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Werner Herzog

GNC

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Any fans of Werner Herzog here? I was watching his documentary Grizzly Man, about self-styled bear expert Timothy Treadwell, which was on TV last night and I knew I could count on Herzog to be thought provoking. I went from thinking Treadwell was a sentimental idiot to really feeling sorry for him and the mess he had gotten himself into.

Herzog sees nature as "chaos and murder", in opposition to Treadwell's view that it was benevolent, and in that film the director won out decisively.

Any thoughts on Herzog?
 
All of his films that I've seen I've found impossibly boring, while at the same time artistically fascinating. Favourite is Nosferatu remake which is a bit lame until the point Klaus Kinski turns up and gives the most terrifying performance on God's green earth. Also, absolutely incredible use of music - a few pieces used sparingly, repetitively, new ones being introduced as the film progresses. They use that same bit as Kate Bush does on one of the songs on The Ninth Wave when Mina is running through a sea of rats - it's an amazing piece of film. But because he shot it both in german and english, the english version is rather badly acted. Also unstructured. Anyway, I can get a lot out of a Herzog film, but it's kind of hard work.
 
his movies may be a bit slow, and he must not be the best director of actors (just look at how claudia cardinale manages to ruin fitzcarraldo...), but he has managed to put out some masterpieces like the wild blue yonder and grizzly man.
he's kind of turning into a documentary maker rather than a "fiction" director.
and i also think that he's part of a special category - that of "quasi-philosophers who use film to convey their thoughts", like cronenberg used to be before the history of violence and the pledge of the assassin or like mr. cerebral stanley kubrick himself.
 
H_James said:
...Favourite is Nosferatu remake which is a bit lame until the point Klaus Kinski turns up and gives the most terrifying performance on God's green earth..
A little OT, but oddly enough I've recently finished reading "Evil Spirits", a biography of Oliver Reed, who appeared with Kinski in the justifiably underrated "Venom". According to their co-star Sarah Miles, Kinski was an utter nightmare on-set, totally unreasonable and unreliable and given to absolute purple rages. The director wouldn't take him on, so Miles suggested to Reed that, being Oliver Reed, he should take Kinski round the back and "have a word". Reed looked at her straight in the eye and basically said that whatever he (Reed) was, he wan't "a bloody fool." As far as anyone could tell, Kinski was the only man of whom Oliver Reed was genuinely frightened. Make of that what you will.

Back OT - I'm very fond of FitzCarraldo. Definitely a film that grows on you :).
 
Herzog is not afraid of the long, open gaze. The Germans are uncomfortable with him, because this lets in so much of the irrational romantic strain which was perverted into Nazism. Some of his work does seem to simultaneously mock and glorify individuals like Fitzcarraldo and Aguirre who aspire to Superman status.

His film commentaries are quite astonishingly unilluminating at an intellectual level - basically a litany of how nice or horrid people were to work with. Yet his work suggests a thorough grasp of some of the key questions which hang over German culture. He responds with an evasion, hankering after the simple-minded actionman types, recalling the plight of some of Mann's over-civilized souls, who at least had the grace to predate Hitlerism. :?

He is often credited with a compassion for the underdog, so much so that his films threatened to rival Fellini's as a parade of intellectual freaks to match the Italian's physical grotesques. He celebrated his creative love-hate relationship with Kinski, a wild man, othewise noted for schlocky horror shows. It may seem a far cry from purification as an agenda but this dwelling on extremes seems to have purposes beyond the merely entertaining.

Often the films challenge our attention-span. Fata Morgana lures us out into the desert and asks us to lose ourselves in the fascinating mirages he captured. Yet we are brought back into the human world, as if to apply some knowledge we ought to have gained. Try articulating it and we fail. The films are maybe in the end as stubbornly bourgeois in their dreams of escape as Grofé's Grand Canyon Suite. If they are much more than that, they are probably not entirely healthy.

