Unexplained Late-Night Office Noises

[gavin burnett]

GNC - The office had the usual electronic equipment, so everyone had a desktop PC under their desk and a phone on it; there was a photocopier, a microwave, a fridge and a kettle. And - that was it. It was 2001 when this happened so there was nothing like WI-FI, Bluetooth speakers or electronic whiteboards. I think some of my co-workers had headphones plugged into their PCs so they could listen to audio without disturbing anyone else.

IbisNibs - I have been reading everyone’s replies back. I was expecting for my story to get a few likes. I did not expect such interest! Considering what everyone has said, I think there are two plausible explanations:

- An airlock in the meeting room radiator.
- A one-off or intermittent fault on a piece of electrical equipment.

The things that undermine these two theories are that the noise was a very specific one, and they do nothing to explain my old bosses story or the cleaners dislike of the place.

escargot - Vic Tandy - That's the man I was thinking of! I might re-read his study. I also seem to recall that he appeared on a Channel 5 documentary about staff having strange experiences in tube stations after hours. I think that he brought some measuring equipment which picked up high levels of infra-sound in the areas where the staff had experienced unease and heard noises.

 

[Ogdred Weary]

The sound of moving furniture seems to be one of the constants of the history of haunting. Not that it's a feature of every haunting, obviously - just that it seems to go way back in the narrative. The odd thing is that it is often described as being so, but with something 'off' about the sound - as if it's not precisely the thing being described, but that this is the closest thing the witness can think of. I think I'm right in recalling several historical accounts which describe a sound as if heavy boxes are being dragged across floors - some coming from areas which are actually bare loft spaces, with no floorboards to drag anything across.

I've often wondered - if it's not actually furniture being dragged, but just sounds like it, then what on earth is it that makes such a noise? Somehow, the unguessed at alternatives feel even more spooky than the idea of tables dragged by invisible hands.

I often wonder this about anomalous stimuli, they may not necessarily be the things we describe or perceive them as but those things are the closest analogies.

 

[Trevp666]

insult and debunk.

Oh but, to be fair, that is also sometimes done when appropriate.

 

[gavin burnett]

A thought has just occurred to me. The desktop PCs we all used had two quite large cooling fans in them - one on the power supply and one above the CPU. This was 2001 - so the PCs were quite big. Most people who worked there (myself included) would leave them on all the time and just turn the monitors off when they went home.

What if - one of the fans was in the early stages of failing and it was producing infra-sound. This sound would not be noticeable during the background noise of a days activity - but in an empty, silent office it would be the only sound present.

 

[Nosmo King]

A thought has just occurred to me. The desktop PCs we all used had two quite large cooling fans in them - one on the power supply and one above the CPU. This was 2001 - so the PCs were quite big. Most people who worked there (myself included) would leave them on all the time and just turn the monitors off when they went home.

What if - one of the fans was in the early stages of failing and it was producing infra-sound. This sound would not be noticeable during the background noise of a days activity - but in an empty, silent office it would be the only sound present.

I had a laptop that when the hard drive died it made the most horrible graunching, grinding sound

 

[catseye]

I have been thinking about the airlock idea - I think that I am going to have to put this in the "maybe" file, as the sound I heard was very specifically "chair dragged across floor". My own experiments days later confirmed this.
The other two things that bother me are my bosses story - he was the kind of hard working, straight talking person that did not make up stories or play jokes on people. For the record I believe him.
The other thing is the cleaners behavior. Now that I think about it, they always seemed miserable and in a rush to finish up and leave. We were always pleasant towards them - offering them cups of tea and so forth. I know that cleaning is a low paid, thankless and unpleasant job - so it could have just been low job satisfaction.

It could also, as stated in your earlier comment, be down to bus timetables. Some people feel an unnecessary sense of shame at admitting they don't drive and have to go everywhere by bus, and it can also restrict your ability to get a job (most employers seem to want their employees to turn up spontaneously whenever required). I have a couple of workmates who need to leave their shift early to be able to use our (occasional, sporadic) rural bus service. Plus, the earnings from cleaning jobs don't really lend themselves to running a car, if there are more pressing requirements for the cash.

So, just saying, don't rule out the fact that the cleaning staff may have been telling the truth about buses.

