Urban Foxes/Rural Legend

ramonmercado

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Also, if they've just arrived in the countryside, urban foxes are probably still pretty fat! After a few years of living in a big city, and only seeing urban foxes, I was surprised to return home to the countryside and see our way, way skinnier ones.

Hunts still hunt foxes, right? Covertly, or they pretend they've caught em by accident, I'm guessing. We live near the river and occasionally hear a fox hunt going on, on the other river bank where they've got deep cover. And the sounds alone - which I knew my whole childhood - convince me, that's not drag hunting they're doing..?

I understand the need for farmers etc to shoot foxes which prey on their fowls but I hate those Hunts. cull those twits I say.
 

maximus otter

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Hunts still hunt foxes, right? Covertly, or they pretend they've caught em by accident, I'm guessing. We live near the river and occasionally hear a fox hunt going on…

Fox hunting where the fox is killed by a dog pack has been illegal since 2005.

Fox hunting where the dog pack flushes a fox from cover, and it is then killed by a bird of prey (usually a golden eagle) is still entirely legal.

Schedule 1, Hunting Act 2004

maximus otter
 

hunck

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On the subject of urban foxes, l forgot to mention a first-hand anecdote from a shooting buddy. He goes out foxing with a gamekeeper mate. Last year/early this year he shot a fox which had had a leg amputated and surgically stitched up. He also believes that he can tell dumped urban foxes from wild, country ones, as the urban ones seem clueless and show little fear of humans, making them easier to shoot.

l have also read more than one account on shooting forums by people who've dropped foxes which, on inspection, prove to have had surgical procedures, evident because of shaved patches with stitched surgical incisions.

maximus otter
I’m not going to get a reply as I’m on ignore but ‘dumped urban foxes’.. Is anyone actually rounding up urban foxes then releasing them in rural locations? Who is doing this & where?

I’m not saying it’s never happened in the entire history of the country but is it actually a ‘thing’?
 

Ghost In The Machine

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I’m not going to get a reply as I’m on ignore but ‘dumped urban foxes’.. Is anyone actually rounding up urban foxes then releasing them in rural locations? Who is doing this & where?

I’m not saying it’s never happened in the entire history of the country but is it actually a ‘thing’?
Dunno, but it's interesting, if it's the case. I guess they are easier to kill if they're not scared of people. (A bit like pheasants are easy to kill because they're so stupid). Makes the "sport" more entry-level?
 

maximus otter

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…pheasants are easy to kill because they're so stupid…

Most shoots raise and release their own pheasant poults. Proportion killed is variable and anecdotal, but a usual estimate is that 40-60% survive the shooting season, and can be seen “clockwork-toying” around the countryside.

maximus otter
 

ramonmercado

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Most shoots raise and release their own pheasant poults. Proportion killed is variable and anecdotal, but a usual estimate is that 40-60% survive the shooting season, and can be seen “clockwork-toying” around the countryside.

maximus otter

They can be rather aggressive at times, I remember one day two of them were eyeing me and i was glad that I didn't have to go up that country lane.
 

hunck

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Fox hunting where the fox is killed by a dog pack has been illegal since 2005.

Fox hunting where the dog pack flushes a fox from cover, and it is then killed by a bird of prey (usually a golden eagle) is still entirely legal.

Schedule 1, Hunting Act 2004

maximus otter
How many fox hunts carry golden eagles with them?

Another question I'm not going to get a reply to.
 

maximus otter

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They can be rather aggressive at times, I remember one day two of them were eyeing me and i was glad that I didn't have to go up that country lane.

“Rooster of a fighting stock/Would you let a Saxon cock/ Crow out upon an Irish rock?/Fly up and teach him manners!”

;)

maximus otter
 

Ghost In The Machine

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Most shoots raise and release their own pheasant poults. Proportion killed is variable and anecdotal, but a usual estimate is that 40-60% survive the shooting season, and can be seen “clockwork-toying” around the countryside.

maximus otter
Yes, I live right next to a shoot and sometimes we walk dog past woods where they feed the pheasants. My humble rural council house often has a splendid display on the front lawn of assorted golden pheasants - and the road kills associated with it! We have a lot of game birds in the hedgerows round here as it's been a place where Lord Knob did his shooting for a very long time... and by far the stupidest bird seems to be the pheasant.

Was driving up in the Dales a few months back and saw so many dead pheasants on the road, we started counting them. (Over 20 on a short stretch IIRC). Stopped counting when we passed the first pub we came to 'The Pheasant'.
 

Ghost In The Machine

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I would hazard a guess at about zero
Yes, can't say I've seen many eagles over the way where we hear them hunting, occasionally...