Herzog likes to paint himself as a child of Nature, growing up without movies or even a telephone. It is a pre-lapsarian pose which seems easier to square with his energy than with his preoccupations. Irony is not enough to deflect comparisons of some Herzog films with the Mountain Movies that Germany was producing in the twenties and thirties.

If this is a bit of a jumble, it reflects my mixed feelings about the man and his work. :?
 
Very interesting, James, and it shows how Herzog can set the mind racing as well as (unfortunately) into boredom. David Thompson pointed out that his preoccupations are so set in their ways that he is pretty much making the same film over and over again, but for me, he's rarely tedious. I respond to his eccentricities, some would say manias.

Here's a great quote from him at the end of Burden of Dreams, about the making of Fitzcarraldo (thanks, IMDB):
[On the jungle] "Kinski always says it's full of erotic elements. I don't see it so much erotic. I see it more full of obscenity. It's just - Nature here is vile and base. I wouldn't see anything erotical here. I would see fornication and asphyxiation and choking and fighting for survival and... growing and... just rotting away. Of course, there's a lot of misery. But it is the same misery that is all around us. The trees here are in misery, and the birds are in misery. I don't think they - they sing. They just screech in pain. It's an unfinished country. It's still prehistorical. The only thing that is lacking is - is the dinosaurs here. It's like a curse weighing on an entire landscape. And whoever... goes too deep into this has his share of this curse. So we are cursed with what we are doing here. It's a land that God, if he exists has - has created in anger. It's the only land where - where creation is unfinished yet. Taking a close look at - at what's around us there - there is some sort of a harmony. It is the harmony of... overwhelming and collective murder. And we in comparison to the articulate vileness and baseness and obscenity of all this jungle - Uh, we in comparison to that enormous articulation - we only sound and look like badly pronounced and half-finished sentences out of a stupid suburban... novel... a cheap novel. We have to become humble in front of this overwhelming misery and overwhelming fornication... overwhelming growth and overwhelming lack of order. Even the - the stars up here in the - in the sky look like a mess. There is no harmony in the universe. We have to get acquainted to this idea that there is no real harmony as we have conceived it. But when I say this, I say this all full of admiration for the jungle. It is not that I hate it, I love it. I love it very much. But I love it against my better judgment."
 
Thanks for the quote.

Is it true that he has to walk to every location in which he films?

I've remembered another bit I love: where Kaspar Hauser says something like:
That can't possibly be the tower in which I was incarcerated! When I was in a cell, the cell occupied my entire field of vision. But this tower is much smaller; when I look away, I can't see it.

When it comes to semi-philosophical art directors, my favourite is Ingmar Bergman, who makes me wonder why other people even bother trying to make films.
 
the worst is when they try to imitate him, though (see woody allen post-manhattan...)
 
I wonder if anyone has tried to imitate Werner, or is he unique?

Some of the images he captures in his documentaries are amazing, and even when you think of "fictional" stuff like Aguirre stuck on the raft with the monkeys, he's always had an eye for the striking and dramatic.

Has anyone here seen his recent Antarctica documentary? Apparently it was made as a reaction to March of the Penguins, which he despised.
 
I once saw 'The Engima of Kasper Hauser' at a local cinema with a couple of friends, sat a few rows in front of us were a goup of German girls; there were perhaps no more than eight of us sat in the darkness watching the film. As we read the subtitles the girls would laugh out loud at certain points, moments when we read or percieved nothing amusing - that afternoon remains one my fondest and warmest memories of the cinema.

Sometimes I'm asked as to which is my favourite film, and i'll often give a different answer depending upon my mood, the last film I saw or the book I'm reading. But, more often than not i'll answer 'Heart of Glass' by Herzog. It's a film that leaves me baffled and amazed with my head raging full of ideas and thoughts; there is indeed a beautifully intense, dreamlike; wonderment to it!

Is it true that he has to walk to every location in which he films?