Edited to add - and winter bus timetables are usually even MORE sporadic and occasional. So the cleaners being more reluctant to stay later during winter would be expected.

 

[Ogdred Weary]

A thought has just occurred to me. The desktop PCs we all used had two quite large cooling fans in them - one on the power supply and one above the CPU. This was 2001 - so the PCs were quite big. Most people who worked there (myself included) would leave them on all the time and just turn the monitors off when they went home.

What if - one of the fans was in the early stages of failing and it was producing infra-sound. This sound would not be noticeable during the background noise of a days activity - but in an empty, silent office it would be the only sound present.

A definite possibility (probability?)but doesn't explain your boss's unease though.

 

[Min Bannister]

So, just saying, don't rule out the fact that the cleaning staff may have been telling the truth about buses.

Edited to add - and winter bus timetables are usually even MORE sporadic and occasional. So the cleaners being more reluctant to stay later during winter would be expected.

Seconded. I travel by bus and luckily my employer allows a bit of flexibility so I come in earlier than everyone else and leave earlier. My buses are really pretty reliable. Getting the buses that allegedly arrive just 30 minutes later is a nightmare from hell. Especially the coming home one. Add in covid restrictions and I can end up standing at the side of the road in the dark and pissing rain for a good couple of hours. I am extremely reluctant to come in to (and so leave) work half an hour later.

A thought has just occurred to me. The desktop PCs we all used had two quite large cooling fans in them - one on the power supply and one above the CPU. This was 2001 - so the PCs were quite big. Most people who worked there (myself included) would leave them on all the time and just turn the monitors off when they went home.

What if - one of the fans was in the early stages of failing and it was producing infra-sound. This sound would not be noticeable during the background noise of a days activity - but in an empty, silent office it would be the only sound present.

I don't know about computer fans but when our instrument fans are failing they do indeed produce a sporadic screeching sound. I couldn't think of anything else that could make a sound as distinctive as a chair screeching across a floor but I think that could come pretty close.

Even if it was a fan, your workplace still sounded creepy though!

 

[Giant R]

Well, that's a thought. At a stretch, could such an airlock have caused the pipework to hammer? When we had an airlock upstairs at home, the pipes would make an horrendous screech about 5 minutes after the bathroom taps were turned off.

Interesting post! It doesn't sound like an airlock to me though. Having been in the plumbing business for many years I can attest that water hammer can be pretty loud (much louder than you would think) and can sound like a thumping noise or deep groaning/vibrating noise but this is generally caused by the main water pipe tremoring, a bit like a tuning fork, due to mains pressure. It normally occurs just before the ballvalve fully closes. Air in heating systems normally just produces a 'gurgle'. The only other thing could be if the heating was fed by high pressure steam but you rarely see that except in large hospitals and the like.

 

[escargot]

escargot - Vic Tandy - That's the man I was thinking of! I might re-read his study. I also seem to recall that he appeared on a Channel 5 documentary about staff having strange experiences in tube stations after hours. I think that he brought some measuring equipment which picked up high levels of infra-sound in the areas where the staff had experienced unease and heard noises.

Yup, Vic Tandy was indeed seen in Ghosts of the Underground!

 

[gavin burnett]

Giant R:

Very interesting post! Based on what you have said, would I be right in saying that it would not be possible for a large old fashioned chunky radiator to make a scraping noise?
A question if I may - would it be possible for air to block up the same radiator in such a way that it would lose all heat for some time and make the room cold? I did not think to check the radiator on the Friday night, but I checked it the next week - on Tuesday or Wednesday (I forget which day exactly), and it was hot from top to bottom then.

Min Bannister:

The cleaners used to work at 100 miles an hour, literally throw the cleaning stuff into the cupboard and high tail it out of there. It is quite possible that they had a bus to catch!

Since I have worked with computers for 20 years, I have seen internal fans fail many times. I have seen two types of failure:
- Fans getting clogged with dust/pet hair/fag ash, etc. When this happens they make a constant grinding/buzzing noise. This can usually be fixed by cleaning the muck out of the fan with cotton ear buds and giving it a small spray of WD40.
- Fans where the one of the bearings inside are failing/has failed. This makes an on and off voom-voom-voom noise. The fix with this is to replace the fan.

I have never heard a fan screech though. The other thing is that the noises described above were not that loud - they were irritating, but not make you jump loud.

