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Weird Weather

Right now therw's a really spooky ring round the moon. I expect it's something to do with ice crystals. I've tried to take a photo but it's too dark. So you'll have to go and look for yourselves if you read this in time.

It looks a lot like this picture I found on the net, but much more spectacular in real life:

http://koti.mbnet.fi/~tuunaes/temp/PICT2802.jpg
 
re: rynner

Yes, it is odd. I remember that evening pretty well, since I was at work and hadn't started drinking. I was having a smoke break with a co-worker- it was overcast, a bit drizzly, but not very windy. Out of the blue came this tremendous downward gust of air, which lasted for maybe two seconds, then all became calm again. I remarked to my fellow smoker: This is tornado weather...

Oh, I should say this is up in Chicago- but I did live in 'Tornado Alley (in SW Missouri) for most of my youth.

Of course now it's colder than that one part of hell here.

:x
 
Odd in itself but of course there may be other... stranger explanations ;)

Microburst may have derailed train

The Yomiuri Shimbun

A ministry panel will ask aviation weather experts to investigate weather conditions at the time of Sunday's fatal train derailment in Shonaimachi, Yamagata Prefecture, as it suspects an intense localized downward air current--called a microburst--caused the accident, according to sources.

The sources said the Construction and Transport Ministry's Aircraft and Railway Accidents Investigation Commission believes a microburst may have caused the accident mainly because an anemometer placed near the accident site had recorded winds of only 72 kph at the time an express train on East Japan Railway Co.'s Uetsu Line derailed.

A microburst produces winds of 252 kph or greater in small areas with a radius of only several hundred meters to two kilometers.

According to investigations by the commission and other parties, a cold front was passing through the Shonaimachi area, generating thunderclouds at the time of the accident. Thunderclouds are thought to cause microbursts--a phenomenon in which cool air rushes to the surface in an intensely localized area, resulting in strong downdrafts.

Aviation weather experts have paid more attention to the sudden gusts, as they have led to fatal airplane crashes during takeoff or landing. But because a microburst is locally formed and does not last long, they prove difficult to predict.

Regarding Sunday's derailment, the investigation commission reportedly has focused on the following points:

-- The anemometer installed at a location about 900 meters from the accident site measured winds of about 72 kph.

-- A shed in the vicinity was destroyed, apparently by strong winds.

-- The driver of the derailed train said it felt as if the train had been suddenly lifted up by a strong force.

The sources said the commission came to suspect a microburst also after analyzing data on weather conditions recorded by the Yamagata Meteorological Observatory and others at the time of accident.

The commission will therefore ask aviation meteorologists, who participated in probes into airplane accidents caused by air turbulence, to examine the weather conditions at the time of the derailment, the sources said.

----------
(Dec. 30, 2005)

www.yomiuri.co.jp/dy/national/20051230TDY01005.htm
 
Not sure if this is the right thread to post this in or not but I would really appreciate a bit of help ...

Was in Rome this week and as I was coming out of St Peter's, I saw this really weird cloud/smoke formation in front of the vatican that was black in an otherwise clear sky. As I watched, the cloud would coil and wisp down, swell and almost seem to reseed itself, becoming really intensely black before repeating the process.

Here's a link to a static pic - I have a moving clip but don't know where I could upload it. http://photobucket.com/albums/y58/Lolly ... tsmoke.jpg

Any ideas?
 
Yep, movement was what made it particularly weird as it was moving through the whole cycle within 2 minutes each time.

On the movie clip it's more obvious, particularly that it's not a jet trail etc. as the scale is more apparent and the movement - it appears fairly low level and middle distance and doesn't just rise up but has vortices, drags downward, compacts then starts roiling up again.
 
AsamiYamazaki said:
Here's the link to the movie clip although it's a chunky monkey..
You ain't kidding! My broadband clearly isn't that broad - it'll take over 50 minutes to download!

I'll report back (if I live long enough...)
 
I got it!

And that is truly strange, like something from the SFX studio for a fantasy movie. I have no idea what it is, although (like some other UFO reports), it seems to show something organic.

I'll watch it again before closing this reply - back soon!

The only meteorological phenomenon it slightly resembles is a twister, and yet it is seen in clear skies - no sign of the stormy weather that normally produces twisters.


(I should have downloaded the file rather than opened it, as I now don't seem to be able to save it. :( )
 
I was under the impression it was a video clip? Its come up as a photo? You got me curious so i'm saving it.
 
