pope, there does exist an evidential choice.

In response to my enquiry of the MoD:

www.forteanmedia.com/MoD_Pope.jpg
 

charliebrown

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The recent U.S. Gallup poll from July, 2021 on UFOs may show citizens are thinking a little more positive toward UFOs.

Since 2018 the positivity rate went from 33% to 41%, but still the majority of the country think that UFOs are secret U.S. Air Force planes according to Gallup.

So this asks the question, if you report a UFO sighting, do the other 60% part of the country think you are crazy.

I been up close to a UFO when I was younger, but I never talk about this event because I still fear that people will run screaming away from me as fast as possible.
 

hunck

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I been up close to a UFO when I was younger, but I never talk about this event because I still fear that people will run screaming away from me as fast as possible.
Have you told us about it? You won’t be able hear us screaming if that’s any encouragement.
 

charliebrown

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Yes Hunck,

I have told my stories on forteana forums with good, friendly responses.

In the past I tried a few other UFO forums that only produced very unfriendly answers, and I left these forums fast.
 

GNC

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Have you told us about it? You won’t be able hear us screaming if that’s any encouragement.

Unless we're screaming our encouragement.

Seriously, though, if you have a rattling good yarn we're always happy to hear it, @charliebrown - you may get it analysed into oblivion, mind you.
 

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An attack on Holloman AFB. Possibly UFO related.

The main gate at Holloman Air Force Base in New Mexico has reportedly been closed after multiple suspects attempted to force their way through it on Wednesday evening.

In a news release sent to local station KTSM about 11:00 p.m. on Wednesday (1a.m. ET on Thursday), the base said "multiple suspects crashed their vehicle" while attempting to storm the gate, which has reportedly been closed until further notice.

"Earlier this evening, multiple suspects crashed their vehicle while attempting to force their way through the gate. The capabilities of our personnel and resources ensured there is no further threat to the safety and security of Team Holloman," the base said in a statement.

The base, which was established in 1942, is located around six miles from the small city Alamogordo in New Mexico, which is situated in the Chihuahuan Desert and bordered by the Sacramento Mountains.

Holloman said that further updates would be issued once they became available. Newsweek has contacted the air force base for comment.

According to the facility's website, the base "supports national security objectives by deploying worldwide to support peacetime and wartime contingencies," and provides support to "more than 21,000 military and civilian personnel."

https://www.newsweek.com/new-mexico-holloman-air-force-base-gate-multiple-suspects-1620889
Not saying it was aliens...

"In a statement to Newsweek on Thursday, a spokesperson at Holloman confirmed that no military personnel were injured in the incident and said: "At approximately 9 p.m. last night, a vehicle fleeing from U.S. Customs and Border Protection agents attempted to breach the Holloman Air Force Base main gate."

Ok sounds like it was (illegal) aliens.
 
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charliebrown

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Ever since the Pentagon said not enough data to prove UAPs, our sky and news have been quite about UAPs.

Did E.T. take off for a summer vacation to the sunny Caribbean ( don’t forget the suntan lotion ) ?

We need a good old fashioned UFO sighting !
 
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