To posit another theory, I wonder if it is possible that a PC fan had some short lived fault that could have caused a screech sound, which coupled with the quiet office and echo prone surfaces could have gotten amplified? If I remember correctly, Vic Tandy during the Ghosts On The Underground documentary stated that tiled walls in combination with certain shaped rooms can make sound waves distort and amplify.

If I had time, I would investigate my theory of a starting to fail PC fan producing infra-sound.
I am wondering if this might explain my old bosses feeling of unease and presence.
If anyone here wants to conduct some experiments, do let me know the results!

My old office was an old building as I have said, and a lot of visitors and co-workers commented that they found it spooky. At night, the rather outdated lighting would leave parts of the rooms in shadow; and the bare white walls and wood floor where very "echoey". There was also no lighting in the car park, so most people used torches to get to their cars during the dark season.

Thinking about it now - I wish that I had gotten hold of a monks costume or something similar, hidden it in my car, and pretended to go home of an evening; but actually gotten changed and crept about the site to scare my co-workers. Happy Halloween!

 

[Trevp666]

would it be possible for air to block up the same radiator in such a way that it would lose all heat

Yes, quite easily, especially if it is the one in the system that happens to be at the highest point or the end of a run, and poorly maintained (not bled to remove a build up of air).
I mean, it wouldn't be stone cold, but it certainly wouldn't get hot enough to give out any significant heat.

 

[Giant R]

Yes, even if the radiator wasn't completely cold it would still reduce the heat in the room quite quickly -especially as it sounds like the windows were the old steel framed, single glazed Crittall windows which were very popular in the early post war period! Also the room sounds like it wasn't in daily use.
incidentally, another cause of hammering noises can be from older style thermostatic radiator valves. The early versions had an arrow on them for flow and had to be fitted on the flow side of the heating circuit. If fitted on the return side they could (can) hammer quite loudly when they are on the point of closing due to pressure pushing against the valve internally. You mentioned though that these radiators didn't have thermostats, so couldn't have been that.

 

[Trevp666]

I hope the building wasn't next door to a hammer factory - that might explain a lot.

 

[gavin burnett]

I would guess that the reason that there were such big radiators is that these older buildings must be horribly energy inefficent - flat roofs, big single pane windows, no lagging or insulation, etc.

 

[Nosmo King]

Interesting post! It doesn't sound like an airlock to me though. Having been in the plumbing business for many years I can attest that water hammer can be pretty loud (much louder than you would think) and can sound like a thumping noise or deep groaning/vibrating noise but this is generally caused by the main water pipe tremoring, a bit like a tuning fork, due to mains pressure. It normally occurs just before the ballvalve fully closes. Air in heating systems normally just produces a 'gurgle'. The only other thing could be if the heating was fed by high pressure steam but you rarely see that except in large hospitals and the like.

Welcome aboad the board

 

[escargot]

graunching

That's the second time i've heard that word on'ere recently!

 

[Nosmo King]

That's the second time i've heard that word on'ere recently!

It a great onomatopoeiac word

 

[Giant R]

Welcome aboad the board

Thanks Souleater, I have been a 'reader for a long time!

 

[Nosmo King]

Thanks Souleater, I have been a 'reader for a long time!

Always welcome

 

[escargot]

A thought has just occurred to me. The desktop PCs we all used had two quite large cooling fans in them - one on the power supply and one above the CPU. This was 2001 - so the PCs were quite big. Most people who worked there (myself included) would leave them on all the time and just turn the monitors off when they went home.

What if - one of the fans was in the early stages of failing and it was producing infra-sound. This sound would not be noticeable during the background noise of a days activity - but in an empty, silent office it would be the only sound present.

The thing about the low-frequency vibrations is that while you can't hear them they can still have an effect on you.

 

[IbisNibs]

Oh but, to be fair, that is also sometimes done when appropriate.

Insults? Nooo, that's just some of the forum members having fun sniping at each other with wry British humor, unless the target is Cromer, in which the insults are truly insulting.
Debunk? Yes, but only with evidence, and, as you say, when appropriate. That is to say, this forum is not a Troll's paradise, like some social media seems to be.