No it's not true, although he does seem to have an affinity with the act of walking: "I personally would rather do the existentially essential things in life on foot. If you live in England and your girlfriend is in Sicily, and it is clear you want to marry her, then you should walk to Sicily to propose. For these things travel by car or aeroplane is not the right thing." - Werner Herzog.

He also said that: "You will learn more by walking from Canada to Guatamala than you will ever learn in film school." A statement that has inspired at least two journeys and at least two films, 'More Shoes' by Lee Kazimir and 'Walking To Werner' by Linas Philips.

I could go on, but instead I'll leave you with links to two sites you may be interested to have a look at: http://thewernerhrzogarchive.blogspot.com/ & http://www.wernerherzog.com/main/index.htm
 
gncxx said:
Has anyone here seen his recent Antarctica documentary? Apparently it was made as a reaction to March of the Penguins, which he despised.
Hopefully going to see it in London on monday, they were giving away free tickets in the Observer and as I'm passing through...
 
Has anyone ever seen Stroszek? I read an article years ago which made me think it might be worth a punt and I've often picked it up and given it a good coat of looking at before deciding it was too pricey for a don't know. I noticed just today that Fopp in Manchester had a copy for £3.00.

And what about Rescue Dawn? Bit of a departure for Herzog I believe. Anyone watched it?
 
I haven't seen Rescue Dawn, but Stroszek is infamous for being the film Ian Curtis watched on TV the night he committed suicide. It can be quite funny, but the overwhelming weight of despair can get to you after a while. If you like Herzog, though, it's essential. The fact it stars Bruno S. of Kaspar Hauser fame makes it all the more interesting.
 
gncxx said:
...Stroszek is infamous for being the film Ian Curtis watched on TV the night he committed suicide...

Yes, I've just consulted my much thumbed and relatively ancient Time Out Film Guide, which finishes it's muted but generally favourable review with - 'For all the supposed lightness, it's the film's core of despair which in the end devours everything.'

...It can be quite funny, but the overwhelming weight of despair can get to you after a while...

Bit like Joy Division then.
 
You should be fine as long as you don't watch it till the incredibly hopeless and depressing ending, then put on a Joy Division album for comfort.
 
sherbetbizarre said:
Here's the trailer for his upcoming Bad Lieutenant "remake" ...


!!! :shock: !!!

I would never have believed it if I hadn't seen the trailer ...
 
EnolaGaia said:
sherbetbizarre said:
Here's the trailer for his upcoming Bad Lieutenant "remake" ...

!!! :shock: !!!

I would never have believed it if I hadn't seen the trailer ...
If it finishes Nick Cage's career, I'll be happy.

:rofl:
 
Pietro_Mercurios said:
EnolaGaia said:
sherbetbizarre said:
Here's the trailer for his upcoming Bad Lieutenant "remake" ...

!!! :shock: !!!

I would never have believed it if I hadn't seen the trailer ...
If it finishes Nick Cage's career, I'll be happy.

:rofl:

If Cage could survive The Wicker Man then he can survive anything.
 
I understand the writer/director of the original is kind of pissed. And Herzog himself is denying it's a remake since he's never seen the original.
 
gncxx said:
Any fans of Werner Herzog here? I was watching his documentary Grizzly Man, about self-styled bear expert Timothy Treadwell, which was on TV last night and I knew I could count on Herzog to be thought provoking. I went from thinking Treadwell was a sentimental idiot to really feeling sorry for him and the mess he had gotten himself into.

Herzog sees nature as "chaos and murder", in opposition to Treadwell's view that it was benevolent, and in that film the director won out decisively.

Any thoughts on Herzog?

Watched this last night. Very good film although the main protagonist was clearly slightly mental and incredibly lucky to have lasted 13 years without getting mauled.

His breakdown in the tent I was waiting for him to start screaming "LEAVE BEAR-ITNEY ALONE!"

Herzog when narrating sounded like Stephen Hawking's Voicebox 2.0

Very good film, the second good documentary on this week so far following Man On Wire.
 
