Urban Ravens

[Spookdaddy]

Not really cryptozoology this as there is nothing peculiar about Ravens as such.

It’s just that in the town where I live (Peak District, bottom end of the Pennines) we seem to have developed a small colony of Ravens despite it being well outside their traditional territory. There has been one bobbing around for a few years but he seems to have gained a few mates and this year they even appear to be nesting. All the info I can find limits the Ravens range to Northern and Western uplands and coastal areas apart from the odd lone stragglers. This is admittedly a highland area but, according to at least one book on local bird-life, Ravens haven’t been a common sight for well over a century.

I just wondered if anyone else has noticed them encroaching into urban areas recently - apart from the Tower of London that is?

(Oh and by the way I’m a country boy born and bred and do know the difference between a Raven and a big f**k-off Carrion Crow).

 

[Bullseye]

Less persecution probably. We get the occasional one or two down here in Sussex, mainly on sea cliffs.
When I used to go to Exmoor ect about 15 to 20 years ago hardly any were down there, but now there are a lot of them about in that area, sure its just that they are not shot/trapped/poisned as much these days. Same with birds of prey, lot more common today than in the recent past.

 

[Anonymous]

(Oh and by the way I’m a country boy born and bred and do know the difference between a Raven and a big f**k-off Carrion Crow).

Could you explain it to me then, please? I tend to look at the beak.

 

[Melf]

iirc the carrion crow is greyer in colour

 

[Bullseye]

Ravens are BIG (about 24inch body) Crows are about 18inch as are Rooks, but rooks have grey beak and legs whereas ravens and crows are completly black, (except for the hooded crow that has a brownish/greyish head)Jackdaws are about 14 inch black but in sunlight have a dark grey head, ravens croak also much deeper.Hpoe this clears it all up.("honesty, townies ehh?")

 

[Bosbaba]

Ravens remain extremely rare in Dublin, and Ireland as a whole, but I am finding an ever increasing population of rooks in the north and west of Dublin.

Four years ago you would be hard-pressed to recall having seen one at all within the city limits, now they are nearly rivalling the jackdaws in terms of their numbers.

Could it have something to do with our increasingly warmer climate?

 

[Melf]

also jays belong to the raven/crow family aswell (just to confuse matters further )

 

[Anonymous]

Yep. I was right then. We used to have a couple of rooks nesting nearby in the local cemetary when I was a kid. The cemetary backed onto playing fields and stuff, so it was actually quite a large area.

Ravens = bloody big things with big beaks. Crows = tend to have greyish head? Yes? Back of head?

I always wanted a pet raven, like Mortimer. Except I wanted to call it Quoth.

 

[Spookdaddy]

Re: Re: Urban Ravens

Could you explain it to me then, please? I tend to look at the beak.

Ravens are a lot bigger - although admittedly it might be difficult to judge if you haven't got a crow in the vicinity to compare sizes. Their beaks are heavier, they have longer, more splayed out wings and a wedge-shaped tail (whereas a crows is squared off).

They also have a throaty croak as a call - which on a misty winters day is guaranteed to get to the hairs on the back of your neck.

 

[marion]

Ravens are a lot bigger than crows- they have the same wingspan as a buzzard.

 

[oll_lewis]

there is nothing unusual about a raven taking an urban habitat as opposed to a rural one. ravens 'natural' habitats are rock faces and inland cliffs and crags. pigeons live in the same habitats but often outcompete the ravens for food in citys which is why you don't tend to see ravans apart from on large buildings near parks. for example, the tower of london, cardiff castle and liverpool cathedral are all city centre ravan habitats

perhaps the reasons for ravens becoming more prevelent in some areas is due to desese or Ken Livingstone decimateing local pigeon populations letting the ravens get a look in because there's a bit less competion then.

 

[Spookdaddy]

...I am finding an ever increasing population of rooks in the north and west of Dublin.

I was travelling on the road from Macclesfield to Buxton today and saw hundreds of rooks foraging in a field with a single hare sat incongruosly in the middle of them doing the same. Although rooks have always been fairly common around here there does seem to be a bit of a population explosion this side of the water as well.

Lord Flashheart's comment about the pigeons rings true. The sooner thay make feeding the little feckers a capital offence the better. A friend of mine is a falconer who contracts out to local councils and airports. He regularly gets attacked by batty old ladies who think feeding pigeons is an inalienable right of old age and that he is a mass-murderer. Explaining to them that the falcons don't actually kill the pigeons and that they just fly about a bit stressing them out which in turn disrupts their breeding patterns and makes a little room for some real wildlife doesn't seem to do any good.

 

[Bullseye]

also jays belong to the raven/crow family aswell (just to confuse matters further )

As do Magpies, Choughs and the very rear vagrant from Scandinavia the Nutcracker.
While we are on about the Crow family, has anyone else noticed that in the last 15 to 20 years quite a few crows have develpoed a grey/whiteish patch on the top of their wings (can only be seen in flight), have posted this before here and on a local wildlife forum and there do seem to be some in Sussex but have had no replies from the rest of the country, any other natural history buffs seen this?.

 

[marion]

I noticed the pale wings on crows in Somerset. Carrion crows can hybridise with hooded crows to make an in between looking bird, but hooded crows aren't found in the South West.

 

[eyepod]

The first time I went to Ireland I had to ask what all the strange black and grey birds were... I got the answer "crows". I'd never seen a hooded crow before, and have still to see one on this side of the water. Plenty of the black sort where I live tho.

 

[Bullseye]

I noticed the pale wings on crows in Somerset. Carrion crows can hybridise with hooded crows to make an in between looking bird, but hooded crows aren't found in the South West.

Thanks, not just local then, now to try to find out if a recent thing.
Carrion crows and Hoodies, same species, just slight different colour variations.

 

[Anonymous]

Growing up in the country in Co. Laois, Ireland, I lived across the road from a rookery. There was a fairly free mix of Jackdaws and Rooks, but occasiaonally a Raven pair nests in the area too. However, waht was as rare was the Raven was the Grey or Hooded Crow. But now around Dublin, they are extremely common. Halfway between the Rook and thr Raven, the Grey Crow is large and powerful, but more important, extremely intelligent and givben to cooperation and boldness. They have been known to cooperatively take down large animals by weaking them through bleeding. Sheep, or goats are targeted usually by pecking them to bleed and keeping the wound open with repeated attacks. Eventually the animal bleeds out and collapses and they swoop. Now this is usually in extremis but still.

Unfortunately, Ravens remain as rare and elusive as ever.

LD

 

[Min Bannister]

There are Ravens in Edinburgh, albeit on Arthurs Seat. Hoodies are common in the North East of Scotland.