 

[Spookdaddy]

The building is a single storey construction, so there is no ground floor / upstairs…

The roof of the property my top floor flat is part of is quite complex and has an odd flat area in the middle - around three square metres, hidden by the surrounding roof and only visible from above. When I first moved in I was mystified by somewhat disconcerting scratching sounds - as well as the occasional quite loud grinding and scraping coming from above the ceiling. When I got up on the roof to investigate, I found an ancient aerial array had been pulled down and left loose in the space. It was clearly this that was creating those noises – blown back and forth across the roof when the wind picked up (which is quite often up here). In other parts of my flat - which is quite large - it was not obvious where the noises were coming from.

I’ve also stayed on the top floors of modern hotels with flat rooves where the noise from trapped debris, banging vents and loose cables slapping around and dragging across surfaces in the wind can be really quite intrusive. (There’s a Travelodge on St Mary’s Street in Edinburgh where, in high winds, you would swear a raiding party had been dropped by chinook and was crashing around above you in the early hours.)

I therefore just wonder if the grinding sound could actually have been something loose and moving on the roof. Although I suspect it's an issue which is probably more common on flat rooves, it can be a source of noise on pitched rooves as well – especially where loose cables run across the slates, or where there are damaged aerials.

(I should point out that, although I think it's always worth exploring every possibility in regard to environmental elements - I also think that the implication that explicable environmental factors automatically also explain away possible hauntings reduces the issue to a simplistic binary process which may not actually reflect how the world works. I believe that thoroughly worldly factors can be intrinsically wrapped up in events which seem much less temporal.)

 

[catseye]

The roof of the property my top floor flat is part of is quite complex and has an odd flat area in the middle - around three square metres, hidden by the surrounding roof and only visible from above. When I first moved in I was mystified by somewhat disconcerting scratching sounds - as well as the occasional quite loud grinding and scraping coming from above the ceiling. When I got up on the roof to investigate, I found an ancient aerial array had been pulled down and left loose in the space. It was clearly this that was creating those noises – blown back and forth across the roof when the wind picked up (which is quite often up here). In other parts of my flat - which is quite large - it was not obvious where the noises were coming from.

I’ve also stayed on the top floors of modern hotels with flat rooves where the noise from trapped debris, banging vents and loose cables slapping around and dragging across surfaces in the wind can be really quite intrusive. (There’s a Travelodge on St Mary’s Street in Edinburgh where, in high winds, you would swear a raiding party had been dropped by chinook and was crashing around above you in the early hours.)

I therefore just wonder if the grinding sound could actually have been something loose and moving on the roof. Although I suspect it's an issue which is probably more common on flat rooves, it can be a source of noise on pitched rooves as well – especially where loose cables run across the slates, or where there are damaged aerials.

(I should point out that, although I think it's always worth exploring every possibility in regard to environmental elements - I also think that the implication that explicable environmental factors automatically also explain away possible hauntings reduces the issue to a simplistic binary process which may not actually reflect how the world works. I believe that thoroughly worldly factors can be intrinsically wrapped up in events which seem much less temporal.)

It can be quite astonishing how loud ordinary, environmental sounds can be when heard in darkness with no other noises as distraction. In my old house I used to get starlings nesting under the eaves and, at first light, they'd start moving about with a quite extraordinary amount of noise for tiny, light little things. Until I saw them flying in and out, I had no idea what the sounds were.

Similarly, when I worked in a school, our science labs were on the top floor of a flat roofed building with skylights. We'd sometimes get seagulls landing on the roof and walking about, and it sounded like men in boots were wandering about. Late in the evening when the students had all gone, if you were alone walking along a corridor and heard this heavy tread above you - well, if we hadn't known about the seagulls, we'd have sworn there were people trying to break in.

 

[Spookdaddy]

It can be quite astonishing how loud ordinary, environmental sounds can be when heard in darkness with no other noises as distraction. In my old house I used to get starlings nesting under the eaves and, at first light, they'd start moving about with a quite extraordinary amount of noise for tiny, light little things. Until I saw them flying in and out, I had no idea what the sounds were...

Oh, yes.

I used to have a swifts nest directly the other side of the wall from where my pillow lies. It's an old-school double leaf wall - both leaves consisting of big stone blocks, with a rubble fill in between. Despite the mass between us, the sound of the adult swift's wings brushing against the outer surface as they shifted in the nest sounded just like a callused hand brushing against the wall by my head while I slept. Could be quite disconcerting at 03.00.