I clearly do not have the same file. Mine looks like a wisp of smoke, not unlike that coming out of the chimney on the left. It only took 3 mins to download, where did I go wrong? :?
 
It is a video clip.

I just watched it a few more times, but concentrating on the crowds.
No-one there seems to have noticed this thing (no standing and staring or pointing), although possibly for the people down in the plaza the 'thing' was below the top of the buildings.

If this was a twister, I cannot account for the dark blobs that move up and down, as the thing seems too high in the sky to be picking up debris from the ground.

This video is worth professional analysis, perhaps first by meteorologists, and then by UFOlogists.
 
:shock: Just found the 'play' button. (Bless) Its really creepy, definately seems to move in a spiral motion. It forms itself into a '?' shape which is nice.
 
Rhynner, there was one couple in front of me who noticed it but no one else seemed intrigued in the slightest.

To begin with I actually assumed it was some papal ritual. It was only when the smoke/cloud continued to behave in the odd cyclical way that I began to realise how weird it was.

I was on a slight elevation compared to the people in the square as was walking down after exiting St Peter's, so was slightly raised with the basilica to the left behind me at the time.

FYI the info the time was approx 5 pm (the date is correct on my camera but time is still set to north american time ish). Any Catholics know of strange smokey goings on on the hour at the vatican?
 
I've just watched it - it's very strange.

This video is worth professional analysis, perhaps first by meteorologists, and then by UFOlogists.

I'd second the motion to get someone in the know to take a look at it.
 
AsamiYamazaki said:
So, does anyone have any idea where would i start getting this looked at?

Cheers!
You could try emailing your local TV weatherman about it.

Or the UK Met Office has a contact link on this page:
http://www.metoffice.gov.uk/

No doubt there's a US equivalent.
 
I have just thought of another explanation, which would explain the dark clumping and the 'organic' movement.

It was dusk, so the birds were going home to roost. Some species do swarm like this before beddy-byes, so I'm now guessing this was a flock of birds.

No doubt bird spotters can enlarge on this idea. 8)
 
Well, I'd expected some response (like "Yeah, why didn't I see that!") but since you're still unconvinced (or asleep), here's some further evidence:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/devon/content/arti ... ture.shtml
As the nights draw in, now is the time to turn your face to the sky at dusk to witness an amazing starling show.

There is a crepuscular drama that unfolds in locations across East Devon; a natural wonder played out by British wildlife that can be watched in the heart of Exeter, as easily as on the most remote estuary.

Starlings, thousands of them, roost in massive flocks in the winter, their numbers bolstered by migrating birds from the near continent.

In fact, it is highly unlikely that any of the birds you see filling roosts at Middlemoor, Seaton or Topsham will have been feeding in your garden this summer.

During the day the birds disperse across a huge area, but thousands meet at the roost site at the same moment at dusk to swarm in vast numbers.

The reason why they all meet like this and put on such a display before settling, is that each bird is very vulnerable to attack from birds of prey as they fly into the roost.

By flocking in huge numbers the starling protect themselves with the safety in numbers principal.

For a really good view, venture down to the Colyford Common Local Nature Reserves viewing platform about an hour before last light, and look towards the reed beds on the far side of the estuary.

You may see a few individual birds making an early dash for the sanctuary of the reeds, but be patient and the real show will get underway as the masses congregate.

Small flocks appear on the horizon, and join with other smaller flocks of starlings, these meld with larger flocks and so on, until a super flock is formed that wheels and contorts in the sky above the reeds.

The huge number of birds move as one above the reeds and if a peregrine falcon makes an appearance you may be lucky enough to see it diving through the flock like a seal through a shoal of herring.

The flock will move over the reed bed at height, and a small funnel of birds will drop out of the bottom and into the reeds gradually reducing the flock until, almost an hour later, a tiny speck is left flying and the reed beds resonates with the noise of thousands of starlings, sounding like the distant rumble of a motorway!

Make sure you wrap up warm if you venture out, as evenings on the estuary can be extremely cold on the estuary, and you will be very disappointed to have to leave this particular theatre half way through the performance.

I think this description pretty closely matches what the video showed.

..and a small funnel of birds will drop out of the bottom and into the reeds gradually reducing the flock..

This funnel was what resembled the 'twister' of my earlier theory.
 
starlingswirl180_tcm3-91819.jpg
In late afternoon in winter, starling flocks will congregate and make a cloud-like formation before settling at their roosting site
 
Sorry for the delay in refuting your theory ;)

Having seen many experiences of birds doing just this, starlings and chimney swifts, I can state categorically that this wasn't it (the smoke was also witnessed in the presence of a twenty-year veteran of the RSPB who also thought it was v. odd and nothing explicable).