Werner Herzog's cave art documentary takes 3D into the depths

The film-maker has taken his 3D camera among the rocky fissures and 30,000-year-old cave artwork at Chauvet in France

From his film about the hostage survivor Dieter Dengler, Little Dieter Needs to Fly, to his examination of the life and death of the eccentric grizzly bear activist Timothy Treadwell, Grizzly Man, Werner Herzog always seems to have an eye for stranger-than-fiction scenarios that make for fascinating documentaries. Over on Roger Ebert's blog, there's news of a new Herzog project that might represent his most important venture into factual film-making yet.

Herzog has apparently been given permission to film inside the Chauvet-Pont-d'Arc cave, a site in the Ardèche department of southern France that contains the earliest known cave paintings, dating back at least 30,000 years. Even more intriguingly, Herzog is planning to shoot much of the film in 3D.

The Chauvet cave, discovered in 1994, cannot be accessed by tourists, as the French authorities have deemed the risk of degradation to be too high, so Herzog's film might be the only opportunity for the rest of humanity to view the site. The paintings depict lions, panthers, bears, owls, rhinos and hyenas, suggesting a vastly different fauna at the time of the paintings to that of modern France.

"It's a film that I'd like to make because I'm so fascinated about cave art," says Herzog in a series of filmed interviews on the blog, which we've reposted here. "It's still tough to bring equipment down. You are not allowed to touch the wall or the floor or anything. I can have only three people with me, and I can use only lights which must not create temperature. For each shot, because the technology is not really advanced, we had to build own camera from zero using a specific configuration of lenses and mirrors. We are doing something nobody has done with 3D."

Herzog will narrate the film himself, which comes as welcome news. His familiar Teutonic brogue adds so much enthusiastic flavoursome fervour to his documentary films, and the interviews suggest that we're in for another uniquely skewiff vision.

"What is also strange," Herzog reveals, "is that somebody [in the cave] started a painting and then they left. And it's known that 3,500 years later somebody continued the painting. And then a bear that hibernated over it left scratch marks. And over the scratch marks there was man, bear, man, bear, man, bear, man [over time]. It's like time does not occur – it's completely fantastic."

Despite his adoption of 3D for the project, Herzog is not an out-and-out convert to the new technology.

"I do it [3D] very reduced and as if it was the most natural way to do it," he says. "3D will always have one major problem, and that is when you look as a human being, normally only one eye looks dominantly at things. The other eye is mostly ignored. And only in specific cases – if somebody approaches you – all of a sudden the brain starts to use both eyes for establishing depth of field and understanding space.

"But it tires you when you are a spectator at a 3D movie, because you are forced to see with two eyes and two images superimposed. So 3D, in my opinion, will only work, in my opinion, for the big firework events like Avatar."

It's a fascinating subject matter, but these types of films traditionally suffer from a dry and worthy approach that makes it hard for viewers to truly engage. Herzog offers something more colourful and distinctive, partly because the film-maker himself is just as captivating as his material. And yet he never overwhelms his subject matter. Does the prospect of seeing the film-maker crawling through rocky fissures and uncovering never-before-seen artwork, like some Germanic David Attenborough, have you salivating?

Guardian link with Youtube interview
 
Herzog talks about his love of books.

I’ve never made a pilgrimage to a filmmaker, but I did make a pilgrimage to Salt Lake City, to the University of Utah. One of the texts, which is not on my list, is one of the greatest books — one of the most intense and beautiful texts. The Florentine Codex, a collection by monks who accompanied the next wave, the next generation of Conquistadors. They collected voices from Aztecs about child rearing, about botanic knowledge, about military things, about history, about religion, about human sacrifice, and so on.

The Outer Fringes of Our Language: A Conversation with Werner Herzog
Robert Pogue Harrison interviews Werner Herzog
https://lareviewofbooks.org/article...r-language-a-conversation-with-werner-herzog/
 
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