And mice - the size of them seems disproportionately insignificant in comparison to the amount of noise the can make; I sometimes wonder if they put boots on when they know nobody will be watching. Rats also have the stealth capabilities of a cow falling down a staircase.

 

[gavin burnett]

Some very interesting stories posted with regard to roof noises.
I have to admit that I did not think that debris blowing around on a roof could sound as if it is inside the building.
From what I remember of that evening it was a calm autumn evening, so there was little or no wind. Indeed - when the weather was rough the noise inside would be quite bad as the wind would shake the nearby trees and the rain would splash loudly against the windows. I do clearly remember that I had a thin jumper on, which I hung over the back of my chair after putting my desk lamp on.
I feel that I have always been able to triangulate the source of noises pretty well, and to this day I do feel quite strongly that the noise came from the meeting room itself ; however I do accept that old echo prone buildings can produce some strange acoustic effects. Taking into consideration the posts about roof noise and fans screeching I am starting to doubt my faculties a bit now!

 

[Sollywos]

Morning swifty nice photo mate.
Can you see what looks like two faces in the boundary wall above what I think are tree stumps!!
Parathingymum stuff.brain trying to put a bit of order in the mix!

Yep I saw them and put it down to 'parathingymum'! I like the word it's easier to spell!

Sollywos x

 

[Zeke Newbold]

What occurs to me is that, since they were on the ground floor in a building where it was possible for unlocked windows to allow entry, they may have felt vulnerable to intruders when cleaning at night. I don't feel safe spending nights on the ground floor myself.

It's so wonderful that your colleagues offered them tea! What a lovely group of people!

Sheesh! I must have been out of the Old Country for too long! I have always thought (and always tell my students) that an offer of a cup of tea us the automatic default response of any Brit to someone entering their home, or plavce of work. Things really have come to a sorry pass if this is now seen as a great act of kindness!

 

[Zeke Newbold]

It could also, as stated in your earlier comment, be down to bus timetables. Some people feel an unnecessary sense of shame at admitting they don't drive and have to go everywhere by bus, and it can also restrict your ability to get a job (most employers seem to want their employees to turn up spontaneously whenever required). I have a couple of workmates who need to leave their shift early to be able to use our (occasional, sporadic) rural bus service. Plus, the earnings from cleaning jobs don't really lend themselves to running a car, if there are more pressing requirements for the cash.

So, just saying, don't rule out the fact that the cleaning staff may have been telling the truth about buses.

Edited to add - and winter bus timetables are usually even MORE sporadic and occasional. So the cleaners being more reluctant to stay later during winter would be expected.

Yes, I can really relate to this and it seems like the most watertight explanation.

As a non-driver myself I have memories of when I lived an d worked back in the UK - of having to turn up to places really early or leave early or spend lots of time waiting at bus stops in all hours and weathers. And what always struck me throughout was the ignorant lack of understanding about this from one's car dependent colleagues. And, yes, the sense of shame that you mention.

The British people put up with an appalingly expensive, unreliable and meagre public transport system. It is one thing I really do not miss about the UK - and a factor as to why I am not hurrying to get back there.

It is little wonder that people feel bound to environment wrecking private automobiles which cause far more deaths and injuries per year than any virus ever did.

In the city I am in now we have an affordable and regular public transport system of underground metro carriages, buses, trolleybuses and trams which means that, as a part of my daily woking life I can whizz around the city using my own money and without being seriously out of pocket.There is no city in the UK where this would be possible.

 

[Sollywos]

And what always struck me throughout was the ignorant lack of understanding about this from one's car dependent colleagues. And, yes, the sense of shame that you mention.

I can identify with that and all the rest of your post!

Things are no better now I'm retired. I try joining in with things (eg U3A) but always having to rely on lifts just leaves me feeling really bad about myself. For sure people are more than willing, but even though I always insist on giving petrol money it's still leaves me feeling uncomfortable.

Of course I no longer have to wait about or run for a bus/train, on account of being freed from the 9-5 type of contraints, which is one blessing. However I still feel trapped in a way as society seems to run on the assumption that everyone has a car.

So at least the cleaners panic as mentioned in the OP seems to have an explaination.

Sollywos x