If you zoom in on the original static image, you can see it isn't composed of birds, plus the nearness of it and the continuing pulsating nature where it wisped into almost nothing before regaining strength (with no birds turning up) meant this would've been impossible to have been formed by avians.
 
AsamiYamazaki said:
Sorry for the delay in refuting your theory ;)

Having seen many experiences of birds doing just this, starlings and chimney swifts, I can state categorically that this wasn't it (the smoke was also witnessed in the presence of a twenty-year veteran of the RSPB who also thought it was v. odd and nothing explicable).

If you zoom in on the original static image, you can see it isn't composed of birds, plus the nearness of it and the continuing pulsating nature where it wisped into almost nothing before regaining strength (with no birds turning up) meant this would've been impossible to have been formed by avians.

But the static photo (and the video) is not sharply focussed, as can be seen from the buildings and streetlights. (This is presumably because it was dusk, and the camera would have been at maximum aperture.) Therefore I wouldn't expect to see individual birds at that distance (I guess about a mile away, well beyond the buildings - what makes you think of its 'nearness'?).

But if you're convinced it wasn't birds, I go back to my earlier suggestion - get the video looked at by a meteorologist. 8)
 
Cheers for your coments.

I don't think it was as far as a mile away although it is admittedly very hard to tell, especially as am unfamiliar with light qualities/conditions in Italy.

As I said before, my main reason for believing it isn't a bird flock is because both my companion and I are very familiar with the sight of birds perparing to roost (and had already witnessed a bunch of starlings doing just that the day before) and this immediately struck us as odd. I will track down local weatherman (and local RSPB club) and report back :)
 
Manuel Presti, from Italy, wins the Wildlife Photographer of the Year 2005 for his swirling image of a flock of starlings evading a peregrine falcon. The WPY is jointly organised each year by the Natural History Museum and BBC Wildlife Magazine.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/4355628.stm
The Italian caught the action scene, titled Sky Chase, high above a city park in Rome.

"Sky chase is a powerful image and, like it or not, it's one that you will never forget," said Mark Carwardine, one of this year's judges.

The competition has become one of the most prestigious in world photography.

It is organised by BBC Wildlife Magazine and London's Natural History Museum. This year brought 17,000 entries from over 55 countries.
Starlings in Rome! I rest my case! :D
 
More on that photo:

http://www.newscientist.com/article.ns?id=dn8186
“I felt the fear and the starlings’ urgent need to survive, and the psychological pressure of the falcon as it dive-bombed the small birds,” says Italian Manuel Presti of his photograph Sky Chase, overall winner of this year’s Wildlife Photographer of the Year competition, organised by the Natural History Museum, London, UK, and BBC Wildlife Magazine.

The lone peregrine falcon is stark against a clear sweep of sky that marks its trajectory through the swirling black cloud of panicked starlings. Presti, an engineer by trade, has been photographing wildlife for more than 20 years and took the photograph during a winter trip to Rome.

“Every evening between 4.30 and 5pm the sky above the city’s parks turns black with gathering flocks of starlings that arrive to roost in the relative safety of Rome. When two or three falcons swooped into a large cloud of starlings, it exploded and I took the pictures,” he told New Scientist.
The timing's right too!
 
Once you start to look, there are references galore to starlings in Rome.

Letters from Rome....

Our days overflow with small miracles. We buy pizza rossa by the kilogram; we buy shortbread so rich with butter it eats through paper bags. At dusk, starlings flock in big, flexing clouds.
LINK

And another startling starling photo by Presti here:
http://www.wildlifephoto-presti.com/Pho ... 1_2004.htm


Even a poem
I seem to detect your lively gaze.
And we shall see how the starlings come flying
across the field in teeming swarms.
They will come from Rome and spend the day out here
where they will eat snails, worms, and seeds
and suddenly they will fly up from a field
as at a given signal
and make us look at the sun.
http://versemag.blogspot.com/2004/11/ne ... enbro.html

(Classical scholars will like that page.)
 
Great links, Rhynner!

The bone shot in particular was pretty convincing to me - although the RSPB expert companion who witnessed it with me insists that there was a white cloud shape involved at one point which would rule that out. I didn't notice that so couldn't say one way or the other!

Still, those Presti shots now have me leaning towards the starlings!
 
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