My grandad had a farm the other side of the river and raised foxhound puppies for the hunt. Like many farmers, he loathed them. (But needed the money).
 

Lb8535

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Fox hunting where the fox is killed by a dog pack has been illegal since 2005.

Fox hunting where the dog pack flushes a fox from cover, and it is then killed by a bird of prey (usually a golden eagle) is still entirely legal.

Schedule 1, Hunting Act 2004

maximus otter
I thought eagle hunting (by) was a Russian thing. In the UK it would be falcons? Does anyone actually still do this?
 

maximus otter

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I thought eagle hunting (by) was a Russian thing. In the UK it would be falcons? Does anyone actually still do this?

Oh yes:


eagle-hunter-fa-128033.jpg


A UK hunt’s golden eagle.

maximus otter
 

Lb8535

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Oh yes:


eagle-hunter-fa-128033.jpg


A UK hunt’s golden eagle.

maximus otter
I read a medieval (Russian, translated) warning about how heavy they are and how you really should always turn your head away from them when you're carrying them and how thick the gloves need to be.
 

JaneD

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Yes, I live right next to a shoot and sometimes we walk dog past woods where they feed the pheasants. My humble rural council house often has a splendid display on the front lawn of assorted golden pheasants - and the road kills associated with it! We have a lot of game birds in the hedgerows round here as it's been a place where Lord Knob did his shooting for a very long time... and by far the stupidest bird seems to be the pheasant.

Was driving up in the Dales a few months back and saw so many dead pheasants on the road, we started counting them. (Over 20 on a short stretch IIRC). Stopped counting when we passed the first pub we came to 'The Pheasant'.
When folk start bleating about ‘alien animals taking over Britain’ they never mean pheasants, but perhaps they should. There’s a lot of them. Hope the foxes get to eat a lot of them
 

WanderingFox

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When folk start bleating about ‘alien animals taking over Britain’ they never mean pheasants, but perhaps they should. There’s a lot of them. Hope the foxes get to eat a lot of them

Why are so keen to blame grey squirrels for the near-extinction of the British red, when it was us persecuting the reds just as much as we now persecute the greys that did for them?

Why do we demonise rats as filthy, waste-eating disease carriers when we're the ones creating and piling up the waste the diseases breed in to begin with?

Why do we blame badgers for TB and kill them en masse when the real major cause of TB spread is bad husbandry?

We are a race with a chronic aversion to responsibility, to acknowledging the results of our actions, much preferring to point fingers elsewhere, at things that can't really fight back, and a certain particularly bloodthirsty subset happily takes advantage of that, the same bloodthirsty subset who exploit loopholes in the Hunting Act to keep killing foxes (and livestock, and pets) and kill huge numbers of predators for daring to eat the pheasants and grouse they shoot for fun.

*deep breath*

Apologies if this comes across as a little ranty, but I'm passionate about nature, and thus can get a touch heated when it comes to those who abuse it. I've tried not to cross any lines, but if I have, I'll accept any action the mods deem appropriate. If anyone wants to discuss in more detail, probably better to take it to a private conversation.

And that pigeon-hunting fox reminds me of a gag Lee Evans cracked when a friend and I saw him live in Bristol some time back, about local ones being so bold and brash they walked around with tattoos, a beer in one paw, a kebab in the other, asking "what you lookin at?" Not too far from the truth!
 

pandacracker

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I've seen many an urban fox, always at night when cycling back from a folk session. One has trotted past me in the lane that ran beside my old place when I was putting my bike in the lock-up.

However, the other night, as I turned onto the path out side my workplace, a fox was standing right in front of me, about two feet away. It only gave me a quick glance as it was focussing on the bushes next to the path (an area with lots of rats, I've seen them scurrying about a lot and at all times of day) I guess the promise of a lovely rat supper totally overrode any instinct it had to avoid humans. I stood right next to it as it surveyed the bushes!
 

WanderingFox

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I've seen many an urban fox, always at night when cycling back from a folk session. One has trotted past me in the lane that ran beside my old place when I was putting my bike in the lock-up.

However, the other night, as I turned onto the path out side my workplace, a fox was standing right in front of me, about two feet away. It only gave me a quick glance as it was focussing on the bushes next to the path (an area with lots of rats, I've seen them scurrying about a lot and at all times of day) I guess the promise of a lovely rat supper totally overrode any instinct it had to avoid humans. I stood right next to it as it surveyed the bushes!

Foxes are more than intelligent enough to recognise individuals and adjust their behaviour to suit, as I've seen for myself, with a fox who had no issue with me watching them from a respectful distance, but would melt away just before someone else went past, then reappear once they were gone. Entirely possible you've encountered the same fox multiple times, they've seen you without you seeing them on more occasions, and they've come to believe you're not any kind of threat. Plus, yes, hunger can certainly override caution.
 

Bad Bungle

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How many fox hunts carry golden eagles with them?
There are about 400 hunters using golden eagles in Mongolia but don't know how many specifically go for foxes (at least one and he is training his daughter according to a news report some 5 years ago). One of the hunters in the pics is wearing a coat made from the pelts.

Golden Eagle fox hunting_03..jpg
Golden Eagle fox hunting_02..jpg
 

hunck

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Why are so keen to blame grey squirrels for the near-extinction of the British red, when it was us persecuting the reds just as much as we now persecute the greys that did for them?

Why do we demonise rats as filthy, waste-eating disease carriers when we're the ones creating and piling up the waste the diseases breed in to begin with?

Why do we blame badgers for TB and kill them en masse when the real major cause of TB spread is bad husbandry?

We are a race with a chronic aversion to responsibility, to acknowledging the results of our actions, much preferring to point fingers elsewhere, at things that can't really fight back, and a certain particularly bloodthirsty subset happily takes advantage of that, the same bloodthirsty subset who exploit loopholes in the Hunting Act to keep killing foxes (and livestock, and pets) and kill huge numbers of predators for daring to eat the pheasants and grouse they shoot for fun.

*deep breath*

Apologies if this comes across as a little ranty, but I'm passionate about nature, and thus can get a touch heated when it comes to those who abuse it. I've tried not to cross any lines, but if I have, I'll accept any action the mods deem appropriate. If anyone wants to discuss in more detail, probably better to take it to a private conversation.

And that pigeon-hunting fox reminds me of a gag Lee Evans cracked when a friend and I saw him live in Bristol some time back, about local ones being so bold and brash they walked around with tattoos, a beer in one paw, a kebab in the other, asking "what you lookin at?" Not too far from the truth!
The fox was just doing what comes naturally & there’s plenty of pigeons to go round - no-one will miss a few, and they can co-exist with people in towns, who mostly aren’t that hostile towards them.

Round my way there’s plenty of foxes - I had one or two sleep in my small town garden during the days a couple of years back. I left them alone as they weren’t doing any harm, & I haven’t heard of any trouble from them round here. If you leave a bin bag out they’ll rip it open but….don’t leave bin bags out - cats will probably do the same. I’ve not heard of them getting into dustbins. They may well keep the mouse & rat population down as well. They’re smart creatures working out a way to coexist with us in towns & largely succeeding I’d say.

I don’t think we’ve persecuted red squirrels have we?..and for the most part we don’t now persecute greys either.

Rats are demonised because of the Black Death. Don’t agree with killing badgers & think I read this has now been stopped as a policy..

Agree with you about the waste we produce.
 

hunck

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There are about 400 hunters using golden eagles in Mongolia but don't know how many specifically go for foxes (at least one and he is training his daughter according to a news report some 5 years ago). One of the hunters in the pics is wearing a coat made from the pelts.

View attachment 44797
View attachment 44798
Mongolia yes - I was thinking more of UK.
 

Ghost In The Machine

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Foxes are more than intelligent enough to recognise individuals and adjust their behaviour to suit, as I've seen for myself, with a fox who had no issue with me watching them from a respectful distance, but would melt away just before someone else went past, then reappear once they were gone. Entirely possible you've encountered the same fox multiple times, they've seen you without you seeing them on more occasions, and they've come to believe you're not any kind of threat. Plus, yes, hunger can certainly override caution.
I dunno if I posted this earlier in this thread, but years ago had a house in a big city that was right on the edge of a nature reserve. (So the foxes were urban although the bit immediately nearby was "countryside", they still had plenty of bins to eat out of, etc.

We had cats and every day my cats would go hunting on the nature reserve behind our garden. One evening, we were walking across it when we saw a fox, transfixed by something. It was staring at our cat and she was staring it down. Fox ran away before the cat did.
 

Ghost In The Machine

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Oh yes:


eagle-hunter-fa-128033.jpg


A UK hunt’s golden eagle.

maximus otter
Jesus!

The woods where they feed the pheasants... We were walking dog through them one day and this couple appear on the trackway, the woman all distressed. She comes up to me (something about my disshevelled appearance probably made me look like the inbred local I am even though this isn't Cromer) - and starts going on about they've just seen a baby pheasant in the woods on the path and it is really really traumatised.

I just casually said "Ah I think it's looking for its mum. I think I just saw her, back there..." and sent her further down the track. Where there was a single pheasant leg...

(Either tourists or newcomers to the countryside).
 
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